Explanation of the Impact of Player Attributes During Match Play

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I’ve not seen a thread like this on the forums ever. So I will try and explain how player attributes are used in game and show what attributes are used. By the end of this when it is all finished I should have highlighted how each attribute work in a game scenario just to give you a general idea. This will be a lot to read and take in, but for anyone wanting to learn how the game works then it is important you understand how the attributes work and what they do.

To start off I will just highlight a goal scored in my Aston Villa game. I will add other explanations for other areas of the pitch at some point but for now this should give you a general idea on how they work as a whole. Before I start I would also like to thank Sfraser as he had a massive amount of input into this threadJ. Also because of how the new forums don’t show pictures properly in threads I’ll just post links to the pictures until SI (hopefully) wider the forum.

While most people have a general idea of what each player attribute does it seems many users still have confusion over what stats and attributes are used during a move. Hopefully this will go a long way to clearing a lot of things up and it might make you think about tactics in a different light. It’s not easy trying to figure out which attributes are used at times as some are similar to each other. But hopefully you’ll understand what I’ve written and be able to see in the screenshots and explanations.

I’ll break the move down into three stages so it doesn’t become too confusing.

Here goes;

Stephen Ireland the player circled in blue has attempted to do a cross field pass to Shaun Wright Phillips. This was to exploit the space down my right side due to my formation as I lack width on this side. It looks like Stephen Warnock (the yellow arrow) will struggle to get across to cover. But that isn’t strictly true as Warnock is in a good starting position to make an interception. So before anything happened the defenders positioning attribute was already working. Let’s remind ourselves what positioning actually means;

Positioning is the ability of a player to read a situation and position himself in the best possible position to deal with the unfolding events. Anticipation will help him in the first stage but in terms of his actual positioning, it comes down to this attribute. A higher rating will ensure the player takes up a better position.

Anticipation also plays a part due to the player needing to anticipate how Shaun Wright Phillips makes his movement. Because anticipation also plays a part here is how that works;

How well a player can predict and react to an event. If a player has a high attribute here he can read the game well and react to situations quicker than others. This attribute works well with ‘Off the Ball’.

Now we have a general idea of what the first 2 attributes used do we need to look at the move a little closer. I won’t mention off the ball just yet as that is mainly an attacking attribute only as defensive players need positioning instead. They are the only 2 attributes (apart from goalkeeping attributes) that are specific to defensive or attacking players. Off the ball is for attacking players and positioning for defenders.

Stephen Warnock manages to come across and pressure Shaun Wright Phillips. Even though SWP is the faster player when he was waiting for the pass from Stephen Ireland he was facing the wrong way. This meant that Warnock had the upper hand as he was facing the correct way due to the position he took up. This allowed him to use his acceleration to come across and cover.

Acceleration is how quickly a player can reach top speed (pace) from a standing start. It therefore ties in very closely with the Pace attribute.

There is in fact a fairly obvious superiority of Anticipation, Composure, Determination and Workrate. This is one of the reasons why Stephen Warnock got to the ball first, along with the attributes already mentioned above.

By showing a good amount of composure it allowed him to stay calm and not rush into making a tackle. Here is a reminder of what composure does.

The player’s steadiness of mind and ability, particularly with the ball. When faced with a big goalscoring chance or heavy pressure defensively, a player with high composure will be able to keep his head and more often than not make an intelligent decision which is beneficial to the team.

I also mentioned determination which is;

A commitment to succeed. A determined player will give everything in order to win. This ties in with Bravery – players with a high attribute in one of these attributes may also be high in the other as the traits necessary are similar.

Once Warnock knew what he had to do he was very determined to get to the ball. His workrate also allowed this to happen.

This reflects the player’s mental drive to work hard. A high rating will ensure a player wants to work his socks off from start to finish, but he will need the necessary physical attributes to actually be able to pull it off. Nonetheless, it is an admirable trait to have in your team.

Then once side by side with SWP it came down to Warnock’s decision making in what he should do.

The ability of a player to make a correct decision a majority of the time. This attribute is important in every position but perhaps more so for central defenders and midfielders, who will see a lot of the ball and have a number of options when in possession.

He decided to make a tackle but he could have quite easily decided to force him wide. But on this occasion he made the correct call to make the tackle. He wins the ball passes it to the striker who then comes deep and loses it. But luckily Warnock was on hand again to repeat the above as SWP looked to win the ball back.

So for me this moved worked as follows;

Positioning – Anticipation – Acceleration – Determination – Workrate – Composure – Decisions.

Sfrazer also made a good spot here in regards to this move;

Also I don't know if you noticed, but just before Warnock plays the ball to Milner, both Milner and Agbonlahor are facing in the direction that the possible move Milner refuses and the eventual move that leads to the goal comes from. That may not have any relevance whatsoever but I thought it might be worth pointing out. It could indicate just how early both players have anticipated the move. Indeed just before Warnock receives the ball after the contest between Toure and Agbonlahor, he turns to face Milner then receives the ball then dribbles infield past the poorly positioned Adrien to pass to the excellent choice of Milner. If you look at how the Aston Villa players involved in the build-up to the goal turn and move, it looks very clear to me that each move has been Anticipated well in advance and that each player has turned and looked in exactly the direction of each subsequent pass quite a few touches prior to execution.

This can be highlighted in this screenshot;

From viewing the clip several times it is clear that Warnock does consider passing to Adrien but realises he isn’t in the best position and decided to cut infield and pass to James Milner. It is hard to show the full movement of the above in just a screenshot. So I’ll also add the PKM to the end of the post so people can download it and see for themselves the events we are talking about.

Part Two of the Move

Once Stephen Warnock wins the ball for a second time, he then comes infield and picks a pass to James Milner.

As Milner received the ball Manchester City’s defence have already begun to step up meaning I have two player’s off-side. The thing that stands out here is that Milner could play the ball through first time. Had he done so however, Agbonlahor would have been half a yard offside. Beyond the technical difficulty of the first-time pass, I see no reason to imagine that Milner would not have considered it, seeing as how he spots the next pass. Therefore in my opinion Decisions has come into play in Milner before he even touches the ball, to make him refuse the bad pass to the offside Agbonlahor.

The attributes brought into play by receiving the pass goes like this;

Anticipation – First Touch – Composure – Technique

He anticipates he’ll receive the pass from Warnock. Then when he gets the pass his first touch is excellent. Important to the First Touch is the fact that Milner has anticipated the pass. Again turning to look at the ball and the passer before it reaches him. Had he not anticipated the pass then irrespective of his First Touch/Composure etc. the pass would have bounced off him? First touch is;

How good a player’s first touch is when receiving possession. A higher rating will ensure that the player can trap the ball quicker and put it in a useful position to then act upon. Players with lower ratings here will struggle to control the ball as adeptly and may be prone to losing the ball if closed down quickly.

Composure then comes into the equation and allows him to not panic about receiving such a difficult ball. Technique also plays a part here;

Technique is the aesthetic quality of a player’s technical game – how refined they appear to be with the ball. A player with high technique will be more likely to pull off a tricky pass or a cross-field ball with greater ease than someone less technically able. This in turn affects a number of technical attributes – poorer technique will let a player down.

This is also an important attribute when first touch is used, they go hand in hand.

The next attribute that really sticks out is Determination. Look at how Milner attacks the game immediately after controlling the ball. That is a determined run, by a mile. There is a bit of Agility, Dribbling, Acceleration, and I would say perhaps Aggression and almost certainly Workrate involved. No doubt a bit of Composure and Technique as well, and Anticipation of the challenge of the number 7 Ireland. Overall though, Determination is written all over that move.

The two attacking player’s in this move are way offside that is why Milner makes the decision to run with the ball. His run is determined but he is also anticipating that Agbonlahor will get back on side. For this to happen Agbonlahor needed to show great determination and acceleration to be able to get back in time. Milner’s timing is crucial here because if he plays the ball now then the whole move collapses. So his decision to hold onto the ball and drive forward before picking the pass is down to his decision making and determination to see the move succeed. Another thing is this move is Teamwork;

How well the player follows tactical instructions and works for and alongside his team-mates. A team full of players with a high rating here will work better as a unit. Players with lower ratings will slack off and not ‘buy in’ to the team ethos.

Concentration played a very important role in the move as well. The Concentration aspect of the move can be shown in how well each player anticipates each other’s movements throughout the move. As this move is early in the match, the final action in the move is a matter of split seconds between pass and run. If this was later in the match then both players might lose Concentration in the later parts of the move and mis-time or even fail to spot the final run or final pass of the move.

Concentration is;

This reflects a player’s concentration on an event-by-event basis. A high rating here will mean the player can concentrate harder for longer and be able to respond to incidents late in the game just as well as he did early on. Lower concentration will see players lose focus and perhaps become liable to mistakes at crucial times in the match.

Part Three

It’s quite clear that Milner and Agbonlahor are working together here because of what happens next. Agbonlahor gets back onside and is on the defenders blind side. As soon as Agbonlahor is back on side he starts to move forward again. Milner then plays a worldclass ball over the top for him to run onto. For him to be able to do this he has shown good anticipation, concentration, teamwork and decision making. In fact Milner looks to be waiting for Agbonlahors runs, showing Concentration and Teamwork, and the Anticipation of the precise timing of the pass is very good. Almost perfect give or take a few milliseconds and quarter of a yard. Concentration plays a large role here in my opinion.

The Teamwork aspect of the move can been seen in how many of the components of each players movements are linked together, in how early they both start playing the move together even before the pass and the run. A low Teamwork player might only spot the run, or the pass, instead of actually moving around before hand to assist his teammate in making the move easier to pull off.

The above is vital and you need to watch the PKM and view the first goal, to get a good understanding of what happened here. No amount of pictures or explanation can describe exactly what happened like viewing the clip would show.

Agbonlahor shows good off the ball due to his movement throughout the move. He knows exactly where he should be and knows the run he needs to make. Anticipation once again is also important. Here is what off the ball does;

A player’s movement without the ball. Similar to Anticipation, this is how well a player, particularly attacking ones, can assess a situation and then move off the ball, making themselves available to receive a pass in a dangerous position.

Once he gets back on side then he uses his agility to turn and make a run onto the ball from Milner.

Agility reflects how well a player can start, stop, and move in different directions at varying levels of speed (pace). It ties in with the Pace, Acceleration, and Balance attributes as they work together in the match engine, especially when a player is running with the ball.

As you can see agility uses a lot of other player attributes and it’s them all combined what makes the difference. However for this move it doesn’t matter than Agbonlahor doesn’t possess great balance or agility because the defender is on the back foot. Due to Agbonlahor running back from an offside position he’s managed to get onto the blind side of the defender. So already he has the advantage. All he needed was for Milner to execute the ball well and he would be away. And that’s what happened.

Once the ball comes over the top of the defender the striker already has a good 5 yards advantage and would never catch someone as fast as Agbonlahor up. He doesn’t even need a good first touch for this as he lets the ball bounce in front of him. He almost runs onto a dead ball by the time he gets on the end of it. Then he picks his corner and fires it home to make it 0-1.

So this move came about using;

Off the ball – Anticipation – Agility – Acceleration – Pace – Strength - Composure – Decisions – Technique - Finishing

Apart from pace and acceleration, Agbonlahor is quite poor in the other attributes. But that didn’t matter this time due to him getting into a position what allowed him time and space without been under too much pressure.

The player circled in red is trying to attempt a last ditch tackle just as Gabby is about to fire the ball home. The other defender Toure is just behind Agbonlahor and from viewing the clip several times you can see he tried to out muscle Gabby off the ball. But Agbonlahor is quite strong so he just dismissed Toure’s attempt and shrugged it off. Toure had one attempt to muscle him off the ball as he was behind the attacker so couldn’t tackle him as he would have given the penalty away.

The finish was also important. Finishing is;

The player’s ability to put the ball in the back of the net when presented with a chance. A high finishing attribute will put the shot on target a majority of the time as a bare minimum but compared to a player with poorer finishing will find the places where the goalkeeper can’t save it. This is purely the ability of the player to perform an accurate shot – Composure and Decisions will also impart on the ability of a player to score consistently.

While it seems the goal I scored was a simple quick attacking move, a lot of effort was made and had it not been for Milner’s brilliant decision making then this goal might have never happened. To view the goal and offer your own opinions on it, the link is;

http://www.filefront.com/16962257/last-goal.pkm/

Thanks to Sfraser once again and I hope this can help many of you out there. I will add to this at some point to further discuss the rest of the attributes I haven’t yet mentioned. But for now there should be more than enough to give you food for thought.

The next bit of this guide will look at certain moments from the same game. This should allow me to pick out key things that will highlight the rest of the attributes I’ve not mentioned yet. Plus the PKM is already uploaded should people decide to watch the game.

So far I’ve mentioned;

Positioning

Anticipation

Acceleration

Composure

Determination

Workrate

Teamwork

Decisions

First Touch

Technique

Concentration

Off the Ball

Agility

Strength

Finishing

In this screenshot it is a simple move that Fernando Gago does. He gets the ball and runs past Lee Cattermole. For this he used composure, technique, concentration, dribbling, balance, decisions, creativity and pace.

Dribbling is;

This refers to the player’s ability to dribble with the ball. This is purely his proficiency with the ball at his feet – his Pace, Acceleration, Agility, and Balance will all aid his dribbling in different circumstances, and whilst a higher dribbling attribute will also help him in different situations, dribbling alone isn’t enough to get by.

I also mentioned balance which is;

Balance reflects simply how well a player can keep his balance in situations both with and without the ball. With the ball, it refers to how balanced he is running with it and evading opponents, without it, it refers to his balance when facing a player running at him, or his stability when turning/jumping.

As the player is not instructed to run with the ball in his settings, then it is obvious his creativity played a part in the move.

This refers to a player’s vision and ability to see a potential opening, not necessarily exploit it. A player might be able to see something to take advantage of but also requires the technical proficiency to pull it off.

He saw he had a good chance of running past Lee Cattermole (due to his creativity) and then used his decision attribute to decide to do it.

Then he gives the ball to Fabian Delph and drops back. For this he used passing, composure, teamwork, workrate and positioning.

Adebayor who is circled in red is just about to receive the ball. Now if you look at my defensive midfielder you’ll see he is in a good position, especially as Adebayor is facing the wrong way. Then Adebayor starts to run towards the flank as he looks to turn and run towards my goal.

But he shows a bit too much of the ball allowing my defensive midfielder to slide in and take the ball away from him. For this Gago showed good positioning, marking, anticipation, bravery, determination, aggression, tackling, acceleration, concentration, workrate, and decisions.

We’ve already covered positioning so let’s move straight onto marking;

How well players, mainly defensive types, mark an opponent. Marking alone will see them do a good job if the attribute is high, but remember that other attributes – Strength, Off the Ball, Anticipation – will play a part in the effectiveness of the marking, as well as the comparable physical statures of the two players.

He also needed to be brave as he did a sliding tackle;

How committed and indeed, brave, a player is. Braver players will risk injury more in situations a lesser-minded player may shy away from. They’ll go in where it hurts and lay it on the line for the team.

We’ve not mentioned aggression before so here goes;

This reflects a player’s attitude in terms of playing mentality but is not necessarily a dirtiness indicator. A more aggressive player will look to involve himself in every incident and get stuck in, perhaps at the expense of a yellow card or two. A less aggressive player may shy away from situations and merely drop into his comfort zone.

And finally tackling which does exactly as it says on the tin;

How successfully the player is at winning tackles and not conceding fouls from such situations. Players with a high tackling rating will consistently win the ball cleanly and be a more capable defensive player

What we are beginning to see here is that a lot of the same attributes are used in all moves. Thing’s like decisions, anticipation, positioning and concentration seem to be more prominent than other attributes and are required for all actions a player does on the field. This is why it can hard to see how attributes work in game.

There are a lot of other factors involved in how attributes work, namely the team and individual settings you have instructed them to follow. But we will talk about the link between attributes and settings once all the attributes have been covered. This thread is just a basics understanding of what each attribute does before we move onto the more difficult stuff regarding player settings. That requires a lot more time and attention due to the sheer amount information we need to squeeze into them. But for now we’ll continue with the attributes and hopefully have this finished by the start of next week.

The other outfield attributes that I’ve not mentioned so far are;

Corners

This attribute reflects how well the player takes a corner. Taking advantage of set-pieces is important, and having a capable corner taker to put the ball into key areas is useful.

Crossing

This indicates a player’s proficiency at crossing the ball from wide areas into the penalty box.

Heading

This is a player’s competence in aerial situations. Heading applies to all situations and is only about the player’s ability to head the ball well. Jumping (and to a lesser extent Strength) plays a big part in combination with heading to utilize the attribute to a greater level, as well as a player’s height.

Jumping

This attribute related to how high a player can jump from a standing start.

Natural Fitness

How fit a player is as standard – his base level of fitness. It affects how many games he is likely to be able to perform to peak physical fitness in before becoming noticeably tired and susceptible to injury.

Flair

A natural talent for the creative and occasional unpredictability. A player with a lot of flair will be one of the key attacking components in any team but at the same time may need tactical restraint to get the best out of him. Flair and Creativity work well together.

The reason I’m not showing you how flair and creativity work in game just yet, is because I can discuss it more and put the point across a lot better but showing you how it works with the individual and team settings we choose. I feel it will be better served expanding on this when discussing those aspects.

Influence

Influence is the player’s ability to affect events or other players without any intentional effort. Players with high influence will be leaders on the pitch and team-mates will tend to rally around these players.

Free Kick Taking

This reflects how good at taking free kicks the player is. It applies to both direct shots at goal and deliveries into dangerous areas from wider or deeper positions. A player who is proficient in taking free kicks can be a valuable commodity – scoring five free kicks a season and adding five more assists from them can be a huge bonus.

Long Shots

This is the player’s prowess at shooting from distance – from outside the penalty area. It is largely a stand-alone attribute but pay attention to any PPMs the player may have which complement their long shots rating.

Long Throws

The ability of the player to perform a long throw, which can be taken advantage of in attacking situations.

Penalty Taking

The ability of the player from the penalty spot. A player with a high rating here will be more confident and capable from 12 yards.

These attributes are easy to see in game and are simple to understand. So there is no need to show how these work in a game situation. These are the easier attributes to see.

Goalkeeper attributes are probably one of the harder set of attributes to see in game. I’ll go into detail about a few of them now but a lot of them will be more visible to see and understand how they work when we talk about how attributes affect what we’ve instructed a player to do.

Aerial Ability

This is a goalkeeper’s ability to deal with the ball in aerial situations – punching and catching. Goalkeepers with higher ratings here will be able to deal with these potentially tricky situations more capably. Taller goalkeepers may have an advantage as well, but that isn’t to say smaller ones will struggle.

When you see a keeper coming for an aerial ball this is what he uses. Agility, balance, strength, concentration, determination, jumping, positioning, composure and anticipation all have an effect. All these attributes are used to determine if he will get to the ball, whether he gets the ball all depends on his handling.

Handling

How securely the goalkeeper holds onto the ball when making a save or coming for a loose ball. Greater handling will be beneficial in unfavourable weather conditions, but in general a goalkeeper who doesn’t give up rebounds will be useful.

Command of Area

This affects how well the goalkeeper takes charge of his penalty area and works with his defensive line. A goalkeeper who commands his entire box (i.e. has a high rating) will be instinctive and look to take charge of situations, especially coming for crosses (therefore working in tandem with Aerial Ability). Do note, however, that a high rating only increases his penchant for coming for crosses and not necessarily claiming them all.

Communication

How well a goalkeeper communicates with his defensive line and organises the defensive side of the team. A higher rating reflects a better communicator and will allow your back five (or more) to work better together, ensuring better defensive stability.

This is vital for sorting out defensive free kicks, a higher communication will allow for the defensive wall to be set more accurate with the right number of people in it.

Eccentricity

This attribute represents the likelihood of the goalkeeper to do the unexpected and typically act completely un-like a goalkeeper. Things like dribbling out of his area will be commonplace if the eccentricity attribute is high.

Ever seen your goalkeeper do something weird for no apparent reason? This could be the reason why.

Kicking

The physical capability of a goalkeeper to kick the ball – this purely defines the distance he can reach. His Passing and Technique ratings will define how accurate his kicks are.

One on Ones

The ability of the goalkeeper to do well when faced with an opponent in a one on one situation. Higher attributes will see goalkeepers attempt to impose themselves and win the ball with confidence.

When faced with a one on one situation, anticipation, decisions, composure, concentration, balance, agility, positioning, reflexes and rushing all will all come into the equation at some stage of the move. The higher the attributes for all those then the more likely he would be to deal with the situation.

Reflexes

How good the goalkeeper is at making instinctive reaction saves. If he has a high reflexes rating he will be able to respond to the unpredictable with more success and be able to pull off the highlight reel saves.

Rushing Out

How good the goalkeeper is at coming off his line to react to through balls and similar situations. A goalkeeper will benefit from Pace and Acceleration here as well.

Tendency to Punch

This determines whether a goalkeeper will catch the ball when he can, or punch it clear. A higher rating reflects a tendency to punch most things clear even when it may be possible to hold onto the ball.

Throwing

How good the goalkeeper’s distribution with his arms is. A higher rating will increase the accuracy of his throws, although Strength imparts on the distance he is able to reach.

Trying to show these attributes working in screenshots wouldn’t get them across well enough. So I am working on some videos to illustrate this better. But that will take a while longer, so I’ll edit the thread and add the links once finished. Might take me a while though as I’ve never done videos before.

Now I’ve covered the rest of the attributes I can move onto showing them in practise in a game and illustrate exactly what impact they have on the settings you select.

Took me awhile to find enough time to watch this clip carefully ( as in frame-by-frame carefully ). Congratulations to both of you and SFraser for this excellent writeup, and a bunch of loose comments and impressions.

Cheers for taking time out to offer feedback.

Warnock never looks like being in trouble. He notices the pass as soon as Ireland attempts to make it ( that would be probably anticipation at work ), turns his back to the goal and starts moving paralel to the pass direction ( positioning ) until the ball hits ground at which point he decides ( decisions ?) to move in and close down on the ball. Wright-Phillips had a poor first touch which caused the ball to run from him. Warnock collects ( acceleration, agility (?), first touch ) decides to play his way out of trouble ( decisions ) and dribbles past SWP ( dribbling ). The crucial part of this move seems to be decisions ( with quite reasonable options not to close down or put the ball to touch later coming to mind ).

Spot on, it was a very decision based move. If however he made the wrong decision I could have found myself 1-0 down.

It's interesting to obseve two more things - first is off the ball movement of Man City forwards witch are both running left ( Decisions, OtB, Teamwork ) dragging central defenders and the anchor away from SWP giving him acres of space if he gets to beat Warnock. Second is poor ( and very rigid in front of and between DCs ) positioning of Villa DM who should be much more to the right, in the way of passes on Ireland-Adebayor route and able to cover for Warnock if he got beat, if you look carefully you can see him rushing to the right to make up for that when the Warnock-SWP duel takes place.

Very true, this was more about the settings the player used though. His poor display in this move was more to do with that. Which we'll be discussing shortly.

I'd say it's Anticipation (noticing the pass) - Positioning ( tracking its course ) - Decisions ( deciding to close in when it hit the ground ) -Agility ( change of direction at speed ) - Acceleration/Pace ( closing in ) - Reflexes ( noticing poor touch of SWP ) - First Touch ( collecting the ball ) - Decisions ( deciding to dribble round SWP ) - Dribbling ( executing the chosen action ).

Can't argue with that.

Notice that the commentary does not say anything about Warnock tackling SWP.

While that is true, it did go down on the stats as a tackle though.

Now, the first pass to Abolanghor is pretty ambitious ( mentality ? ), and let's face it, poor

He was instructed to pass 'long' for this game to get Young and Agbonlahor behind the defenders so they could utilise their pace.

Much better decision would be probably to do a short pass into space for young who was positioning himself behind his fullback and looked ready to run. I can't say if it's lack of vision ( creativity ) or bad pass choice ( decisions ) from Warnock. You can see excellent positioning and marking from Barry who puts Adrien out of this move and good anticipation/decisions from Toure who immediately moves up to win the ball and puts a lot of pressure on Agbolanhor.

Because I gave him low creative freedom he is just following my instructions to the letter. That's why the move didn't work. If I'd allowed him to express himself more or gave him a different passing option then he should have passed to Young.

Warnock is faster to the back pass despite having more distance to cover than SWP which shows poor work rate of ManCity player and then is allowed to cut inside and let alone in space as SWP stands off and drops back quickly ( low determination ?).

I agree that Warnock seems to consider, and rule out a pass to Adrien who has two opponents going forward ( Barry, SWP ) and two going back ( City strikers ). In the end he chooses much better option of Miller in space on centre left.

SWP probably did show a lack of determination and probably failed to anticipate the return ball.

And here's where we have to disagree. For me his little run after getting the ball is all about teamwork ( gives Agbolanhor time to move back onside ) and bravery ( he's not afraid to run at Ireland and into the crowd ). Sure, there's some composure, technique, and a lot of decisions, but what he does is basicaly holding up the ball. Determination? Meh, maybe at the end when Ireland finaly closes in

The first thing for me that he does is make a determined run. For me both the teamwork and determination attribute played a massive part in the beginning of the move when Milner gets the ball. As soon as he recieved the ball he'd already made the decision to drive forward with the ball, which for me shows great determination and teamwork due to him waiting for Agbonlahor to get back on-side.

Determination and Aggression ( or rather lack of these ) can be seen in Irelands' behaviour as he neither closes down or challenges Millner giving him all the time in the world to pick his moment. Notice also how completely off guard is Toure caught by following pass as he doesn't turn untill the ball is allmost over him and his striker well in front already ( anticipation and concentration failure ? ).

It was the sort of ball that would have caught anyone out imo. It's something that is very hard to stop happening from in games.

I really appreciate the feedback, gave me more food for thought

I've deleted all the old posts and added a lot more content. The first part is now actually finished.

I'm really shocked and saddened by the lack of interest in a thread like this, especially when most of the thread's asking for help on this forum are all linked to the attributes of a player. I really thought it would have been a more appealing thread than it is....

Absolutely fantastic thread Cleon. Well done and this has been a great help as well as opening my eyes to a lot that I didn't know.

Cleon, I'm not sure if this is relevent but do you know what attributes make a player more likely to hit the ball hard or place it when shooting except for PPM's?

Absolutely fantastic thread Cleon. Well done and this has been a great help as well as opening my eyes to a lot that I didn't know.

Thanks

Cleon, I'm not sure if this is relevent but do you know what attributes make a player more likely to hit the ball hard or place it when shooting except for PPM's?

Creativity and Flair would be used to decide what type of shot to try if they don't have a PPM for it. How powerful the shot would be would also be tied to strength.

Hey, it would look better if all the other posts ( including mine ) didn't disappear mysteriously ;]

And to be serious - we had the forums locked for most of the time lately which must have hurt the attendance. What's more it's a highly technical topic ( and it looks even more technical than it really is ) which probably scares people away. What's more, it's highly abstract, a lot of theory, a lot of meticulously dissected examples but not a lot of hooks for discussion. I think people would be much more engaged if we went for more practical and down to earth problems. Eg - If I had two players with exactly the same technical, physical and hidden skills, which one would perform better, one with higher anticipation, or one with hidden decisions?

If it comes to me personally, I'm curious which flaws can be compensated by other attributes ( eg. is poor positioning compensated by good determination + work rate? does team with high teamwork compensate for poor technical skills ? ) and which are fatal flaws ( is poor concentration always lethal for your defensive prospects ? ). I'm also trying to find out things about set pieces ( does long throws determine accuracy only or does it also determine reach? is technique involved? creativity? do corners require good crossing? ) Generally in your place I'd start writing about small practical problems like that.

If I was also to suggest something, I'd switch from using world-class players as examples because they are usually well rounded and lack distinct advantages and flaws. Not all of us play EPL and can treat 10 in an attribute as an end of the world ;]

And to be serious - we had the forums locked for most of the time lately which must have hurt the attendance. What's more it's a highly technical topic ( and it looks even more technical than it really is ) which probably scares people away. What's more, it's highly abstract, a lot of theory, a lot of meticulously dissected examples but not a lot of hooks for discussion. I think people would be much more engaged if we went for more practical and down to earth problems. Eg - If I had two players with exactly the same technical, physical and hidden skills, which one would perform better, one with higher anticipation, or one with hidden decisions?

What's a lot of theory? What I've wrote isn't theory.....

Plus if you'd read it all which I'm assuming you have you'd know that this is just 1 small part of a much bigger project which will focus on more specific things. But before I can do anything else the basics of the attributes had to be highlighted. These are the foundations for the rest of the thread.

If it comes to me personally, I'm curious which flaws can be compensated by other attributes ( eg. is poor positioning compensated by good determination + work rate? does team with high teamwork compensate for poor technical skills ? ) and which are fatal flaws ( is poor concentration always lethal for your defensive prospects ? ). I'm also trying to find out things about set pieces ( does long throws determine accuracy only or does it also determine reach? is technique involved? creativity? do corners require good crossing? ) Generally in your place I'd start writing about small practical problems like that.

Which I will be going into. But I can't write it all in a day, something like this is time consuming.

If I was also to suggest something, I'd switch from using world-class players as examples because they are usually well rounded and lack distinct advantages and flaws. Not all of us play EPL and can treat 10 in an attribute as an end of the world ;]

I don't have a single worldclass player in the squad......plus I use things from my own games to discuss. For discussing the attributes and what they do it doesn't matter what type of player was used. As the next set of articles will go into detail about the effects of attributes in relation to tactic settings.

This is one of the best threads written in a long while. Thank you, Cleon. A GREAT read... Bookmarked for many, many future references!

This is one of the best threads written in a long while. Thank you, Cleon. A GREAT read... Bookmarked for many, many future references!

Thanks I appreciate it

Brilliant thread as always Cleon! Only had time to skim-read, but i'm sure when I have time I'll find that the detail is just as good!

An amazing thread. I'm holding off, until you've written all your posts, to come up with any questions as I might go into something that you were going to cover anyway, but let me just say that I had a few pennies drop while reading this. The biggest thing for me until now is probably how important anticipation seems to be. I should have figured that out for myself a long time ago probably, but I always seemed to value it only in strikers and central defenders until now. I always had it more tied to how players anticipated passes into the goal area or "killer balls", not just movement and passes in general. Well, not so anymore...

As for the lack of interest, don't feel too hard done by. I had to attempt to post this reply 7 times before the servers were done messing everything up. It was only because you seemed somewhat hurt by the lack of interest that I persisted through so many attempts. I guess until these boards are up and running properly again, everything will just be slightly strange around here.

An amazing thread. I'm holding off, until you've written all your posts, to come up with any questions as I might go into something that you were going to cover anyway, but let me just say that I had a few pennies drop while reading this. The biggest thing for me until now is probably how important anticipation seems to be. I should have figured that out for myself a long time ago probably, but I always seemed to value it only in strikers and central defenders until now. I always had it more tied to how players anticipated passes into the goal area or "killer balls", not just movement and passes in general. Well, not so anymore...

As for the lack of interest, don't feel too hard done by. I had to attempt to post this reply 7 times before the servers were done messing everything up. It was only because you seemed somewhat hurt by the lack of interest that I persisted through so many attempts. I guess until these boards are up and running properly again, everything will just be slightly strange around here.

Yeah, and a double post as well. Hope, they get this figured out soonish...

Great thread, very informative and clears up a lot of things.

Arise Sir Cleon!

Good understanding of the role of player attributes, can be pivotal in both understanding and creating tactics.

Cheers lads

I am adding to this but it wont be until FM 11. I've already started work and completed a few more articles based around the attributes. But I'll be releasing it as 1 big thread a bit like TT'11 will be. I'm already 97 pages into it, which means it'll be a massive project but well worth it.

If you want to keep upto date with my latest threads on here then follow me http://twitter.com/Cleon81

I am adding to this but it wont be until FM 11. I've already started work and completed a few more articles based around the attributes. But I'll be releasing it as 1 big thread a bit like TT'11 will be. I'm already 97 pages into it, which means it'll be a massive project but well worth it.

If you want to keep upto date with my latest threads on here then follow me http://twitter.com/Cleon81

Wow! That would be really impressive and I'm trying my best to read everything on here and that would be brilliant! I'm very, very excited !

I'd be interested in the other side of the analysis : what contributed to a goal being conceeded or a poor performance/mistake. People tend not to focus on things when they're going well.

I've done lengthy posts on that before in the SI Sports thread I did. I didn't feel the need to cover old ground in this thread. But in the thread for FM11 it will touch upon that.

Great article Cleon, eagerly looking forward to additions to this discussion. One thing I feel missing though is inclusion of the attribute values for each of the players you are talking about as a terms of reference, not so much as discussion points however.

I think your discussion too does a great job of highlighting attribute links and partnerships and how they play out on the field. With the relationships between Anticipation, Positioning and Off the Ball, would you say Anticipation is the dominating attribute in each of these partnerships (Ant/Pos & Ant/Off), i.e. better for a player have a higher Anticipation score then the accompanying 'positioning' attribute or vice versa?

I discussed about putting my player's attributes up with SFraser but we decided against and just wanted to highlight the attributes used and how they work rather than focus on a number. It's something we didn't do because we were going to work on a next bit highlighting how the values effect tactics and what they do. So we should have that just intime for FM11 for you

As for the 2nd bit of your question I think anticipation is vital for all, everything a player does will always come down to how he anticipates the move. Other's might disagree but for me it's one of the core attributes that the higher in a player the better.

Excellent writing as usual.

I discussed about putting my player's attributes up with SFraser but we decided against and just wanted to highlight the attributes used and how they work rather than focus on a number. It's something we didn't do because we were going to work on a next bit highlighting how the values effect tactics and what they do. So we should have that just intime for FM11 for you

No worries, I look forward to FM11 coming out then so we can read the next installment.

As for the 2nd bit of your question I think anticipation is vital for all, everything a player does will always come down to how he anticipates the move. Other's might disagree but for me it's one of the core attributes that the higher in a player the better.

This has been my thinking too, it's not often considered a 'core' attribute for positions but it's like the polish that allows other attributes to shine, like technique.

What we are beginning to see here is that a lot of the same attributes are used in all moves. Thing’s like decisions, anticipation, positioning and concentration seem to be more prominent than other attributes and are required for all actions a player does on the field. This is why it can hard to see how attributes work in game.

Thinking about it some more, I think this one paragraph is the most critical point of all. These four attributes are the starting points for all chains of action, a poor start will result in a poor end result, it doesn't matter how good a players technical abilities are, if he is unable to think and put himself in a good position to receive or distribute the ball then he has a greater chance of failing.

Strong mental attributes, underpin technical attributes greatly and to a certain extent, physical attributes.

Clearly, one of the key reasons I always get small teams to over perform, is that I look to sign players with above average mental attributes for the level I'm playing. Likewise, when analysing player performances, I can usually pin flaws in player performance on deficiencies of certain mental attributes.

For example, in my Granada C.F. save, I have Nigerian striker Odion Ighalo on loan from Udinese, my teams parent club. He has excellent technical and physical attributes for his position, but what I consider to be poor mental attributes. Anticipation, concentration, decisions, positioning, are all below 10. Now at lower levels, his strong technical and physical attributes mean he can still do a good job and he usually always scores a respectable amount of goals. Problem is, as I observe in matches, if he had even slightly better ratings in the aforementioned attributes, he would be an outstanding player.

He has exceptional flair and dribbling, pace, acceleration, technique so he can often beat players to get into good positions, but often, his poor decisions, anticipation, positioning and concentration, mean his end product can be poor.

At lower levels, he can get away with a certain deficiencies, because opponents are generally poor too, but as my team climbs the leagues, he begins to struggle unless his mental attributes improve considerably. Sometimes he can produce flashes of brilliance, whilst at other times, he can seem a bit like a headless chicken.

When you look at the "best" players in the game, both FM and real, they have what pundits like to call a "good footballing brain", great "vision" or "awareness" of what's going on around them.

If you can build a team of players with strong mental attributes, believe me, the game can actually feel quite easy to play.

As an example of a player who many would overlook, I have a midfielder called Óscar Pérez at Granada C.F. His technical abilities are not very good for a central midfielder and his physical attributes are average to above average. His overall mental attributes are really good though. Whenever I've played a Granada C.F. save, he's usually the only player who starts at the club, who I keep - even when I'm playing at the highest level. His match ratings are always high, because he has the great mental attributes, which more than make up for deficiencies in other areas.

So, nine out of ten times when I've looked at people's saves or tactics, they wonder why a tactic isn't working, or that certain players seem to blow hot and cold, it's often because they've favoured players with strong physical and technical attributes, over those with strong mental attributes. I find strong mental attributes can help players adapt and perform well with most tactics and setting. They'll usually always do the basic tasks well, even with poor technical or physical abilities.

So as is often the case when I've seen the "it's your tactics" comments on the forums, my usual response is "not always". More often, it's the players. Either players being used in unsuitable roles, or most often, players with weak mental attributes.

Strong mental attributes, underpin technical attributes greatly and to a certain extent, physical attributes.

Clearly, one of the key reasons I always get small teams to over perform, is that I look to sign players with above average mental attributes for the level I'm playing. Likewise, when analysing player performances, I can usually pin flaws in player performance on deficiencies of certain mental attributes.

Great summary Heathxxx and details the thinking I had earlier which all of a sudden became crystal clear. The old addage of Garbage In/Garbage Out sprang to mind.

In photography, you can have the best equipment available and take technically perfect photographs, but if there is no thought or creativity behind the viewfinder then you cannot expect any great photographs to be created which works on all levels. A bad photograph will still be a bad photograph no matter how much technical skills you apply to it. The same with FM.

Mentality attributes are the inputs, and the technical and physical attributes by and large are the outputs. If players have sub-par mental abilities (inputs), they will only be able to generate poor outcomes (outputs) most of the time. Every now and again everything might come together, but if only garbage is placed in the input stream then the outputs will equally suffer.

If an active thinking player consistently reads the game well, makes the correct decisions and gets himself to the places he needs to be, then he will be more able to succeed in his chosen action despite not have perfect technical abilities. When the quality of the inputs and outputs match then the player truly will be successfull.

Apologies if this is just repeating the obvious but it truly got me excited and made me think of my players in a different light and how I will approach them in future.

Great summary Heathxxx and details the thinking I had earlier which all of a sudden became crystal clear. The old addage of Garbage In/Garbage Out sprang to mind.

In photography, you can have the best equipment available and take technically perfect photographs, but if there is no thought or creativity behind the viewfinder then you cannot expect any great photographs to be created which works on all levels. A bad photograph will still be a bad photograph no matter how much technical skills you apply to it. The same with FM.

Mentality attributes are the inputs, and the technical and physical attributes by and large are the outputs. If players have sub-par mental abilities (inputs), they will only be able to generate poor outcomes (outputs) most of the time. Every now and again everything might come together, but if only garbage is placed in the input stream then the outputs will equally suffer.

If an active thinking player consistently reads the game well, makes the correct decisions and gets himself to the places he needs to be, then he will be more able to succeed in his chosen action despite not have perfect technical abilities. When the quality of the inputs and outputs match then the player truly will be successfull.

Apologies if this is just repeating the obvious but it truly got me excited and made me think of my players in a different light and how I will approach them in future.

Exactly, it's the reason why so many people struggle at the game because they see a good player with good technicals but can't understand why he doesn't score many goals, do those killer type of passes or make them important tackles. Technical and physical attributes can only carry you so far.

Concentrating on player attributes has been hugely important in the way I play the game. My approach has always been to create a tactic, then build my team around it.

Sometimes, when people say the tactical side of the game has become more difficult, I would argue the opposite. It has become more detailed, but I think it's also become easier to control your team's destiny. At the heart of things though, the game is still very much about building the best squad you can. It's just you need to pay a little attention to detail.

Sometimes, a team with mostly great players, with high mental attributes, can carry a couple of players with poor mental attributes. Like Cleon said though, I think far too many people rely on physical and technical attributes across the board. Also - and mindful of the benefits of a thread like this - I think a lot of people don't really understand clearly enough, what some of the mental attributes actually mean. In relation to what they see statistically, or in the match engine. Many of the mental attributes could fall under what people would refer to as vision and awareness.

Paul Scholes in his prime had (and possibly still does, as reflected by his FM attributes) great vision and awareness. Obviously with age, some of his technical and physical attributes are on the decline. At lower levels of the game, such players would almost be god-like. At higher levels, a good combination of the three areas, positionally related of course, are very important.

As a general tip though, if looking to sign new players, when comparing potential signings, I would always favour the player with the strongest mental attributes, over technical and physical.

Very intresting read and plenty of ideas added. Would you say that if looking for a good DM that you need a player with a full set of rounded stats lets say 13, this way i think it covers both attacking and defending areas. Also it seems that the MENTAL stats have a larger contribution in this version than in previous ones, would you agree? Have also noticed that pace and acceleration no longer give you a massive advantage as in older versions, this can also be hilighted in real life looking at Sol Campbell although much slower now his reading of the game is still a huge advantage.

Keep up the good work Cleon your ideas and therios are superb and make for very intresting reading i also think you dont supply a tactic but give people the tools to buy and design there own.

Mental stats have always been important, but seeing as pace and acceleartion isn't as vital as it used to be makes it more noticeable. In previous version pace and acceleration alone was good enough to carry player's especially attacking ones.

For a good DM it depends what you expect from him. I'd just get as many high stats as possible in the attributes rather than go for someone who is average for them all.

Mental stats have always been important, but seeing as pace and acceleartion isn't as vital as it used to be makes it more noticeable. In previous version pace and acceleration alone was good enough to carry player's especially attacking ones.

For a good DM it depends what you expect from him. I'd just get as many high stats as possible in the attributes rather than go for someone who is average for them all.

Agree also a quick question for you would you say that Heading and Jumping need to be evenly matched or does a players natural height play a larger part, another real life example would be Rooney not the tallest but leathel in the air?

Agree also a quick question for you would you say that Heading and Jumping need to be evenly matched or does a players natural height play a larger part, another real life example would be Rooney not the tallest but leathel in the air?

Well

Heading

This is a player’s competence in aerial situations. Heading applies to all situations and is only about the player’s ability to head the ball well. Jumping (and to a lesser extent Strength) plays a big part in combination with heading to utilize the attribute to a greater level, as well as a player’s height.

Jumping

This attribute related to how high a player can jump from a standing start.

So someone not tall can still be lethal.

The Mental attributes are always going to be under-estimated or under-appreciated because of the very fact that they define a players Mental abilities and are difficult to spot and difficult to understand. Understanding the "Decisions" attribute, for example, requires that the manager does more than simply watch what is occuring on the pitch but is aware of what is not occuring, what could have occured but did not, and that requires an understanding of what the player himself can see.

That's why the PKM is such an important part of this thread, because it is only through analysing each action in the goal scoring move, each possible action, each chosen action and each refused action, and how the individual actions of multiple players knit together, that you can build up an accurate picture of what the explanations mean. Take Teamwork for example, the explanation would be "how well players work as a team" and what exactly does that mean? It's not the most useful explanation in the world. But when you see two players employing their Technical and Physical and Mental skills to construct a move together, to make a move easier for each other, to work hard to produce a good off-the-ball run and defender beating movement while the other guy works hard to get into a good position to deliver the telling pass and it is only after this effort between the players that the final events play out, then you can understand Teamwork and how it is different from Workrate or Determination.

It has always been the case that a lot of these attributes are unknown quantities, that they seem like they should be doing something important but it is difficult to pin down. The descriptions in the manual do not help, and even the player written guides tend to paraphrase the manual with a few new ideas thrown in. This type of thread, where a specific move is analysed in depth, where even an apparently simple move is explained in great detail with each action and each event and even each ignored possibility looked at in fine detail, is something I think a lot of people have wanted to do but is also something that has been needed. The only way to explain attributes properly, especially the Mental attributes, is to show a match event and then dissect it in fine detail. There is no other way to really explain certain attributes.

Like Cleon I still think more could be done. The analysis of this move is excellent and I think gives a window into the function of several attributes that were obscure, but it's only one move and it does not explain every attribute let alone explain every attribute in every way. Holding a defensive position, Closing Down an opponent player, sending a Longshot into the top corner, or even perhaps a series of quick one touch passes around the edge of the box are all actions and events that could be looked at in detail to show the different ways attributes function in game. Indeed without giving too much away I think Cleon is looking at writing a thread about how different attributes fit into different styles of play.

However untill the next thread I think that this thread is a particularly impressive one in the list of all previous threads attempting to explain attributes. This thread takes a specific move, dissects it in detail, sheds light on the function of a lot of attributes that are notoriously difficult to understand and explain, and ends up confirming what a lot of people have thought for a while, that Mental attributes have an absolutely huge role to play in the game in every action and event and series of events. These attributes do not necessarilly have to be the best in the league for your players, but you ignore Mental attributes at your peril, to the detriment of the ability of your players to actually play as a team.

The Mental attributes are always going to be under-estimated or under-appreciated because of the very fact that they define a players Mental abilities and are difficult to spot and difficult to understand. Understanding the "Decisions" attribute, for example, requires that the manager does more than simply watch what is occuring on the pitch but is aware of what is not occuring, what could have occured but did not, and that requires an understanding of what the player himself can see.

Yups it's a daunting task to t ry and figure it all out. Plus I can understand why people wouldn't want to go to such lengths. But once people have a basic idea of how to identify these attributes then the game not only becomes simplier but you begin to see things differently. Atleast I did when I learned how the game worked like 10+ years ago.

That's why the PKM is such an important part of this thread, because it is only through analysing each action in the goal scoring move, each possible action, each chosen action and each refused action, and how the individual actions of multiple players knit together, that you can build up an accurate picture of what the explanations mean. Take Teamwork for example, the explanation would be "how well players work as a team" and what exactly does that mean? It's not the most useful explanation in the world. But when you see two players employing their Technical and Physical and Mental skills to construct a move together, to make a move easier for each other, to work hard to produce a good off-the-ball run and defender beating movement while the other guy works hard to get into a good position to deliver the telling pass and it is only after this effort between the players that the final events play out, then you can understand Teamwork and how it is different from Workrate or Determination.

The people who just read the thread and didn't watch the PKM won't fully understand how complex the move was. I wish I could have done an imbedded video to illustrate it though to give it the proper attention it deserved.

It has always been the case that a lot of these attributes are unknown quantities, that they seem like they should be doing something important but it is difficult to pin down. The descriptions in the manual do not help, and even the player written guides tend to paraphrase the manual with a few new ideas thrown in. This type of thread, where a specific move is analysed in depth, where even an apparently simple move is explained in great detail with each action and each event and even each ignored possibility looked at in fine detail, is something I think a lot of people have wanted to do but is also something that has been needed. The only way to explain attributes properly, especially the Mental attributes, is to show a match event and then dissect it in fine detail. There is no other way to really explain certain attributes.

That's very true. Something like this as been needed for a long time but for some reason or another no-one ever got around to doing one. It's probably because its time consuming to do and is quite difficult to get right. It took days for me to write about just 1 single move. I'd have loved to waited and possibly done a full match detailing the impact of the attributes but I honestly think that would have took a good 3 months possibly longer to write about.

Like Cleon I still think more could be done. The analysis of this move is excellent and I think gives a window into the function of several attributes that were obscure, but it's only one move and it does not explain every attribute let alone explain every attribute in every way. Holding a defensive position, Closing Down an opponent player, sending a Longshot into the top corner, or even perhaps a series of quick one touch passes around the edge of the box are all actions and events that could be looked at in detail to show the different ways attributes function in game. Indeed without giving too much away I think Cleon is looking at writing a thread about how different attributes fit into different styles of play.

I'm in the process of redoing the above and adding things like this into it for FM11. Even then I still don't think it'll be as detailed me and you'd like but it will be another step in the right direction. A thread like this will be one of them that needs to be added to all the time as the different aspects and scenarios of which attributes are used and why will take a long time to cover them all. So we'll need to add installments every so often. Hopefully it'll be completed one day but in the mean time I look forward to the endless discussions we'll be having in the coming months when we add the newer bits. I think we'll have a lot to discuss.

not sure if something similar has already been said, but would it be worth talking some more about position/role specific mental attributes? The reason i ask is that i have been doing some player filters using some of the key mental attributes mentioned on this thread, and what is obvious is that midfielders (in particular MC's and DMC's) are prominent, as are central defenders. THere are however, very few attacking players (ie attacking midfielders, inside forwards and strikers) with significantly strong mental attributes that come up (even more so if you take out players who are 27+). I know Cleon that you don't want to be too specific in this thread about actual numbers etc, but could you provide some more indication of the mental stats that should be looked for in attacking players?

not sure if something similar has already been said, but would it be worth talking some more about position/role specific mental attributes? The reason i ask is that i have been doing some player filters using some of the key mental attributes mentioned on this thread, and what is obvious is that midfielders (in particular MC's and DMC's) are prominent, as are central defenders. THere are however, very few attacking players (ie attacking midfielders, inside forwards and strikers) with significantly strong mental attributes that come up (even more so if you take out players who are 27+). I know Cleon that you don't want to be too specific in this thread about actual numbers etc, but could you provide some more indication of the mental stats that should be looked for in attacking players?

I will be covering that but I wont be posting anything until FM11 though. That way it allows me to do 1 big project and explain the sort of things that your asking. Rather than release little bits here and there. By taking my time and not doing anything til FM11 it allows me to be a lot more specific and gives me time to expand on things in more detail. I know that kind of sucks because you're wanting answers now but it'll be worth it in the long run if I can do a more comprehensive guide.