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Thread: Accelaration and Pace

  1. #1
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    Default Accelaration and Pace

    I just made a new test starting with Legia Warsawia
    and basically I edited with fmrte my team 20 speed and pace while everyone else 1 speed and pace
    (it decreased and increased in both because of the current and potential abilities)
    Then I started playing with Zero sea's v5 tactic
    and these were the results:
    Fulham 3-4 legia
    Legia 5-1 Fulham
    FC Twente 2-5 Legia
    Legia 4-0 Twente
    Thats only in Europa league in the league itself I am predicted 2nd
    and for the moment
    4 games 4 won
    19 scored 1 conceded
    I dominated every single game with 20 shots + in every single game and 70% + possession...
    Legia is a good team in poland but very poor in Europe... I am gonna continue testing however it seems that pace/acceleration is one of the most important
    or the most important attribute in the game.
    I also tested fitness (natural fitness/stamina)
    strength (stamina/strength)
    by doing same as speed/pace
    no "findings"

    I remember in cm 01/02 position was thought to be the most important stat making you invincible in defense ... it seems speed makes such an impact
    maybe if I only edit my players speed wise and leave the others "untouched" i wouldn't be that successful but its certainly an interesting aspect...
    plz comment

  2. #2
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    Of course pace is going to have a huge impact on the game but so would putting first touch and passing on all your players to 20. By increasing any 2 stats across your team to 20 you improve your team a crazy amount.

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    ...wait, what?

    Do you mean that you made it so your team had pace-acceleration of 20-20 whilst everyone you faced had 1-1? And you're surprised you won games? If you set your passing on all players to 20 and the opponents all to 1 you'd win as well I'm fairly certain. To completely cripple players in one aspect of a game and give yourself a massive edge will of course make you a force. This doesn't mean that pace and acceleration are the most important though. Do some tests with other attributes like Finishing-Composure, Passing, Strength, Jumping-Heading, Tackling-Marking, etc. I'd hypothesise that these would yield similar results.

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    yeah but the fact that i get possession only because of speed? my players are still rubbish, the other stats are rubbish.... In real life if everyone was faster but then u can't pass or shoot u wont win games the other team could just be passing the ball everywhere on the pitch and you shouldn't be able to get over 80% possession doesn't make sense...

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    Quote Originally Posted by penza View Post
    yeah but the fact that i get possession only because of speed? my players are still rubbish, the other stats are rubbish.... In real life if everyone was faster but then u can't pass or shoot u wont win games the other team could just be passing the ball everywhere on the pitch and you shouldn't be able to get over 80% possession doesn't make sense...
    If one team was forced to walk the entire game and the other was allowed to run how do you think possession would fare out? Thats right, the running team would have near all of it because the walking players cant get near them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by penza View Post
    yeah but the fact that i get possession only because of speed? my players are still rubbish, the other stats are rubbish.... In real life if everyone was faster but then u can't pass or shoot u wont win games the other team could just be passing the ball everywhere on the pitch and you shouldn't be able to get over 80% possession doesn't make sense...
    yeah but then you should increase the oppositions passing to 20 if you want this to happen, you cant just negatively change the opponents stats and expect them to suddenly adapt their style of play.

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    I did this experiment on FM11.

    Made a team in the DB. Duplicated them so they were identical. Gave one team 20 - 20 pace and acceleration, and 5 in every other attribute.

    Gave the other team 5 - 5 in pace and acceleration, and 20 in every other attribute.

    The pacier, but far less skillful team, beat the the slower, far more skillful team, 5 games out of 10, with 3 draws and 2 losses.

    This to me proved Pace and Acceleration are far too over-powered. Those 2 skills alone effectively negated all other attributes, weather physical, technical, or mental.

    It was like watching a team full of Usain Bolts dominate a team full of Luca Modric's.

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    I am trying with leicester predicted 5th with balance and strength 20 and the rest 1
    Its not the same.. 20 games 14 won 3 drawn 3 lost
    out of league cup vs reading on penalties ...
    I bet if i edited speed and pace I would have won all my games... it is definitely overpowered
    I continued my legia game i won 6-1 vs. bayern.... lol and won treble

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    Penza, when you say you used FMRT to edit speed and pace do you mean you edited the clubs attributes or the players within the club and then whoever you were playing against? (note i havent used Editor since CM days)

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    Oh sorry yeah I mean the players themselves which means editing only the two single stats of acceleration and pace... u can do "mass edit" with fmrte which allows you to edit everyone in the
    game ...

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    cool, i thought you ment that but just wanted to check, i think while it isnt 100% full proof, it defo adds weight behind the theory of signing players with high stats of acceleration and pace, especially at low league level. i.e jamil adam. very poor player yet he is capable of scoring 50 plus goals a season. (considered a quick player at lower level, but il add he does score in the SPL lol not exactly EPL but hey)

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    Acc and pace are 2 most important attributes in game, I checked it with tool I managed to get from testers. They have biggest weight and are consuming most of CA. So it's logic that they are most important attributes in ME. Also....waht you did is like having 10 Husein Bolts in your team, while your opponent players are allowed just to walk!

    Check this, but I warn you, you will loose lot of time. http://community.sigames.com/showthr...hlight=Ljuba82

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    Players shouldn't need high pace in order to position themselves correctly, mark tightly, tackle at the right time, win headers, make good runs, anticipate moves etc etc etc... but in FM that's what quickness does. It basically modifies everything a player does. By having extreme mental attributes (like John Terry, Huntelaar or De Rossi) they can overcome lack of speed, but the technical attributes won't do this to a noticeable degree - with the exception of Dribbling, perhaps.

    Good player:
    Technical attributes 5
    Mental attributes 5
    Physical attributes 20

    Mediocre player:
    Technical attributes 5
    Mental attributes 20
    Physical attributes 5

    Bad player:
    Technical attributes 20
    Mental attributes 5
    Physical attributes 5


    I haven't done any tests to "prove" this, but I don't really have to...

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    It's one of those near impossible to say for sure, as people argue in real life about whether technical, mental or physical is more important, and it also changes over time with different tactics anyway.

    In my opinion, pace should be the single most important stat for most (not all) positions, and it may be a touch over important in the ME but not by so much as to be a disaster. Just my opinion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by penza View Post
    I just made a new test starting with Legia Warsawia
    and basically I edited with fmrte my team 20 speed and pace while everyone else 1 speed and pace
    (it decreased and increased in both because of the current and potential abilities)
    Then I started playing with Zero sea's v5 tactic
    and these were the results:
    Fulham 3-4 legia
    Legia 5-1 Fulham
    FC Twente 2-5 Legia
    Legia 4-0 Twente
    Thats only in Europa league in the league itself I am predicted 2nd
    and for the moment
    4 games 4 won
    19 scored 1 conceded
    I dominated every single game with 20 shots + in every single game and 70% + possession...
    Legia is a good team in poland but very poor in Europe... I am gonna continue testing however it seems that pace/acceleration is one of the most important
    or the most important attribute in the game.
    I also tested fitness (natural fitness/stamina)
    strength (stamina/strength)
    by doing same as speed/pace
    no "findings"

    I remember in cm 01/02 position was thought to be the most important stat making you invincible in defense ... it seems speed makes such an impact
    maybe if I only edit my players speed wise and leave the others "untouched" i wouldn't be that successful but its certainly an interesting aspect...
    plz comment
    If all players at say wigan had the pace of say walcott in real life they'd be pushing for europe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by penza View Post
    yeah but the fact that i get possession only because of speed? my players are still rubbish, the other stats are rubbish.... In real life if everyone was faster but then u can't pass or shoot u wont win games the other team could just be passing the ball everywhere on the pitch and you shouldn't be able to get over 80% possession doesn't make sense...
    If the other teams player are as slow as a snail no matter how good they are at other skills you will be all over them not letting them on the ball because your far to fast anytime they got the ball you'd be on at them so quick.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BiggusD View Post
    Players shouldn't need high pace in order to position themselves correctly, mark tightly, tackle at the right time, win headers, make good runs, anticipate moves etc etc etc... but in FM that's what quickness does. It basically modifies everything a player does. By having extreme mental attributes (like John Terry, Huntelaar or De Rossi) they can overcome lack of speed, but the technical attributes won't do this to a noticeable degree - with the exception of Dribbling, perhaps.

    Good player:
    Technical attributes 5
    Mental attributes 5
    Physical attributes 20

    Mediocre player:
    Technical attributes 5
    Mental attributes 20
    Physical attributes 5

    Bad player:
    Technical attributes 20
    Mental attributes 5
    Physical attributes 5


    I haven't done any tests to "prove" this, but I don't really have to...
    Noone says they didnt do as you say they should be able to, but if you are a team as slow as snails and there is super fast players the super faster team will see more of the ball.

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    Quote Originally Posted by toon army 06 View Post
    If the other teams player are as slow as a snail no matter how good they are at other skills you will be all over them not letting them on the ball because your far to fast anytime they got the ball you'd be on at them so quick.
    I disagree. There was a post above where (admittedly in FM11, but I doubt it's changed drastically in FM12) Erimus1876 created two teams. One had 20 Pace, Acc, 5 in everything else, the other had 5 Pace, Acc, 20 in everything else. The fast team won more.

    This is very unrealistic. When the fast team have the ball they would find it very hard to create chances. They would have non-league standard skills against a team whose positional play was immaculate. Their only chance would be to play the ball into space and run nto it, but with such low technical, tactical and mental skills this wouldn't get them far.

    When the slow team have the ball they would completely outpass their opponents, working the ball up the field. Pace would not be enough to win the ball back against players this good.

    Pace/acceleration without stamina or workrate means they can't or won't run fast all game.

  19. #19
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    Also, forgot to mention, in real life players don't run all game.

    A slow player should walk or jog as fast as a quick player, and their running speed shouldn't be too much different either. Surely it's only when sprinting (which is rare) that you'd see big differences.

    Not sure whether Opta, or anyone else, has compiled stats to confirm or deny that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bromley Raven View Post
    I disagree. There was a post above where (admittedly in FM11, but I doubt it's changed drastically in FM12) Erimus1876 created two teams. One had 20 Pace, Acc, 5 in everything else, the other had 5 Pace, Acc, 20 in everything else. The fast team won more.

    This is very unrealistic. When the fast team have the ball they would find it very hard to create chances. They would have non-league standard skills against a team whose positional play was immaculate. Their only chance would be to play the ball into space and run nto it, but with such low technical, tactical and mental skills this wouldn't get them far.

    When the slow team have the ball they would completely outpass their opponents, working the ball up the field. Pace would not be enough to win the ball back against players this good.

    Pace/acceleration without stamina or workrate means they can't or won't run fast all game.
    Have to agree with that, the technically superior team should win really, ok they will get closed down faster, and through balls may not work as well but cmon, they would be completely outplayed in every part of the pitch. All they could do try and win anything is run really fast

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    Two words. Gabriel Agbonlahor.

    Two more words. Ivica Olic.

    Both are 2 of the best I've ever used in FM. Both have ghastly technical attributes.

    I feel like the weighting of physical attributes and foot ability mask how good a player truly is.

    Because of the way things are set up, if a player has like 20 accel/pace, then his technical attributes more than likely appear less than what his technical ability actually is. Same thing with players who are 2 footed.

    I've always thought that physical attributes should hold no bearing on mental or technical attributes but in the current system where they are all grouped together and the max is 200, thats what is going to happen.

    Trust me the I understand the frustration of watching a player with 11 for dribbling runs circles around your defense like he is Leo Messi. In all reality a player who has terrible dribbling and insane accel and pace should be a terrible dribbler because it is harder to dribble with the ball at high speed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aderow View Post
    Two words. Gabriel Agbonlahor.

    Two more words. Ivica Olic.

    Both are 2 of the best I've ever used in FM. Both have ghastly technical attributes.

    I feel like the weighting of physical attributes and foot ability mask how good a player truly is.

    Because of the way things are set up, if a player has like 20 accel/pace, then his technical attributes more than likely appear less than what his technical ability actually is. Same thing with players who are 2 footed.

    I've always thought that physical attributes should hold no bearing on mental or technical attributes but in the current system where they are all grouped together and the max is 200, thats what is going to happen.

    Trust me the I understand the frustration of watching a player with 11 for dribbling runs circles around your defense like he is Leo Messi. In all reality a player who has terrible dribbling and insane accel and pace should be a terrible dribbler because it is harder to dribble with the ball at high speed.
    The bolded bit is touched upon in the manual;

    A player with strong physical attributes is one who can potentially fit into a team better than a player strong in only one area in the other attribute groups. If a player is strong in these attributes he’ll be able to play a competent game and make sure he isn’t embarrassed much should he be less than adequately skilled because he has the required attributes to be a solid footballer. A skilled and mentally strong player who also has strong physical attributes can be considered a fantastic all-round player, as being strong in all three areas is pretty much what you look for.

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    Very interesting thread

    Ask a defender one thing he would hate defending against most, 99% of them would say pace.

    However, pace does not win you football matches on its own in real life. Theo Walcott the best example, there is no point having all that pace with absoutely no end product at all (maybe 1 in 20 crosses are any good and 1 in 15 shots go in)

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    pace is fantastic, my united save hernandez scored more then 1 a game. the thing with those 2 stats are, counter attacking, and killer ball receiving, as well as beating the offisde trap.


    erm...yea
    interestingly his strike partner is scoring around the same him as a DLF... that is wilfried
    Last edited by scott MUFC; 17-02-2012 at 15:10.

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    Interesting thread, but it seems to me that the game is flawed, since it let physical players perform at a higher level than their mental and technical skills should let them.

    I think for everyone who has played football, has experienced when you play a training match between the old guys against the young ones then the old guys always wins. Their vision, anticipation, positioning and team work are
    just something that takes pace out of the equation, except if the fast players are also technical gifted.

    I would say Barcelona is an example of technical and mentality players should dominate the game. I would say they are a team of not relying on pace/acceleration.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleon View Post
    The bolded bit is touched upon in the manual;
    Don't think I've ever read the manual before

    Thats all well and good but shouldn't physically superior have less of an effect when playing technically and mentally strong players that you find at the top level? And yet I've seen players with only good physical stats and terrible everything else have successful careers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ljuba1982 View Post
    Acc and pace are 2 most important attributes in game, I checked it with tool I managed to get from testers. They have biggest weight and are consuming most of CA. So it's logic that they are most important attributes in ME. Also....waht you did is like having 10 Husein Bolts in your team, while your opponent players are allowed just to walk!

    Check this, but I warn you, you will loose lot of time. http://community.sigames.com/showthr...hlight=Ljuba82
    Kjudos Ljuba, read this thread a while ago, a very interesting waste of time it was too. ;)

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    Holy crap I remember that thread too

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    Ondrej Kusnir was always beast in this game as winger playing for Norwich.This says much about pace and acceleration and how OP are this attributes.And in reverse players like Di Natale,Totti,Cardozo,etc are underpeforming just because of this and players with better pace and with average mental and technical stats perfom much better wich is abit ridicoulos.
    In conclusion trequartista and big target strikers kinda suck if dont have speed.
    Last edited by Bebetu; 18-02-2012 at 05:45.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scott MUFC View Post
    pace is fantastic, my united save hernandez scored more then 1 a game. the thing with those 2 stats are, counter attacking, and killer ball receiving, as well as beating the offisde trap.


    erm...yea
    interestingly his strike partner is scoring around the same him as a DLF... that is wilfried
    thats welbeck

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    yea i know, i am on my blackpool save, but same rules apply

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    I'm pretty sure these are some of the most important stats in real life, right now. This is how the modern game is played. Ask any older player(40+) and they'll all tell you that football was slower in their time. Heck, these stats are crucial even in anime(Giant Killing, rather good football anime series).
    I also remember Dribbling being so overrated in FM2010. Had a crappy winger with 19 dribbling become Player of the year, for 15+ dribblings a match and tons of assists.

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