Originally posted by Amaroq:
I've been thinking that high PA should be a bit more common, in the game and in the initial DB, but that only works if the development model is less predictable: if high PA doesn't guarantee high CA at some point in his career.
This is one of the main things I'd like to see. Bringing young players through the ranks is, I believe, one of the most enjoyable parts of the game and having more variation in this area would be a massive step forward for me.
I'd really like to see the development model made a lot more sensitive to "Playing at the right level".
For example, if I take a 16-year-old with low CA - even if he has 198 PA - and play him in the Premiership, I don't think he should learn much from that experience. He's being asked to play "in over his head", and he'll be in "survival mode" - hardly conducive to learning. The resulting poor performances and media pressure may also do permanent harm to his confidence - but I want the experience to do nothing for him.
Likewise, if I play him in my Reserves, he'll learn up to a certain point .. but shouldn't be able to reach Premiership quality without regular competitive football. I'd need to send him on loan or sell him before he could grow into the rest of his potential.
In that way, you'd be a lot more likely to see "late bloomers", the 23-year-old who never could break into the first team at X, but once given the chance at Y, matures into a starter.
In particular, I'd like to see Champions League / Euro / World Cup performances being almost a requirement to reach "elite" level.
Interesting ideas, and I agree to an extent. I agree that for many youngsters playing at the top level too early could be more detrimental than beneficial, and care should be needed to slowely bring them into the team. However I think this should be tied in with personality. A very professional and determined youngster with the right personality should not be affected as much by this and could even benefit (eg a Rooney type player).
This would again give more variation and would add something else for the user to consider. Currently I don't worry at all about a youngsters personality when deciding whether to put them into the first team.
I definitely agree with the last part completely though, for a player to reach his absolute peak he should need to play at the very highes level, be that world cup finals, champions leagues or whatever.
Anticipation - anticipating the run of play seems like a clear experience-linked trait in my mind; its one I'd expect to increase over time, not be static/tutored.
I'll agree it should be able to be improved to some degree with training but for me this is one of those 'natural ability' type attributes that you can't just learn.
- since this tends to be "Ability to spot the killer pass" in FM terms, I think its probably also one which should be learn-able. I just don't see a 16-year-old having Beckham's ability to spot a pass.
Good point, perhaps creativity is an attribute that can be improved through training.
Flair - yeah, we love videos of kids doing amazing tricks, but the ability to apply flair in a match? Again, I'd say Cristiano Ronaldo's got more Flair now than he did at 16.
I disagree. I think Ronaldo still had as much flair when he was 16, for me flair is the desire to 'show off' and use your natural skill as much as possible. I think Ronaldo now just has the abilities that he didn't have when he was 16 to turn his flair into an end product, i.e pace, crossing, passing, technique etc.
Both of those two, you might want to put in a "change resistant" category: in other words, making sure that the most you could really gain in them would be 5-7 points. A kid with 3 Creativity will never learn into a 20, and maybe you can't train it at all..
Totally agree for creativity, but as I said, I think flair is something you have naturally and rarely increases at all.
Decisions - I can see the argument that Decisions shouldn't drop precipitously when a player gets old, but on the other hand, I've also seen players IRL who make Decisions based on what they would have been able to do three years earlier, not what their aging body is capable of doing now. So I can see it both ways.
I see your point, perhaps this again should be linked in with personality and determination in some way. An intelligent player (I'm not sure how you would represent intelligence in the game) would quite comfortable adapt the decisions they make based on their age and ability. Whereas a player with lesser attributes in certain areas may suffer as you have pointed out. As a general rule though I feel many top players decisions improve mainly due to experience. So if the ability was lacking in the game to have decisions affected by personality etc I think I'd rather accept all players decisions being influcened by experience rather than the way it works now.
- I'd have added this to your list of experience-based attributes. How do you train composure-under-pressure?
Maybe its tutorable...
Agree. I think I was looking at this attribute incorrectly. I was picturing a striker practicing shot after shot in training but in effect this would only improve his finishing. As you rightly point out composure-under-pressure is entirely different and should indeed be affected positively or negatively by the players experience.
Team Work - I might almost have linked that one with the club's mentality. A team of guys who "Would Die For Each Other" should teach and train Team Work in the younger players who are thrown into the mix ... but a group which is at each other's throats might actually harm Team Work in each other, learning to be selfish because your teammates won't have your back.
I like this idea and I think coupled with the idea I put forward (i.e having this also linked with the amount of time spent with the same group of players) would make team work improvements/decreases much more realistic.
The other thing I'd like to see on the "aging" model is the ability for a player to drop deeper. For example a "Natural" AM might drop back to MC by age 30 and close out his career as a DM at age 34 - still able to contribute on experience, but no longer really an attacking midfielder even if that was his childhood position.
Another very good idea, a good example of this is Dwight Yorke at the team I support, Sunderland. He used to be a very successful striker for Man Utd but is now playing at CM for us. He's also an excellent example of a player who's experience is very useful despite his age. In FM currently a newly promoted team would rarely look to sign this type of player as their experience really doesn't count for much.
All in all I think many of these ideas would make the development model much more realistic, exciting and impressive.