POLL- STEAM for FM 2012

[pauly1616]

How will compulsory STEAM effect you?


VOTE ONLY - TO DISCUSS GO HERE:

http://community.sigames.com/showthr...ivation/page11

[Lord Rowell]

I voted "Furious - I will not buy the game".

Have to add I think the poll options aren't that clear. I actually also think Steam is a good application - my computer and internet connection handle it fine.

I just don't believe that people should be FORCED to use it, which is why I am furious and won't be buying the game. There is a very important principle at stake, that people should be free to decide what to put on their computer. There are also equity issues of access for people without stable / high bandwidth internet connections.

[chob]

ive been running the game on steam for a few years now and it's great.

[Lord Rowell]

I voted "Furious - I will not buy the game".

Have to add I think the poll options aren't that clear. I actually also think Steam is a good application - my computer and internet connection handle it fine.

I just don't believe that people should be FORCED to use it, which is why I am furious and won't be buying the game. There is a very important principle at stake, that people should be free to decide what to put on their computer. There are also equity issues of access for people without stable / high bandwidth internet connections.

Also, I'm concerned a new poll will now not represent the population. I suspect a lot of the dissenters have got fed up of SI and vanished never to return.

[Barside]

If this is a vote only thread then it serves a purpose, if it turns into another stream of posts on the subject then it will just cause problems.

Just an idea but how about people select their option in the poll but refrain from additional posts that are better served being made in the stickied thread.

[CaptainPlanet]

Problem being, if there are no posts, it drops down the page.

[CaptainPlanet]

There are also equity issues of access for people without stable / high bandwidth internet connections.

You do not need a stable or a high bandwidth connection to do a one off authentication of a game via Steam.

[Barside]

People could just post 'voted +10 characters' or as it nears the bottom of the page it gets a little bump.

[Cougar2010]

You do not need a stable or a high bandwidth connection to do a one off authentication of a game via Steam.

True but patching the game certainly won't be as easy.

[Neil Brock]

I really can't see the point in this, there's already been a poll for this which was closed as it descended into exactly the same as the other thread. We're aware that a percentage of the forum users are unhappy that they have to use Steam to play FM, but you have to remember these forums are only a percentage of the overall userbase of the Football Manager game. And without trying to come across as harsh, the decision has been made and won't change on the basis of a forum poll.

[SCIAG]

you have to remember these forums are only a percentage of the overall userbase of the Football Manager game.

Probably (generally) the percentage who are most computer literate? More likely to have high-speed internet?

[Ackter]

As long as it doesn't descend into the circular arguments the other did, I don't see a problem with leaving this open.

[jags4ever]

Bout time that games were made download only and not boxed IMO.

Still gotta laugh at the "OMG THE SKY IS FALLING DOWN" posts all over this forum , some people should just be locked up

[milnerpoint]

this is a waste of time, everyone at SI knew this would cause an outcry, anyone who thinks otherwise is completely deluded, just like the patch threads this will die down soon and everyone will just get on with playing FM. It does seem that a big chunk of those unhappy are those who are vocally overly critical of FM, so hopefully the forums will cheer up a bit when they're gone.

btw i voted i like it, again

[SCIAG]

Bout time that games were made download only and not boxed IMO.

Why on Earth would you want to take away other people's choice?

I don't like downloads, I like owning a physical copy. I don't begrudge people who wish to download it for whatever reason (maybe they don't have a disk drive), and generally those who download don't care if people without internet connections or who like the security of a physical copy, purchase a boxed version. Live and let live.

[milnerpoint]

Why on Earth would you want to take away other people's choice?

I don't like downloads, I like owning a physical copy. I don't begrudge people who wish to download it for whatever reason (maybe they don't have a disk drive), and generally those who download don't care if people without internet connections or who like the security of a physical copy, purchase a boxed version. Live and let live.

Sadly it looks like you will have to get used to not owning a physical copy of anything, this is way media is going, music, games eventually films, they will all be download only in the next 5-10 years.

[El_Strict]

I really can't see the point in this, there's already been a poll for this which was closed as it descended into exactly the same as the other thread. We're aware that a percentage of the forum users are unhappy that they have to use Steam to play FM, but you have to remember these forums are only a percentage of the overall userbase of the Football Manager game. And without trying to come across as harsh, the decision has been made and won't change on the basis of a forum poll.

Thanks for replying. I don't think anybody expects the decision to be changed. This is about being unhappy with SI, not about the decision being changed.

And as for "these forums are only a percentage of the userbase," what a stupid thing to say. The other percentage of the userbase is most likely to be even worse at computers, and will be more inconvenienced by steam than people here who could work the program correctly whether or not they agree with it. Yet more arrogance and neglect of the fanbase by SI.

I have voted by the way.

[spizaa]

Its not rocket science to DL and install Steam. If you can grasp how to play FM then I'm quite sure you should be able to manage installing Steam.

[Neil Brock]

Thanks for replying. I don't think anybody expects the decision to be changed. This is about being unhappy with SI, not about the decision being changed.

And as for "these forums are only a percentage of the userbase," what a stupid thing to say. The other percentage of the userbase is most likely to be even worse at computers, and will be more inconvenienced by steam than people here who could work the program correctly whether or not they agree with it. Yet more arrogance and neglect of the fanbase by SI.

I have voted by the way.

On the last poll 345 people voted - I don't have exact sales figures for FM11 but I'd be surprised if that was 1% of our overall sales figures. These forums are only a percentage of the userbase. That's not really a stupid thing to say, it's just stating a fact

[El_Strict]

On the last poll 345 people voted - I don't have exact sales figures for FM11 but I'd be surprised if that was 1% of our overall sales figures. These forums are only a percentage of the userbase. That's not really a stupid thing to say, it's just stating a fact

Sorry I wasn't clear. Your implication is that, despite around half of the people on here despising SI's allignment with Steam, it doesn't matter because "these forums are only a pecentage of the userbase," so don't provide an accurate sample of opinion. As you are backing the decision it is obvious that you are implying that the other percentage of the userbase will receive Steam well. That is what I was referring to as stupid.

The nature of a forum attracts the more technology capable segment of a fanbase - 50% of which dislike the decision. Do you think that, on the whole, less computer literate people will be happy or unhappy about having their FM experience complicated?

Please take your time, and consult with the PR department, or whatever it is you all seem to be doing to come up with such consistently wishy washy answers. Sorry for being an asshole about it.

[Cougar2010]

On the last poll 345 people voted - I don't have exact sales figures for FM11 but I'd be surprised if that was 1% of our overall sales figures. These forums are only a percentage of the userbase. That's not really a stupid thing to say, it's just stating a fact

Its not even close to 1% of the userbase but the question should be does it give a fair representation of the overall userbase.

[spizaa]

Do you think that, on the whole, less computer literate people will be happy or unhappy about having their FM experience complicated?

How is it complicating? The game itself is complicated, you should be able to install an application if you can play the game?

[hugo_rune]

Where's the polll option for 'Furious - I was going to download the game on torrent, but now I can't freeload and am going to have to buy it instead' because that's probably more appropriate for a number of users, not thinking of anyone in particular.

[El_Strict]

@Hugo_rune, I actually doubt that people who pirate the game are particularly worried. I'll bet anybody who wants to a £10er that the game will be avaliable for free this year, maybe even before the official release date.

[Indi75]

The nature of a forum attracts the more technology capable segment of a fanbase - 50% of which dislike the decision. Do you think that, on the whole, less computer literate people will be happy or unhappy about having their FM experience complicated?

Crap. Not a single one of umpteen FM playing mates or acquaintances frequents these forums and yet we're all techno geeks of some form. Argument is completely unfounded and amounts to nothing more than clutching at straws.

My 7 year old can master the use of steam ffs.

[Kriss]

As warned this thread will be closed if it turns into a second edition of the main one, and it's getting perilously close.

[pigfacemonkeyman]

Why is this thread still open? Oh wait, the poll is in favour of Steam.

Here is the original, closed by Neil Brock, (SI), 12 hours after it started:

http://community.sigames.com/showthr...eam-activation

[El_Strict]

Crap. Not a single one of umpteen FM playing mates or acquaintances frequents these forums and yet we're all techno geeks of some form. Argument is completely unfounded and amounts to nothing more than clutching at straws.

My 7 year old can master the use of steam ffs.

I have never said Steam is difficult to use. My point is that I believe a survey of the entire FM playing base would be more negative than a survey of just people on this forum. Maybe we are both guilty of extrapolating our own personal experiences to come up with some sort of rule, and I am happy to accept that.

What I said though, was neither unfounded nor clutching at straws.

[hugo_rune]

My bad, really - I'll refrain from being snarky about it. I still can't see any legitimate reason for opposing Steam activation, it is far more convenient and safe than many claim, and I think anti-piracy measures in general are good for real consumers, good for developers, good for investors. And I think SI are well placed to understand what the impact of this - either having it in, or out - is on their business.

[Kriss]

Why is this thread still open? Oh wait, the poll is in favour of Steam.

Here is the original, closed by Neil Brock, (SI), 12 hours after it started:

http://community.sigames.com/showthr...eam-activation

So you'd like this closed because it doesn't reflect what you want it to?

No problem, just say the word.

[pigfacemonkeyman]

So you'd like this closed because it doesn't reflect what you want it to?

No problem, just say the word.

And that word would be? I believe I asked a question rather than made a request.

[Lazaru5]

voted

you know what I chose

[x42bn6]

On the last poll 345 people voted - I don't have exact sales figures for FM11 but I'd be surprised if that was 1% of our overall sales figures. These forums are only a percentage of the userbase. That's not really a stupid thing to say, it's just stating a fact

A well-designed poll of a couple of thousand people can be accurately generalised over the entire population of China.

Personally, I think this poll isn't that well-designed, but I digress - what is clear is that there is a fair amount of anger.

[postal postie]

i have steam on my computer. i dont download games from steam. i haven't played a game through steam since half life 2: episode one, all those years ago. its easily ignorable and doesn't go out of its way to make me know its there. so i dont care. from what i read, its a one time activation and if my internet connection goes down it wont stop me from playing the game.

[Kriss]

And that word would be? I believe I asked a question rather than made a request.

You insinuated it was still open because it leant towards favouring Steam, I'm telling you I'm quite willing to close it to demonstrate that isn't the case.

[Kriss]

A well-designed poll of a couple of thousand people can be accurately generalised over the entire population of China.

Personally, I think this poll isn't that well-designed, but I digress - what is clear is that there is a fair amount of anger.

Personally I'm not a bit surprised, it mirrors what I've seen elsewhere in exactly the same circumstances, we'll not see what that translates to for sometime yet though.

[rancer890]

Why is this thread still open? Oh wait, the poll is in favour of Steam.

Here is the original, closed by Neil Brock, (SI), 12 hours after it started:

http://community.sigames.com/showthr...eam-activation

At least this thread has an unbiased OP. No problem with having an opinion, but I think this poll is better. There's more choices than a 'yes' or 'no' answer. Your OP is obviously aiming to get the 'no' people to your side. And that thread was going nowhere anyways and degenerating into pro-Steam vs anti-Steam insults.

I voted great btw.

[Indi75]

I have never said Steam is difficult to use. My point is that I believe a survey of the entire FM playing base would be more negative than a survey of just people on this forum. Maybe we are both guilty of extrapolating our own personal experiences to come up with some sort of rule, and I am happy to accept that.

What I said though, was neither unfounded nor clutching at straws.

You can attempt to gloss that up any way you choose. You quite clearly stipulated that persons on the forum were the "more technology capable segment' of a fanbase" and then described those not on the forum as "less computer literate people"

Regardless of personal experience, the claim is unfounded and in my opinion was tantamount to clutching at straws - in this case to present a flawed argument.

Nevertheless, I care not about Steam, I've gone from hater to relaxed user and benefited hugely from the resource. What does concern me is all the scaremongering and outright jingoism being allowed to propagate in the very forum most new users, curious about the game, will be coming too. Hardly a good advert.

[Indi75]

Why is this thread still open? Oh wait, the poll is in favour of Steam.

Here is the original, closed by Neil Brock, (SI), 12 hours after it started:

http://community.sigames.com/showthr...eam-activation

In which 194 people either didn't care or were in favour of Steam versus 151 not in favour.

I'd say that poll was in favour of Steam too. Infact as a Steam user with no issues I was sorely tempted to go for the 'don't care' option as a measure of my complete lack of concern over Steam.

[x42bn6]

Nevertheless, I care not about Steam, I've gone from hater to relaxed user and benefited hugely from the resource. What does concern me is all the scaremongering and outright jingoism being allowed to propagate in the very forum most new users, curious about the game, will be coming too. Hardly a good advert.

Welcome to the real world, which is never black and white, where users can gain an understanding from all parts of the userbase, not just those who like Steam.

Negative responses are just as important as positive ones.

[pigfacemonkeyman]

In which 194 people either didn't care or were in favour of Steam versus 151 not in favour.

I'd say that poll was in favour of Steam too. Infact as a Steam user with no issues I was sorely tempted to go for the 'don't care' option as a measure of my complete lack of concern over Steam.

It wasn't about being in favour of Steam or not, and, as you proved with this post, you and people like you are trying to make it that. I'm so glad you 'don't care' enough to come and post about it.

[Kriss]

Enough, you had enough warnings.

Closed

[Matt_no_7]

What does concern me is all the scaremongering and outright jingoism being allowed to propagate in the very forum most new users, curious about the game, will be coming too. Hardly a good advert.

I doubt making Steam mandatory is a better advert in fairness. I'm in no way, shape or form against users of Steam as they feel it's best for them and i'm all for the old saying "Each to their own." I mean who am i to tell someone what they should or shouldn't be doing? But what i am against is us who just don't want to use Steam being forced into it. Some have never used it and just don't want to, some have and don't want to because of that. I once tried a banana, didn't like it at all so i'll never try it again no matter what i may or may not be missing out on. Same goes here, i've tried it, didn't like it, won't use it EVER again.

I am disgusted at this whole situation. But don't believe that WE cannot change a companies mind, case in point a couple of years ago was EA.

Fight Night 4 was released with no button control option, EA said they will not add button controls at all prompting many to cancel pre-orders or just refuse to buy it..... 3 months of outcry later we have button controls as a free DLC. A small victory but a win is a win. If enough people voice their disgust and follow through with threats of non purchase companies will take notice and re-think things.