Small sides a little "too hard" to beat?

[Ezequiel_Lavezzi]

I am just curious...is it me or are smaller sides (ie bottom half of your division) a lot harder to beat in FM than lets say it would be in real life?

I feel that there is some major flaw in the complacency of the players as it seems time and time again I tend to struggle against smaller sides but I can beat (and sometimes quite easily) all of the big guns in the EPL.

Wondering if anyone else notices this problem and where they think the problem is eminating from.

[hilly_boro]

My last 4 games in my Boro save.

Villa away. Won 2-0 .... 16 shots on goal.

I went to Old Trafford with an attacking formation. Won 3-1 .... 17 shots on goal

Home to Hull with an attacking formation. Lost 1-0 .... 3 shots on goal

Home to Stoke with an attacking formation. Lost 2-0 .... 5 shots on goal.


Its happened all season, and in every season. No matter how I play, what philosophy etc. These results keep happening.

[wanderer89]

My last 4 games in my Boro save.

Villa away. Won 2-0 .... 16 shots on goal.

I went to Old Trafford with an attacking formation. Won 3-1 .... 17 shots on goal

Home to Hull with an attacking formation. Lost 1-0 .... 3 shots on goal

Home to Stoke with an attacking formation. Lost 2-0 .... 5 shots on goal.


Its happened all season, and in every season. No matter how I play, what philosophy etc. These results keep happening.

It could just be your home form

[Edle]

i find that i do better against teams with a bigger rep and the reason why is, in my opinion, quite simple.

bigger teams are going to play a more expansive style and give me room to work and allows my formation to be successful. small teams will defend more and be harder to break down which my team formation is not suited for.

[swed151]

I play on Control philosophy with 'Retain possession' and 'Work ball in into box' and have success with it. I also play a 4-2-3-1 formation with one of the MCs pushing up to support/attack essentially working up the ball with 5 attackers and the defensive MC recovering possession in the middle along with the DCs. The fullbacks push up to provide width.

Smaller teams will often stack the box, so you really need to counter with more numbers and be patient. Also I set long shots to rarely on most of players except for maybe the attacking MC if he is good at long shots.

This has proven to be very successful for me at least.

[Fabio MVP]

There is no such thing as Control philosophy.

[raffious]

I'm having the same issues. What attributes precisely contribute to "complacency"?

Also, I seem to lose/draw EVERY match I deserve to win and win EVERY match I deserve to lose/draw. I'm really losing faith with this match engine.

[BenDPB]

I have the same problem, I play the big teams and smash em but then I play smaller teams and just scrape a draw or even lose......winds me up but thats what happens in the real world which is why I love the game

[Edle]

There is no such thing as Control philosophy.

how fickle

[swed151]

Control strategy with fluid philosophy.....

Really depends on your team though. I've got creative midfielders to open holes in the defense

[keeper tom]

Yes i find this always happens against the likes of Bolton, West ham, Sunderland and Wigan etc. Just seem to be so hard compared to other games against a better opposition and I swear when I play bottom half of the table teams they always seem to score screamers against me Does this happen to any of you lot ???

[Ezequiel_Lavezzi]

After reading up on a bit of tactics, it seems this is the case.

You need to play a lot more defensive against smaller sides. If you play with a deep defensive line, slow tempo, less closing down, you draw the opponent on to you.

Playing through the middle with an attacking narrow formation, with lots of closing down/pressing - you will more than likely lose your game. (and unrealistically too)

In theory, it does make sense, however, what does not make sense is why we HAVE to do this every game just to keep the results realistic.

In reality, some sides are brushed away quite easily no matter how attacking/defensive some of the top sides are.

In all honesty, it seems like SI just go over-board with the tactical aspect of the game and it seems there basically is only one approach to most encounters. (attack the big sides, defend against the small sides.)

I feel SI needs to take a look at the AI tactical approach to games, and make them "less perfect". More often than not the AI does the right thing, at the right time and usually takes its chances, regardless of the stature of the human player.

[baker.simon]

Lavezzi, your becoming as bad as Hammer1000 with your niggles at the game. The past few days it's all i've read from you - negativity and how the game is against you.

As you pointed out, it was your tactics . About making the AI tactics less spot on, surely if your beating them then they have failed in their tactics? Or is it because your tactics are superior?

[lcutty]

Happened to me all the time first 2 seasons with liverpool, i could beat the so called bigger clubs like villa, spurs, citeh and big four but when it came to hull, wolves teams like that i was conceding goals for fun even at home. One game i went 4-0 down in the first half at anfield to wolves which was a complete joke coz at the time i was flyin and top while they was down in 18th!

[tektonik]

2 things gut me.

Evenly matched games where something like this happens. half time shots are 10 to 10. I have 1 clear cut chance and 7 shots on goal with no goals. They have 3 shots on goal, no CCC, all three shots on goal were long shots and scored... As a result my teams morale crumbles and we lose.

I destroy the other team in shots, not just total shots but minus long shots still have good quality shots on target something in the 10+ ranges. Super Keeper to the rescue for them. They convert some freak goal or convert their one quality chance and I am struggling to get back in the game. Strikers ratings are crap because of the super keeper

[lcutty]

Happens all the time in the prem, the main suspects

Paul Robinson
Chris Kirkland
Rob Green
Tom Sorenson
Tim Howard

[DaveTheGaff]

Same i won top of the leauge and lost to a team in relagation next game

[Kenco]

Instead of just moaning about superkeepers and flaws in the game, try going to the tactics forum and reading up on some of the strategies and philosophies. I play a rigid/control system, and I usually score 4 or 5 against the weaker teams in the division. Away to bigger teams I play rigid/counter, and generally get good results there too. There are occasions when I outshoot the opposition by 10 to 1 and still lose, but it happens all the time in real life, so why not in the game? Those who complain about this probably have their MCs taking and missing a lot of long shots.

[Tomer]

In theory, it does make sense, however, what does not make sense is why we HAVE to do this every game just to keep the results realistic.

I never change my tactics and I've won all 16 games so far this season.

[muncherdave]

I am having terrible problems motivating my big side to beat the weakest teams in the league. Midtable teams I'm thrashing without a problem and we usually play well against the top sides, but its not happening for me with this patch.

The suggestions in post #12 seem sound to me, I shall have to give them a go. As for the rest of the post I think it's a knock-on effect of the current state of the match engine that problems like this and things like teamtalks seemingly having too much effect are so happening so often and seem so glaringly obvious.

[santy001]

It's a fairly simple matter of fact that if Arsenal play along the middle with their tippy tappy football against Man Utd, they will push up, look to play the strikers offside and cut them out to get a counter attack going. Last year, Arsenal came to Stoke and tried the same thing, Stoke got 9 men back with one player on their defenders, and Arsenal were completely bereft of any ideas of how to get a goal. They couldn't find any gaps or pull the defense apart regardless of passes/trickery used.

Arsenal were 2-0 down and in the end quite lucky to get a consolation goal as the match ended 2-1, Liverpool came and drew, Man Utd came and were only able to score after Stoke had a man sent off. Chelsea were the only side to come and beat Stoke with ease. Wenger did have an FM style rant about how it was unfair etc and he got laughed at for it by many.

[Newky]

My problems all but disappeared after I started making "no comment" to all the press conference questions. Although they often gave a few of my players the "is happy with managers pre-match comments" it seems there are some large behind the scenes factors associated with these comments that arent apparent to the manager.

My advice - if you think you have no chance against the opposition by all means try and use the pshycological stuff, but if your team is plainly better than the opposition - no comment (that goes for the pre-match team talk as well)

[Matt123456]

It is quite simple. The larger teams play with a more attacking strategy that gives you a lot more space to work with and you can create a lot more chances. Smaller teams player on the counter, play narrow etc and that can be very succesful at limiting chances. Just like in IRL - just look at Stoke or Bolton at their best under Sam Allardyce. The best way to combat this I have found is to play wide and play control rather than attack. Playing attacking can leave you vulnerable on the counter attack and so you leak goals like that. Playing under a control strategy enables you to boss the game and a creative attacking midfielder can rip their defense apart.