+ Reply to Thread
Page 4 of 42 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 ... LastLast
Results 301 to 400 of 4116

Thread: Challenges / Sign-Ups / Holiday Games ideas thread.

  1. #301
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Just another idea, do you think that the Records Thread belongs in here?

  2. #302
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by cookie15:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by dafuge:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    I know it's probably a long shot but what does anyone think of having an off-topic thread in here?
    I've always been against it, since there is an off topic forum already, but having a look around it seems a few of the other sub forums already have them:

    (ignoring the GD and the data/bugs forums)

    Editors - no
    Graphics - no
    Tactics - yes
    LLM - yes
    GPTG - no (although they had it removed)
    FM Online - yes
    FM Stories - yes
    Challenges - no </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    My only question (whilst understanding the concept) is what will be discussed? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Just anything really. What everyone is doing, real life football, other news, etc. It would just be a bit of banter among the challenge community.

    No idea really, but if people think it could help to create more of a community in this forum I would consider it.
    That's why I suggested it. I've been thinking about it and although it may not seem necessary I think it's just what this forum needs, only my opinion though.

    I remember when I was a new user on here and when I first discovered the off topic forum; I was a bit overwhelmed by it and I still feel that a lot of new users still are. I'm settled in there now but for some users that only use this challenge forum out of the whole forums it may be something alternative to get them settled in and introduce themselves to the challenge community and get to know people better.

    Just another idea, do you think that the Records Thread belongs in here?
    Yes, although it should still stay in GQ in my opinion just like kipfizh's thread did.

  3. #303
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    1st September 2006
    Location
    us-tv(.co.uk)
    Posts
    16,180

    Default

    An Off-topic forum in here would mean less off-topic banter in sign-up/challenge threads. Not me to judge whether this is a good thing or a bad thing. Might be worth starting one up for a trial of say, a month, and see how it affects the forum.

    Also, I think the Records thread should be "mirrored" over here, such as Kipfizh's thread, so it is in GQ and this forum. (As James said)

  4. #304
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Might be worth starting one up for a trial of say, a month, and see how it affects the forum.
    Possibly a good idea.

  5. #305
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Might be worth starting one up for a trial of say, a month, and see how it affects the forum.
    Possibly a good idea. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I think I'll try it out, I'll put one up on a trial basis in the next few days.

  6. #306
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by dafuge:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Might be worth starting one up for a trial of say, a month, and see how it affects the forum.
    Possibly a good idea. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I think I'll try it out, I'll put one up on a trial basis in the next few days. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


  7. #307
    Amateur
    Join Date
    12th February 2008
    Posts
    109

    Default

    well another idea for the off topic forum could be people sharing ideas for potential new signups

    so often i see there are nto enough well thought out ssignups and if each idea can get individual attention and criticism, we might see some more interesting ones

  8. #308
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by problemchild:
    well another idea for the off topic forum could be people sharing ideas for potential new signups

    so often i see there are nto enough well thought out ssignups and if each idea can get individual attention and criticism, we might see some more interesting ones
    There is an ideas thread for that.

  9. #309
    Amateur
    Join Date
    12th February 2008
    Posts
    109

    Default

    which is supposed to be this thread lol

    but instead we're putting forward ideas on how to up activity on this part of the forum

  10. #310
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Well it's just ideas for anything really. Does it matter anyway? As long as the ideas are put forwards.

  11. #311
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by problemchild:
    which is supposed to be this thread lol

    but instead we're putting forward ideas on how to up activity on this part of the forum
    Looks like the two threads are being mixed up a bit, I think I'm just as guilty as anyone else of it. I'll change the title of the other one to avoid confusion.

    Just to reiterate, this thread is for ideas for new challenges, sign ups and holiday games, the other thread is for general forum discussion.

  12. #312
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Sorry. :/

  13. #313
    Reserves
    Join Date
    17th July 2006
    Location
    In the Aeroplane over the Sea
    Posts
    11,862

    Default

    I've decided to postpone my complicated player sign-up/draft idea until possibly FM09, in the meantime I'm looking to start a sign-up in possibly Northern Ireland.

    It might appear as early as tonight.

  14. #314
    Amateur
    Join Date
    9th October 2005
    Posts
    320

    Default

    Had an idea today. What about the 'FM fantasy football league'. Just like your normal fantasy football league but based on a single season of FM premiership football, taking the values of players at the start of a new game (Not sure if they differ from game to game?). Would probably be a lot of work but could be fun.
    Not something I could take on myself but maybe one of you hardcore FMers could do??
    Just an idea, probably not feasable but worth a mention.

  15. #315
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by Jonzii:
    Had an idea today. What about the 'FM fantasy football league'. Just like your normal fantasy football league but based on a single season of FM premiership football, taking the values of players at the start of a new game (Not sure if they differ from game to game?). Would probably be a lot of work but could be fun.
    Not something I could take on myself but maybe one of you hardcore FMers could do??
    Just an idea, probably not feasable but worth a mention.
    That my friend is an excellent idea.

    If I understand correctly, each player in the selected league (probably the english premiership) would be given a value, then each user would pick a team to a budget. The person running the game would then play each gameweek and allocate the points accordingly (similarly to the Official Premiership Fantasy Game). It could be a lot of fun.

    I'd be willing to run this if there is enough interest? I'd probably have to limit it to about 25 users at most though if there were interest.

  16. #316
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jonzii:
    Had an idea today. What about the 'FM fantasy football league'. Just like your normal fantasy football league but based on a single season of FM premiership football, taking the values of players at the start of a new game (Not sure if they differ from game to game?). Would probably be a lot of work but could be fun.
    Not something I could take on myself but maybe one of you hardcore FMers could do??
    Just an idea, probably not feasable but worth a mention.
    That my friend is an excellent idea.

    If I understand correctly, each player in the selected league (probably the english premiership) would be given a value, then each user would pick a team to a budget. The person running the game would then play each gameweek and allocate the points accordingly (similarly to the Official Premiership Fantasy Game). It could be a lot of fun.

    I'd possibly be willing to run this if there is enough interest? I'd probably have to limit it to about 25 users at most though if there were interest. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Forgot to add.

  17. #317
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    I've decided that I will run this. I've seen that someone else has gone off and made their own version but I intend mine to be different to this.

    It will be run in a similar way to the official fantasy premier league with a few minor adjustments as this won't be such a large scale and there are a few things I don't like on that anyway. Also, it will involve no editing at all. I'd expect the thread to be up sometime tonight.

    Thanks.

  18. #318
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    6th December 2007
    Posts
    15,944

    Default

    Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    I've decided that I will run this. I've seen that someone else has gone off and made their own version but I intend mine to be different to this.

    It will be run in a similar way to the official fantasy premier league with a few minor adjustments as this won't be such a large scale and there are a few things I don't like on that anyway. Also, it will involve no editing at all. I'd expect the thread to be up sometime tonight.

    Thanks.
    Birdy's already doing thats very similair to this. Maybe you should do it for a different country?

  19. #319
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Originally posted by ridleys:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    I've decided that I will run this. I've seen that someone else has gone off and made their own version but I intend mine to be different to this.

    It will be run in a similar way to the official fantasy premier league with a few minor adjustments as this won't be such a large scale and there are a few things I don't like on that anyway. Also, it will involve no editing at all. I'd expect the thread to be up sometime tonight.

    Thanks.
    Birdy's already doing thats very similair to this. Maybe you should do it for a different country? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    It's not the same. THere is no editing. You just pick players like a fantasy football team and aaberdeenn just plays a season and the winner is the player who gets the most points.

  20. #320
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by ridleys:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    I've decided that I will run this. I've seen that someone else has gone off and made their own version but I intend mine to be different to this.

    It will be run in a similar way to the official fantasy premier league with a few minor adjustments as this won't be such a large scale and there are a few things I don't like on that anyway. Also, it will involve no editing at all. I'd expect the thread to be up sometime tonight.

    Thanks.
    Birdy's already doing thats very similair to this. Maybe you should do it for a different country? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I think this idea is different, and something that hasn't been done before. This can be run just like fantasy football, where people select their team and then gain points for those players as they play for their normal teams. You could have as many people playing as you want and the game is very simple to run, all you need to do is simulate a Premier League Season. The points system will take quite a bit of work though.

    I like this idea

  21. #321
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    I like the idea. Too bad aaberdeenn managed to say he will do it before i read it

  22. #322
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by Robert_296:
    I like the idea. Too bad aaberdeenn managed to say he will do it before i read it
    I'm not desperate to do it. It was just something I quite liked the idea of and thought would be interesting to run. If you really want to do it then you're welcome to.

  23. #323
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Robert_296:
    I like the idea. Too bad aaberdeenn managed to say he will do it before i read it
    I'm not desperate to do it. It was just something I quite liked the idea of and thought would be interesting to run. If you REALLY want to do it then you're welcome to. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


  24. #324
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Thinking about it, it is going to involve an awful lot of work, a lot more than the usual sign ups. I'm quite happy to help get it going, but there's no way I'll have time to run it.

  25. #325
    Youth Team
    Join Date
    29th October 2006
    Posts
    4,057

    Default

    Liking the idea of a fantasy football competition.

    I think if you did a simple scoring system like the BBC used to / Channel 4 do now, then that would be easier.

    ie:
    Goal = 3pt
    Appearance = 1pt
    Clean Sheet for defenders / goalies = 3pts
    Something for yellow / red cards maybe



  26. #326
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Robert_296:
    I like the idea. Too bad aaberdeenn managed to say he will do it before i read it
    I'm not desperate to do it. It was just something I quite liked the idea of and thought would be interesting to run. If you REALLY want to do it then you're welcome to. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    you can do it if you want i'm not desperate

  27. #327
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Perhaps if we could get a few of us, say 5, together and each work on a small part of it, it might go together quite well.

  28. #328
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    Perhaps if we could get a few of us, say 5, together and each work on a small part of it, it might go together quite well.
    that would be good.

  29. #329
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Ok, a few ideas to get things started:

    Decide which database to use, 8.0.2 updated is the obvious choice.
    Decide on a points system, Premier League System is an option.
    Decide transfer system, how often and when should people be allowed to change their players?
    How many players to choose, team of 11 or squad of 16? Do you allow things like subs and captains, like the Premier League website?
    Compile a list of players with FM values, this is going to take some time. I suggest natural position is used so players can only appear in one position.
    Decide how to keep track of the scoring, manually or using a spreadsheet?

    Then you could think about the sign up thread.

  30. #330
    Amateur
    Join Date
    9th October 2005
    Posts
    320

    Default

    Originally posted by Walcott's Wonderkids:
    Liking the idea of a fantasy football competition.

    I think if you did a simple scoring system like the BBC used to / Channel 4 do now, then that would be easier.

    ie:
    Goal = 3pt
    Appearance = 1pt
    Clean Sheet for defenders / goalies = 3pts
    Something for yellow / red cards maybe


    Yeah, thats the kind of thing I was talking about. Like they do in the newspapers every year. I think the number of entrants would have to be limited to make it possible.

  31. #331
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    I'm going to be out all afternoon but when I'm back I'll give a reply on my thoughts regarding this.

  32. #332
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Unless aaberdeenn keeps the save it will have to be 8.0.1 because my fmo clan has decided not to use the new patch. I think we should do that points system but maybe with bonus points have 3 points for a 10, 2 points for a 9 and 1 point for an 8? I think we should have a set number of transfers for the season and if they do any extra transfers they get deducted 4 points. I think a squad of 15 so 2 GK's, 5 DF's, 5 MF's and 3 ST's with subs and captains.

  33. #333
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    What time will you be back?

  34. #334
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    1st September 2006
    Location
    us-tv(.co.uk)
    Posts
    16,180

    Default

    Team of 11, with a captain that gets double points, imo.

    I'm here to help, mate, don't hesitate to ask.

  35. #335
    Semi Pro
    Join Date
    24th June 2006
    Posts
    2,795

    Default

    Can anyone think of a Porteguese team name for a sign-up I'm thinking of doing please?

  36. #336
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Originally posted by birdy123:
    Team of 11, with a captain that gets double points, imo.

    I'm here to help, mate, don't hesitate to ask.
    I think at least 4 subs so you still have a chance of getting points. Thanks for the help. I think we should do updates every month and then people have to say whether they are doing transfers or not before we continue.

  37. #337
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    The idea of having subs and selecting your first 11 depending on the upcoming fixtures could have worked well, although I just don't think we have time for that now.

    Perhaps an idea for FM09 could be a full on interactive fantasy football game almost played in real time.

  38. #338
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Originally posted by dafuge:
    The idea of having subs and selecting your first 11 depending on the upcoming fixtures could have worked well, although I just don't think we have time for that now.

    Perhaps an idea for FM09 could be a full on interactive fantasy football game almost played in real time.
    That would be good but I think we should still do a monthly update then everyone says if they are doing team changes and then when everybody is done we can continue.

  39. #339
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by Robert_296:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by dafuge:
    The idea of having subs and selecting your first 11 depending on the upcoming fixtures could have worked well, although I just don't think we have time for that now.

    Perhaps an idea for FM09 could be a full on interactive fantasy football game almost played in real time.
    That would be good but I think we should still do a monthly update then everyone says if they are doing team changes and then when everybody is done we can continue. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Do you mean having monthly 'transfer windows' on top of the weekly updates?

  40. #340
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    yeah

  41. #341
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    That's probably a good idea, saves the chaos of people making transfers whenever they want.

  42. #342
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Work in progress; thread will be up at some point tomorrow afternoon.

  43. #343
    Part-timer
    Join Date
    22nd February 2007
    Location
    \"We are on top at the moment but not because of the club\'s financial power. We are in contention for a lot of trophies because of my hard work.\"
    Posts
    1,691

    Default

    Sounds good - hopefully i'll be around tomorrow to get a place!

  44. #344
    Youth Team
    Join Date
    11th February 2007
    Location
    You should've told her the truth. Dreams crumble to dust.
    Posts
    5,559

    Default

    I think the whole "fantasy football" idea is brilliant.
    My thoughts on it are that as already said it's going to take a lot of work and so the scoring system needs to be simple I think
    Goal = 3pt
    Appearance = 1pt
    Clean Sheet for defenders / goalies = 3pts
    Something for yellow / red cards maybe
    Or something similar is fine.

    Also I think you should limit it to a squad of 11 and just have transfer windows at the start of September and February, that allows players to make changes based on transfers actually made within the game and allows people to change injured players or players who aren't playing. Limiting it to 2 windows it will be easier to keep track of who has what players and will mean you won't have to wait on people posting at the end of every month or week to make their transfers or squad selections. If people get injuries within their team that's just bad luck, they'll have to live with it.

    Whatever you do though I hope it works out well because as I said it's a great idea. ( I hope all of that made sense, it did in my head )

  45. #345
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by Whoopy D:
    I think the whole "fantasy football" idea is brilliant.
    My thoughts on it are that as already said it's going to take a lot of work and so the scoring system needs to be simple I think
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
    Goal = 3pt
    Appearance = 1pt
    Clean Sheet for defenders / goalies = 3pts
    Something for yellow / red cards maybe
    Or something similar is fine.

    Also I think you should limit it to a squad of 11 and just have transfer windows at the start of September and February, that allows players to make changes based on transfers actually made within the game and allows people to change injured players or players who aren't playing. Limiting it to 2 windows it will be easier to keep track of who has what players and will mean you won't have to wait on people posting at the end of every month or week to make their transfers or squad selections. If people get injuries within their team that's just bad luck, they'll have to live with it.

    Whatever you do though I hope it works out well because as I said it's a great idea. ( I hope all of that made sense, it did in my head ) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Thanks for your thoughts. I'm sure to take some of your suggestions on board but the full details will be in the initial thread for the signing up and team picking phase.

  46. #346
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Whoopy D:
    I think the whole "fantasy football" idea is brilliant.
    My thoughts on it are that as already said it's going to take a lot of work and so the scoring system needs to be simple I think
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
    Goal = 3pt
    Appearance = 1pt
    Clean Sheet for defenders / goalies = 3pts
    Something for yellow / red cards maybe
    Or something similar is fine.

    Also I think you should limit it to a squad of 11 and just have transfer windows at the start of September and February, that allows players to make changes based on transfers actually made within the game and allows people to change injured players or players who aren't playing. Limiting it to 2 windows it will be easier to keep track of who has what players and will mean you won't have to wait on people posting at the end of every month or week to make their transfers or squad selections. If people get injuries within their team that's just bad luck, they'll have to live with it.

    Whatever you do though I hope it works out well because as I said it's a great idea. ( I hope all of that made sense, it did in my head ) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Thanks for your thoughts. I'm sure to take some of your suggestions on board but the full details will be in the initial thread for the signing up and team picking phase. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Are you just doing it on your own then?

  47. #347
    Amateur
    Join Date
    14th August 2005
    Posts
    896

    Default

    Just a thought but if there are weekly updates would it also be possible to arrange a time once a week or fortnight to have the game set up as a server then the people involved could come on at this time have a little nose round the stats of all the players and make their transfers accordingly?

  48. #348
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Some bad news unfortunately.

    I've spent the last four or so hours working on trying to get this game going and I've barely done anything other than get together the player values. I knew that it would require a lot of hard work but I was unaware that the way I wanted to do it would require so much work and so much time. I know I could do it a simpler way but I like to do things the way I want and at the moment I don't have the time to spend hours every day doing this doing it in this way.

    Due to this I can't commit to so much time and leave it open for anyone else to take up and try to work, good luck.

  49. #349
    Youth Team
    Join Date
    17th June 2007
    Location
    Turkey for now, soon to be Gabon!
    Posts
    5,456

    Default

    I noticed there are now 'small club to big club' challenges for England, small European nations, South America and Scotland - would there be anyone interested in doing a similar challenge for the big European nations i.e. Spain, Italy, France, Germany, Portugal and Holland? (which would only go ahead with permission from dafuge/gundo of course )

  50. #350
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Originally posted by aaberdeenn:
    Some bad news unfortunately.

    I've spent the last four or so hours working on trying to get this game going and I've barely done anything other than get together the player values. I knew that it would require a lot of hard work but I was unaware that the way I wanted to do it would require so much work and so much time. I know I could do it a simpler way but I like to do things the way I want and at the moment I don't have the time to spend hours every day doing this doing it in this way.

    Due to this I can't commit to so much time and leave it open for anyone else to take up and try to work, good luck.
    I'm still here if you need help.

  51. #351
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by DodgeeD:
    I noticed there are now 'small club to big club' challenges for England, small European nations, South America and Scotland - would there be anyone interested in doing a similar challenge for the big European nations i.e. Spain, Italy, France, Germany, Portugal and Holland? (which would only go ahead with permission from dafuge/gundo of course )
    dafuge has already said elsewhere that this would be a good idea so I'm sure if it were made there would be a market for it.

  52. #352
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Just another idea, what about a Premier League score predictor game like this. I'm sure one of the mods used to run one of these in the old CM forum, does anyone remember?

    A bit like the fantasy football idea, it would be really easy to setup but it would take a fair bit of work to keep it going.

    If it is started quickly, it could run as a weekly predictions game that would take us up to the usual release time for FM09.

  53. #353
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Originally posted by dafuge:
    Just another idea, what about a Premier League score predictor game like this. I'm sure one of the mods used to run one of these in the old CM forum, does anyone remember?

    A bit like the fantasy football idea, it would be really easy to setup but it would take a fair bit of work to keep it going.

    If it is started quickly, it could run as a weekly predictions game that would take us up to the usual release time for FM09.
    I was thinking about that last night. Great minds think alike

  54. #354
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    I'll try to start it today if you don't want to do it?

  55. #355
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by Robert_296:
    I'll try to start it today if you don't want to do it?
    The fantasy football idea?

  56. #356
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    predictions

  57. #357
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by Robert_296:
    predictions
    Go for it.

    A few suggestions:

    Use a simple scoring system, correct result = 1 points, correct score = 3 points.

    Run it weekly, for example start on a Saturday with the weeks fixtures (make sure to include any midweek games) then take predictions until Friday, post the results, player scores and leaderboard then post the new fixtures the next day on the Saturday. Obviously the days/deadlines are completely up to you, just make sure you choose something you can stick to every week.

    Make it a weekly competition and a running competition, that way people can join for the odd week if they want.

    Tell everyone which patch you are using, it might help people decide what scores to go for.

  58. #358
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Thanks. I'll get started on planning it now.

  59. #359
    Part-timer
    Join Date
    22nd February 2007
    Location
    \"We are on top at the moment but not because of the club\'s financial power. We are in contention for a lot of trophies because of my hard work.\"
    Posts
    1,691

    Default

    I have a vague idea for an interesting mix of sign-ups and ideas which have been suggested recently. (ObviouslI'd need all the relevant permissions from Birdy and aaberdeenn to start this up, and I won't have time to run this myself (Due to school and exams) however I would be willing to sort out the database then hand it over to someone else to run!

    The main idea is a mix of Birdy's sign-up (With his permission of course) and aaberdeenn's idea (Again with permission). I would set up a draft style (like in Birdy's thread) but with only premiership (And perhaps one other league - spain or italy i'm thinking - to keep it different from Birdy's game), then instead of using a simple league table in game to determine success, base the points on perhaps one, two, five or even ten seasons in game, with points for wins and draws, minus points for defeats. Then perhaps points for goals scored by a team (eg 50 goals in 1 season - 10 points or something then 60 goals - 15 points etc), points deducted for conceding more than x amount of goals (perhaps 35-40) in similar amounts to goals scored.

    Then run a league table in the thread based on these points. Its a bit complicated and I would like to hear your thoughts. As I have already said, I would be prepared to do some editing, but would not have the time to run it, so if people like the idea someone will have to be willing to take it on.

  60. #360
    First Team
    Join Date
    12th January 2006
    Location
    We Never do anything together anymore.
    Posts
    23,175

    Default

    I would be happy to help with the fantasy football idea. Even run it, since I have time to spare.

    Just a quick thing on player values. People seem to think collating them would be a lot of work, but surely FM Genie Scout would have them? I personally couldn't use this, as its not available for mac, but surely it would be an easier way than going through each player of each team.

  61. #361
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Predictions league is going to be up soon.

  62. #362
    Banned
    Join Date
    24th November 2007
    Location
    His armband proved he was a red!!! You\'ll never walk alone it said!!! Fernando Torres -
    Posts
    1,668

    Default

    Yay!!!

  63. #363
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by Robert_296:
    Predictions league is going to be up soon.
    Nice one, were you still intending on running the fantasy football or can NepentheZ do it?

  64. #364
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    I don't mind. I could do it because the predictions isn't really much work but NepentheZ seems like he really wants to do it so he can do it.

  65. #365
    First Team
    Join Date
    12th January 2006
    Location
    We Never do anything together anymore.
    Posts
    23,175

    Default

    Originally posted by Robert_296:
    I don't mind. I could do it because the predictions isn't really much work but NepentheZ seems like he really wants to do it so he can do it.
    - I don't "really" want to do it. I'd be happy to be a part of something like this, but I was a late comer to the idea/thread, so please, be my guest. You guys have put a lot more thought and effort into this than I have, and it would be unfair of me to steam in here and take it off of you.

  66. #366
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    I don't really mind who does it, as long as it isn't me

  67. #367
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    tbf, I haven't done anything at all on it. I'm already doing the predictions so you do it.

  68. #368
    First Team
    Join Date
    12th January 2006
    Location
    We Never do anything together anymore.
    Posts
    23,175

    Default

    Originally posted by Robert_296:
    tbf, I haven't done anything at all on it. I'm already doing the predictions so you do it.
    Ok. Will do.

  69. #369
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Starting the predictions league now. I hope everything is OK with it.

  70. #370
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    When you say midnight Saturday, is that Friday/Saturday or Saturday/Sunday?

    What patch is this being run with?

    (I'll also tidy up those links for you)

  71. #371
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Also, it might be nicer to see the fixtures/results as screenshots rather than text, makes it look a bit more authentic then.

  72. #372
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    OK. Saturday/Sunday and the latest patch. I'll use screenshots next time.

  73. #373
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by Robert_296:
    OK. Saturday/Sunday and the latest patch. I'll use screenshots next time.
    Although saying that, the text version makes it much easier for people to c&p their predictions. Both might be a good idea for the fixtures, just a screenshot for the results.

  74. #374
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    Originally posted by dafuge:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Robert_296:
    OK. Saturday/Sunday and the latest patch. I'll use screenshots next time.
    Although saying that, the text version makes it much easier for people to c&p their predictions. Both might be a good idea for the fixtures, just a screenshot for the results. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Thanks. I was thinking of typing it up like in the OTF predictions but I'll do a screenshot of the results

  75. #375
    Part-timer
    Join Date
    22nd February 2007
    Location
    \"We are on top at the moment but not because of the club\'s financial power. We are in contention for a lot of trophies because of my hard work.\"
    Posts
    1,691

    Default

    Just a note on earlier suggestions - seeing as my Hong Kong Challenge has not really been very popular (And now seems to have died out ), I would be willing to start the suggested Small Club to Big Club From a Big European Nation Challenge if people have got an interest in this idea. (Involving Holland, France, Spain, Italy, Portugal and Germany and perhaps Greece).

  76. #376
    Amateur
    Join Date
    10th September 2005
    Location
    Challenge clubs: Parque del Plata - Uruguayan Primera Division, Liptovsky Mikulas - Slovakian II. Ligy, Halesowen Town - Blue Square North
    Posts
    237

    Default

    Originally posted by JoseRR:
    Just a note on earlier suggestions - seeing as my Hong Kong Challenge has not really been very popular (And now seems to have died out ), I would be willing to start the suggested Small Club to Big Club From a Big European Nation Challenge if people have got an interest in this idea. (Involving Holland, France, Spain, Italy, Portugal and Germany and perhaps Greece).
    I think Greece is already included in Gundo's challenge. The leagues that he ruled out of his challenge were France, Germany, Holland, Italy, Portugal, Spain and Scotland (and England of course, but Dafuge has already got that one covered!), so those would be the ones to go with.

  77. #377
    Reserves
    Join Date
    14th November 2006
    Location
    Aberdeenshire, Scotland
    Posts
    11,611

    Default

    WHS part from Unrealgod has Scotland covered too.

  78. #378
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    1st September 2006
    Location
    us-tv(.co.uk)
    Posts
    16,180

    Default

    Cultural Durango

    Are they playable in FM08?

  79. #379
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by birdy123:
    Cultural Durango

    Are they playable in FM08?
    Sadly not, they were relegated in 2005/6 and haven't made it back up yet.

  80. #380
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    1st September 2006
    Location
    us-tv(.co.uk)
    Posts
    16,180

    Default

    That's a shame. Would have been a real difficult challenge.

  81. #381
    Part-timer
    Join Date
    22nd February 2007
    Location
    \"We are on top at the moment but not because of the club\'s financial power. We are in contention for a lot of trophies because of my hard work.\"
    Posts
    1,691

    Default

    I have my opening post ready now, so just to check, I have the permission of all required to start JoseRR's FM08 Small Club to Big Club From a Big European Nation Challenge now?

  82. #382
    World Cup Winner
    Join Date
    20th May 2003
    Posts
    56,763

    Default

    Originally posted by JoseRR:
    I have my opening post ready now, so just to check, I have the permission of all required to start JoseRR's FM08 Small Club to Big Club From a Big European Nation Challenge now?
    Go for it

  83. #383
    Semi Pro
    Join Date
    24th June 2006
    Posts
    2,795

    Default

    Must we have permission here to post a sign-up?

    If so, could I post one?

    A basic team sign-up based in Italy.

  84. #384
    Youth Team
    Join Date
    17th June 2007
    Location
    Turkey for now, soon to be Gabon!
    Posts
    5,456

    Default

    Originally posted by DodgeeD:
    I noticed there are now 'small club to big club' challenges for England, small European nations, South America and Scotland - would there be anyone interested in doing a similar challenge for the big European nations i.e. Spain, Italy, France, Germany, Portugal and Holland? (which would only go ahead with permission from dafuge/gundo of course )
    Originally posted by JoseRR:
    Just a note on earlier suggestions - seeing as my Hong Kong Challenge has not really been very popular (And now seems to have died out ), I would be willing to start the suggested Small Club to Big Club From a Big European Nation Challenge if people have got an interest in this idea. (Involving Holland, France, Spain, Italy, Portugal and Germany and perhaps Greece).
    Was going to get this started tomorrow once I'd sorted out all the reset dates.... Guess I'll have to be quicker next time

  85. #385
    Amateur
    Join Date
    10th September 2005
    Location
    Challenge clubs: Parque del Plata - Uruguayan Primera Division, Liptovsky Mikulas - Slovakian II. Ligy, Halesowen Town - Blue Square North
    Posts
    237

    Default

    There have been a couple of sign up ideas I've been mentally kicking around for some time now. I don't quite have time to set one up yet, but I thought I'd post the ideas here to gauge the level of interest/get feedback on how they should be run/check that nobody's run something similar before, so I know whether it's worth me spending any more time on it!

    So, my two ideas are relatively similar, and I think there would only really be a niche for one of them - it's just deciding which one. The first is what I call the "It could be you (who's crap!) sign up", and the second is the "Journeyman sign up". Both ideas spring from the same observation - that most games have people sign up as very promising young starlets with high PA, and follow their career as they develop into worldwide superstars. Which is great fun, of course.

    But how about introducing an element of chance into the proceedings? In the "It could be you (who's crap!) sign up" I'd use a random number generator to generate a PA for each user between a minimum of, say... 80? and a maximum of 200. I feel like each user's career trajectory would be a little bit less predictable in this game, as while some would end up at top clubs and playing for their country, some would never get out of the lower leagues.

    It would be interesting to see if your player was going to be one of the ones that would develop into something special and where their career was going to take them - since no-one would ever know their assigned PA at the start of the game.

    I was thinking maybe I could run it as a striker sign up, and after the first couple of seasons I could divide everyone into different "leagues" depending on what level they played at, so you could follow your progress amongst players at a similar level - and therefore even if your player never made it to, for instance, the Premier League, you could still have bragging rights as the best League One striker. I could also include some sort of overall career goals table - so if you never made it above League One but were a really good League One level striker, you could still be higher in that table than a player that made it to the Premier League but was a little out of their depth there.

    The idea is a little rough around the edges - for instance, I'm not sure whether to make it just strikers, or whether to make it only in England or include several leagues. And of course, no-one would ever be told their CA and PA as determined at the start of the game, so they will have to follow their player's career to get an idea of how good they really are.

    The second idea is quite similar, if a little simpler - basically removing the random element, but instead of having everyone be superstars, have everyone be the sort of players who never make it into the top divisions and spend their careers playing for various clubs in the lower leagues.

    Those are the ideas in outline - any comments or suggestions?

  86. #386
    Amateur
    Join Date
    16th December 2007
    Posts
    205

    Default

    I think the 1st 1 would be a superb idea tbh
    The second not as much but hey that's only 1 guys opinion

  87. #387
    Youth Team
    Join Date
    11th February 2007
    Location
    You should've told her the truth. Dreams crumble to dust.
    Posts
    5,559

    Default

    I think the first idea is good, a nice change from the usual striker sign ups. It would be great to have to follow your player never knowing if he's wasted a huge amount of potential or is punching way above his weight. Then at the end you could reveal everyones PA so we can judge how well they did based on their PA

  88. #388
    First Team
    Join Date
    12th January 2006
    Location
    We Never do anything together anymore.
    Posts
    23,175

    Default

    iseemonsters - Great idea, the first one. I'd definitely be interested in that. It'd be much more refreshing that the regular sign ups floating about.

  89. #389
    Youth Team
    Join Date
    11th February 2007
    Location
    You should've told her the truth. Dreams crumble to dust.
    Posts
    5,559

    Default

    The more I've thought about the random PA idea the more I like it, just a couple of things I was unsure about when thinking how I'd run it.

    What club if any would the players start at?
    What would the starting CA be?
    Would you let people pick some atrributes and if so how because I can't see someone with PA 80 having too many stats at even 12 let alone 20?

    I really like the idea though and if you decide not to do it I might have a go at running it myself if that's ok with you.

  90. #390
    Amateur
    Join Date
    10th September 2005
    Location
    Challenge clubs: Parque del Plata - Uruguayan Primera Division, Liptovsky Mikulas - Slovakian II. Ligy, Halesowen Town - Blue Square North
    Posts
    237

    Default

    Thanks for the positive feedback, everyone.

    Originally posted by Whoopy D:
    The more I've thought about the random PA idea the more I like it, just a couple of things I was unsure about when thinking how I'd run it.

    What club if any would the players start at?
    What would the starting CA be?
    Would you let people pick some atrributes and if so how because I can't see someone with PA 80 having too many stats at even 12 let alone 20?

    I really like the idea though and if you decide not to do it I might have a go at running it myself if that's ok with you.
    Whoopy D - these kinds of questions are the reason I haven't gotten around to starting this sign up yet - I think I would need to maybe do a test game or two to iron out all the kinks!

    For instance, I'm not sure whether to just run the English leagues or whether to run quite a few regional "hub" leagues so that people can be whatever nationality they want. But if I want to put people into different "leagues" with each other dependent on the level they are playing at, then this would raise issues of which leagues are on an equal "level" - is Serie C1 on the same level as League 1? What league is there in the game world that is on the same level as the Conference N/S? You see the problem. Maybe I could group leagues by their reputation in the editor - as in, have one "league" for people playing in leagues with reputation 16-20, one for people playing in leagues with reputation 11-15, one for people playing in leagues with reputation 6-10, etc. Or I could just play it in the English leagues since that is what people are generally most familiar with.

    As far as the clubs that players would start at - I had a couple of ideas. I think my favourite is to put everyone on free transfers, and see who picks them up. But I'd have to run a couple of test games to make sure that everyone was getting picked up - it would be awful if someone didn't even get signed and retired at 19! But I'd try to engineer the balance of CA/PA so that even the worst players in the sign up were still good enough to have a career at Conference/Conference N/S level. The other difficulty with this option is player nationalities - if I decide to run just the English leagues or just the UK leagues, then people of other nationalities might be less likely to be signed. I'm sure there's a way around it - maybe give everyone who does not already have a UK nationality a UK second nationality, since I believe that would give them more chance of being signed by UK teams - or just make everyone be English! - but it'll take a bit of figuring out.

    Another option might be to place them randomly at teams in the bottom divisions of whatever leagues I run, and take it from there. I like the idea of the AI deciding where they should go though - but this idea would take a lot of the hassle out of it.

    As far as starting CA goes, there are a couple of options - I could just give everyone the same starting CA - say, 55 or something. Some players would obviously then reach their peak a lot faster than others. The other option is to have CA as a function of the PA - so everyone's got plenty of room to grow - for instance, CA could be 1/3 of PA. I think I like the first option best, because people would be at a similar level to start with, so it would be difficult to tell who was going to be good and who wasn't for the first few seasons, when some people started to reach their peak while others still had a long way to go.

    With regards to picking attributes - my understanding is that if you give a player attributes in the editor that are way to high for their CA/PA, the game will just adjust them down. For instance, I could put a player with CA 55 and PA 80 into the database with Finishing 20, and when I opened up the game they would probably just have Finishing 12 - however, I think the attributes I set to 20 would still be higher than the attributes which had been set lower or left on random. So that's probably the way to go - let people pick attributes that in an ideal world would be 20, and then we can see if they ever reach that!

    Thanks for the offer of running it, but I'm sure I will do it pretty soon - got a bit of spare time on my hands at the moment, so it's really just a case of working out how best to get it all set up. Any further input would be gratefully received though - and I'll make sure to save you a place in the sign up if you like!

    If anyone else has any ideas/feedback on how they think this would work best, I'd be glad to hear it.

  91. #391
    Youth Team
    Join Date
    11th February 2007
    Location
    You should've told her the truth. Dreams crumble to dust.
    Posts
    5,559

    Default

    I like the idea of the AI deciding where they should go though
    I agree with that but there is that risk of some people retiring young.

    As far as starting CA goes, there are a couple of options - I could just give everyone the same starting CA - say, 55 or something. Some players would obviously then reach their peak a lot faster than others. The other option is to have CA as a function of the PA - so everyone's got plenty of room to grow - for instance, CA could be 1/3 of PA. I think I like the first option best, because people would be at a similar level to start with, so it would be difficult to tell who was going to be good and who wasn't for the first few seasons, when some people started to reach their peak while others still had a long way to go.
    Those are the same two ways I thought about using and like you I decided starting everyone on the same CA was the way to go. It would help add to the element of not knowing "My player is developing fast, does he have a high potential or is he almost at his peak?"

    Thanks for the offer of running it, but I'm sure I will do it pretty soon - got a bit of spare time on my hands at the moment, so it's really just a case of working out how best to get it all set up. Any further input would be gratefully received though - and I'll make sure to save you a place in the sign up if you like!
    Wasn't so much an offer to run it more making sure it got done if you decided not to because I think it's a really good idea and I'd definitely like a place reserved

  92. #392
    Amateur
    Join Date
    10th September 2005
    Location
    Challenge clubs: Parque del Plata - Uruguayan Primera Division, Liptovsky Mikulas - Slovakian II. Ligy, Halesowen Town - Blue Square North
    Posts
    237

    Default

    I've done a little bit of testing now and it looks like people will need to be assigned to teams to ensure they don't drop out of the database when they are unattached. I also think it would be more fun to allow people to play in plenty of leagues rather than limit them to the English leagues - and I think I've devised a way to divide them up into player leagues depending on the level they play at. So, I think I'm going to offer people the opportunity to choose a team within the lower reputation leagues I will be running, or allow a team to be randomly chosen for them. This also gives the fun opportunity, if somebody wanted to, to be an English player, but to start a career in, for instance, Argentina, and see where that took them.

    I've also decided that the CA will definitely be the same for everyone, and I might set the minimum PA at somewhere in the region of 90-100 - that means that the worst players should be good enough to play for a team in the bottom division of the leagues that I am running, and would obviously be far too good for some leagues, such as the Conference or Scottish Third Division - but shouldn't really get too much higher than League One level at best.

    I'll also just have to put in a blanket statement that if your player is a bit crap and doesn't get that many games... well, that's part of the fun of this particular sign up!

    Anyway - with that all in mind, I'll probably start this sometime tomorrow. Any further feedback from anybody is gratefully received.

  93. #393
    Reserves
    Join Date
    14th November 2006
    Location
    Aberdeenshire, Scotland
    Posts
    11,611

    Default

    Looks great!

    I'll reserve a place too as he did.

  94. #394
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    6th December 2007
    Posts
    15,944

    Default

    Is the predictions league going to be in-game results or results in real life,

    I was thinking about doing a Premiership predictions league for the real premiership. I know there is one similair on the off topic forum but this forum is much more exciting

    What does everyone think?

  95. #395
    Third Team
    Join Date
    14th January 2007
    Posts
    9,822

    Default

    My predictions league is for a season in FM. You can't do a real life predictions league in here it would be going off topic.

  96. #396
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    6th December 2007
    Posts
    15,944

    Default

    Originally posted by Robert_296:
    My predictions league is for a season in FM. You can't do a real life predictions league in here it would be going off topic.
    Not fully off topic because it is a kind of challenge to guess the score

  97. #397
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    3rd November 2006
    Posts
    17,316

    Default

    Originally posted by ridleys:
    Is the predictions league going to be in-game results or results in real life,

    I was thinking about doing a Premiership predictions league for the real premiership. I know there is one similair on the off topic forum but this forum is much more exciting

    What does everyone think?
    You could possibly run it on a small scale basis in the off topic thread if you really wanted to and provided that there were people willing to take part.

  98. #398
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    1st September 2006
    Location
    us-tv(.co.uk)
    Posts
    16,180

    Default

    Had a good idea. (Even if I do say so myself )

    How about a thread like "What challenge should I join?".

    This would be for people who want to start a challenge, but don't know which one to choose (of course). In here people can say something like:
    I want to manage LLM, but not in England
    or something; and other users can then post ideas to what challenge would be best for them.

    What do you think?

  99. #399
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    1st September 2006
    Location
    us-tv(.co.uk)
    Posts
    16,180

    Default

    Got this idea just now while looking to join a challenge.

    How about a thread like "What challenge should I join?".

    This would be for people who want to start a challenge, but don't know which one to choose (of course). In here people can say something like:
    I want to manage LLM, but not in England
    or something; and other users can then post ideas to what challenge would be best for them.

    What do you think?

  100. #400
    First Team Squad Member
    Join Date
    1st September 2006
    Location
    us-tv(.co.uk)
    Posts
    16,180

    Default

    Double post? :/

    Didn't think you could do that any more.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 4 of 42 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts