View Poll Results: What do you feel about having to activate your FM12 through Steam?

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  • I Hate It

    151 43.77%
  • I Don't Care

    89 25.80%
  • I like it

    105 30.43%
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Thread: Poll on Steam activation

  1. #1
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    Angry Poll on Steam activation

    http://community.sigames.com/showthr...012-Activation

    :mad: This is outrageous. Don't do it. :mad:

    Make your feelings known, vote now.

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    Can I say "yes"? I'm fine with Steam.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SWaRFeGa View Post
    Can I say "yes"? I'm fine with Steam.
    Yes, erm I think you just did.

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    If I have to install Steam to play FM12 then I won't be buying it, no matter how immense it looks!

    I play only FM12, I don't play any other games... Why the hell do I need an invasive, resource hogging, pos like Steam running as well?

    Definitely the worst decision SI/Sega have ever made...

    Steam = No thanks

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    Whoa.... already a poll post?

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    I play only FM12, I don't play any other games... Why the hell do I need an invasive, resource hogging, pos like Steam running as well?
    Steam uses up less memory than firefox or IE. It is ridiculous some of the myths on the internet about steam.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pigfacemonkeyman View Post
    Yes, erm I think you just did.
    Erm, thanks.

    Not sure in the point of a poll where everyone is told what to vote for beforehand - but whatever.

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    I've been using Steam since 2004 and have 258 games on it. I'm sorry, I'll be saying yes .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    I play only FM12, I don't play any other games... Why the hell do I need an invasive, resource hogging, pos like Steam running as well?
    Because something with over 30 million accounts is a pos right? I haven't seen it take up more then 200k of ram, and unless your computer is God knows how old (in which case you should upgrade), then it won't even effect you to the slightest. The average computer nowadays has 4gb of ram, Steam is barely hogging any of that. I personally have 16GB of ram, I wish Steam used more so I could get a better use out of it .
    Last edited by Dune297; 16-09-2011 at 14:56.

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    sorry i wont be buying fm again, i won't be forced to install third party software on my pc regardless if its harmless or not just to play fm

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    Quote Originally Posted by cemendur88 View Post
    Steam uses up less memory than firefox or IE. It is ridiculous some of the myths on the internet about steam.
    Myth? So I haven't run it for two years plus on my laptop with FM09 then? Is that what you're saying?

    This isn't a myth, my opinion is from BITTER experience... It's like Microsoft forcing everybody to have IE installed on their machine, it's wrong, it's illegal and it's immoral!

    No, no, and THRICE NO! :mad:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    Myth? So I haven't run it for two years plus on my laptop with FM09 then? Is that what you're saying?

    This isn't a myth, my opinion is from BITTER experience... It's like Microsoft forcing everybody to have IE installed on their machine, it's wrong, it's illegal and it's immoral!

    No, no, and THRICE NO! :mad:
    It's a myth its a resource hog. On the PC i'm on right now steam is using 29k of memory, firefox 250k. Its even using less than Outlook (49k).

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    Last year FM11 was available with pre-loading which meant that as soon as the game came out, it was activated and ready to play.
    Steam is also great for automatic patching and it's very easy to take screenshots, upload them to the Steam Cloud and then post them online - quicker than finding them and uploading to photobucket or elsewhere.
    If there's one thing I don't like about it, it's not having the game case. But that's me being really picky.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cemendur88 View Post
    It's a myth its a resource hog. On the PC i'm on right now steam is using 29k of memory, firefox 250k. Its even using less than Outlook (49k).
    Yes, well.. I can't give you any figures as I no longer own the laptop and I've vowed never again to let that POS anywhere near my hardware again... if I need to have it for FM, it also means that I won't buy buying that either..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    I play only FM12, I don't play any other games... Why the hell do I need an invasive, resource hogging, pos like Steam running as well?
    its not a resource hog at all, you wouldnt even notice it was running in terms of resources.
    My take on it is they have to do something, nothing else they have tried so far has really worked, they all had issues, steam is simple and easy to use and you can turn it offline if your bothered about your it being invasive, after you install the game it never has to be online again until they release a patch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    Myth? So I haven't run it for two years plus on my laptop with FM09 then? Is that what you're saying?

    This isn't a myth, my opinion is from BITTER experience... It's like Microsoft forcing everybody to have IE installed on their machine, it's wrong, it's illegal and it's immoral!

    No, no, and THRICE NO! :mad:
    I have run it since 2004 and haven't seen it go over 200k...

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    Quote Originally Posted by magicmastermind124 View Post
    Last year FM11 was available with pre-loading which meant that as soon as the game came out, it was activated and ready to play.
    Steam is also great for automatic patching and it's very easy to take screenshots, upload them to the Steam Cloud and then post them online - quicker than finding them and uploading to photobucket or elsewhere.
    If there's one thing I don't like about it, it's not having the game case. But that's me being really picky.
    You need to install Steam even if you have the disc, now... in other words, to play FM12 you need to install steam - period!

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    Quote Originally Posted by SWaRFeGa View Post
    Erm, thanks.

    Not sure in the point of a poll where everyone is told what to vote for beforehand - but whatever.
    The title of the thread is not the poll. The title of the poll is the poll.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pigfacemonkeyman View Post
    The title of the thread is not the poll. The title of the poll is the poll.
    You'd have to read the thread title before the seeing the poll.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    You need to install Steam even if you have the disc, now... in other words, to play FM12 you need to install steam - period!
    You can thank piracy for that.

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    I think SI or Sega need to post a blog about Steam and what it does, resources and to quash the misinformation people have.

    Perhaps dedicate a day to answering questions on it or something?

    People just don't seem to have a clue?

    Steam is not a resource hog at all.

    Why are people so against this? It won't make a difference to your user experience with the game at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    I think SI or Sega need to post a blog about Steam and what it does, resources and to quash the misinformation people have.

    Perhaps dedicate a day to answering questions on it or something?

    People just don't seem to have a clue?

    Steam is not a resource hog at all.

    Why are people so against this? It won't make a difference to your user experience with the game at all.
    Eugene, they can paint it gold and give it away with flowers for all I care, nothing SI or Sega say or do will make me install Steam on my computer... NOTHING! So that's at least one copy of FM12 they won't be selling, innit?

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    Ive been using steam for a few years now but that doesnt change my mind. I think its a bad idea to force the use of it irrelevant of system resources nor anti piracy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    Eugene, they can paint it gold and give it away with flowers for all I care, nothing SI or Sega say or do will make me install Steam on my computer... NOTHING! So that's at least one copy of FM12 they won't be selling, innit?
    i bet if they gave you £10,000 to install you would

  25. #25
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    Why not though? What have you got against it? It's it just stubbornness?

    It's a very small application program. They are trying to prevent piracy - which is farcical in itself, but they're trying.

    Steam is free, it's lightweight, and it helps them prevent piracy (they hope).

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    Quote Originally Posted by magicmastermind124 View Post
    You can thank piracy for that.
    No, you can thank SEGA. Steam doesn't stop piracy at all.

    I use and love Steam btw, I just don't like its usual prices, but there are good deals form time to time.

  27. #27
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    Steam isn't invasive at all. It's less invasive than the volume meter on your taskbar.

    You can install FM on it, create a desktop shortcut, set Steam to offline mode once installed and close the window. You'll hardly notice that it's there.

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    people are idiots though in general

    i bet the same lot here saying no to steam as it's intrusive, download updates for firefox or IE weekly and have no idea if they are intrusive or not - but hey if porns available why the hell not!

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    Quote Originally Posted by magicmastermind124 View Post
    Steam isn't invasive at all. It's less invasive than the volume meter on your taskbar.

    You can install FM on it, create a desktop shortcut, set Steam to offline mode once installed and close the window. You'll hardly notice that it's there.
    I don't want it there, period! Ever! I don't care how many people defend the application, it is not something that is going to ever see my computer...

    Quote Originally Posted by englandmanager View Post
    i bet if they gave you £10,000 to install you would
    However, if they give me £10k to buy their £30 game I'd use some of it to buy an FM-Only computer that I used for nothing but FM with Steam in offline mode and nil internet connection!

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    I already have steam but would be very pissed off at being forced to install their software if I didn’t want it.
    A moronic decision to shaft genuine customers.

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    Steam is fine, if people don't really want to buy the game because of it, so be it, sad, but it will be there loss. I also think it does cut down on piracy.

    I remember people saying they would never play the game if it went 3D.

    There is an urban myth surrounding Steam that actually had me believing it was an all invasive program and that it would do this, do that, impact on my privacy and so on. Then I installed it and never looked back.

    It seems that PC games will all become a digital download in a few years, from what I read so there will not be the choice!

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    Quote Originally Posted by asdpoo View Post
    No, you can thank SEGA. Steam doesn't stop piracy at all.

    I use and love Steam btw, I just don't like its usual prices, but there are good deals form time to time.
    45% of people in the UK who play FM pirate it - that's why they've taken the decision to activate by Steam. SEGA may have implemented the idea but it is down to piracy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    However, if they give me £10k to buy their £30 game I'd use some of it to buy an FM-Only computer that I used for nothing but FM with Steam in offline mode and nil internet connection!
    Then really you shouldn't say NEVER should you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SWaRFeGa View Post
    Erm, thanks.

    Not sure in the point of a poll where everyone is told what to vote for beforehand - but whatever.
    General Discussion>Thread Title>Discuss.


    Quote Originally Posted by SWaRFeGa View Post
    You'd have to read the thread title before the seeing the poll.
    Correct. Then you read the poll question and vote if you wish.

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    Quote Originally Posted by englandmanager View Post
    people are idiots though in general

    i bet the same lot here saying no to steam as it's intrusive, download updates for firefox or IE weekly and have no idea if they are intrusive or not - but hey if porns available why the hell not!
    I'm an IT Administrator, so that's flattened your argument, I also don't use IE or FF, so there goes another bit... how many more useless attempts at defending Sega are you going to try? Just accept that Sega have dropped the proverbial bollock on this one, and we'll all move on (well I wont, looks like I'm playing FM11 for at least another year!)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    I don't want it there, period! Ever! I don't care how many people defend the application, it is not something that is going to ever see my computer...



    However, if they give me £10k to buy their £30 game I'd use some of it to buy an FM-Only computer that I used for nothing but FM with Steam in offline mode and nil internet connection!
    what exactly have you got on it being intrusive?

    i've been using it 3 years, used all my credit cards, typed in my address in numerous locations, emails, personal details

    yet i've never lost any money, recieved any emails from steam, got any letters from steam?

    weird how some people get paranoid, get used to it mate its the new future for us, everytime you walk a public street you are being watched by cctv!

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    Quote Originally Posted by englandmanager View Post
    what exactly have you got on it being intrusive?

    i've been using it 3 years, used all my credit cards, typed in my address in numerous locations, emails, personal details

    yet i've never lost any money, recieved any emails from steam, got any letters from steam?
    this basically

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    Quote Originally Posted by magicmastermind124 View Post
    45% of people in the UK who play FM pirate it - that's why they've taken the decision to activate by Steam. SEGA may have implemented the idea but it is down to piracy.
    I never would've thought it is because of the UK. I'm in that €50 "rest of Europe" region, but it is okay, since the game can be bought from elsewhere and only activated on Steam.

    And I know Steam doesn't set prices, publishers do.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by englandmanager View Post
    people are idiots though in general

    i bet the same lot here saying no to steam as it's intrusive, download updates for firefox or IE weekly and have no idea if they are intrusive or not - but hey if porns available why the hell not!


    Exactly - they have no idea if Steam is invasive or not.

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    ive been using steam for a while now, its EASY to use, UNINTRUSIVE and makes my life easier (no more discs to lose/break) all these people that are moaning, can i ask, why are you moaning? its quite simple, Sega/SI have chosen to do this as they think its good business, moaning about this decision isnt going to change it, one or two people saying "im never buying FM again" isnt going to stop them from doing it, the only thing that will stop them doing it is if EVERYONE chooses not to buy FM12, which just isnt going to happen as there are MANY people who are happy with steam
    (off topic i know but i have to wonder what free games steam are going to offer with FM12, the last two years have been pretty cool imho)

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    The main problem is we have to intsall Steam to play the CD game. Why could SI or SEGA put a section on the SI website where you goto register your game no need for downloads and has for patches they are availabe to download from here when they come out anyway. Or are they planning on stopping doing that and you will only be able to get them through Steam aswell.

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    Will Steam stop piracy? Obviously not, it's like saying implementing the death penalty will discourage people from committing murder, it'll still happen. If people are smart enough, they'll still break the law and pirate games like FM.

    But what's so wrong about installing Steam on your system? It's not spyware. It won't even be noticeable when you play. For those anti-Steam people, stop being stubborn.

    Welcome to the 21st Century lads. Some of your favourite PC games might be on Steam too in the future. Digital download games is gaining its place in the PC game market and although physical copies are still going to be available, but don't be surprised if more companies use these methods for 'anti-piracy' measures. F12011 is using GFWL.

    So what are you gonna do if more of the games you play have something similar to this, stop gaming?

    If you want proof for a pos invasive software, look no further than EA's Origin.

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    People moaning about Steam 'prices' need to remember the game can still be purchased in shops for whatever retail price they charge, it's just you have to activate the game through Steam.

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    Option number 1 for me. Simply because I like to have a freedom of choice and this decision is just limiting it and I don't lke it at all.

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    If you do activate through Steam does that allow automatic updating or is that only if you buy through Steam?

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    its never as simple as it sounds, I tried to install through steam on my kids laptop so when I went away I wouldnt have to take the disc and risk losing it, tried to play it offiline and I couldnt, and yes I ticked the little box to play ooffline through steam

    I said last year that we'd eventually be forced to use steam and I've been proven right just didnt think it would happen this soon!

    Now I know the argument of steam doesnt take up any memory and it doesnt slow down your computer etc etc, but I dont see why we should have to install a 3rd party software just so we can play a game, and as I've said I found the offline not to work properly, Idont want steam poping up everytime I want to go on the game

    and as for people downloading the game illegally I think this system will only increase it, I myself wouldnt ever do that as I have all the previous game in cases and I like how I can look back at them all and also the excitement of going to a shop and buying the game (sad I know) but others wont want the hassel of steam and will look to get the game elsewhere and wheres theres a will theres a way!!!

    Bad move SI/sega
    Last edited by stu9000; 16-09-2011 at 15:33. Reason: added something

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    Quote Originally Posted by rancer890 View Post
    Will Steam stop piracy? Obviously not, it's like saying implementing the death penalty will discourage people from committing murder, it'll still happen. If people are smart enough, they'll still break the law and pirate games like FM.

    But what's so wrong about installing Steam on your system? It's not spyware. It won't even be noticeable when you play. For those anti-Steam people, stop being stubborn.

    Welcome to the 21st Century lads. Some of your favourite PC games might be on Steam too in the future. Digital download games is gaining its place in the PC game market and although physical copies are still going to be available, but don't be surprised if more companies use these methods for 'anti-piracy' measures. F12011 is using GFWL.

    So what are you gonna do if more of the games you play have something similar to this, stop gaming?

    If you want proof for a pos invasive software, look no further than EA's Origin.
    You keep pointing us towards other games...

    I only play FM, I don't want to play any other game, I don't care about any other game, I just want to play FM12 but I don't want Steam. To do 1, I need 2, therefore I won't be doing 1, it's really quite simple. I pay for a hard-copy of the game, I should be allowed to do whatever I choose with that game including choosing whether or not to install a piece of software that I won't use for anything else, ever again!

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    Some things about Steam, that should be kept in reasonable discussion.

    Steam is not a resource hog. Not for any computer that has more than 512Mb of Ram and a processor that is newer than a Pentium 3.

    Offline mode is flaky at best (when it decides not to work, you can't play if you're away from internet connections.)

    It does nothing against piracy. Deus Ex was cracked and available on line the same day as it was available on Steam.

    It is a cloud based service. Ergo, it requires a login email and password. There are obvious security implications with this.

    Steam customer support has no phone number, a one size fits all approach to problems, and a very slow rate of responding to tickets.

    Making a user install third party software to run something that they've paid for is poor form, at best.

    Steam makes updating games easier.

    Adding steam into the mix adds an entire plethora of potential technical issues to running the game.

    Steam collects and analyses user data, particularly type of games, hardware, and software installed.

    Steam bombards you with pop up adverts when the client is opened, particularly when there is a sale.

    Steam doesn't work for everybody.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kazza View Post
    If you do activate through Steam does that allow automatic updating or is that only if you buy through Steam?
    You will get the automatic updates if you buy a disc version and activate through steam too.

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    I voted that "I hate it" which is a bit strong, but I'd certainly prefer that SEGA & SI be honest rather than hiding behind the piracy excuse, and users just should not be forced to install third party software for something that they have purchased.

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    Don't like it at all.

    I really looked forward seeing all the changes in FM12 but I might stick to FM11 now

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    I'm going to have to think long and hard about this. I did by GTA San Andreas for the PC to find out what it was like from the PS2. I didn't like the fact then I had to intsall all their parafanalia before I could play the game. Lets just say the game is now gathering dust on my shelf.

    Whilst obviously people can get access to an internet connection via intenet cafes, libraries because some places don't allow to download onto their systems, if you don't know what to do then its going to be a frustrating time and if something does go wrong with steam, you wont be able to play the game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    I don't want it there, period! Ever! I don't care how many people defend the application, it is not something that is going to ever see my computer...
    You've said that, without ever giving a valid reason why...though your next paragraph leads me to believe you're might be paranoid about having your computer hooked up to the internet in any kind of "background" way. At least, you seem to be okay opening your CPU to the Wild Wascaly World to post on forums.

    Sorry, I'm just trying to find some rationale to your fear of Steam that doesn't invole some form of phobia...

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    Quote Originally Posted by SSGTroyer View Post
    You've said that, without ever giving a valid reason why...though your next paragraph leads me to believe you're might be paranoid about having your computer hooked up to the internet in any kind of "background" way. At least, you seem to be okay opening your CPU to the Wild Wascaly World to post on forums.

    Sorry, I'm just trying to find some rationale to your fear of Steam that doesn't invole some form of phobia...
    He doesn’t have to justify not wanting to install third party adware to his computer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SSGTroyer View Post
    You've said that, without ever giving a valid reason why...though your next paragraph leads me to believe you're might be paranoid about having your computer hooked up to the internet in any kind of "background" way. At least, you seem to be okay opening your CPU to the Wild Wascaly World to post on forums.

    Sorry, I'm just trying to find some rationale to your fear of Steam that doesn't invole some form of phobia...
    he clearly avoided my valid question as to how it is percieved to be intrusive, he's clearly just a paranoid guy with no valid reasons

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    You guys are overreacting to Steam.

    Steam is a marvelous product.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GaIatasaray_35 View Post
    You guys are overreacting to Steam.

    Steam is a marvelous product.
    No it isn't. It's decent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by djvandyke View Post
    He doesn’t have to justify not wanting to install third party adware to his computer.
    your right he doesnt have to justify anything, but why not add to the discussion? He clearly feels strongly about this, so why not explain why, otherwise it looks like unwarranted paranoia, which people are trying to help ease.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GaIatasaray_35 View Post
    You guys are overreacting to Steam.

    Steam is a marvelous product.
    This. 1000x this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by englandmanager View Post
    he clearly avoided my valid question as to how it is percieved to be intrusive, he's clearly just a paranoid guy with no valid reasons
    My paranoia is based on experience, I installed steam to activate FM09... and regretted it big-time. I bought my current PC with the intention of it being future-proof for FM (As it's the only game I play), and now I'm told I have to have a piece of software I will not install again in order to play the only game I play...

    I don't need to go into any further detail.. I've used Steam to play FM once before, and I didn't like the experience... I won't be doing it again *shrugs*

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wakers View Post
    No it isn't. It's decent.
    I personally find it a fantastic thing.

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    I wont install either steam or itunes, even for free giveaways so if this is the only way to activate it then its not worth buying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post
    My paranoia is based on experience, I installed steam to activate FM09... and regretted it big-time. I bought my current PC with the intention of it being future-proof for FM (As it's the only game I play), and now I'm told I have to have a piece of software I will not install again in order to play the only game I play...

    I don't need to go into any further detail.. I've used Steam to play FM once before, and I didn't like the experience... I won't be doing it again *shrugs*
    But why, what was wrong when you installed FM09? Keep in mind that was also two years ago, steam has moved on a lot since then.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wakers View Post
    No it isn't. It's decent.
    wakers do you always use your own opinion to answer for everyone?

    i find it amazing, quick updates, very fast downloads (the fastest i've found online), low resources and pre-orders that let you pre-install and have your game ready for 12.01am on release day whilst others are running to tesco's and joining queues

    that's my opinion, i don't answer for everyone else though like you do wakers

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    I like Steam.

    However I wouldn't install iTunes if I hadn't already done so years ago - the changes in their EULA are horrible now. I've not updated iTunes in over a year because of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by englandmanager View Post
    wakers do you always use your own opinion to answer for everyone?

    i find it amazing, quick updates, very fast downloads (the fastest i've found online), low resources and pre-orders that let you pre-install and have your game ready for 12.01am on release day whilst others are running to tesco's and joining queues

    that's my opinion, i don't answer for everyone else though like you do wakers
    I do believe it was playable at approx 11:45 last year the day before too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stevie_G_32201 View Post
    I do believe it was playable at approx 11:45 last year the day before too.
    yes due to peer pressure, haha

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    Quote Originally Posted by djvandyke View Post
    He doesn’t have to justify not wanting to install third party adware to his computer.
    "Adware"...please...you're trying to equate an occasional popup ad when exiting an app with Comet Cursor, Cydoor, and Zango. While technically, that occasional popup ad brings Steam into the broadest definition of the term, Steam is nothing like those hideous apps which most decent anti-malware suites will block.

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    Quote Originally Posted by philly_flyer10 View Post
    I wont install either steam or itunes, even for free giveaways so if this is the only way to activate it then its not worth buying.
    In my opinion, that's a ridiculous attitude, no offence intended towards you. Fair enough you don't need iTunes to buy music or listen to music.

    But Steam is a small application that allows you to play FM. It costs nothing, it's non-intrusive.

    How about you try it for a week and if you don't like it you can uninstall it? If you have any questions on how to use it, or to uninstall it just ask.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ackter View Post
    I like Steam.

    However I wouldn't install iTunes if I hadn't already done so years ago - the changes in their EULA are horrible now. I've not updated iTunes in over a year because of it.
    Same goes for steam, theyve wrongly banned accounts in the past and theres no UK law to help you out. You can lose access to all your games just because they say so. I dont even think buying elsewhere and activating it on steam will help you out here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by englandmanager View Post
    wakers do you always use your own opinion to answer for everyone?

    i find it amazing, quick updates, very fast downloads (the fastest i've found online), low resources and pre-orders that let you pre-install and have your game ready for 12.01am on release day whilst others are running to tesco's and joining queues

    that's my opinion, i don't answer for everyone else though like you do wakers
    Oh, I'm very sorry, I did not mean to say that I was speaking on behalf of everyone. Oh wait, I didn't.

    Steam is brilliant until you have a problem with it, in which case it quickly becomes less and less brilliant. If you were to take an overall look at the way Steam works, it really isn't the God send that a lot people make it out to be. Like everything, it has good things, it has brilliant things, but it also has very poor components which balance out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    In my opinion, that's a ridiculous attitude, no offence intended towards you. Fair enough you don't need iTunes to buy music or listen to music.

    But Steam is a small application that allows you to play FM. It costs nothing, it's non-intrusive.

    How about you try it for a week and if you don't like it you can uninstall it? If you have any questions on how to use it, or to uninstall it just ask.
    I refuse to use it at all because of the companies, behaviour. Same goes for companies like apple, I wouldnt use a product even if it was given to me.
    EAs origin is even worse, that scans your computer and reports back to them and you cant opt out of it.

    I didnt install it when they were giving away Portal for free so Im not going to have it for FM.

    Same goes for starforce, the worst system ever that even damages hardware, trackmania was free and came with that and I wouldnt touch that.
    Last edited by philly_flyer10; 16-09-2011 at 16:12.

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    That's very strange attitude to have. It seems like you're paranoid about it.

    Fact is, you install steam. You install the game. Register the game through steam. Unplug your internet. Leave steam running in the background and FM will play just fine.

    Close steam and FM won't run. But if you're already running steam you can shut down Steam or go to Offline mode and continue playing the game.


    No reporting is done by Steam. You've got a touch of Paranoia.


    Did you know that everytime you go to a new web page it can be recorded by the previous website you were on? Say if you were to go from here to BBC to Sky news, this very website would be able to track to you 3 or 4 websites after you've left here. And you can't turn that off either. That's exactly how adverts are targeted to your internet browser. Based on your frequency to visit certain sites. Visit BBC sport regularly and your google ads will feature sport related topics.


    This is the digital age. Nothing you do online, even right now as you read or type a reply here, is not recorded and transmitted somewhere. There's little robots scouring code and taking your information and reporting back to databases to feed you adverts related to what you are looking at on the internet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by philly_flyer10 View Post
    ...
    iTunes is one step away from agreeing to sign over your first born son

    Steam isn't quite that bad...

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    Only ever purchase on Steam if you understand that you are not buying a product.
    You are paying them for the privilege of playing their game, this privilege is not guaranteed and can be withdrawn at any time without good reason.
    If you have a problem you are likely to be ignored or treated like scum.
    Last edited by djvandyke; 16-09-2011 at 16:23.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    That's very strange attitude to have. It seems like you're paranoid about it.

    Fact is, you install steam. You install the game. Register the game through steam. Unplug your internet. Leave steam running in the background and FM will play just fine.

    Close steam and FM won't run. But if you're already running steam you can shut down Steam or go to Offline mode and continue playing the game.


    No reporting is done by Steam. You've got a touch of Paranoia.


    Did you know that everytime you go to a new web page it can be recorded by the previous website you were on? Say if you were to go from here to BBC to Sky news, this very website would be able to track to you 3 or 4 websites after you've left here. And you can't turn that off either. That's exactly how adverts are targeted to your internet browser. Based on your frequency to visit certain sites. Visit BBC sport regularly and your google ads will feature sport related topics.


    This is the digital age. Nothing you do online, even right now as you read or type a reply here, is not recorded and transmitted somewhere. There's little robots scouring code and taking your information and reporting back to databases to feed you adverts related to what you are looking at on the internet.
    Just something to note here: A great many people have problems with Steam's offline mode. It personally stopped me from being able to play Civ V for two weeks while I was on holiday with no available internet (well, there was, but I'm not paying £1 per mb!). It's not a reliable solution.

    Also, if you buy a game on Steam - you don't own the game. You are given temporary access to the game as long as Steam deem fit. Meaning (and obviously, they don't do this all the time, but they have the power to) they can stop you from playing any game that you have in your games library.

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    Quote Originally Posted by djvandyke View Post
    Only ever purchase on Steam if you understand that you are not buying a product.
    You are paying for them privilege of playing their game, this privilege is not guaranteed and can be withdrawn at any time without good reason.
    If you have a problem you are likely to be ignored or treated like scum.
    That's technically true of all games - when you buy a game you're paying for the license to use it, not for the game itself.

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    I never said steam scans and reports back, I just said EA is even worse. i disagree with a company having the power to stop you playing your whole catalogue of games.

    My browser is safe using ghostery and webpolicy which blocks all requests to other sites, no reporting to 3rd parties and no ads at all.
    I havent seen an ad in years.

    This site uses/reports to:

    siresearch.com
    googleapis.com
    clicksmilies.com
    omniture.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ackter View Post
    That's technically true of all games - when you buy a game you're paying for the license to use it, not for the game itself.
    How are they going to stop you playing a non internet activated game?
    Also, even if they could stop you, they would only stop that one game, steam can and does stop you from playing your whole collection, often hundreds or even thousands of pounds and you have no comeback.

    I dont see why anyone would give a company that power and for you to lose all your purchase rights.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wakers View Post
    Just something to note here: A great many people have problems with Steam's offline mode. It personally stopped me from being able to play Civ V for two weeks while I was on holiday with no available internet (well, there was, but I'm not paying £1 per mb!). It's not a reliable solution.

    Also, if you buy a game on Steam - you don't own the game. You are given temporary access to the game as long as Steam deem fit. Meaning (and obviously, they don't do this all the time, but they have the power to) they can stop you from playing any game that you have in your games library.
    Most EULAs stipulate you only have a license to use the software, you never actually own it.

    SI or SEGA could deem you violation of the EULA and terminate your license if they wanted to or it was fit.

    Any issues with Steam discontinuing your license should be brought up with steam.


    If you do buy online make sure you save all the emails regarding receipts, also the statement from the bank with regards to the cash transfer to Steam.

    If you have documentation to backup that you bought it, Steam should reinstate your software.



    Although a lot of people seem to be thinking you have to BUY through Steam. You don't, you can buy it in the shop. You just have to ACTIVATE through Steam.

    Once activated, whether bought online or in-store, you can launch FM and quit Steam and it will play fine.

    If you want to relaunch FM - then start up Steam - launch FM - quit steam.


    It's not rocket surgery, it's brain science.

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    I was going to buy in on steam anyway...

    These "I hate steam" threads pop up each year from people who clearly don't use steam for anything else so its a little hassle and they have no idea how to use it, its a system that has been working perfectly fine for several years now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    That's very strange attitude to have. It seems like you're paranoid about it.

    Fact is, you install steam. You install the game. Register the game through steam. Unplug your internet. Leave steam running in the background and FM will play just fine.

    Close steam and FM won't run. But if you're already running steam you can shut down Steam or go to Offline mode and continue playing the game.


    No reporting is done by Steam. You've got a touch of Paranoia.


    Did you know that everytime you go to a new web page it can be recorded by the previous website you were on? Say if you were to go from here to BBC to Sky news, this very website would be able to track to you 3 or 4 websites after you've left here. And you can't turn that off either. That's exactly how adverts are targeted to your internet browser. Based on your frequency to visit certain sites. Visit BBC sport regularly and your google ads will feature sport related topics.


    This is the digital age. Nothing you do online, even right now as you read or type a reply here, is not recorded and transmitted somewhere. There's little robots scouring code and taking your information and reporting back to databases to feed you adverts related to what you are looking at on the internet.
    Yes you can... it's called "block cookies" which I do on pretty much every website I visit, there are exceptions, obviously, but my browser makes selecting them easy as pie. I have websites of my own that plant a nice little tracking cookie onto your hard-drive just so's I can be nosey (cos I don't actually care where you came from or where you go when you leave as long as you visit my site(s) ). Unscrupulous people (read Sega/Steam/EA/Whoever) would use this information to target you with specific advertisements related to your browsing history...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ackter View Post
    That's technically true of all games - when you buy a game you're paying for the license to use it, not for the game itself.
    If you purchase a real copy the man in the shop can not just come round your flat and take your game away on a whim.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Quacky View Post
    I was going to buy in on steam anyway...

    These "I hate steam" threads pop up each year from people who clearly don't use steam for anything else so its a little hassle and they have no idea how to use it, its a system that has been working perfectly fine for several years now.
    Not true, I use Steam.

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    Hmm, such a shame that I won't get to play the full game as I refuse to have third party software forced upon me. I don't use steam and don't plan to anytime soon. Thankfully I have a good fm11 save.

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    Quote Originally Posted by djvandyke View Post
    If you purchase a real copy the man in the shop can not just come round your flat and take your game away on a whim.
    Irrelevant, its the same with DVD's and such.

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    Blocking cookies doesn't stop that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    Most EULAs stipulate you only have a license to use the software, you never actually own it.

    SI or SEGA could deem you violation of the EULA and terminate your license if they wanted to or it was fit.

    Any issues with Steam discontinuing your license should be brought up with steam.


    If you do buy online make sure you save all the emails regarding receipts, also the statement from the bank with regards to the cash transfer to Steam.

    If you have documentation to backup that you bought it, Steam should reinstate your software.



    Although a lot of people seem to be thinking you have to BUY through Steam. You don't, you can buy it in the shop. You just have to ACTIVATE through Steam.

    Once activated, whether bought online or in-store, you can launch FM and quit Steam and it will play fine.

    If you want to relaunch FM - then start up Steam - launch FM - quit steam.


    It's not rocket surgery, it's brain science.
    Massive misinformation there Eugene, you can't "quit Steam" whilst playing FM12, it will close FM too... you need to have Steam running to play it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    Most EULAs stipulate you only have a license to use the software, you never actually own it.

    SI or SEGA could deem you violation of the EULA and terminate your license if they wanted to or it was fit.

    Any issues with Steam discontinuing your license should be brought up with steam.


    If you do buy online make sure you save all the emails regarding receipts, also the statement from the bank with regards to the cash transfer to Steam.

    If you have documentation to backup that you bought it, Steam should reinstate your software.



    Although a lot of people seem to be thinking you have to BUY through Steam. You don't, you can buy it in the shop. You just have to ACTIVATE through Steam.

    Once activated, whether bought online or in-store, you can launch FM and quit Steam and it will play fine.

    If you want to relaunch FM - then start up Steam - launch FM - quit steam.


    It's not rocket surgery, it's brain science.
    Yes, but if you only have the DVD then they can't remotely stop you from using it. And they won't send out anyone to take it away from you either.

    Also, I just tested something that you stated about having steam open and playing a game. I just launched Civ V, closed steam - it warned me that CIV V would close too if I quit Steam. So you can't do that.

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    As a paying customer i reserve the right to decide myself what goes onto my pc/mac and quite frankly whether steam is great or crap totally disinterests me. I do not like being dictated to especially when i am parting with my hard earned cash and as such this will be the first in the fm series that i have not bought. Sad day for consumer choice but i will most definitely not be purchasing fm12.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    Most EULAs stipulate you only have a license to use the software, you never actually own it.

    SI or SEGA could deem you violation of the EULA and terminate your license if they wanted to or it was fit.

    Any issues with Steam discontinuing your license should be brought up with steam.
    Sega/SI are a UK company so you have consumer rights and they couldnt do that without a very good reason.

    Steam is a US company that you have zero rights with, they can and do wrongly ban accounts with no comeback, the often wont even tell you why your account was banned.

    You will get banned if you are hacked and you will lose every game you have. People have also been wrongly banned with a faulty cheat check.

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    Quote Originally Posted by philly_flyer10 View Post
    I never said steam scans and reports back, I just said EA is even worse. i disagree with a company having the power to stop you playing your whole catalogue of games.

    My browser is safe using ghostery and webpolicy which blocks all requests to other sites, no reporting to 3rd parties and no ads at all.
    I havent seen an ad in years.

    This site uses/reports to:

    siresearch.com
    googleapis.com
    clicksmilies.com
    omniture.com
    Just so you know.. two of those (googleapis and omniture) are for web analytics which we (and noone else) use to track traffic. Siresearch.com is another forum that we run and the fourth "clicksmilies" looks to be a plugin for the smilies, fair enough don't know what that's for personally, but I would imagine that the only thing it's reporting is whether it's smilies are being used or not (if anything at all).

    I personally prefer my ads to be targeted as then they might be relevant to me and not just completely irrelevant things I'm not interested in but that's irrelevant to this conversation. Each to their own though

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    Blocking cookies doesn't stop that.
    not quite... but it will stop people 3 sites down the line seeing that I was visiting the BBC sport site two hours ago. I can see where people come from and where they go, what they click on my site (and what they don't), where they spend the longest amount of time and when they leave immediately and all this is through the use of cookies and tracking scripts that are run "without your knowledge" (supposedly). At least I know that by blocking scripts, cookies, etc etc that my security isn't compromised...

    I don't intend to waste all the care I take in protecting myself by installing a piece of software I don't need or want just to be able to play a game. I value my privacy too much

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    Blocking cookies doesn't stop that.
    Im not just doing that. They stop all 3rd party requests.

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    This is a good idea to stop illegal copies of the game.

    About Steam

    I seriously don't know why people are moaning about this, all you have to do is activate the game on steam, once its activated you can play the game with the disc without using steam iirc. Also you can disable steam from starting up when your PC loads, so it wont slow down the start up process.

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazaru5 View Post

    I don't intend to waste all the care I take in protecting myself by installing a piece of software I don't need or want just to be able to play a game. I value my privacy too much
    Your privacy is not being invaded by using Steam! You're privacy is invaded when you use the internet though. You might stop somethings, but not them all. Most of those things are inhibitors, in that it stops pop-ups, but it's very hard to stop them tracking or analysing where you have gone after you've left that site.

    Don't suppose you use mobile internet, wifi, mobile phone, or send emails then?

  97. #97
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    I approve. SEGA and SI have a right to ensure their product is protected. Steam activation is a technique that they believe is effective and needed for combating piracy, and it's their responsibility to make that judgement, not ours. As a paying customer I respect the fact that they have a right to make these decisions.
    And the reality is that in 2011, if you don't have an internet connection, you're probably Amish, you have the misfortune to be a subsistence farmer in a developing country, or you're in the more troubled parts of the third world.

    Regarding Steam, I'd add that it's a very standard form of copy protection that is becoming increasingly more common throughout the industry. The whinging about it, for whatever motive, really is getting old. Just face facts, the times when you'd download all your games from a BBS, install the hack, and play away, are gone - the industry's matured, the protection technology's gotten better, and that's led to far lower rates of piracy across the industry, more investment in development, and hence better games and more bang for the back for the genuine customers. Even if we're fickle and don't always acknowledge it.
    Last edited by hugo_rune; 16-09-2011 at 16:43.

  98. #98
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    It's true, however unlike facebook the scripts dont report your browsing habits as liberally. Google for example uses them to put ads you're more likely to look at(whether that is a good or a bad thing, it's up to you). As for STEAM, i've never actually seen a valid reason as to why people dont want to use it. You could always start it up in offline mode if you value your privacy that much(oh and it does no data tracking whatsoever on top of that, the only thing it asks you is to complete a survey which you can opt out of easily).

  99. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by philly_flyer10 View Post
    Sega/SI are a UK company so you have consumer rights and they couldnt do that without a very good reason.

    Steam is a US company that you have zero rights with, they can and do wrongly ban accounts with no comeback, the often wont even tell you why your account was banned.

    You will get banned if you are hacked and you will lose every game you have. People have also been wrongly banned with a faulty cheat check.

    You need to bring that up with Steam. Email first. Then email again if no reply. If not then find a contact number for support in your country.

    There's also pen and paper, envelopes and stamps from the local post office.

    (sorry that sounded a bit smart arsed, but I'm serious)

  100. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eugene Tyson View Post
    You need to bring that up with Steam. Email first. Then email again if no reply. If not then find a contact number for support in your country.

    There's also pen and paper, envelopes and stamps from the local post office.

    (sorry that sounded a bit smart arsed, but I'm serious)
    Steam don't have phone support. They also don't have an address available for written support. If you write to them it will likely just be met with an email in return or a letter sent back stating that you have to use the online ticket system.

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