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Thread: More african leagues

  1. #1
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    I believe the makers of Fm should do alot more to help promote football in africa. please consider creating more leagues for this great continent.

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    I believe the makers of Fm should do alot more to help promote football in africa. please consider creating more leagues for this great continent.

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    Which country are you from?

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    they should make the ghanaian league . it might help me win them the world cup

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    I am from england

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    I would like to see the Egyptian League included.

    If others could be included too, it would be great. But I think the Egyptian League is the easiest one to research and find info about it.

    And Al-Ahly play there.

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    I would like to see the Moroccan,Tunisian,Egyptian & Nigerian leagues implemented into the game.

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    If you chose to "retain players" from some african nations, you'll find that clubs from Morocco, Tunisia, Egypt already have what seem to be very complete squads. So I guess research wouldn't be that big an issue.

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    I help Driss out with some African data occasionally. I'm in agreement with you that the research isn't that big an issue (at the moment).

    I am confident that if SI were to create the Algeria, Egypt, Morocco and Tunisia league for example then people from those countries would decide to help because it would be worth their time and effort. As it stands they don't see the point because if they create players for example the only time they will see them is using retain players.

    Please have a read of http://community.sigames.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/5211026...2044063?r=9272044063 to see just how much we have improved the data over the past couple of months.

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    That countries like Belarus, Hong Kong, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore and Slovenia are included before the likes of Egypt, Tunisia and Ghana is a huge insult to African football.
    SI like to claim that they represent the world game but their claims are false.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by djvandyke:
    That countries like Belarus, Hong Kong, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore and Slovenia are included before the likes of Egypt, Tunisia and Ghana is a huge insult to African football.
    SI like to claim that they represent the world game but their claims are false. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    To be fair, I would imagine that the countries that the game is shipped to and sells well in are always going to be prime candidates, regarding playable leagues implemented.

    It will always be nice to see more leagues and countries available over time. Give them chance

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    I would also like to add that I want to play EVERY league on the game...

    ...Unfortunately I can't afford and don't think there is a PC fast enough to do this quickly enough yet.

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    I'd rather see a 2nd tier to the Welsh League added !!

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    Egypt is a league i would play straight away if implemented. Qatar also, but this is asian so i believe

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    Stop blaming SI.

    If the researchers were available for those leagues, they'd be included by now. However, the researchers are not available, so the leagues aren't there yet.

    If researchers don't volunteer, then there will be no additional leagues added for FM09, FM10, FM11, etc, etc.

    So, it is not SI's fault. They can only include what they know.

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    I'm seriously gutted that the Japanese links aren't in there anymore.

    Anybody know what that is? Licensing issues I assume.

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    Si is already very good in researching the curent european and south-american leagues, they shouldn' weakenthis aspect by laying more focus on a contintent were clubfootball is not on the same level. The finale of the WC for clubs was between a S-american and an european team.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DamianY2J:
    Stop blaming SI.

    If the researchers were available for those leagues, they'd be included by now. However, the researchers are not available, so the leagues aren't there yet.

    If researchers don't volunteer, then there will be no additional leagues added for FM09, FM10, FM11, etc, etc.

    So, it is not SI's fault. They can only include what they know. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    in many cases the players are already in the database, so it's just a case of fleshing out some of the smaller teams and making the league playable.

    they could do this, or they could make the editor capable of designing new leagues without having to replace existing ones.

    not sure how you can blame people from the countries in question for not volunteering. if si took steps to make the leagues playable, i'm sure they'd get a better response

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DamianY2J:
    Stop blaming SI.

    If the researchers were available for those leagues, they'd be included by now. However, the researchers are not available, so the leagues aren't there yet.

    If researchers don't volunteer, then there will be no additional leagues added for FM09, FM10, FM11, etc, etc.

    So, it is not SI's fault. They can only include what they know. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Er, or maybe they could start paying people to do research. They can't be that short of a few bob.

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    Rather than being a research issue, I think it's more a case of balancing the time/effort required to add a new league against the number of people who SI think will play in that league. Perhaps they don't think there is enough demand for these leagues. Don't forget that adding leagues also increases database size and processing power required so it's not just about the initial research.
    More african leagues are however a good idea, especialy Egypt as that is one of the primary leagues in Africa, with teams like Al-Ahly. However the next leagues to add would logically be in South America. Having already added leagues like Peru, Chile and Colombia, I don't think it will be too many years before places like Paraguay and Bolivia appear.

  21. #21
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DamianY2J:
    So, it is not SI's fault. They can only include what they know. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I don't beleive this to be the case. In my opinion Africa is neglected by SI.

    The African Champions League is in the wrong format.

    The Confederations Cup was the result of a merge between the Cup Winners Cup and the CAF Cup.

    This happened in 2004 and since then the Confederations Cup has remained in game with the wrong format with an incorrect past winners history (it contains another competition's history in addition to its own).

    The Confederation Cup competition in game remains with the Cup Winners Cup format and the name still hasn't been changed - four years on! Matches are played on the incorrect weekday (CAF games are only ever played on Friday, Saturday or Sunday).

    The African Super Cup final is played in the wrong month and on the wrong weekday.

    The African Nations qualifiers are in the 2004 format (there is a qualifying group in game which does not exist in real life).

    If these errors were to happen with a UEFA competition people on here would be baying for blood.

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    African leagues would make them game better, because the Africa teams would produce good youth for Arsenal to steal

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">African leagues would make them game better, because the Africa teams would produce good youth for Arsenal to steal </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    You mean there are actually some African youth players left in Africa?

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sad Git:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">African leagues would make them game better, because the Africa teams would produce good youth for Arsenal to steal </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    You mean there are actually some African youth players left in Africa? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Nope. They all turn out to be Olympic long distance runners, im sure they could be the next Eto or Drogba, but somehow they think running 1500 metres is a better alternative

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    Year after year, I ask for more African leagues. As mentioned above, there are enough African internationals in the game to make up the bare bones of several clubs in several nations. The rest can be rated by "guesstimate."

    The leagues of several nations that are minor football powers, at best, are already in the game. The number of researchers for some of those nations is quite small, which leads me to believe that quite a bit of "guesstimation" goes on in rating players in those leagues.

    Does anybody really believe that some researcher has seen every single player on every single team in FM often enough to rate him accurately???

    Approximate ratings for non-top tier player can and should be done for African countries.

    The potential number of players who would love to play more African leagues is quite large, certainly larger than the market for some nations already included in the game.

    Not everybody who would want to play an African league lives in Africa or is of African descent.

    Not everybody of African ancestry who would love to play an African league lives in Africa.

    Africa is a lot more than South Africa.

    It's long past time for more African leagues to be included in FM.

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    I know I certainly would like to manage an African team.

  27. #27

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    Nevertheless, it doesn't help to say that SI is neglecting Africa, as someone mentioned, all they need is to add the smaller teams.

    But the problem here is, where are the researchers who can write the stats of these players in smaller teams? Surely SI can't just grab stats out of the air and claim that it's correct? Multiple researchers are needed and it doesn't help that African games are rarely shown outside of Africa.

    So it all boils down to 2 points.

    1) Lack of researchers.

    2) If anyone is neglecting African football, it's the world.

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    I'd like to see a Canadian League next year. Doubt that will ever happen though.

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    Passer-by, it seems to be catch 22. SI don't want to add more leagues without research and the African researcher can't find more researchers without an active playable league.

    There is absolutely no reason why the African continental competitions in game have remained the same since the 2003-2004 season.

    Asia has the Olympic qualifiers fully playable and under 17 and under 20 youth championship history in the game, Africa doesn't. They should be in there for Africa too.

    Because of this neglect, people who could potentially be researchers are put off because they don't think that it is worth their while as there is no end product.

    Certain people forget that the researcher is a voluntary service for both SI and the customers, they use their own free time and effort and try to ensure that the game is of a high standard. The sole benefit of being a researcher is a free copy of the game (which was selling for £5 in PC world this week, this begs the question; does a free £5 game make it worth spending all of those hours refining data - only to be told that it is completely wrong because someone saw him on the youtube once).

  30. #30

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    Asian league are receiving so much attention, J-League especially. Africa has many brilliant players but not much focus to paid to their teams there.

    Correct me if I'm wrong.

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    Some typos in there, disregard them.

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    Sorry I don't understand your argument (if it was one), what has that got to do with having more than one African country's league playable in the game?

    The likes of Algeria, Egypt, Morrocco and Tunisia are better supported than the Asian leagues with the exception of Japan, South Korea and maybe China.

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    To be honest when you spend as much time playing with the data as I do you get to see the true picture of what is actually there.

    African Data - Pretty much spot on for a) the limited people involved and b) the limited coverage it gets.

    South American - there's a few places where there's neglected data but on the whole pretty sound.

    Asia - see above

    North America - Al does a grand job

    Central America - Never notice it, which in my book means it's a good thing

    Europe - Europe would be the perfect continent if they threw the Finish and Turkish data out completely - by god does it suck in so many ways.


    so to summarise - Boot out the likes of Turkey, Finland, Bolivia, South Korea and throw in more African leagues and my data updates would become a whole lot easier!!

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    Some people who post here have no clue.

    First of all I saw someone saying researchers should get paid...they do. I am not sure if all do but the ones that are in charge of a whole country's research do.

    Next thing someone said that the problem is not SI but the researchers. Thats wrong also. SI dont want to waste there programmer's time on making new leagues playable unless there is enough interest in them. This includes lower divisions in countries.

    Last thing people are saying Egypt and other African leagues should be in ahead of India and Indonesian leagues. Maybe in terms of the quality of the league but SI are looking at what leagues there is most interest in and where they could make more money. India has 1 billion people and Indonesia has a enormous population as well and in Indonesia I believe its there national sport. So they get more sales by including those leagues.

  35. #35

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Q2thaz:
    To be honest when you spend as much time playing with the data as I do you get to see the true picture of what is actually there.

    African Data - Pretty much spot on for a) the limited people involved and b) the limited coverage it gets.

    South American - there's a few places where there's neglected data but on the whole pretty sound.

    Asia - see above

    North America - Al does a grand job

    Central America - Never notice it, which in my book means it's a good thing

    Europe - Europe would be the perfect continent if they threw the Finish and Turkish data out completely - by god does it suck in so many ways.


    so to summarise - Boot out the likes of Turkey, Finland, Bolivia, South Korea and throw in more African leagues and my data updates would become a whole lot easier!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Turkey and South Korea? Surely not! 2 in every 5 threads would be about their leagues disappearing.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DamianY2J:
    Stop blaming SI.

    If the researchers were available for those leagues, they'd be included by now. However, the researchers are not available, so the leagues aren't there yet.

    If researchers don't volunteer, then there will be no additional leagues added for FM09, FM10, FM11, etc, etc.

    So, it is not SI's fault. They can only include what they know. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    love it when people make bold statements like this. how do you know? maybe they never advertised for researchers from those countries...and they do as i just read an ad looking for researchers for couple of english clubs.


    FM series is mainly developed for european and english speaking countries or at least with the ability to speak some form of english.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Passer-by:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Q2thaz:
    To be honest when you spend as much time playing with the data as I do you get to see the true picture of what is actually there.

    African Data - Pretty much spot on for a) the limited people involved and b) the limited coverage it gets.

    South American - there's a few places where there's neglected data but on the whole pretty sound.

    Asia - see above

    North America - Al does a grand job

    Central America - Never notice it, which in my book means it's a good thing

    Europe - Europe would be the perfect continent if they threw the Finish and Turkish data out completely - by god does it suck in so many ways.


    so to summarise - Boot out the likes of Turkey, Finland, Bolivia, South Korea and throw in more African leagues and my data updates would become a whole lot easier!! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Turkey and South Korea? Surely not! 2 in every 5 threads would be about their leagues disappearing. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I was basing it on current data, not popularity

  38. #38
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    Last year there were plenty of queries in regard to leagues people had edited and researched themselves.

    People had done updates for Egypt, Jordan, Jamaica, Cuba, Bosnia and I'm sure there was Ghana or Tunisia as well. Changing match days, competitions, etc.

    The big question was that if people had pulled the effort to do that much work, why couldn't SI include an update for the following year based on what these people had done?

    As far as I know isn't Bosnia and/or Macedonia going to be added to FM09? I'm sure that's what the people who did the update for FM07 said.

    If their update's making a future game why not the other leagues people made?

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Nostromo:
    maybe they never advertised for researchers from those countries...and they do as i just read an ad looking for researchers for couple of english clubs.
    </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Interesting point, I've never seen a post on SI explicitly asking for people to assist the head researchers with data.

  40. #40
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    Somebody called Amr Fekry created another Egyptian patch based on mine. He's added clubs and hundreds of players.

    http://www.fmafrica.net/index.php?topic=128.0

    He's a little biased towards the reputation of the Egyptian league (he gave it a 15, thats more than the African Nations cup!) and some kits are incorrect but other than that it's good.

  41. #41
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    personally i think SI should forget about african leagues for now and concentrate 100% on getting what we have already, right.

    Maybe start talking about expanding the game when the one we already have is working properly,then,maybe think about expanding?

    im not having a pop at SI as im enjoying another version of FM.

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    THe other coonsideration in researching new leagues is the quality of league.
    If we take wales and scotland as examples; players in the welsh premier or scottish third division are probably only rated at 4 or 5 out of 20. If you continue to go below this then you will end up with squads of players only being stats at 1 and 2.

  43. #43
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    My fellow bluenose - are you suggesting that the WPL and Scot's third division are of a higher standard than the domestic leagues of Algeria, Egypt, and Tunsia's etc?

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Blue Lou:
    Somebody called Amr Fekry created another Egyptian patch based on mine. He's added clubs and hundreds of players.

    http://www.fmafrica.net/index.php?topic=128.0

    He's a little biased towards the reputation of the Egyptian league (he gave it a 15, thats more than the African Nations cup!) and some kits are incorrect but other than that it's good. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Blue Lou -- Are you using this Egyptian patch? Is it legit? Any problems? No viruses?

    It looks interesting, but am very careful about downloading things from sources I don't know very well.

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    The Egyptian leagues would be nice... maybe also Tunisia, with Club Africain would be nice...

    I've always wanted to play in the Qatar league... I know it's Asian, not African, but meh :-p

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    i love the ivory coast and togo!

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    Antonin, it is legit. I checked it out

    It's based on the Egyptian league patch I made a while ago but he has updated transfers and created real teams (some kit colours are wrong but that's the only gripe I have with it!)

    Snowblind - in the editor's hideaway there is an Egypt / Tunisia patch that I made ready to download.

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    Thanks Blue Lou! I will download it and see what's what.

    I assume this is a patch for FM08? I had stopped playing WSM 2008, but maybe for a chance to play in Egypt I will give it a go once again.

    My usual practice is to have the leagues of perhaps 2 neighboring countries active, such as Germany and Austria, so I can seek career options in both.

    Is it possible to run Egypt and South Africa at the same time, and recruit players from both?

    I'll do a search for this, but I wonder if there is a single thread for African patches for other FM versions (05, 06, 07...).

    Also, would African patches for FM work in WSM?

  49. #49
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    Hmm... tried to download Amr's patch, got the message "page cannot be displayed."

  50. #50
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    http://www.4shared.com/file/33562164/cbec3a3b/8004.html...PwdVerified=88f4949a

    Try that link.. he typed it wrong on the forums. I'll fix his post now

  51. #51
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    It comes down to

    1. Is it worth the resources for SI to implement these African leagues? (more programming and research will be needed, not to mention additional licenses, but will it increase sales, widen influence etc...)

    2. Is it an issue that has higher priority than other areas of improvement?

    Right now I don't see this as meeting either of those requirements really. Maybe SI will find the time to add one or two more leagues from Africa in 2009, but I doubt there's any major increase anytime soon.

  52. #52
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    Yes it is worth the "resources," as you put it. Why wouldn't it be?

    If you think "other areas" should be/will be addressed first, dream on. There have always been bugs in FM and there will continue to be in FM09.

    Three bugs will be fixed, and that will cause two more.

    Using "other areas need improvement first" as an excuse to not add African leagues is simply another way of saying African leagues do not interest you at all. Which is just fine.

    But the almost total lack of African leagues in FM is an appalling oversight. Some of us have been asking for more African content since the CM 01/02 days!. Year after year the response from SI is either silence or "we hope to add more African leagues some day." Meanwhile, the game includes the likes of football powerhouses like Malaysia and Indonesia. And we get "new features" like team talks.

    Why is this issue not regarded as important by some people here?

    Is it because the issue has to do with Africa? Why is the "African issue" at the absolute bottom of the ladder when it comes to importance?

    People are already howling about problems with the Spanish league in FM08. And rightfully so, given the importance of the Spanish league. But what if somebody who doesn't care about Spain said "Well, so what? Manage someplace else. There are more important things to fix first."

    What if someone suggested removing several European leagues so that the game would be smaller and downloads would be quicker? There would be a firestorm of anger from people whining about their little pet European league.

    What I can't understand is, why wouldn't FM players want to manage in an African league? I'm not of European background, yet I have no problem managing in Germany, France, Russia, Croatia, Romania, Uruguay and even bloody Indonesia.

    What's the big deal? Are you assuming that only somebody African will want to manage in Africa?

    The research for more African leagues has already been done. Several people, working on their own, have cobbled together "patches" for Egypt and Tunisia. There is also at least one Chadian league patch out there.

    These efforts should receive official recognition and be incorporated into FM.

  53. #53
    Brazilian Head Researcher
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">not to mention additional licenses </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Most leagues aren't licensed, so this is not an issue.


    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">more programming and research will be needed </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    The research for some of the leagues (especially Egypt) is already there and the ones who code leagues aren't the same ones that code teamtalks and the likes.

  54. #54
    Amateur
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Antonin:
    Yes it is worth the "resources," as you put it. Why wouldn't it be?

    If you think "other areas" should be/will be addressed first, dream on. There have always been bugs in FM and there will continue to be in FM09.

    Three bugs will be fixed, and that will cause two more.

    Using "other areas need improvement first" as an excuse to not add African leagues is simply another way of saying African leagues do not interest you at all. Which is just fine.

    But the almost total lack of African leagues in FM is an appalling oversight. Some of us have been asking for more African content since the CM 01/02 days!. Year after year the response from SI is either silence or "we hope to add more African leagues some day." Meanwhile, the game includes the likes of football powerhouses like Malaysia and Indonesia. And we get "new features" like team talks.

    Why is this issue not regarded as important by some people here?

    Is it because the issue has to do with Africa? Why is the "African issue" at the absolute bottom of the ladder when it comes to importance?

    People are already howling about problems with the Spanish league in FM08. And rightfully so, given the importance of the Spanish league. But what if somebody who doesn't care about Spain said "Well, so what? Manage someplace else. There are more important things to fix first."

    What if someone suggested removing several European leagues so that the game would be smaller and downloads would be quicker? There would be a firestorm of anger from people whining about their little pet European league.

    What I can't understand is, why wouldn't FM players want to manage in an African league? I'm not of European background, yet I have no problem managing in Germany, France, Russia, Croatia, Romania, Uruguay and even bloody Indonesia.

    What's the big deal? Are you assuming that only somebody African will want to manage in Africa?

    The research for more African leagues has already been done. Several people, working on their own, have cobbled together "patches" for Egypt and Tunisia. There is also at least one Chadian league patch out there.

    These efforts should receive official recognition and be incorporated into FM. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


    while most of those arguments are valid, it would still require SI spend additional resources on top of their existing projects to add new leagues.

    And how much additional sales would it generate? Not as much as say, if they spent that resources on improving Confidence or Media or AI. Most of the people demanding African leagues will most likely buy FM anyway without it.

    It is unfortunate that profit drives the product, not ideals. However if you can get a large enough group to start boycotting FM unless SI puts it in then it'll become a profit issue.

  55. #55
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    U.S.A.
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    I will say that I use Blue Lou's database and it is solid. Egypt and Tunisia in the database, very solid. I have noticed a lot of Algerian and Moroccan players coming around from Africa too which are solid.

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