If EA, Eidos and SI merged to make a 2010 management game...

[peter-evo]

What features would you take from Championship Manager, Fifa Manager and put into Football Manager

From Fifa Manager: I would have to take the menu graphics. I find their game design very nice and is something I feel FM could use to improve the game further.

From Championship Manager: I will have to take the idea behind set-piece creator. I am not sure it will work in CM well but would love that sort of feature in FM. 33% of goals come from set-pieces and I don't feel that section of the game is thorough enough.

So what about you?

[arsenal_2111]

You stole the 33% stat from the CM podcast thing

I think the practise pitch looks great from CM, FIFA it would have to be the whole personal life thing ( )

[peter-evo]

I did steal that stat

[rsk360]

playing it would be like having sex

[baker.simon]

FM - Database
FIFAMan - Graphics
CM - Set piece & training

[golfpunk]

FM - Database
FIFAMan - Graphics
CM - Set piece & training

Hit the nail on the head Simon

[rsk360]

i also remember that someone tried saying this around this time last year


the hard-on fm players said that they would rather eat their own genitals then having anything from fifa in a manager game because apparently your personal life and other cosmetics values have nothing to do with being a manager in a game game *yawn*

but yeah im all for it

like i said, it would be like having sex

[golfpunk]

i also remember that someone tried saying this around this time last year


the hard-on fm players said that they would rather eat their own genitals then having anything from fifa in a manager game because apparently your personal life and other cosmetics values have nothing to do with being a manager in a game game *yawn*

but yeah im all for it

like i said, it would be like having sex

I would hate to have the whole lifestyle thing implemented into a management game. The only thing I would take from FIFA Manager would be the graphics for the 3D view. Saying that I love 2D Classic so it wouldn't really bother me in the slightest.

I agree with Baker.Simon though, would have to be FM's database, FIFA's graphics and CM's set piece training....BUT that is only my opinion from watching the promo clip. It may well turn out tedious and rubbish

[wingz47]

I agree. The diehard FM fans at times can be very annoying. They are not the one who IMPROVED this game. Call them moaners, it's those who like to complain a lot of this game which helped the game to improve. SI will learn NOTHING from those everything-is-perfect mentality.

Let's face it, take FIFAM's GRAPHIC, it's TOP TOP draw. I bet should one day FM go for the same state of art graphic design, everyone, including those diehard fans would LOVE it.

[TigerJoe]

Fifa Manager: Graphics
CM: The training and ideas like the setpiece creater etc
FM: The database and most of the stuff that is already on the game.

[Stevicus]

Put them all together and it'll be a £30 i won't regret spending

[Smallen]

FM would be the greatest game ever if It had better graphics imo. I wouldn't take anything from CM, even the new features. It looks as though there would be loopholes in the set piece creator and training which would produce unrealistically good results.

[rsk360]

FM would be the greatest game ever if It had better graphics imo. I wouldn't take anything from CM, even the new features. It looks as though there would be loopholes in the set piece creator and training which would produce unrealistically good results.

yeah so lets stick to sliders init....

[peter-evo]

FM would be the greatest game ever if It had better graphics imo. I wouldn't take anything from CM, even the new features. It looks as though there would be loopholes in the set piece creator and training which would produce unrealistically good results.

I am presuming that we could get them to work well, would you then take them features?

[Smallen]

What do you mean by work well? no 'corner bug' type things?

[peter-evo]

What do you mean by work well? no 'corner bug' type things?

No major glitches and exploits.

[SCIAG]

yeah so lets stick to sliders init....

Eidos are doing so aren't they? Drills are in addition.

Sliders are a much simpler way of doing the same thing IMO, only thing is you don't get the good-first-time-you-see-it factor of seeing the players train.

A set piece creator that works realistically would take genuine AI IMO. It would be a great addition, but I don't think it will happen for a good long while

[Smallen]

Then yes, they'd be a very good feature. UNLESS you had to do training schedules and 'drills' as CM calls them more or less everyday. That would be even more repetitive then press conferences.

EDIT: but it's probably unrealistic to ask for no glitches and exploits in such things.

[peter-evo]

Then yes, they'd be a very good feature. UNLESS you had to do training schedules and 'drills' as CM calls them more or less everyday. That would be even more repetitive then press conferences.

EDIT: but it's probably unrealistic to ask for no glitches and exploits in such things.

With regards to training. I read somewhere that you don't have to do the drills every day and you can set your assistant to deal with them.

[rsk360]

Then yes, they'd be a very good feature. UNLESS you had to do training schedules and 'drills' as CM calls them more or less everyday. That would be even more repetitive then press conferences.

EDIT: but it's probably unrealistic to ask for no glitches and exploits in such things.

yh it would be kinda dry if you had to do them everyday, but they probably thought ahead of this and gave a option for the assistant to continue your drills and occasionally come up with his own and recommend them to you

[Smallen]

That's a decent idea. It does remind me of press conferences though (new feature, great first time, good second time, dull third time, ass man from then on). I'll have to wait for the demo for my verdict on them though.

[rsk360]

That's a decent idea. It does remind me of press conferences though (new feature, great first time, good second time, dull third time, ass man from then on). I'll have to wait for the demo for my verdict on them though.

tbh they were boring cos they were repetitive

there are an inifinite possibilities with this one

[Nik_Dut]

It will like Sega, Konami and EA make a hybrid of PES, FIFA and Ace Striker.

















Never gonna happen, though....

[chob]

in all honesty i think fm is the best and could still improve but with their own new features. Ive got a feeling that the new additions in cm wont work that well

[antonjw]

With regards to training. I read somewhere that you don't have to do the drills every day and you can set your assistant to deal with them.

This is the most obvious. Thing. Ever.

That's not a pop at you evo, but I find myself bewildered by other folks on this thread and the CM Video thread looking for ways to shout down CM's new features.

"Oh my god you're gonna have to do drills and set-pieces to set up every match! You'll never play a game!". Well, no... you will build sets of drills and set pieces and train your players in a selection of them at any one time I would imagine, i.e. have schedules just like you do for training in FM... leaving you to tweak at your leisure, and delve as deeply or otherwise into the feature as it your want.... the suggestion you'd have to sit there and watch your players doing the same routines before each and every match.. is laughable.

For me, the Set Piece Editor, and to a lesser extent (though I can see the benefit of them), Drills, I think go hand in hand with the increased realism provided by a 3d Match Engine. You get into that more realistic territory of really being able to see your team instructions and tactics taking shape and coming alive... and for me the Set Pieces and Drills really complement that ethos and go hand in hand with the step-change in realism offered by a good 3d Match Engine.

To be fair to them, Eidos seem to have really grasped this, and these are ideas that will take Football Management sims forward. I'm glad that they have delayed the release in order to get these features right, because it is all so ambitious that a rushed release would have been a disaster, and could have seen some of these features shot down in flames and never be considered for FM either as a result.


But if they get these features right, or pretty damn close to it, then for me they push the envelope of the Footie Management simulator, and the football game-playing community could have a genre re-defining game-changer on its hands, the likes of the release of Kick Off in 1987, Sensible Soccer, ISS64, Pro Evolution 3, Player Manager, the original Champ Manager, etc. etc...

Some catching up to do for SI; that is if they haven't got something pretty big up their sleeve as it is. It may be that SI can hold their position in the market by ensuring that they have a rock-solid, more realistic, better-looking Match Engine that is perhaps tied in with more understandable tactical controls.

That would be a fairly sizeable leap for FM2010, I feel. Once that is in place, then perhaps SI can try to catch up on the Set Pieces and any other innovative tactical, Match-Engine related features, and take a little time to get it right on top of an already (hopefully) very sound 3d Match Engine.

[bardock]

After reading the training article posted by SFraser I have to say that training in FM isn't that realistic either. It's just harder to grasp once you get used to it you can improve a players pace from 8 to 16. I don't see how that's possible IRL. Sure you can make someone run a little faster but not double their speed unless they were really fat and you slimmed them down or something.

A merger of all 3 would be nice. Like most on here have said graphics from FIFA a couple of idea's from CM and have FM as the spine.

[anthony wright]

Put them all together and it'll be a £30 i won't regret spending

Yes but you realise that if there was no competition it would cost a lot more than £30

[Morgie93]

A merger of all 3 would be nice. Like most on here have said graphics from FIFA a couple of idea's from CM and have FM as the spine.

Yes i agree with that, but it would take a lot of work to merge them all together.

[peter-evo]

Never ever going to happen, just thought it'd be an interesting topic to discuss. The general opinion is clear, wonder whether that will change after the release of CM.

Oh, one more thing I'd take from CM; the Rhyman's league. Would make Dafuge's challenge epic.

[SCIAG]

you can improve a players pace from 8 to 16.

That would probably take at least five years, and I doubt it is really possible at all.

[SFraser]

That would probably take at least five years, and I doubt it is really possible at all.

I was going to say the same thing, but this thread doesn't need me to prove itself full of nonsense.

[peter-evo]

I was going to say the same thing, but this thread doesn't need me to prove itself full of nonsense.

My thread is nonsense

[baker.simon]

My thread is nonsense

Dont take it personally mate

[Stevicus]

Yes but you realise that if there was no competition it would cost a lot more than £30

Would it though?

I would imagine that they could still sell it cheap and make money out of it.

Besides, I don't think they would put out a PC/mac game that would be more expensive than other computer games, when there is clearly no need.

[Brian Shanahan]

Would it though?

I would imagine that they could still sell it cheap and make money out of it.

Besides, I don't think they would put out a PC/mac game that would be more expensive than other computer games, when there is clearly no need.

It would, it always does in a monopoly situation. Also the game would get really bad very soon (over 2 or 3 editions), as there would be no incentive to make it well, or even to patch the mistakes.

[playmaker]

It would, it always does in a monopoly situation. Also the game would get really bad very soon (over 2 or 3 editions), as there would be no incentive to make it well, or even to patch the mistakes.

It wouldn't be a monopoly situation though - it competes against other genres of computer game, not just other football management sims. In fact it competes against a lot of other leisure activities. Correct pricing strategy is far more complex than, "we have no competition, let's whack the price up."

[Brian Shanahan]

It wouldn't be a monopoly situation though - it competes against other genres of computer game, not just other football management sims. In fact it competes against a lot of other leisure activities. Correct pricing strategy is far more complex than, "we have no competition, let's whack the price up."

It wouldn't be completing directly against other games. For example I didn't say when I bought the game "Oh FM09 is out, but wait I've Civ IV and also Fallout 3 on XBox, so I'd better not buy the game, as I've already got some games"

It's a bit like evolution, as cats compete with cats and not swallows (they just eat them), so management sims compete with managemet sims and not RPGS.

[SFraser]

It wouldn't be a monopoly situation though - it competes against other genres of computer game, not just other football management sims. In fact it competes against a lot of other leisure activities. Correct pricing strategy is far more complex than, "we have no competition, let's whack the price up."

Hearts of Iron 3 is due out around August and it is shaping up to be the best strategy title yet from Paradox Interactive, which is saying a lot considering Hearts of Iron 2 and the perennially under-rated yet totally supreme Victoria. Victoria is one of the most incredibly brilliant historical strategy games on the planet, and one of the most perplexingly complex games to boot.

Personally I am not even remotely interested in CM unless to defend FM. I have been around enough and played enough games to know which side my bread is buttered and to know that visuals are no substitute for gameplay.

As a strategy gamer that owns every single one Paradox Interactives games; that spent months of my life on the Europa Barbarorum modification for Rome: Total War and refused to buy Empire: Total War; that spent even more time on Sid Meiers Alpha Centauri and has never played a Civilisation game for more than 10 hours in my life; that considers Dominions 3: The Awakening to be a pure work of art; I have absolutely no interest in a football management game that is not made by SI.

As far as I am concerned Strategy Gaming is defined by the following games:

1. Chess.
2. Anything made by Paradox Interactive.
2. The Dominions Series.
2. Football Manager.
2. Sid Meiers Alpha Centauri.
2. Europa Barbarorum.

In no particular order.

EDIT: You can add Eve Online to that list at number 1.5. I have played no strategy game so simple yet so brilliantly complex on a PC.

[playmaker]

It wouldn't be completing directly against other games. For example I didn't say when I bought the game "Oh FM09 is out, but wait I've Civ IV and also Fallout 3 on XBox, so I'd better not buy the game, as I've already got some games"

Many of us don't have limitless pots of cash or the time to play more than one game, so choosing between the latest Call of Duty: Slight Scuffle in a Pub in Basingstoke and Super-Dooper Footy Game 2010 by EAdoSI (vain attempt to stay on topic!) is a regular occurrence for a significant number of people who buy games.

I have to choose between games in different genres, because I can't get all the games I want and would never get round to playing some of them even if I did have the money.