Hello all, just like the title says, will there ever be an American Football Manager? NFL style. Thanks for any input.
Hello all, just like the title says, will there ever be an American Football Manager? NFL style. Thanks for any input.
There's already the ice hockey game and out of the park baseball is very similar to fm so I'm hoping an American football game will get made eventually. If it was done right it could be great.
I dont know but the best football simulator by far is STRAT-O-MATIC....... check it out... But I do wish that this company would make it... cuz it has both great graphics and realism.. stratomatic is mainly for realism and not much graphics at all
Doubtful because EA has the exclusive NFL license. But it would be great if they did.
try front office football by solecismic software
its a really good text based sim
and they offer free updates every year
Blasfemy! Kill the heretic!! ;)
Don't think there will be anything like FM in terms of the NFL.
The Americans seem to hate this sort of game.
I read some reviews and NFL Front Office really didn't go down well with them.
I used to play a Dos based game called Head Coach which was purely text but was addictive. I still have it somewhere but it will not play on Vista even using a dos emulator.
Yes that kind of thing won't sell very well over here... games like that have came on different consoles and such. It just never has sold that well. Stuff like Madden will always sell better which is a shame, that genre could have a lot of potential.
It was a bit clumsily put, but it's a fair point. There's never been a management sim in the USA that's even approached european levels of sales of CM / FM. The reasons for that are varied, of course.
It's unlikely that SI will ever make an American Football game , I would suggest.
SI has an ice hockey game?
How about a rugby league game? Or if they reckoned the target market was too small, how about tagging on a little bolt on with Union [spits] on it as well?
I have Russell Crowe on Messenger and he said he would do the advertising campaign for it free of charge if you let him wear a Bunnies hat.
^^ Thats a shame I was thinking bout getting the hockey game
I've always wanted a Rugby Manager
I've already asked Miles about an NFL game, it would be far too dear to buy the licenses from EA Sports. I used to play Mike Ditka's ultimate Football years and years ago, I only needed 3 or 4 attacking and 3 or 4 defensive tactics and I would never lose and would always rack up huge scores in the process. It's still available online however, I had had trouble managing to download and run it. Just doesn't seem to want to load up on Windows 7, it's a game you need to load up in DOS
If anyone is actually successfull in downloading and able to get it to load up, then please let me know how you managed to do it as I would love to play this game again !
Last edited by Neil Brock; 10-05-2011 at 14:49.
The only thing that comes close is Head Coach 09. Has some issues, but is generally a really good game. Not sure if you can get it outside of the states. Takes a few goes to understand what to do, but it's worth it. The players and teams abilities are a bit dated, but the worst team (Dophins) can be taken to the superbowl in about 3-5 seasons if you manage the draft well.
eastside hockey manager was really good, and had huge potential i think. i think if they had continued the series it would have gained a buzz. it would be awsome to see with a 3d engine, but what irritated me was that the games were so many that it got monotonous
Not relevent, but I'm loving Starters Orders 4, a horse racing management sim.
Just googled it and it is a PS3 game and not out on PC - never mind
I had Pro Rugby Manager 2 back in 2004 whilst the graphics were good the actual management side and transfer system seemed awful and after a few attempts it went back in the box never to see the light of day again, shame really as I thought it had some potential if developed properly.
I would certainly be all for SI branching into this market after all Rugby is a increasingly popular sport here, Africa, Australia and New Zealand so I imagine that it would have a decent enough interest and the sales I bet would be very good especially in the southern hemisphere.
deleted. t'was rhubarb
Last edited by m1983; 24-01-2011 at 00:58.
This thread gave me an urge to play EHM. Unfortunately, I traded my copy in some years ago. Some amazon rummaging has tracked down a copy of EHM 2005 for £1.50, which i have ordered and hope to be playing within the week.
I used to play a 'Boxing Manager' game for the Amiga which was great fun. Anyway, the likes of the Madden franchise have surely cornered the market in such a way that it would be hard to break into it in with a purely strategy game...
And what is the best sports management simulation? Is it not this franchise? I believe so, and I've played quite a few. If there was an American football simulation that could stack up with how well this game is made, I'd wager it would do very well here in the States.
On EHM, I'm still very, very bitter about that series ending. I played it when it was freeware and was deeply saddened the series wasn't renewed. In fact, it was EHM that got me introduced to sports management sims in the first place. I've tried football, which have all sucked including the horrid Head Coach EA game, but the best up to date management simulation outside of FM is OOTP.
Last edited by Chad_; 24-01-2011 at 23:54.
I just received an email that my £1.50 copy of EHM 2005 has been dispatched. FM2011 will be put on the back burner for a few days once I get back into the Carolina Hurricanes and Newcastle Vipers like the old days (the presence of the British league was one of EHM's selling points to me, I was a regular at Vipers games when I lived in Sunderland, so knew their players better than most NHL rosters))
I've thought for years that a dual code rugby management game should be released to maximise the market and with FM being by far the best setup as far as Football management games go I would have thought that the basic crossover from football to Rugby would not be too difficult.
The main problems I see being the 3D side but that would not be expected in the first couple of editions and the other major problem would be implementing the different codes rules but being an RL fan I think having a game based on FM where you can coach in RL or RU would appeal to a fairly broad market and the club/players/staff etc would be the exact same setup as FM.
I think it would pay for itself as I know RL fans both here and in AUS/NZ are crying out for a quality game and i'm sure RU fans are to so by making it one game 2 codes allowing for players to crossover.
There is a RL game called rugbyleaguemanager 2010 already out there and its not a bad little game for a one man band organistion but if it was taken over by SI/SEGA then it could be the basis for an RL/RU game as the maker is looking to implement 3D in if not the 2011 version then certainly the 2012.
I know it will never happen but if Miles was to pawn his awards and believe then dreams would come true for any RL/RU fan
I know that the exclusive lisence that EA has would be a huge hurdle, but I believe a game like this would in fact sell. EA's NFL Head Coach is just a terrible game and that is why it did not sell. One thing that makes it so bad is, it is only the NFL. No college or high school teams to build up to. I would love to see a game, like FM, where you can start at the college level and move up to a huge football school (Ohio St., LSU, Alabama, Clemson) or even up to the NFL. Or maybe even start as an offensive or defensive coordinator and move up. I think going to the high school level is going to be hard, but I would have never thought that FM would have as may leagues as it currently does.
A well made American Rules Football game would sell in the USA.
I would LOVE a really good american football management game-, it would definitely need to feature college football too imo - I would love to be head coach of Notre Dame with the fight song blaring out!!
Get to it S.I......
They're an independent small company who made their name with Baseball Mogul in the 90's (that's how i found out about them). Recently they've made football mogul as well - if you like management games and drafting prospects i highly recommend them. Their baseball simulations are a lot deeper than the football ones but i've bought both titles and have racked up tons of hours with each.
It certainly would be a hard game for SI to make, what with the amount of research that would be needed for teams and players, as well as the tactics, and match engine, they would have to set up a whole new american task-force to get a game that would be really worthwhile. But the overall feel and look of the game I have always imagined would be very similar to the way football manager is now and it is potentially a game that would be as good as FM. The depth of american football in the U.S is such that it would certainly be a worthwhile project.
sigh........to bad it will remain a dream
American football, you serious? most boring game ever to be made.
Why is it called Football in America when they very rarely use thier feet is it because thier minds just did not have the capacity to think of a different name for the sport.
I genuinely don't know the answer, but how much can a coach actually dictate in American Football? I'd always been given the impression that the game revolved around the qualities of the runners, and most importantly, the brain and arm of the quarterback. Is there the same level of strategy that there can be in football? Likewise for rugby, really- you may be able to say "use the forwards" or "use the backs", but you can't really say "use a slow tempo" or "play lots of mispasses".
This is why I ask why call it Football ?
To the history of the sport, it started as a blend of Rugby and Association football in the mid 1800s. The balls originally were mostly round, so kicking was much more easily done. In the late 1800s, some of the more modern rules were adopted including changing the shape of the ball to make carrying it easier, but that of course made the kicking less useful.
SCIAG- the strategy is different of course, but my god it can be detailed like you wouldn't believe. In comparison, I believe a footie manager or head coach does far less actual "managing" over the course of the game. For example, playing high school football, we had a play book about as thick as War and Peace. Every player's role and instructions are dictated at a micro level, and most often, the coach reads the other team and sends in his plays based on the formations he sees, player positions, and other cues. The strategy is different in that because the plays have definite starts and stops you don't get the flow and shape like in footie. But there is a lot of the same things going on: "that cornerback looks weak, lets run at him," that sort of deal. The tempo in each play is pretty much the same, so it's style that gets managed- running up the middle vs. short passing game vs. wide runs vs. long passes etc.
At least that is my poor attempt at trying to make a comparison. I don't watch or play anymore, so this is old school 1980s stuff I am talking about, but I don't think it's changed at the core much in 25 years.
I don't think it's that Americans dislike management sims, I think it's just that all of the ones we get are crap. NFL Head Coach was pretty boring and clunky, while MLB Front Office Manager was pretty much a disaster. We do have things like Baseball Mogul or Out Of The Park Baseball which are good, but they're made by smaller companies who mostly distribute online. Further, those indie management sims lack the depth that FM has or, to be entirely honest, that FIFA Manager has.
The issue is that the major sims (i.e. the first two I mentioned) that Americans get are made by huge companies who are more interested in sales than making a good game. I wish a smaller company who care about the sport (such as SI or something similar) make a great management sim and then get published by one of the big guys to make distribution and marketing easier.
Personally, I probably wouldn't play an NFL management game unless it were very, very good as I don't care much for the NFL, but would definitely play it if you could coach an NCAA team. I definitely would like to see an FM-style baseball management sim and am thirsty for one- I loved Baseball Mogul but after playing FM you can see how lacking it truly is, and I played MLB Front Office Manager which was a waste of money. I also would love to see EHM come back, as it was a decent game that had huge potential. I wouldn't play a basketball management game, either, but that is something that I don't think has been tried at all and could be very good.
Sadly, I don't see any of the things I mentioned above happening due to all of the damned exclusive licensing agreements American leagues have with game companies. Sure, those companies may well make management sims, but due to the lack of competition and their only major goal being the bottom line, Americans look to be stuck with mediocre product for the forseeable future.
Further, touchdowns in American football used to be rarer (thus why they are worth 6 points as opposed to three from a field goal). Most of the scoring a long time ago was had through field goals, touchdowns became more common after the introduction of the forward pass. Therefore, a long time ago, feet were much more important than they are now, but, as I said earlier, that isn't the true reason why it's called football.
All of that being said, I must say, that your football is much better than ours!
Last edited by ArranoBeltza; 06-02-2011 at 23:18.
no. as Miles already stated when i asked him, SI will never make an NFL management/coaching game. to buy the licenses, it would cost far too much
Sports games don't really sell without a license anymore, except the NCAA games where no one has a player license.
I don't reckon they would lose too much money, if any, as there seems to be such a big demand for it on here alone. They might make a slight loss on the first edition but the versions after that would generate more and more publicity and fans as the detail got better.
It is not just the American market that would buy it either, there would be plenty of peopel oversees who would buy it. I originally come from Scotland but now live in Australia. in Scotland/Europe about 10 yrs ago iirc there was an American football comp going on between European teams, dont know if still goes on now, that was reasonably popular. Also in Australia there seems to be a lot of people who follow the American teams over here. In my office there is a least 3-4 people who follow it and not just during superbowl. So i would imagine there would be plenty of people from these countries who would give it a go.
Another potential market would be people like myself who dont actually follow the sport, tried once but couldn't get the hang of it, but love management sims who would buy it.
Last edited by fuzzrab; 07-02-2011 at 07:45.
Front Office Football is basically a one-man basement project, and EA's NFL Head Coach was just another pile of crap that EA cranked out to make another quick buck or two.
If done right, an NFL sim could be the American FM. But the key is: "if done right"... which, to be honest, I don't think SI could pull-off. We would need an American version of SI; people who could make it from first-hand knowledge, rather than research.
I personally believe that a Rugby League management game could be a hit.
Rugby League is a sport with a professional competition in Australia and NZ (NRL), England, France and Wales (Super League).
Rugby League is the second sport in the world with a World Cup (after football).
The aforementioned Rugby League Manager is terrible, oddly enough in a sport where Australia's NRL is by a fair distance the best Rugby League competition in the world, England's Super League is ridiculously overrated, to the point where I simply cannot play a game where some of my team's best players are average, and some of my teams reserve graders are quite good.
One potential issue is that if Rugby League Manager is made I'd play FM less .
I'd also certainly volunteer to research.
I'd pay quite a bit for a Rugby League Manager and there are at least a few million in Australia who would do the same.
Last edited by William Hall; 07-02-2011 at 09:28.
I'd buy a copy of an American football game.
On side note, I hope S.I. can make a footballer's career mode where play as the player.
EA has the exclusive rights to NFL, but out of all the worlds big sports it does seem to be the most tactical. But until the license issues have been sorted its EA and EA alone that would have to make the game.
A bit of a side note:
I find it funny that Americans are so against European "socialism" whereas, if you look at American sports leagues, they are way more "socialized" than sports in Europe.
Front Office Football is a good game, Just very outdated graphics wise and a little confusing if you don't know the way the game works. You have to edit in the team names but it has all the real players and is updated regularly. It has a good community and a lot of people playing multiplayer leagues online. Everyone is waiting for a new version that should come along soon. Football mogul seems like a good game as well. Wolverine Studios is in the process of developing an NFL management game as they have recently released their NBA sim.
A game that includes the college scene would be immense and have a very large target audience both in America and around the world. The reason i originally got into football(soccer) was through playing management sims, I also loved EHM to death and i don't have any interest in ice hockey.
Contrary to popular belief there is a lot of strategy involved in NFL. The game itself is like a game of chess, you have to guess what the other guy is going to do and figure out a way to counter it as well as focus on the strengths and weaknesses of different teams. There is a Salary cap so you can't just sign all the best players and roam around the nation mauling other teams. Then there is the draft where you have to try and guess what kind of player a young guy will develop into and if his personality will fit in with your current group of players, and that's really just scratching the surface.
It's a shame that EA has neglected the management part of the Madden series in recent years as it was quite good around the turn of the century and i spent many an hour playing it. I think SI could do a good job of releasing an NFL game and would make a lot of $$$ too, Perhaps the best approach would be to do what they have done in the past and take over an already developed game and make it better.
Last edited by Johnjo; 08-02-2011 at 08:56.
I actually disagree with you here. At least in my country (Australia) the general belief seems to be that the game if anything is a bit too tactical rather than not tactical enough. However the game seems to be getting more and more popular over here, and I reckon a management sim for gridiron would definitely sell outside of the states as well as in.Contrary to popular belief there is a lot of strategy involved in NFL.
I am an Aussie too mate, we seem to be taking over the SI forums of late. Basicly got into American Football by playing madden a lot. Don't particularly like either of the rugby codes and reserve a special hatred of AFL. As for our disagreement I was trying to have a subtle dig at SCIAG's post.
Greydog software make a college American football sim called Bowl Bound but there is no option to carry on into the NFL.
The now defunct 400 software studios made a decent American football sim called Total Pro Football which was clearly based on the NFL although the teams had names like Cincinnati Tigers, etc. Sadly I have never been able to get it to work in anything other than XP.
Their would be a lot of interest if SI decided to release an 'NFLM' IMO.
The only problem is time and money, SI have always said their match engine and database is their biggest asset in terms of what puts them ahead of their 'rivals. Re-vamping the match engines for an NFL game would take a lot of time and money. We know this just by the patch by patch release from SI to tweak match engine problems every year so to change the mechanics completely would be a BIG job.
As to the database, this would take time as well as many volunteers which FM currently has.
Its just a matter of SI and Sega digging into their pockets to make this new venture. In the long term i think it would be of great benefit to them. After all America is the size of Europe with a population of around 700 million right? Of which American football is a big franchise and a big money spinner with millions upon millions of fans.
Never say never as they say but its not something that would be on the shelves in the near future unfortunately IMO.
I know this topic should have perhaps died months ago but my two cents is that this is a risk not worth taking for SI. They sit very comfortable with decent sales figures year after year for FM why rock the boat and put the whole company at risk on the off-chance that either an American Football or Rugby Management game would sell well.
Honestly I think basketball would be better. That way you could - at least ideally - include all the leagues from across the world, college basketball, even high school and AAU. The NBA would just be the top league. It also has the bonus of international competitions, as well.
Also the reason NFL Head Coach didn't sell well is it was terrible. Madden's Franchise mode had almost everything it did, and had the bonus of being Madden.
Last edited by tdpatriots12; 10-05-2011 at 16:25.
Speaking as an englishman who plays american football at uni, and has played football most of my life, to the few people that have said they are unsure of the popularity of such a game in europe, you'd be very surprised. It was only until i started playing thta i realised how large the game is, withteams all over europe competing, and the teams themselves do feature a fair few ex NFL players (albeit those that were 3rd string etc). But many people playing at the top level in Britain believe its only a matter of years before it becomes a professional sport in the uk, and the capacity for success can be seen by the NFL games at wembley. Although, personally i find the game isnt always that enthralling to watch, it depends who you're with, if your watching it wiht a good group of freinds you barely notice the stop/start nature, however if you're watching it on your own... And the capacity for the spectacular is amazing.
In regards to managing, i agree with those saying American Football is much more in depth, due to the fluidity of football, players are only really working on a base structure, its up to the flair and differences of the individuals to create the space and so on, so the players in essence have more of an impact. Whereas in american football, in all of our games this year, our plays were completely altered to deal with an opponents strength and their usual plays, whilst in offense, your working more to a strict tempo, and people executing their set plays perfectly, its a far more tactical game than football, and as a result the coaches have more influence. So i think the merits of having this sort of game are there, i think its doable...
Anyway, thats what i had to say...
Agree completely with the above. The coaches have so much more control over the game. It's generally if sheer ignorance when it's described as boring. Although I wouldn't say there are enough fans in England to support a mainstream game with the rise of social and internet gaming I reckon one will appear given time. Albeit not quite as much depth as FM.
There's still an EHM community and there's the entire Canadian/US market as well as Scandinavia, Germany, Switzerland, Russia, and the UK. We love our hockey and if there was more of an EHM presence here it can work.
An NFL game won't sell very well without a license. I rather bring back EHM than a rugby manager or a NFL manager game.
i personally would prefer a basketball game because i think that SI could do a brilliant nba management sim.
An American football game similar to fm would work in my opinion but I would not buy it, I would buy a basketball one.
Only other sports simulater I play is text based wmma 3 which involves running a mixed martial arts company. It is easily one of the most addictive games ever.
Firstly where do you get the wmma from?
Secondly i think that the main problem would be that the games would take far too long. I mean in my understanding, much of american football is about changing formation, calling individual plays, depending on the opposing team etc.
So you would constantly be pausng the game going into the tactics screen, choosing an appropriate tactic, until the next down, where you would go into the tactics screen etc etc etc.
It would take an AGE to get through a game, which for me would be a turn off, and im guessing most casual fans would say the same.
I think hardcore fans would buy it but that is about it.
Unless i am wrong about american football? I only watch it a bit.
I would LOVE a really indepth NFL management game, would have to have college football in it too imo. There is a huge fanbase out there in my experience.
The podcast did say FML was shutting down and Miles had a new announcement to make that he refused to make on the last podcast. So who knows, maybe a new game is coming! Or it could be something else..
Creating your own plays and playbook itself would have almost limitless tactics & strategy
Imagine the depth if you did have college football included
Ive always missed a quality NFL online management game bigtime - bring it on
Last edited by Adam Dunbar; 12-05-2011 at 22:19.
The games wouldnt take forever to sim though, you could invent the playbook, then set your team on which series of plays to run for deifferent scenarios. E.g 2nd and long going for a draw play, or could come up with many run offensives and set your team up as a running team, to change on 3rd and long to the passes etc, similiar with defence, only taking control when your either in the red zone or in the 35. It could definately work, but the amount of time that would need to be invested for such a project...
I think it would be fantastic to be able to call the shots for an NFL team like with FM. However, I think that the NFL rights would be astronomical to obtain and they're pretty tight with things like that and the time required to create it and functionality of the game could be very, very complicated.
A NFL or college football management game towards the FM standard would be amazing. Yes the NFL rights would be expensive, but there are no rights for NCAA. There is certainly a big market for it in the US, if the game was good it would undoubtedly boots FM sales over there too.
You'd definitely need a shedload of clauses in there to stop them from just running away and building their own game once they've learnt the FM secrets.
Come one SI make the Aussie Rules version, Premership Coach is too annoying and rough.
i hope some day can see a boxing managment game with the quality and realism of football manager
for years now, an american football manager game made with the engine of FM is my dream game.
there never was a proper NFL management game, Head Coach is a stupid, shallow, typical EA Sports crap, Football Mogul and co. are too amateurish.
I understand the marketability issues, the fact that many american football fans dont give a crap about the immense depth of the tactics of the sport, they just wanna see huge tackles, and all the other sad realities of the thing, but I cant stop dreaming, cause weve already seen OOTP branching out of FM, made by only a handful of guys.
I wouldnt even mind if there werent be a graphical engine, but srsly, a game with the tactical depth, and the 2D engine of FM would be absolutely the perfect game for me.
im a massive nfl fan and with there not being a decent management sim theres not even a decent f1 management sim thats up to date
There is simply no market for it. Believe it or not, the number of people who enjoy this style of game is very small.. What makes FM such a success is the world wide popularity of the sport which enables them to tap into those small groups in each country, boosting their sales. American football however, while clearly the most popular sport in America, has hardly any significant fan base outside on the US, which would really limit the game to just a very small number of really diehard sport franchise game fans in the US (and you really have to be diehard to enjoy a game this in depth).
That said, if SI ever made one, I would buy it