What ever happened to....

[scofi_b]

kerlon and he's seal dribble...I remember one FM he had a high (PA)

Also lulinha was an awesome talent that never made it


http://community.sigames.com/newthre...newthread&f=24
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6Yj7GoXPZw


was wondering if you guys could remember any talents on fm who never made it in game and in real life

thiago neves is another one that comes to mind

[uprockindude]

kerlon got injured a lot he got signed to chievo and inter took his registration (italian rules) they later signed him he had a bad run of injuries and eventually got loaned to ajax however he had a bad knee injury and got ruled out for a long time and when he did make it back he only was played in their reserve team. his contract then expired and he returned to brazil I can't remember who though I know it is not a good team though

lulinha is doing well in brazil playing for corinthians

I would say thiago neves has been alright he joined hamburg to replace VDV but for whatever reason he returned to fluminese on loan the next season the season after that he joined al-ittihad (either them or al-ahli but i'm 95% sure it was al-ittihad) they signed him for significant coin it was about 9 million euro's and he was incredible for them played very well indeed so naturally the next season he went on loan to fluminese .....AGAIN then the season after that he finally rejoined fluminese permanantly where he is still playing and tbh he has played well for them so well in fact he has an IF in FUT LOL he has either 2 or 3 caps for brazil which considering AM is a top position in that team you can understand why he doesn't have more .

[SCIAG]

Lulinha got relegated, then had a bad season.

[scofi_b]

thanks for that guys found them all on the game now...to be fair all still have good stats also came across martin galvan hes let him self down

[interesti88]

Whatever happened to Nicholas Millan?

[samdiatmh]

Whatever happened to Nicholas Millan?

he's still only 20?
he's been loaned out to chilean div 2 side's for first team games, making 15 appearances last season

Lebohang Mokoena and Benedict Vilakazi (two of numerous FM05 gems) spring to mind, what happened to those?

[x42bn6]

Lebohang Mokoena. He should simply have never been rated that high. The same applies to the likes of Babacar...

[jcoll]

Sherman Cardenas? Fm07 I think he had very high PA

[uprockindude]

Lebohang Mokoena. He should simply have never been rated that high. The same applies to the likes of Babacar...

Babacar is amazing in the game still 12 goals and 20 assists from cam playing every other game for me..... however I totally agree I have seen him play in RL and he is nothing special at all he is playing for fiorentina about 25-30 times and he has scored twice none of which I have seen.

my nominee for this thread would be sergio asenjo a spanish GK who had the stats and potential to be Spiderman god damn it he would save everything that even came close to him however in RL all the times I have watched him play which tbf isnt too much for him not being 1st choice he is an average GK better than almunia worse than German Lux from deportivo. has anyone signed him lately and has he been any good

[scofi_b]

i signed german lux for my santos team...worse keeper ever lol

[BiggusD]

Aimar and Saviola were God's gift to football ten years ago (or more) according to FM. Although it is unfair to call them flops since they have both played Champions League football for good European clubs, they didn't quite live up to the hype.

There are literally hundreds of such players in FM's history, and even more were nobodies in one version and superstars in the next. I guess CM/FM isn't exactly PreCrime

[uprockindude]

i signed german lux for my santos team...worse keeper ever lol

lol you are not wrong in game Lux is terrible I was talking more as in RL when I was comparing Asenjo's ability lol

[Salad Daze]

Tonton Zola Moukoukou
Kennedy Bakirloglu

Ryan Williams for Sheff Weds from CM93... and Billy Kenny for Everton.

Mark Collis xD

[uprockindude]

Tonton Zola Moukoukou is playing for atlantis FC in finland where 1st season there they got relegated
Kennedy Bakirloglu is currently playing for Racing Santander 1st season he did well and he was a regular player but last season I think he had an ACL injury and they got relegated

I have never heard of Ryan Williams for Sheff Wednesday the only Ryan Williams I know of played for mansfield chesterfield and hull

Billy Kenny I had forgotten about him what a waste I saw a documentary on him ages ago he was named MOTM for a big game got a ton of injuries got addicted to cocaine and alcohol got fired for gross misconduct got signed by oldham barely played and scored an OG got released believe he went to either barrow or dover and then he played in the liverpool amateur leagues

Mark Collis for all those who don't know in CM93 in the end of season Update they added 2 fake players just to spice the game up they were Mark Collis and ???? Orosco they were put in the third division can't remember who for though Collis was a striker and Orosco was a defender

[Karnage94]

Henri Saivet and Freddy Adu tore it up for me in FM09. Neither have come close to living up to their potential

[Lenzar]

I remember everyone at school back when CM 01/02 (EVERYONE played that) was about that Cherno Samba was the best player in the game.

Did he ever even make an EPL game?

[scofi_b]

I have made a datebase of all the players i can think of...who had good pa in previous games and was meant to be the next big thing if anyone is interested also includes legends pretty awesome game

[uprockindude]

Saivet has been a massive disappointing in RL but Adu has been decent played well in portugal and back in the MLS now really we have to remember that he has experienced a lot and at a young age so you can understand why people will be disappointed with him because he never reached the pinnacle.

Cherno Samba was the mutts he always played well however in RL no he has never played a PL game and despite making many juniour england caps returned to play for the Gabon national team if it interests you after he left england permanantly he joined FC Haka the man u of finland Panetolikos F.C. one of the most famous teams in Greece and FK Tønsberg a 2nd division norweigian team, Cherno didn't underachieve he was just overpowered like other players he never should of had those stats in the 1st place

[kieronbrown73]

Sherman Cardenas? Fm07 I think he had very high PA

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sherman_C%C3%A1rdenas

It would appear he has never left Colombia and his goal tally is a little less than he acheived in FM

[RBKalle]

Mobi Okoli from Sandnes Ulf (Norway) has been insanely good in FM11/12 despite being little more than a backup in real life.

Babacar and Kofi Agyei have been given outlandish skills last year despite not having played a single professional game in their life.

Lauri Dalla Valle doesn't seem to have turned out as deadly as he was in FM

Vincenzo Fiorillo went from top prospect to Serie B backup, via a couple of embarrassing performances for Sampdoria.


The list of "who the hell rated him so high and why?" imaginary superstars is very very long, and it should have been used a long time ago already in order to prevent such things from happening.
We know it's difficult to predict the future, but for a researcher the first rule should be "never buy into the hype"

[kieronbrown73]

The list of "who the hell rated him so high and why?" imaginary superstars is very very long, and it should have been used a long time ago already in order to prevent such things from happening.
We know it's difficult to predict the future, but for a researcher the first rule should be "never buy into the hype"

Try telling this advise to Real Life Club Managers. I seem to remember a certain Arsenal manager paying a large amount for Francis Jeffers based on his perceived potential. What a fantastic piece of business that turned out to be!

[Salad Daze]

Tonton Zola Moukoukou is playing for atlantis FC in finland where 1st season there they got relegated
Kennedy Bakirloglu is currently playing for Racing Santander 1st season he did well and he was a regular player but last season I think he had an ACL injury and they got relegated

I have never heard of Ryan Williams for Sheff Wednesday the only Ryan Williams I know of played for mansfield chesterfield and hull

Billy Kenny I had forgotten about him what a waste I saw a documentary on him ages ago he was named MOTM for a big game got a ton of injuries got addicted to cocaine and alcohol got fired for gross misconduct got signed by oldham barely played and scored an OG got released believe he went to either barrow or dover and then he played in the liverpool amateur leagues

Mark Collis for all those who don't know in CM93 in the end of season Update they added 2 fake players just to spice the game up they were Mark Collis and ???? Orosco they were put in the third division can't remember who for though Collis was a striker and Orosco was a defender

Good stuff uprockindude.

I'm sure it was Ryan Williams for Sheff Weds... but perhaps the name is wrong... one thing for certain though - Wedsnesday had an awesome squad in teh game. I'm sure one of the developers must have been a Wedsnesday fan.

The other player was Ferrah Orosco - both he and Collis started the game at Cambridge.

[pigfacemonkeyman]

I remember everyone at school back when CM 01/02 (EVERYONE played that) was about that Cherno Samba was the best player in the game.

Did he ever even make an EPL game?

The start of this guide might tell you.
http://www.thedugout.net/community/s...ad.php?t=67502

[pigfacemonkeyman]

Good stuff uprockindude.

I'm sure it was Ryan Williams for Sheff Weds... but perhaps the name is wrong... one thing for certain though - Wedsnesday had an awesome squad in teh game. I'm sure one of the developers must have been a Wedsnesday fan.The other player was Ferrah Orosco - both he and Collis started the game at Cambridge.

This could be why Everton always seem to do well. (in my saves anyway)

[RBKalle]

Try telling this advise to Real Life Club Managers. I seem to remember a certain Arsenal manager paying a large amount for Francis Jeffers based on his perceived potential. What a fantastic piece of business that turned out to be!

But to be fair Jeffers had a respectable record as a teenager for Everton. Then injuries and other circumstances ruined his career, but his high potential wasn't completely unsubstantiated IMO.

The likes of Samba, Babacar and Saivet had been awarded very high potential based on ZERO match experience... at least Jeffers had a passable scoring record in EPL with Everton.

[kieronbrown73]

But to be fair Jeffers had a respectable record as a teenager for Everton. Then injuries and other circumstances ruined his career, but his high potential wasn't completely unsubstantiated IMO.

The likes of Samba, Babacar and Saivet had been awarded very high potential based on ZERO match experience... at least Jeffers had a passable scoring record in EPL with Everton.

Fair point and maybe Jeffers was a bad example but I am certain real life managers have made rash purchases of players based on a couple of good games only to discover they have bought a dud.

[RBKalle]

Fair point and maybe Jeffers was a bad example but I am certain real life managers have made rash purchases of players based on a couple of good games only to discover they have bought a dud.

Sure, and every club have a fair share of those "what were they thinking" signings.

However I maintain most of those poor deals are the result of rushed transactions (aka panic signings), overestimated performances (guys performing adequately at a lower level or abroad aren't necessarily able to do the same at a new club or in a different country) or potential.

In other words: the manager, the DoF, the scouts etc just SAW something that either wasn't there or that ended up not being enough.

But what we have in FM with all those -8/-9 Joe Nobody is little more than "I read somewhere he's great" or "he scored 30 goals at Under16 level so he MUST be the next Messi". That or it's club researchers going totally overboard on rating the latest addition to the youth squad.


I dug out FM09 and there's this kid, Martin Galván with a -10 PA (and apparently an altered d.o.b.) despite him being 16 at the time of the game release and with a grand total of 110 (goalless) minutes of professional career under his belt.
And then we have the already mentioned Saivet and Fiorillo...

I'm not even looking at the -9 or at the kids with FIXED potential worth of a Top Club starting XI.


I understand there are some "risks" to be taken, but I'm strongly against handing >150PA left, right and center... The hit/miss ratio is clearly in favour of a more strict and even stingy approach.
No fixed high potential should be accepted unless there are solid proofs of the players' skills and performance
No high negative potential should be awarded unless there are clear signs of the players' potential in competitive match at an acceptable level.


Because let's be fair, for every Balotelli the researchers got right there are at least a dozen of Carlos Vela, a couple of Keirisson and a few spectacular Cherno Samba.
And to me it's a lot less impressive getting one right and ten wrong (to various degrees) than getting the ten mediocre right while missing out on the Top Prospect

[Marcussy]

I understand there are some "risks" to be taken, but I'm strongly against handing >150PA left, right and center... The hit/miss ratio is clearly in favour of a more strict and even stingy approach.
No fixed high potential should be accepted unless there are solid proofs of the players' skills and performance
No high negative potential should be awarded unless there are clear signs of the players' potential in competitive match at an acceptable level.

I understand your viewpoint but don't agree. In fact, I don't think there are enough real-life youngsters in the game given high PAs. Sure - it will make the game unrealistic but surely it's still more realistic that these real players have a shot at being good players than having them be mediocre and fade out of the game and then have the game be dominated by newgens almost immediately after the current generation? Newgens dominating has to happen anyway but it shouldn't be quite so soon and only once a few generations of real players have had their time in the game.

[eplkewell]

Freddy Adu and Eddie Johnson have been the biggest disappointments for me. They used to be beasts on the game, but never panned out in real life. As an American, this has caused me a lot of suffering.

[stotty1982]

the norwegian lad from few years ago sindre loe bing i think he was called,stats werent amazing but could play in every position possible nearly.great player to have on the bench.

[Wonderkid36]

Tonton Zola Moukoukou
Kennedy Bakirloglu

Ryan Williams for Sheff Weds from CM93... and Billy Kenny for Everton.

Mark Collis xD

Quote From wikipedia "Championship Manager and Becoming a Cult Hero
Moukoko achieved fame through his depiction in Championship Manager, a computer game developed by Sports Interactive.He is frequently telephoned by fans of the game, who have also set up dedicated Facebook groups."lol

[kieronbrown73]

No fixed high potential should be accepted unless there are solid proofs of the players' skills and performance
No high negative potential should be awarded unless there are clear signs of the players' potential in competitive match at an acceptable level.

So we have 1000's of clubs worldwide with youth aged 16. These players have really only started to blossom so how does a researcher know if he is going to make it or not. Surely they have taken an educated guess based on their own opinion in watching them, current facilities and coaches as well as feedback from various media sources. We can't always get everything 100% correct, yet I feel that the researchers do an admirable job.
Whilst their may occasionaly be a liitle over valuation I feel they underestimate more. This aside it does not spoil my enjoyment for the game.

[SCIAG]

Sherman Cardenas? Fm07 I think he had very high PA

I think Cardenas was one of those, like Eddie Johnson or To Maderia, who didn't have a particularly high PA, but had very good attributes for his position so always performed well for human managers.

[FFC4EVA]

Sherman Cardenas? Fm07 I think he had very high PA

Pretty sure he was shot in the head last year some time. Survived, but obviously out for a very long time!!

[RBKalle]

I understand your viewpoint but don't agree. In fact, I don't think there are enough real-life youngsters in the game given high PAs. Sure - it will make the game unrealistic but surely it's still more realistic that these real players have a shot at being good players than having them be mediocre and fade out of the game and then have the game be dominated by newgens almost immediately after the current generation? Newgens dominating has to happen anyway but it shouldn't be quite so soon and only once a few generations of real players have had their time in the game.

But that's mostly due to many player hitting the proverbial glass ceiling imposed by the CA/reputation based system currently in the game.

And it's not entirely true the first batch of newgens takes the gameworld over immediately, au contraire, all the talented players born from 1990-1994 are usually replacing the established superstars, IF given enough playing time to fulfill their potential.

If that doesn't happen it's a AI's fault for sticking with the old geezers [higher Rep] instead of giving a fair chance to the new generation.

But that can't be solved with a global PA rise of all the Under 18 kids as long as Reputation is the #1 factor in transfers and selections.

So we have 1000's of clubs worldwide with youth aged 16. These players have really only started to blossom so how does a researcher know if he is going to make it or not. Surely they have taken an educated guess based on their own opinion in watching them, current facilities and coaches as well as feedback from various media sources. We can't always get everything 100% correct, yet I feel that the researchers do an admirable job.
Whilst their may occasionaly be a liitle over valuation I feel they underestimate more. This aside it does not spoil my enjoyment for the game.

Different opinions I guess...

I just can't stomach to see Babacar scoring for fun in FM while in real life he's been nothing short of embarrassing... it's a matter of immersion, or of suspension of disbelief if you will.

I have no issue with researchers giving high potential to players who had proven SOMETHING already (Bojan and Pato's -10 in FM09 made 100% sense even if in hindsight it could look a bit too generous).

I have issues however with high potential which is almost completely based on hearsay or "impressions".

Just because there are thousands of youngsters that doesn't mean we should assign Top Player potential almost at random just because "someone" said they're good or because we're bound to have N Top Players in 5 years.
If that's the logic behind the -9s and -10s let's just assign those values at random at a given number of young players at famous youth clubs... The outcome will be the same...

Unfortunately the overvaluation is far from being occasional... There have been players with unwarranted high PA for YEARS despite no actual improvement in real life...
It's almost as if they can't get a PA cut unless the original assessment is proven wrong, which IMO is completely backwards...

They must PROVE to be good enough, instead of researches waiting to get proven wrong.