Long bans and serious tackles [Player Naming]

[silva_gunner]

Now i'm sure veryone on here has by now heard of Axel Witsel's horrific tackle on Marcin Wasilewski in the Liege-Anderlecht game by now, and i'm sure we all hope Marcin recovers through all right.

However this got me thinking. Are bans like this on FM (so will Witsel have a lengthy ban if it is given to him) and have you ever seen a player get one in-game?

edit; someone can close this now i've got my awnser (and before it gets too aggressive).

[bardock]

Now i'm sure veryone on here has by now heard of Axel Witsel's horrific tackle on Marcin Wasilewski in the Liege-Anderlecht game by now, and i'm sure we all hope Marcin recovers through all right.

However this got me thinking. Are bans like this on FM (so will Witsel have a lengthy ban if it is given to him) and have you ever seen a player get one in-game?

No it never happens in game.

[Saxonaitor]

what horrific tackle?

[Kees04]

You don't want to watch Saxonaitor.

Warning: Graphic Content!!
http://i29.tinypic.com/33e1wfd.gif

[ShaunCpfc]

what horrific tackle?

Just took a look at youtube...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-2nJC67Zf8

[bardock]

That made me cringe

[ShaunCpfc]

Nasty tackle by Witsel. :|

[brigadier]

That's even worse than Eduardo's

Anyways, i haven't seen any big bans handed out in my game.

[ShaunCpfc]

Most l've seen is 3 for a red card which is the usual.

[easternhawk2]

I've had a five game long ban before because it was extended from three to 6 but I played a game before i got the mail saying it was extended.

[Arijit]

That's even worse than Eduardo's

Anyways, i haven't seen any big bans handed out in my game.

yeah! you're right. That man (witsel) should be banned from the game itself.

[silva_gunner]

OK. But if UEFA or FIFA give him say, a 5 month ban, would that compute to the game?

yeah! you're right. That man (witsel) should be banned from the game itself.

I think that should depend entirely on how well Wasilewski recovers.

[Cougar2010]

yeah! you're right. That man (witsel) should be banned from the game itself.

I think thats a bit extreme.

Its the first time I've seen it and its a horrible incident but I don't get the impression there was a lot of malice in it.

[Arijit]

I agree. But that tackle should be punished strictly so that any player will think twice. I have read recently, that FA can now punish a player for bad tackles harshly, they have the power to review the punishments. This happended after eduardo's infamous incident.

[jayahr]

Any global ban is always picked up in the game as well, but I doubt that in this case one will be given.

It was a hard foul with very severe consequences but the foul itself only looked that bad in the super-slow-mo.

[DaveDaveDave]

It was a bad tackle, but not at all malicious or even intentional.

I remember on FM08 (I think) I had a player banned for 12 months for attacking a referee, or something like that. Never for a tackle though.

[RT--]

Witsel's been banned until the end of the year (he'll be eligible to play again on Jan 1st, 2010).

[I\'m Brian (and so is my wife!)]

Witsel's been banned until the end of the year (he'll be eligible to play again on Jan 1st, 2010).

Are you posting from the HQ of the belgian FA?
They're still discussing the case: no ban has been given yet (as far as I can see on all the belgian football sites)


edit: btw the tackle was malicious (just look at the position of his torso just before the 'tackle'; he comes to an upright position and braces himself to get as much weight on the leg as possible) and with preplanned intent (Payback move for a kick in the back Witsel received from Wasyl 2 years ago)

Appalling
Really bad form from a talented young guy...

[SCIAG]

I don't think it was that bad tbh. 3 game ban at most.

The user that got 6 games: was that for violent conduct, per chance?

[tomtuck01]

That man (witsel) should be banned from the game itself.

Dont be so ridiculous.

[RT--]

Are you posting from the HQ of the belgian FA?
They're still discussing the case: no ban has been given yet (as far as I can see on all the belgian football sites)


edit: btw the tackle was malicious (just look at the position of his torso just before the 'tackle'; he comes to an upright position and braces himself to get as much weight on the leg as possible) and with preplanned intent (Payback move for a kick in the back Witsel received from Wasyl 2 years ago)

Appalling
Really bad form from a talented young guy...

Yeah, sorry, I was going on the basis of somebody from another forum, who was himself going on the basis of an article on a Polish news site. I'd never make a historian

[Ceching You Out]

In my opinion, the tackle wasn't malicious at all (based on the replays I've seen). Dangerous? Absolutely, and I wouldn't be surprised to see Witsel miss 3-5 games. But that's the sort of tackle you see all the time from strikers; Witsel is thinking to protect himself first, challenge for the ball second. But the tackle isn't accurate and he's a little late, and to top off the unfortunate circumstances he misses the defender's shinguard and puts his boot straight to bone.

All-in-all, it's just not a situation you like to see. A defender plowing forward full speed into a slide tackle and a striker coming in strong with cleats up even if they're only raised an inch or two.

[tomtuck01]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Witsel miss 3-5 games.

He's been banned until 23rd November, which is 10 league games and a cup game.

But that's the sort of tackle you see all the time from strikers; Witsel is thinking to protect himself first, challenge for the ball second. But the tackle isn't accurate and he's a little late, and to top off the unfortunate circumstances he misses the defender's shinguard and puts his boot straight to bone.

All-in-all, it's just not a situation you like to see. A defender plowing forward full speed into a slide tackle and a striker coming in strong with cleats up even if they're only raised an inch or two.

I dont where you are getting your information from, but Axel Witsel is a holding midfielder. So the "strikers challenge" excuse cannot be used.

[jayahr]

He's been banned until 23rd November, which is 10 league games and a cup game.


I dont where you are getting your information from, but Axel Witsel is a holding midfielder. So the "strikers challenge" excuse cannot be used.

Well, then I would expect that ban not to be in the game as obviously the ban did not exist at the start of the season. And having a ban in the db from now until November isn't possible iirc

[Ceching You Out]

He's been banned until 23rd November, which is 10 league games and a cup game.

10 games still seems within reason, but between this and the Eduardo tackle from a season or two ago football associations are treading into new territory with extended bans.

I dont where you are getting your information from, but Axel Witsel is a holding midfielder. So the "strikers challenge" excuse cannot be used.

Sorry for that, saw that he won the Belgian Golden Shoe award for last season and I assumed it was given to the top goal scorer. Turns out it's given to the best player instead. I think I'll crawl back into my hole now!

That definitely does change my opinion on it...

[bandi15]

Dont be so ridiculous.

That's not ridiculous. He was either trying to end another player's career or he's so crap that he's a danger to everyone he plays against. Such people should not be allowed anywhere near a football pitch.

[tomtuck01]

That's not ridiculous. He was either trying to end another player's career or he's so crap that he's a danger to everyone he plays against. Such people should not be allowed anywhere near a football pitch.

Yes it is ridiculous to call for him not to be allowed to play again.

You have no idea if he was trying to hurt the other player, nevermind end his career, and that is just an assumption by you and other foolish people. Neither is he crap or a "danger to others" - one extremely poor challenge does not make him a danger to others, it just means that he made a poor tackle.

As I have already said, it was a very poor tackle, but it is a contact sport and unfortunately these things happen. The ban handed to him is more than adequate.

Will it be in FM10? I'd have thought so, and that he would be banned in-game until the date that his real life ban finishes.

[bigwills88]

That's even worse than Eduardo's

Anyways, i haven't seen any big bans handed out in my game.

To be honest most leg breaking tackles are worse than Eduardo's. Why it caught the imagination of the public so much more than any other I'm not sure...

[tomtuck01]

To be honest most leg breaking tackles are worse than Eduardo's. Why it caught the imagination of the public so much more than any other I'm not sure...

Arsene Wenger making a fuss over it and the Arsenal attitude that there is some kind of conspiracy against them, if I remember correctly.

[Cougar2010]

As I have already said, it was a very poor tackle, but it is a contact sport and unfortunately these things happen. The ban handed to him is more than adequate.

Urm, technically its not if you read the rules of the game....

[Highor]

He is banned for 10 matches IRL.

[baker.simon]

Has Witsel said sorry? Been to visit the other player in hospital etc? That usually calms all the fuss down.

[earmack]

Thats about as bad as anything I've seen on a football pitch. To be clear If anyone EVER puts a 'tackle' in like that that I want them banned for life. Either A) he did it on purpose or B) he is so unaware of his own actions having consequences he is infact functionally a 3 year old. In both scenarios he is not fit to play a GAME.

edit: Id go as far to say if you think that the GBH was accidental or just a little wreckless you are functionally a 3 year old.

[tomtuck01]

Laughable opinion.

[earmack]

Laughable opinion.

oh well allow me to retort: he trod downwards on the guys leg at full speed.
If you think thats just incidental contact or just a 'bad' tackle your a ****ing moron.

[DivineOne]

I don't think it was that bad tbh. 3 game ban at most.

Maybe you should look again then. He didn't go for the ball and definitely went in to cause injury. After that he even dares protesting again his red card. He's a golden boot, he's supposed to be an example.

Has Witsel said sorry? Been to visit the other player in hospital etc? That usually calms all the fuss down.

Yes.
Wasil can't get visitors yet (except his wife offcourse) because they still need to operate.

[tomtuck01]

oh well allow me to retort: he trod downwards on the guys leg at full speed.
If you think thats just incidental contact or just a 'bad' tackle your a ****ing moron.

I never said it was "incidental" or that he shouldn't recieve a ban, (which has done), indeed if you read my previous posts you would see that I agree with him being banned for the incident.

But you simply cannot ban a player for life on the basis of one very poor tackle. The player has no history of this sort of thing, and is not the type of player that goes out trying to deliberately hurt his opponents.


As for suggting I am a "****ing moron", (as you so eloquently put it), then there is really no need for that sort of comment just because I think your opinion is sensationalist and laughable.

[DivineOne]

The player has no history of this sort of thing, and is not the type of player that goes out trying to deliberately hurt his opponents.
:

I don't remember why he got it, but remember, he still needs to sit out a 5 match ban for the national team.

[bean824]

It was definitely intentional - although I don't think he knew the amount of damage that it would cause. He wanted to hurt him, not take a limb off.

[tomtuck01]

I don't remember why he got it, but remember, he still needs to sit out a 5 match ban for the national team.

Perhaps I am wrong then about him having previous. But it does not change the fact that people who think he should be banned for life are being over the top. The ban until November 23rd is more than adequate.

[DivineOne]

I agree with the ban being adequate. However I hope they extend the ban, just because they appealed against it.

[I\'m Brian (and so is my wife!)]

You have no idea if he was trying to hurt the other player, nevermind end his career, and that is just an assumption by you and other foolish people. Neither is he crap or a "danger to others" - one extremely poor challenge does not make him a danger to others, it just means that he made a poor tackle..

1. A teammate of Witsel (Sarr) called the tackle "logical" after what happened 2 years ago (see my previous post) --> he did this on purpose and with premeditation.
2. One?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWgl3...eature=related
view at 1:17...
He is currently banned for the Belgian Intl team (4 games) for the same infraction in the match against Bosnia.(tackling without regard to the ball with the sole intent of hitting the leg of the adversary as hard as possible) --> he has shown this kind of behavior on several occasion.

As I have already said, it was a very poor tackle, but it is a contact sport and unfortunately these things happen. The ban handed to him is more than adequate.

Another teammate (Dufour) had the following reaction:
"If the referee would had given the foul on me 10 seconds before the incident, nothing would have happened"
This implies that Witsel was going into that challenge with the sole intent of fouling Wasyl as hard as possible to 'get even'.


"Should he be banned for life?"
Not according to me
Severly punished?
Yes!; the current 11 match ban + fine (and possibly same ban for European matches) seems propotional to the infraction.

Every footballplayer in the world knows what can happen if you hit somebody with the force and in the manner Witsel did.
This has nothing to do with football being a 'contact' sport.
In traffic accidents do happen. This however was a hit and run by a drunk driver...

Every (objective) fan/player seeing how Witsel executes this tackle can see this is done with the sole intent of hitting the defender.
Did he mean to cause a double leg break? No
Did he mean to cause an injury? Yes

This was a vicious retaliation by a very talented young player whose wage is inversely proportional to his maturity.

Two careers ended on sunday; one due to injury and another due to infamy.

[tomtuck01]

It was definitely intentional - although I don't think he knew the amount of damage that it would cause. He wanted to hurt him, not take a limb off.

How do you know it was intentional? Are you privy to Axel Witsel's thoughts? You are making an assumption and you cannot ban players on an assumption of what he is thinking.

[DivineOne]

Two careers ended on sunday; one due to injury and another due to infamy.

I wouldn't say Witsel's career is over. The public forgets very easy. Remember De Bilde? His career certainly wasn't over.

[I\'m Brian (and so is my wife!)]

I wouldn't say Witsel's career is over. The public forgets very easy. Remember De Bilde? His career certainly wasn't over.

His career in Belgium then?

[DivineOne]

Not like he wasn't going to leave in a year or 2, it'll just be a bit faster now.

[silva_gunner]

On a bit of a side note has anyone noticed his wikipedia page has been locked? suggests there was some bad stuff goin gon there from angry fans.

[Unknown Hacker]

Definitely agree with the ban, and to the guy above who said how it was intentional:

1. He straightened his back, just before impact, and his arm comes up, which is always an indicator of an application of force through the lower back.

2. He planted his left leg before jumping into it with his right leg, which also indicates intent.

3. He has previous with the other player, and has previous with making those types of tackles, which makes intent more likely.

4. He looked back after making the tackle, and did not even go and say sorry to the player on the floor, even thoug his foot was pointing the wrong way and he was in absolute agony...

5. The fact that he had the audacity to try and appeal against the red card when it inevitably came makes it even worse in my eyes...

Oh and by the way, it is simple to add a ban into the database, especially when you have experience with that kind of thing.

[SCIAG]

Another teammate (Dufour) had the following reaction:
"If the referee would had given the foul on me 10 seconds before the incident, nothing would have happened"
This implies that Witsel was going into that challenge with the sole intent of fouling Wasyl as hard as possible to 'get even'.

No it doesn't.

Maybe you should look again then. He didn't go for the ball and definitely went in to cause injury. After that he even dares protesting again his red card. He's a golden boot, he's supposed to be an example.

He is going for the ball. His foot is where the ball was a split second earlier. The other guy comes crashing in towards him and goes easily have broken Witsel's leg if he'd had it on the floor. When I saw the incident for the first time I thought they were the other way around.

Seriously, 3 games should have been the max.

Regardless, football forum!

[Unknown Hacker]

Doubtful the other guy was going to break his leg, but whatever. I think, he was either trying to injure, or it was an attempt to shield the ball with his right foot that went horribly wrong, like the tackles essien used to make quite frequently...

[FrazT]

This discussion has nothing to do with FM so please go and discuss it in the Football forum