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Thread: 59% fit but comes on and scores a hattrick

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    Angry 59% fit but comes on and scores a hattrick

    1 nil up away at arsenal 60 minutes gone and arsenal decide to make a change. they take off chamakh and bring on van persie who i see is only 59% fit to play upfont on his own :s, so i set closing down to always and set tackling hard and to show him onto to his weaker side and think right no worries here. WRONG!!! He then procedes to score a hattrick WTF!!! One of which he skips past two of my defenders!!! Is this realistic??? i wouldnt put a 59% fit player in my squad let alone bring him on desperate for a goal or does filtness not matter on this game!?

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    Just because a player isn't a 100% fit it doesn't mean he can't make a difference. A lot of teams will include players who can make a difference to their team even if they aren't fit. The reason being is because they can make difference. You have obviously been unlucky on this occasion .

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    good old van persie unlucky xD

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    Fabregas did it against Villa last season, came on for 20 mins did the business and went off again injured.

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    I believe the mistake you made was playing him onto his weak foot, he has a very strong right foot so you'll have given him a lot of space to shoot on it.

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    What type of injury was he in light training from?

    Condition might not neccessarly mean he's 59% of full physical ability and given the last 20 mins of a game he could still destroy your defence.

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    Closing him down always may not have helped either.

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    Tbf Van Persie nearly scored a hattrick against us last year when he was about 60% fit coming off the bench. Only Gomes' heroics gave us the 3 points.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dar2000 View Post
    What type of injury was he in light training from?

    Condition might not neccessarly mean he's 59% of full physical ability and given the last 20 mins of a game he could still destroy your defence.
    he had the orange injured sign and was expected to be out for another day to three days after specialist treatment on a hip injury. so he hadnt played for two months or trained and come off the bench 59% fit and scored a hattrick, very unrealistic imo

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    Despite all the excuses I have to agree with the OP. I find it hard to believe that a team like Arsenal would include a 59% fit player on the bench (regardless of how important or how much impact he could provide). Why would they risk injuring him further when they have the depth to let him fully recover. As for him scoring a hat trick with 20 mins to go I feel that his fitness may have been similar, although probably lower, than your defence and a player of his quality has it in him to bang in 3. It's not like they started a 59% fit player.

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    Luck of the draw. A completely fit player doesnt make them good, and an unfit player doesn't make them poor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deejaydoubleyou View Post
    Despite all the excuses I have to agree with the OP. I find it hard to believe that a team like Arsenal would include a 59% fit player on the bench (regardless of how important or how much impact he could provide). Why would they risk injuring him further when they have the depth to let him fully recover. As for him scoring a hat trick with 20 mins to go I feel that his fitness may have been similar, although probably lower, than your defence and a player of his quality has it in him to bang in 3. It's not like they started a 59% fit player.
    But they've done it constantly IRL with Fabregas and RVP. Chelsea had a half fit Drogba on the bench yesterday. Spurs had a 75% fit THudd on the bench. It happens. Depends on how important the game is I guess.

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    If its ok to bring on a player at 59%, how come the AM keeps on saying players are exhausted when they are at 75% fitness and we should take them off?

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    Quote Originally Posted by philly_flyer10 View Post
    If its ok to bring on a player at 59%, how come the AM keeps on saying players are exhausted when they are at 75% fitness and we should take them off?
    The assman was probably telling the AI Wenger that!!
    Do you always listen to the assman?

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    Quote Originally Posted by edgar555 View Post
    But they've done it constantly IRL with Fabregas and RVP. Chelsea had a half fit Drogba on the bench yesterday. Spurs had a 75% fit THudd on the bench. It happens. Depends on how important the game is I guess.
    why are you talkiing about, something you know nothing about..?

    you dont know ANYTHING about the fitness levels, when it comes to drogba, huddlestone or any other player.

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    Quote Originally Posted by greco View Post
    why are you talkiing about, something you know nothing about..?

    you dont know ANYTHING about the fitness levels, when it comes to drogba, huddlestone or any other player.
    LOL I was thinking that. Does he have access to the percentage of real life players? Could you tell me how Rooney is doing in America? Is he back to 90% fitness yet?

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    Quote Originally Posted by greco View Post
    why are you talkiing about, something you know nothing about..?

    you dont know ANYTHING about the fitness levels, when it comes to drogba, huddlestone or any other player.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deejaydoubleyou View Post
    LOL I was thinking that. Does he have access to the percentage of real life players? Could you tell me how Rooney is doing in America? Is he back to 90% fitness yet?
    people will try to defend the game in anyway even by making things up

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dicko99 View Post
    people will try to defend the game in anyway even by making things up
    that was also my initial thought.

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    Fabregas against Barca last year - must've been about 10% by the end!

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    Quote Originally Posted by greco View Post
    why are you talkiing about, something you know nothing about..?

    you dont know ANYTHING about the fitness levels, when it comes to drogba, huddlestone or any other player.
    Quote Originally Posted by Deejaydoubleyou View Post
    LOL I was thinking that. Does he have access to the percentage of real life players? Could you tell me how Rooney is doing in America? Is he back to 90% fitness yet?
    Quote Originally Posted by Dicko99 View Post
    people will try to defend the game in anyway even by making things up
    Quote Originally Posted by greco View Post
    that was also my initial thought.


    Where did I claim to know exact %ages. I'm just going by whats been said by their managers, and in Drogba's case my own experience of how bad it feels to have a severe fever. I've not claimed any knowledge other than that. I don't know how Rooney's doing but I bet he says he's 100% ;)
    I'm not blindly defending anything, I'm just putting a case forward that you obviously see no merit in. Doesn't mean others won't look at it without the uproar you 2 have felt necessary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by InterWolf View Post
    Fabregas against Barca last year - must've been about 10% by the end!
    Yeah a broken leg willl do that!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deejaydoubleyou View Post
    LOL I was thinking that. Does he have access to the percentage of real life players? Could you tell me how Rooney is doing in America? Is he back to 90% fitness yet?
    its a game of numbers and percentages, so we - as players - really rely on those and therefore its rather "disturbing", when these things happens.

    its not like the player has a niggle or a smallish injury, the player is only HALF fit, thats a huge handicap. Half fit and outhustling elite level athletes, that doesnt seem like the norm in pro sports.

    Everyone of us, who has played sports, where the heartrate is high, wil know, that going in, only being 59 percent ready, would result in a awful awful and an even more awful performance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by greco View Post
    its a game of numbers and percentages, so we - as players - really rely on those and therefore its rather "disturbing", when these things happens.

    its not like the player has a niggle or a smallish injury, the player is only HALF fit, thats a huge handicap. Half fit and outhustling elite level athletes, that doesnt seem like the norm in pro sports.

    Everyone of us, who has played sports, where the heartrate is high, wil know, that going in, only being 59 percent ready, would result in a awful awful and an even more awful performance.
    But as someone else pointed out when he came on with 20 mins to go, all the other players would have been around 60-70% and falling. Whats the difference between 59 and 60? 1. Not a lot is it.
    Like I said above I'm not definitely saying this is right, just looking at it with an open mind.

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    oproar.. lmao..

    yiou quite clealy state, that such things happen in real life and gladly thow out numbers, you know nothing about. So how do you really know, if it happens, when you dont know the numbers..?

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    teams play players who are not fully fit all of the time. it has been well documented tha players like john terry have taken cortisone steroid injections in order to play through injuries.
    i'm not going to pretend i know anything about percentages (i firmly believe the real life managers use them as a rough guess in most cases as its a percentage one day and 50/50 the next) but if a player needs an injection to play then they are not fully fit.
    as mentioned above, RVP has played in games when he is not match fit (also been well documented) and performed, likewise with fabregas against barcelona, so why should this not be replicated in the game? is it a one off or is it happening to you every week?

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    Quote Originally Posted by edgar555 View Post
    Where did I claim to know exact %ages.
    Ummm in that post you made where you said "Chelsea had a half fit Drogba on the bench yesterday. Spurs had a 75% fit THudd on the bench."

    I think we have two issues here.

    1: It's not real life to say Arsenal would have a 59% fit RVP sitting on the bench to start the game. Top flight teams would not start players who were coming back from a hip injury 3 days early after being out for 2 months (as was stated by the OP).
    2: A 59% fit RVP coming off the bench and bagging three in a game as was the OP topic.

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    I'm enjoying the assumption that you can measure fitness in percentage terms in real life. All a real life manager does is decide how much of the game his returning to fitness player is likely to last. Sometimes it goes wrong, sometimes it goes right.

    In this match Va Persie was not match fit. However, if he was up against a tiring defence instructed to close him down aggressively and dive in at him when he got the ball, it would even things up remarkably.

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    How fit do you think Ronaldo Nazario has been for the las 8 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deejaydoubleyou View Post
    I think we have two issues here.

    1: It's not real life to say Arsenal would have a 59% fit RVP sitting on the bench to start the game. Top flight teams would not start players who were coming back from a hip injury 3 days early after being out for 2 months (as was stated by the OP).
    2: A 59% fit RVP coming off the bench and bagging three in a game as was the OP topic.
    1. top flight clubs regularly bring back players before they are fully fit. arsenal have done this with RvP on more than one occasion as well as other players.
    2. fabregas destroyed barcelona with a broken leg.

    so for you to say that this never happens is not quite true is it?

    look at RvP's stats. he is clearly one of arsenal's better players and in the game, as well as in real life a half fit RvP would do a better job than bendtner would

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    I always recall Pompey's 4-1 demolition of Saints one Sunday.

    harry in charge at Saints...lua-lu scores a goal then injures himself doing his backflips. He's then waiting by the touchline to get subbed.....ball comes his way way picks it up small dribble shoots and its a goal

    Anyway I do agree that its unlikely you'd have anyone in your squad if it was less than 70% fit...very unlikely. i've also noticed the championship that playing Saturday and mid-week really seems to drain my players fitness levels. Anyone else noticed?

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    so far i havent seen my defenders at 60 % with 20 min to go. You throw out numbers and in such a vague and incoherant manner, that its getting stupid.

    no one claims, that managers do not play players with niggles, small injuries or even players lacking match fitness, but ill sure as hell claim, that a players suffering from a hip injury, close to only half og his top game, who hasnt played for months, isnt gonna score a hattrick in the premier league. This isnt sunday league.

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    Quote Originally Posted by underwater sunlight View Post
    1. top flight clubs regularly bring back players before they are fully fit. arsenal have done this with RvP on more than one occasion as well as other players.
    2. fabregas destroyed barcelona with a broken leg.

    so for you to say that this never happens is not quite true is it?

    look at RvP's stats. he is clearly one of arsenal's better players and in the game, as well as in real life a half fit RvP would do a better job than bendtner would
    Summed up what I was going to say exactly, but not just bendtner!

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    Quote Originally Posted by greco View Post
    no one claims, that managers do not play players with niggles, small injuries or even players lacking match fitness, but ill sure as hell claim, that a players suffering from a hip injury, close to only half og his top game, who hasnt played for months, isnt gonna score a hattrick in the premier league. This isnt sunday league.
    He speaketh the truth!

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    if fabregas can destroy barcelona with a broken leg is the above so hard to believe?
    when it happens to you every week then there is a severe issue in the game, but when a team relies on their star striker despite not being fit and he exceeds expectations on one occasion i suggest you suck it up and get over it

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    Quote Originally Posted by underwater sunlight View Post
    if fabregas can destroy barcelona with a broken leg is the above so hard to believe?
    when it happens to you every week then there is a severe issue in the game, but when a team relies on their star striker despite not being fit and he exceeds expectations on one occasion i suggest you suck it up and get over it
    how about you deal with the fact, that the game aint flawless, can you suck that up fanboy.

    wrecked barcelona.. you must be an arsenal nuthugger, cause fabregas didnt wreck anything, the man scored a penalty. And that you want to compare to scoring a hattrick.

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    I think the problem lies here. It is pretty clear that the game does not cheat. It is a game made up of numbers, percentages, and probability. It does not just decide that you are not going to win today.

    The match engine does precise calculations to determine what happens on the field, whether you believe it to be realistic or not. Therefore the only conclusion that can be possible is that you messed up royally to allow a half fit player to score a hat-trick. It's been a while since I've seen this on these forums but here goes ...

    It's your tactics. Pure and simple. Whatever you did, however you reacted, was the wrong decision, hence the reason you lost. There is literally no other logical explanation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by greco View Post
    how about you deal with the fact, that the game aint flawless, can you suck that up fanboy.

    wrecked barcelona.. you must be an arsenal nuthugger, cause fabregas didnt wreck anything, the man scored a penalty. And that you want to compare to scoring a hattrick.
    lets see, fanboy? not in the slightest, and actually i'm a rangers fan but nice try.
    the fact that arsenal's best player on the night was one with a broken leg says that what happened in the OP's post is possible in real life.
    if you read through my posts you will notice that i have repeatedly said that what happened to the OP is possible and that similar occurances have, and will continue to happen in the real world.
    i have also stated my beliefs that what happened is not a likely occurance.

    the fact that players have cortiso-steroid injections every week in rare instances, when the average person is medically advised to limit themselves to 2 a year says that these players will do a lot to play every week, let alone in the bigger games.

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    How about you all get back on topic without the insults

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    Quote Originally Posted by underwater sunlight View Post
    lets see, fanboy? not in the slightest, and actually i'm a rangers fan but nice try.
    the fact that arsenal's best player on the night was one with a broken leg says that what happened in the OP's post is possible in real life.
    if you read through my posts you will notice that i have repeatedly said that what happened to the OP is possible and that similar occurances have, and will continue to happen in the real world.
    i have also stated my beliefs that what happened is not a likely occurance.

    the fact that players have cortiso-steroid injections every week in rare instances, when the average person is medically advised to limit themselves to 2 a year says that these players will do a lot to play every week, let alone in the bigger games.
    yiour vague attempt, at comparing 2 vastly different scenarios, proves absolutely nothing.

    fabregas didnt wreck anything, he got injured 10 min before the game ended and scored a PENALTY, whereas an only halffit and injured rvp scored a hattrick.

    No one, who is only 59% ready, is going to score a hattrick in the premier league. You have to remember what this number represents in the game, ots the only option we as managers have to evaluate, if he is ready or not. IRL there are no numbers, the manager will throw the player through tests, we dont have that option, so these numbers in question, are really of huge importance and what we go by.

    at elite level 1 or 2 % means so much, but we arent talking about that, we are talking 41..!

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    Fabregas wasn't out for 2 months when he came on and scored, then went back off after 20 minutes was he? nor did he bag 3 goals. Drogba also wasn't out for ages and came back half fit to bag a hat-trick and I agree with the OP, hip injuries are bad and 2-3 months out so you then need a few games to get match fitness back letalone proper fitness, so to come on without match fitness and 59% fit after 2-3 months out and score 3 goals is hardly justified and I can't believe people are even trying to defend that.

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    greco, you nor i nor anyone has any percentage level of fitness, so how can you judge how the game decides to interpret it?

    i just got 3 kills while in last stand, point proved

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    the only thing more preposterous than the instance in the OP actually happening is the claim that cesc fabregas 'wrecked' barcelona ? think your memories are a bit clouded mate, barca should have absolutely DESTROYED arsenal in the scoreline that game but almunia played out of skin.

    barcelona pretty much taught arsenal how to play football in their own ground for 60mins or so where cesc certainly 'wrecked' very little. has arsenal ever had only 38% possession in the emirates before? probably not. walcott changed it around coming on late obviously. before cesc's 'wrecking' was being fouled in the box while trying to to get to bendtner's knockdown iirc, and taking a penalty.

    actually am probably being a bit harsh on how preposterous the OP's situation is because whilst i loathe to play players below 95% let alone 59%, the context of what the OP's players condition is important, and RVP's class probably made the most from tired players diving in - but even still, a hattrick is just insane.

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    OP just suck it up man. Your defenders couldnt deal with a half fit RVP, its ur own fault

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    its cos he's Van the Man!!!! hes a don for my team just incredible luv him to bits!!

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    I think its just a set a bad rolls I doubt he'd do a hat trick again in 20 trys given the situation presented

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    First mistake you did was show him on weaker foot. He doesn't have one.
    Second, you didnt raise your defensive line.

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    One thing to also take into account is that 59% fitness isn't just over half fit. I have never seen a player with anything under 40% (except with injuries) so for a player to be at 59% is almost running dead. Personally I normally sub players when they get down around 65-60%

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    George Best scored a hat trick while drunk out of his senses heheh

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    Depends why he's at 59% to be honest, if he's just tired or unfit then he could definately turn a few players and score a hat trick. In that case play high up the pitch so he has more running to do to get to goal.

    If he's at 59% because of a broken leg (or recovering at least), then it's a rare but possible case. Some players don't have to be 100% to perform well, especially in big matches. Put it this way, even if I had the flu and barely had anything in me I'd still be able to play football in a big match. I'd be a big liability and a gamble but gambling is all about seeing if it pays off or not.

    Defending against one attacker is tricky though, I try to push up and then mark him with a stopper. I leave a cover behind him to mop up any mess to lower the chances of somebody getting between them. I've been caught napping plenty a time realising too late that the opposition is playing 1 striker or changed to 1 striker.

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