FM 2013 - What do we actually think this game will be like

[ViG1980]

I have bought every version of FM....I even bought FM12 although I failed to even make it through a season - I need to see a major overhaul...

But more to the point, what features do you think will make it into FM13?

Do we think SI will go 3D on us?

Like I said, I need an overhaul and the time is about right for them to do it - it's just been "minor" tweaks for the last 3-4 versions....we're due a major change.

[Ackter]

The match engine is already 3D

[milnerpoint]

The 3d has only been in for about 4 versions now.......
DLR and add and remove leagues were pretty big tweaks to the way the game works.

I can't see FM13 being a huge step in any direction, except hopefully a new match engine.

[White Flag]

I'm hoping it will be like FM12, but with a few new features and a few improvements. And new players and staff.

[Sussex Hammer]

New match engine for me with no added gimmicks. Just get the game right and bug free would be a good start. The problem is in many ways it's a very realistic game until you get to a match and then falls down which is unfortunate considering the match is the most important part!!

[MeesterCat]

The same as the previous ones. I mean that in a good way.

[ViG1980]

The match engine is already 3D

True - I mean a serious bump in graphics. I think of the match engine as being more isometric for some reason but you're right, it's 3D...

[Tractor_Boy_Rv]

I'm hoping it will be like FM12, but with a few new features and a few improvements. And new players and staff.

I think you may be in luck judging by previous releases

[ViG1980]

I'm hoping it will be like FM12, but with a few new features and a few improvements. And new players and staff.

I certainly hope it's not the same as FM12.

[Ackter]

Even the "2D" engine was modelled in 3D.

[ViG1980]

Even the "2D" engine was modelled in 3D.

That's great but means little if the end product is 2D...which is what I use for what it's worth...but i think a serious bump is needed now...without dumbing down the rest of the game a la Fifa...which I know will be tough!

[Ackter]

They'll continue to improve the animations and graphics, but you shouldn't expect anything near FIFA for a long, long time - and even then you'd end up with generic faces because EA have most of the image rights and refuse to let them go.

[Robsy1990]

Wishful thinking, but the removal of the reputation system. New ME would be great too.

[TOUGHGUY]

It will mostly be the same. New database, obviously. Match engine reworked - might as well not be since you don't really get to see under the hood. Some old bugs and issues gone. More new ones. Slight tweaking in terms of user interface and secondary matters (i.e. cutting down 'tones' to three or some such minor change). No major, noticeable improvement/addition.

[Niebiescy]

I couldn't care less about the graphics or anything visual. I would love to see a more realistic match engine and vastly improved interaction. If it can't be made realistic then remove it.

[superscunk]

I really hope for a new match engine as well.

If there's only a few new gimmicky features i definitely wont be buying FM13.

[duccio]

I would be a happy camper if FM13 included the following:


1. Markedly improved AI ability to build a balanced squad in long-term games.

2. German Oberliga, Spanish 3rd division & Italian Serie D. Or divisions even further down the ladder in these countries.

[themadsheep2001]

More tweaking to the AI

More roles in the TC

Hopefully the new match engine is finished in time.

[Barside]

a new match engine.

No new match engine & SI will not be getting a penny from me, it's a must along with revamping every system that uses reputation to formulate AI decision making.

I'd also like to see an end to sliders, they're horrible, unintuitive & oddly by being so precise they are actually a very imprecise tactical interface.

[gmilitao]

I like to see a stadium editor, more improvement in game ambience... i think this is not so hard to do...

[Smac]

I'm going to take a wild guess and say that I think FM13 will add some pretty remarkable graphical improvements on top of a new ME. I'm thinking: Closeups for "Flair" moves, more detailed sprites, and maybe some additional variation in animations for tackles, heading duels and of course shots. Maybe.

I think 95% of the game will be based on the same architecture. I think SI is content with the basic format of the game and won't be shaking things up too much for FM13. Wish they would, but don't see it happening. That said, I have high hopes that individual modules will be improved again and that FM13 will be "better than ever", truly. Some fundamental issues though regarding AI strategy and team building, these won't change enough for most.

Also, the tutorial system and "manual" will not improve enough to become accessible to nubs. Maybe 1 or 2 modules will become a bit more friendly. I can see tutoring coming clean and some expansion of the backroom staff aspect, but there will be just as many mysteries as ever, in the end. Poor nubs.

[jon157uk]

I'll be quite happy if they get the match working properly, it's not really that bad at the moment to be fair but definitely needs improvements. I can't really think of any features that need to be added although as mentioned above, stadium editor might be nice if it worked OK.

[scott MUFC]

hopefully they will fix the reputation. man utd are "underdogs" v chelsea in the champions league at stamford bridge?

[Richey2008]

I can't think of any features as such I'd like to see added. I think there is enough for the time being at least. I think a redesign of the match engine would have a knock on effect of allowing all the existing and recently added features to work with greater realism and efficiency.

[chocolatecoatedballs]

I do not see a dramatic change on the horizon, going by previous fm releases.

What I would like to see: Better ME and tactic builder.

[Chicha_14]

Better match engine and better AI team building I hope.

[Erimus1876]

No new features or gimmicks. The game is packed full of them at the moment. Do we really need more?

I hope they concentrate on...

1 Match Engine

2 AI Squad Building

3 3D Graphic Improvement

In that order

[CityAndColour]

I pray that the revamped match engine will be ready for FM13.

Another 'polished' version of the FM11/12 one will likely result in me skipping a version and that's something that I'd like to avoid.

[jimbobBRFC]

I couldn't care less about the graphics or anything visual. I would love to see a more realistic match engine and vastly improved interaction. If it can't be made realistic then remove it.

Completely agree visual changes dont actually improve the game

[upthetoon]

if there is no major changes to AI and the Match Engine i'm not going to bother to buy the game. They have been adding alot of eye candies to the game but the AI and the Match Engine is lagging very far behind now. About time they did something.

No ME improvements and i'm skipping the game. just play FM 2012.

[QWERTYOP]

An "overhaul" is not needed. I would like to see communication with your players improved and increased though. I agree with the removal of the manager reputation thing too. It's just not needed. And for me the most important chance... Make it easier to sell unwanted players!!

[Barside]

Make it easier to sell unwanted players!!

I always love this one, I wonder how often people moaning about how difficult it is to shift deadwood actually buy deadwood from AI teams?

[milnerpoint]

I always love this one, I wonder how often people moaning about how difficult it is to shift deadwood actually buy deadwood from AI teams?

LOL i know what you mean!
It always amuses me when you break it down,

"i dont want player x because he is rubbish and not good enough for my team, but i expect the AI to bid over the odds for him"

[jimbobBRFC]

LOL i know what you mean!
It always amuses me when you break it down,

"i dont want player x because he is rubbish and not good enough for my team, but i expect the AI to bid over the odds for him"

It is annoying still though do you not agree? I usually just flat out release deadwood, no point trying to fob them off to the AI for that exact reason.

A ME Uprgrade is needed I think, although Im not too fussed about visuals i.e graphics. Some people have also mentioned a stadium editor which personally I think would be too gimmicky and add to the endless list of things that arnt really used.

[dolph11]

Buut deadwood in your team could be worthwhile to another team. If I'm in Serie 'A' but I don't need a certain defender as I've 3 better ones, it doesn't mean the unwanted defender isn't a decent player for a good Serie 'B' team. 'One mans rubbish is another mans treasure'

[Ackter]

As long as their wages match their ability I have no problems getting rid of players I don't want.

The hard part is when the players IRL are being paid way more than they're worth, or in-game managers give them too much money in the hope of beating others to their signature, which is usually why they can't be sold.

As an example, Newcastle:

Alan Smith? Almost no chance of selling.
Peter Lovenkrands? Hell of a lot easier.

[milnerpoint]

What its annoying that the AI wont bid for players you never play and keep in your reserves? Not really.
Selling players in FM has never been a problem for me, but i dont keep big squads and dont try to mass sell everyone not in the starting 11 in the first week i arrive at the club, and then keep said players in the reserves getting no exposure at all. I use the game mechanics to get interest in players and sell them that way.

[milnerpoint]

Buut deadwood in your team could be worthwhile to another team. If I'm in Serie 'A' but I don't need a certain defender as I've 3 better ones, it doesn't mean the unwanted defender isn't a decent player for a good Serie 'B' team. 'One mans rubbish is another mans treasure'

But would that defender want to move down 2 divisions? There are not many players if any out there that would consider that a good career move.

Ackter is right, the only issue is when the deadwood is on a very high wage, no one is going to pay Alan Smith half of what Newcastle currently are, why would they?

[PGB_SPURS_FM09]

No new match engine & SI will not be getting a penny from me, it's a must along with revamping every system that uses reputation to formulate AI decision making.

This exactly for me. ME needs to change so that its better then before, but also in a state where it is "fresh" - as in the develepors have lots and lots of room where they can keep improving it over the next 5-10 years. Then the AI is an even bigger problem IMO like Biggus said the use of reputation throughout the game and just the general AI altogether needs to be improved and made more flexible/realistic like real life(hard to achieve i know) as everything is still too static, the steps forward taken with dynamic reputation etc needs to be implemented into every part of the AI system. This could potentially help improve squad building, management(what formations they use etc), squad analysis, transfers, player interaction, manager interaction, buying players, international call-ups etc... the list goes on and on lol!!!

[QWERTYOP]

It's just unrealistic. If you have a player who you have told to their face is no longer wanted, slap them in the reserves, offer them at a decent price, then their agent has a duty to see to it that they're gone during the next transfer window. There are a zillion clubs out there. Players just don't sit on transfer lists for years and years. Somebody will always take them. It's a problem, and it needs attention.

[dolph11]

In real life it happens. My team in real life, Wolves, had a striker called Andy Keogh, he wasn't good enough and was considered 'deadwood', along with Andrew Surman. He went down a division to Milwall, as did Surman to Norwich who then got promoted. It does depend on the wage and the individuals personality but I think it's way out of hand on this version. A lot of players in real life also take wage cuts in order to be playing, you get the feeling on this version that EVERY single player is in it for the dosh. I feel like a player would rather rot in the reserves of a Prem team than be playing regular for a team in the league below on this FM. I just don't buy it. Of course, this does happen in real life with primadonnas and self-loving individuals but it's actually very rare that a player would rather rot in the reserves on the transfer list than join another club that suits him. Even a player as High Profile as Craig Bellamy went on loan to Cardiff. I know it's only a loan but it's still significant.

My next point, most players would be wanted by at least one team in this great big footballing world, somewhere along the line, a team is found and a deal is negotiated.

[Barside]

I'll give you the wage cut point, every player in FM seems determined to get a pay increase at each contract negotiation.

Me: You're 34 & getting on a bit but I'll offer you £20,000pw for 3 years
Player: I want £35,000 pw for 2 years
Me: I'm offering you a better deal
Player: I'm not signing that........
Player: I'm a free agent & I'll take £15,000pw* for 1 year or I'm not wanted so I'll retire

*AI clubs only

[Johnjo]

It will be the greatest game ever.......or a huge disappointment.

[dolph11]

I agree Johnjo! If SI have listened and took on board then it will be amazing. I think it's not far off being fantastic, despite my gripes. I do have issues with this version but they won't take much to iron out. Improved ME (don't care about the graphics, just the actions and decisions of the players), AI squad building and the transfer system would be great.

[jimbobBRFC]

I agree Johnjo! If SI have listened and took on board then it will be amazing. I think it's not far off being fantastic, despite my gripes. I do have issues with this version but they won't take much to iron out. Improved ME (don't care about the graphics, just the actions and decisions of the players), AI squad building and the transfer system would be great.

That is everything they should concentrate on, and it will be brillaint

[Ackter]

What this game needs, really needs, is streakers and more varied goal celebrations.

[haunted1234]

i mean i just started playing the game in FM11, the changes to 12 are bearly noticable, cant think of anything "major" despite the lock function on contract negotiations, everything else seems the same for me

fm13 will be the same i think, just 1-2 minor changes, nothing special

[bolulu]

I would like the game to not keep me out of work for so bloody long when I leave, or (very ocassionally) get sacked, from previous club. I always make sure there are leagues loaded where I have the status/experience to do a good job but this game keeps me unemployed; sometimes for over a couple of years.
Never understood why FM allow this to happen.

[Barside]

What this game needs, really needs, is streakers and more varied goal celebrations.

I want foxes, cats & squirrels running on to the pitch with a bonus mini game that allows my groundsman to shoot the intruders

[milnerpoint]

A spot of half time clay pigeon shooting wouldnt go a miss i guess.

[haz32]

Just a small thing, but I would like a more detailed explanation as to why a player "would have no intention of joining our club at this time."

For example, "X would have no intention of joining our club at this time as he wants to play European football/ does not want to drop down a division/ has recently signed a new contract."

[Barside]

Why does it have to be clay pigeon's? I want to shoot vermin.

[milnerpoint]

SI would probably want to watch out incase the RSPCA stated legal proceedings LOL

[haz32]

Why does it have to be clay pigeon's? I want to shoot vermin.

There might be some legal issues when it comes to shooting Rangers fans.

[milnerpoint]

harsh, im sure ter will love reading that.....

[Coentrao]

A new match engine where pace and acceleration aren't so overpowered.

Scouting could use a revamp, scouts shouldn't lose knowledge so fast of a country they spent a few months working in, i barely know anything about the Eredivisie, but if i spend a couple of months in Holland watching games and footage, i wouldn't forget all that knowledge in a month or so, it should last at least until the new season when there are transfers,retirements,new young players and even then i shouldn't lose all of the knowledge.

Ex-players that have permanent knowledge of a country just because they played there for a season 10 years ago doesn't seem realistic as well.

I really want to have custom regions in the game, just tell my scout to go for the regionX that comprises Portugal,Spain and France for instance, and just roam around those three countries, specially because scouting countries now is awkward when they have full knowledge of a country and complete it on a day and some regions have a lot of countries that just won't produce any good players when you are playing with a smaller DB so they end up wasting a lot of time.

[as260191]

The ability to build your manager's face in a newgen style, your manager would age over time, and it would affect the appearance of any sons you end up spawning in the game.

[jimbobBRFC]

A new match engine where pace and acceleration aren't so overpowered.

Scouting could use a revamp, scouts shouldn't lose knowledge so fast of a country they spent a few months working in, i barely know anything about the Eredivisie, but if i spend a couple of months in Holland watching games and footage, i wouldn't forget all that knowledge in a month or so, it should last at least until the new season when there are transfers,retirements,new young players and even then i shouldn't lose all of the knowledge.

Ex-players that have permanent knowledge of a country just because they played there for a season 10 years ago doesn't seem realistic as well.

I really want to have custom regions in the game, just tell my scout to go for the regionX that comprises Portugal,Spain and France for instance, and just roam around those three countries, specially because scouting countries now is awkward when they have full knowledge of a country and complete it on a day and some regions have a lot of countries that just won't produce any good players when you are playing with a smaller DB so they end up wasting a lot of time.

Great idea with the scouting, would be ncie to send a scout to a list of specific countries, rather than just spain or just portugal

[Kawee]

For me the most important things are:

1. The AI's ability to build squad in a long-term game. This mostly has to do with their players trading and youth development.

2. Improve match engine, especially with things like the 3-man backline (eg. not being to push the CBL and CBR wide during build up play,) the proper implementation of liberos who push forward, and also closing down to be more than just 1v1 battles.

[Keyzer Soze]

For me the most important things are:

1. The AI's ability to build squad in a long-term game. This mostly has to do with their players trading and youth development.

1000 times this!
It's probably the hardest thing to improve in the game, but if SI would get this right (or at least improved) the game it would be so much better after 5 or 6 seasons.
i think the large majoraty of the players, think the way i do: The longer you play in one save, less funnier that save will get, and the main reason is the poor ability from the AI teams to keep building (and re-building) their squads.

I know that a lot as been done in this particulary aspect, but lets face it... its far from perfect.

[Stephanie McMahon\'s Secret Lover]

Would absolutely love a "Football Chairman" or "Director of Football" mode.

Want to be able to employ a manager then tell him parameters for tactics and buying and selling players, then just whizz on with the season without having to watch the boring games over and over again, until naturally I have to sack the useless cretin!

[Keyzer Soze]

Would absolutely love a "Football Chairman" or "Director of Football" mode.

Want to be able to employ a manager then tell him parameters for tactics and buying and selling players, then just whizz on with the season without having to watch the boring games over and over again, until naturally I have to sack the useless cretin!

So, basicaly you would like a different game!

[Ackter]

Would absolutely love a "Football Chairman" or "Director of Football" mode.

Want to be able to employ a manager then tell him parameters for tactics and buying and selling players, then just whizz on with the season without having to watch the boring games over and over again, until naturally I have to sack the useless cretin!

Possible to do so already, it's how I play the game.

[haunted1234]

you mind explaining ackter?

[Ackter]

Your assistant is your team's manager.

You set the starting tactics and tick the "use current tactic" option on the holiday screen and holiday through matches (your assistant will make changes as the game goes on). Tick all the team policy stuff relating to your assistant attending the press, using opposition instructions etc as well

You still have control over all the scouting, buying etc, and occasionally your assistant will recommend you a player in the backroom - take this as him wanting you to sign that player for his team.

If he's crap, fire him and place a job advert.

Sure, you won't be able to hire Mourinho or whatever as your "manager", but it still gives you the right gameplay.

[thistle_46]

i like the way this years is after the bugs were fixed , theres only a few relitivly small things id like to see changed for example the transfer values of players drop dramaticly very quickly , i would like the opertunity for players to recieve transfer budgets and attract the players which are getting touted in the media for instance the likes of psg being able to buy guys like kaka , anzhi buying another few players of eto'o stature , like that chinese team getting anelka aswell , if the chairman is financially backing the team to take them to the top of the world stage then it should be reflected in the game and lastly , to be able to have national and international acadimeies available to the top clubs.

[Gee_Simpson]

It's just unrealistic. If you have a player who you have told to their face is no longer wanted, slap them in the reserves, offer them at a decent price, then their agent has a duty to see to it that they're gone during the next transfer window. There are a zillion clubs out there. Players just don't sit on transfer lists for years and years. Somebody will always take them. It's a problem, and it needs attention.

Actually this isn't always the case IRL.

My team Hearts have recently told players that they weren't wanted and that they were to find new clubs. Clubs came in for them in January but they decided to stay at the club instead picking up a better wage and not playing.

[superpostie36]

I would like to see the set piece overhaul,and like to see sliders gone, so ai and human controls are using the same system.

[Stephanie McMahon\'s Secret Lover]

Your assistant is your team's manager.

You set the starting tactics and tick the "use current tactic" option on the holiday screen and holiday through matches (your assistant will make changes as the game goes on). Tick all the team policy stuff relating to your assistant attending the press, using opposition instructions etc as well

You still have control over all the scouting, buying etc, and occasionally your assistant will recommend you a player in the backroom - take this as him wanting you to sign that player for his team.

If he's crap, fire him and place a job advert.

Sure, you won't be able to hire Mourinho or whatever as your "manager", but it still gives you the right gameplay.

I play exactly the same way. However I would like the assistant to have the ability to buy/sell players with parameters set by me.

Currently giving youth a chance playing this way. Can get a season done in 30 mins

[havokunited]

Able to play the world super league and the basque league

whats the point of having a check nations rule and to see its valid and yet when you actually run the game it stops while loading the custom database and it just gives an error report every time

its like what is wrong with the database when the database itself cannot find anything wrong with it


also no steam

make your own servers if you want to combat piracy

[QWERTYOP]

Actually this isn't always the case IRL.

My team Hearts have recently told players that they weren't wanted and that they were to find new clubs. Clubs came in for them in January but they decided to stay at the club instead picking up a better wage and not playing.

I know it isn't ALWAYS the case IRL, but it's very rare. It's the other way around right now in FM. It really needs sorting. Players just don't sit there for years and do a Bogarde. The vast majority of players primarily just want to play. Doesn't work that way most of the time on FM though, and it should do.

[scott MUFC]

it does happen, even when they want to leave.
not everyone can get paied 105k a week to do nothing *cough*waynebridge*Cough*

[Gee_Simpson]

I know it isn't ALWAYS the case IRL, but it's very rare. It's the other way around right now in FM. It really needs sorting. Players just don't sit there for years and do a Bogarde. The vast majority of players primarily just want to play. Doesn't work that way most of the time on FM though, and it should do.

Lol at your comment in bold.

Football is full of money hungry players nowadays and I bet half of them couldn't care less whether they were playing or not as lets face it, you wouldn't complain at sitting on a bench if you were getting paid thousands/millions of pounds a year. If they have a better deal at their current club, I doubt they would be in any rush to move on, although of course you get some who are only interested in the football.

[Football Manager.]

In real life it happens. My team in real life, Wolves, had a striker called Andy Keogh, he wasn't good enough and was considered 'deadwood', along with Andrew Surman. He went down a division to Milwall, as did Surman to Norwich who then got promoted. It does depend on the wage and the individuals personality but I think it's way out of hand on this version. A lot of players in real life also take wage cuts in order to be playing, you get the feeling on this version that EVERY single player is in it for the dosh. I feel like a player would rather rot in the reserves of a Prem team than be playing regular for a team in the league below on this FM. I just don't buy it. Of course, this does happen in real life with primadonnas and self-loving individuals but it's actually very rare that a player would rather rot in the reserves on the transfer list than join another club that suits him. Even a player as High Profile as Craig Bellamy went on loan to Cardiff. I know it's only a loan but it's still significant.

My next point, most players would be wanted by at least one team in this great big footballing world, somewhere along the line, a team is found and a deal is negotiated.

completly Agree. every single player is a wayne bridge/michael owen in football manager when it just simply isn't the case in real life, if they can fix that and a few other things i might buy 2013. if not i really am for the first time not going to buy football manager this coming release. i guess this is the end for me with football manager.

[Flohrinho]

They'll continue to improve the animations and graphics, but you shouldn't expect anything near FIFA for a long, long time - and even then you'd end up with generic faces because EA have most of the image rights and refuse to let them go.

That's something I don't quite understand. For many years now this game has been one of the best selling pc games every year and SI still can't afford a good graphics development team? I know graphics aren't the major selling point of this game and good graphics alone don't make for a good football manager as EA is demonstrating every year but I still think the game day atmosphere could do with a lot of improvements and graphics are a major part of that.

I think the fact that match presentation is rather dull is a major reason why so few people actually watch an entire match, because it's just not very interesting and entertaining to watch.

[milnerpoint]

I know it isn't ALWAYS the case IRL, but it's very rare. It's the other way around right now in FM. It really needs sorting. Players just don't sit there for years and do a Bogarde. The vast majority of players primarily just want to play. Doesn't work that way most of the time on FM though, and it should do.

Completely wrong, the majority of players look at the wage first, the chances of first team games second, i could go through countless players who have left Aberdeen for more money and rarely play at their new clubs. Your living in a fantasy world i think.

[BlueSquarePremier]

I'd he happy with a new match engine, and a overhaul of the lower leagues, their just not realistic enough for me, not asking for much

[bullybeef]

I agree with the selling players issue which is a problem IRL.


Obviously we don't know what goes on behind the scenes. Maybe a buying club does enquire whether a player on high wages is willing to drop his wages and move, or whether he is happy to rot in the reserves at his present club. If he is not willing to drop his wages, negotiations end. But that doesn't solve problem in a game scenario.


So in FM I just don't understand why any club won't even bid for a player to see if he is willing to drop his wages for 1st team football. Surely these negotiations do occur IRL, and we just don't hear them (like the Wesley Sneijder joining Man Utd rumours).


Or maybe, like on FM11, when a player does agree to move for less wages, but asks for a his current club to pay the difference up until the end of his contract. This then gives the human manager more control and enables him to make calculated risk whether his is willing to pay someone whom isn't playing for him, in order to move him on for a transfer fee.


I think it keeps in allowing a manager in a game environment to have more control rather than just stubbornly not allowing clubs to bid for players on high salaries and/or long term contracts.

[CityAndColour]

Completely wrong, the majority of players look at the wage first, the chances of first team games second, i could go through countless players who have left Aberdeen for more money and rarely play at their new clubs. Your living in a fantasy world i think.

It really depends on the stature of the player involved. If he has already earned a lot of money in his career, it's likely he would look to find first team football as his career goes down. If it's a young prospect, then first team football is the only thing that's going to get him a good living out of the game going forward.

All people are saying is the game doesn't have the balance right, which I think it a fair point.

[paganizer]

New matchengine tactical options is all I want, and that is what they are working on, so I'm looking very much forward to it. Just hope they make it in for 2013 and are not pushed to 2014.

[Ackter]

That's something I don't quite understand. For many years now this game has been one of the best selling pc games every year and SI still can't afford a good graphics development team? I know graphics aren't the major selling point of this game and good graphics alone don't make for a good football manager as EA is demonstrating every year but I still think the game day atmosphere could do with a lot of improvements and graphics are a major part of that.

I think the fact that match presentation is rather dull is a major reason why so few people actually watch an entire match, because it's just not very interesting and entertaining to watch.

FIFA 12 System Requirements
OS: Windows XP / Windows Vista / Windows 7
CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 2.4GHz / Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core 5600+ (Dual core processor /Core duo 2 or better)
RAM: 2 GB
GFX: ATI RADEON HD 2900 / NVIDIA GEFORCE 8800 GS
GFX RAM: DirectX® 9.0c Compatible 3D accelerated 256 MB video card or equivalent (must support Shader Model 3.0 or above).
DirextX: DX 9

Football Manager 2012 System Requirements

OS: Windows XP/Vista/W7
CPU: XP – 1.4GHz or Faster, Vista/W7 – 2.0GHz or Faster like an Intel Pentium 4 or AMD Athlon.
RAM: XP – 512MB, Vista/W7 – 1GB
GFX RAM: 128MB
HDD: 2GB free hard drive
Audio: DirectX 9.0c compatible
LAN: TCP/IP compliant

[QWERTYOP]

It's not wrong at all. Footballers first want to play football. Somebody mentioned Wayne Bridge... Well he's at Sunderland now because he wants to play. Players want to play football. And if they're not playing, they'll move somewhere else. But not on FM...

[QWERTYOP]

Lol at your comment in bold.

Football is full of money hungry players nowadays and I bet half of them couldn't care less whether they were playing or not as lets face it, you wouldn't complain at sitting on a bench if you were getting paid thousands/millions of pounds a year. If they have a better deal at their current club, I doubt they would be in any rush to move on, although of course you get some who are only interested in the football.

This just simply isn't true.

[QWERTYOP]

Completely wrong, the majority of players look at the wage first, the chances of first team games second, i could go through countless players who have left Aberdeen for more money and rarely play at their new clubs. Your living in a fantasy world i think.

There's a difference between moving to a bigger club and gladly sitting in the reserves for years on end. It just doesn't happen in the vast majority of cases. Football players WANT to play football.

[dolph11]

The players probably left Aberdeen primarily for a better and more promising club, then, got left in the reserves. This is very different. Even then, I'm sure the players that were left in the reserves for a long period moved on to a new club. I've seen some horrific player at Wolves in my time that I've thought no other team would want, yet, they still get sold!

[QWERTYOP]

The players probably left Aberdeen primarily for a better and more promising club, then, got left in the reserves. This is very different. Even then, I'm sure the players that were left in the reserves for a long period moved on to a new club. I've seen some horrific player at Wolves in my time that I've thought no other team would want, yet, they still get sold!

You said what I was trying to say much better than I did. One teams dead wood is another teams Messi. There are THOUSANDS of clubs out there. Selling REALLY needs to be looked at. I've offered a 31 year old RVP to clubs for free before and NOBODY wanted him. Are you telling me that not ONE MLS team, or team in the far or middle east would take up the opportunity to sign RVP for nothing?! Rubbish.

Just one example.

[upthetoon]

Completely wrong, the majority of players look at the wage first, the chances of first team games second, i could go through countless players who have left Aberdeen for more money and rarely play at their new clubs. Your living in a fantasy world i think.

what this game lacks as another user has point out is the right balance between both. the game hasn't got it yet.

[QWERTYOP]

what this game lacks as another user has point out is the right balance between both. the game hasn't got it yet.

They have, they've just got it backwards!...

[Ackter]

People who think 10,11 and 12 are the same game must only be paying attention to the superficial.

[Keyzer Soze]

Both agreed the game has come stagnant and unsure if there will be any massive improvements or design changes for 13 as version 10, 11, 12 are basically the same.

You must be kidding right? "basically the same game"? the fact that FM2012 still have issues that need improvement, doesn't mean that it's "basically the same" game that FM2010 was.
Between FM2010 and FM2012 there are so many changes, that if i went back to play FM2010 i would probably think..."jesus... what a poor game"

[Sir_Liam]

At a guess we'll either get a revamping of the AI's squad building, decision making etc, or the new match engine which is in development, but we won't get both.

Personally I'd probably prefer the former as it's holding the AI back quite a bit. I'm playing in Russia and AI clubs are regularly releasing some of the best young players in the country when they're 18. I often snap them up without competition as well. Considering you have to have 5 Russians on the pitch, it's pretty dumb to release a really promising youngster like that. I'm also fed up of seeing good players who would be useful to a lot of clubs retire because the AI refuses to sign them. That's needed changing for many years now.

[ViG1980]

I think if I had to choose I would go for the former too....but I think they need both...and when I say need I'm not sure what I mean because people are likely to buy regardless. I just hope they don't think like that when deciding whether to implement both or just the one new major feature.

[dolph11]

I think that's partly the reason why there is a little room for complacency at SI - 'and when I say need I'm not sure what I mean because people are likely to buy regardless.' ViG1980

[Gee_Simpson]

This just simply isn't true.

That is your opinion and I disagree with it.

[QWERTYOP]

That is your opinion and I disagree with it.

It's not opinion, it's facts. Facts with evidence. There's a difference.

[Gee_Simpson]

Lol and how many footballers do you know? Don't state your opinion as fact because it isn't.

[dolph11]

Gee_simpson, I wouldn't say it's fact, but, I would say on FM the way the transfer system works doesn't mirror reality.

[upthetoon]

You must be kidding right? "basically the same game"? the fact that FM2012 still have issues that need improvement, doesn't mean that it's "basically the same" game that FM2010 was.
Between FM2010 and FM2012 there are so many changes, that if i went back to play FM2010 i would probably think..."jesus... what a poor game"

sometimes now in FM 2012, your strikers' stats don't matter. Because the engine is busy balancing the score etc to prevent it from becoming a cricket score. So world class strikers miss plenty of easy sitters game after game.
high finishing composure first touch etc. i don't matter anymore and it's annoying. in that aspect FM has gone backwards as far as i'm concerned. and i won't say fm 2010 will be a poor game if i play it now.

[QWERTYOP]

Lol and how many footballers do you know? Don't state your opinion as fact because it isn't.

It IS fact that the VAST majority of footballers who are told they are no longer wanted, placed on the list and put in the reserves, leave. That IS a fact. When Bogarde openly stayed at Cheslea in the reserves because of the money, it made headlines worldwide BECAUSE it was so incredible. In real life, it's the VERY rare exception. In FM, it's pretty much the norm.

See... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winston_Bogarde

But in FM, MOST players are Winston Bogarde.

[Ackter]

sometimes now in FM 2012, your strikers' stats don't matter. Because the engine is busy balancing the score etc to prevent it from becoming a cricket score. So world class strikers miss plenty of easy sitters game after game.
high finishing composure first touch etc. i don't matter anymore and it's annoying. in that aspect FM has gone backwards as far as i'm concerned. and i won't say fm 2010 will be a poor game if i play it now.

That doesn't happen.