Difference between watching in 3D, 2D and just text

I've started about 15 games now and played about 4 months in each, but keep giving for a number of reasons (most of them being my tactics being rubbish, or being bored of the team i picked to start with).

However, a worrying trend i've noticed is that i score a heck of a lot more goals when i turn off highlights and just have the text flashing up.

This was highlighted for me when in my most recent game i played 3 months with arsenal, played 17 games and scored only 14 goals watching in 3D...whereas in previous iterations with arsenal i have just watched text (heresy i know) and scored over 2 goals per game average.

Am i just being paranoid? Is the match engine at all affected by how you view a game? Please tell me someone else is possibly seeing something like this?!

I haven't played FM09 enough to have my opinion about this but in 08 i had that feeling a lot of times...

I agree, i am finding the same. When I playing in 3D im scoring a lot less goals then when im not. I love watching the 3D games so Ill have to live with it.

I've noticed the same thing myself.

Im playing with Man Utd so not hard to win games.I watched in 3d with extended highlights up until Christmas and altough I was winning most games it was always 2-0,2-1 etc.

I then switched to just commentary and started hammering teams including 3-0 at Anfield,7-0 against both Hull and Stoke.

Not sure if it is just coincidence but I havent watched highlights since and I havent lost a game.

Maybe someone like Cleon,Rashidi or wwfan can comment on this.

i've now decided there is a definite link (although that it is course opinion and not fact;))

however, my new tried and trusted technique if i'm watching the highlights and drawing after 60 mins is to switch to text only and invariably i will score in the last half hour:)

surely this has to be conincidence? something so stupid cant possibly be affecting results please?!

I'll try it. I've just won the treble with Arsenal but I've hardly scored more than 3 in a game..

I was losing 1-0 at half time to Lazio earlier on today with Inter, read this topic, changed to text commentary and ended up winning 3-1. It was also the first time that season my side had scored more than 2 a game

I was losing 1-0 at half time to Lazio earlier on today with Inter, read this topic, changed to text commentary and ended up winning 3-1. It was also the first time that season my side had scored more than 2 a game

my pleasure:)

now that i know a few others are experiencing this i'm going text all the way!

So the tactic is to watch the text until you go 1-0 up, then switch to 3D!

So the tactic is to watch the text until you go 1-0 up, then switch to 3D!

definitely... text for goals (but opposition seem to score more too), 3D for clean sheets

You are all nuts, but hey whatever floats your boat

If you honestly want to test it take control of two sides, set up a friendly and just replay the match with same team talk at beginning and same tactics. Not exact but 10 or so in each and a look at the match stats should give you the answer.

You are all nuts, but hey whatever floats your boat

If you honestly want to test it take control of two sides, set up a friendly and just replay the match with same team talk at beginning and same tactics. Not exact but 10 or so in each and a look at the match stats should give you the answer.

come on, give me some credit! all my tactics are rubbish, at least give me credit for finding a way to score more goals... watching in text only!

come on, give me some credit! all my tactics are rubbish, at least give me credit for finding a way to score more goals... watching in text only!

I guess all that matters is what you think is happening. No different to me believing I have a decent idea of what the sliders do, believing that tweaking different things are having a given effect when in fact I am seeing effects that just aren't happening

I guess all that matters is what you think is happening. No different to me believing I have a decent idea of what the sliders do, believing that tweaking different things are having a given effect when in fact I am seeing effects that just aren't happening

sliders do nowt... the real tactical nous is deciding exactly what minute to switch from 3D view to text:D

I think it's just coincidence.. even though experience proves otherwise :x

I don`t think it is coincidence...........I played first 10 games of premier league using 3d then saved the game and played the exact same games using just text commentary...........I won 2 more games using text commentary and scored more goals aswell.......hmmmmmmm

ps. I am playing as West Ham

This point as i understand comes up year after year with literally every single version of FM since it switched from text only.

And from memory every single year SI categorically state that its a pure myth. There are FM fanatics whove tested everything in previous versions to destruction and theyve never suddenly announced that theyve discovered this quirk which other people report, if it were there those FM fanatics would have found it by now IMO.

One theory i have to explain it is just good old human nature. Watching in text mode, people (i know i do the few times ive bothered with text mode) tend to not fiddle with everything as much as there is no representation of what is actually happening, just some vague commentary.

As a result its safe to assume that your players will tend to settle into the tactic youve set quicker and score more but that also you wont spot what the AI is doing and hence let in more goals also.

In 2D (or 3D) mode people (again i know i do) tend to fiddle every time something happens they arent happy with, if you see a replay where the opp striker gets a free run at goal with ease chances are you will go straight to tactics and tweak away thus unsettling the rhythm of the game and the overall flow of your team but also cutting down the AIs chances against you (assuming you do your tweaking correctly)

If you really believe this (and many have before you and still do) do a test, run ten games in text mode with no tactics tweaking at all.

Then run same 10 games in 2d or 3d mode again with no tweaking at all and check the results. Personally i think its a myth...

Oh, yeah!!

3D & 2D "works" very BAD - most popular scores 1-0, 2-0, 1-1 - scored 1.5 goals per game average.

I'm disable 3D and choose "Only commentary" - now... most popular scores 3-0, 4-0 - scored over 2.3 goals per game average )

Just try "Only commentary" options.

PS I'm play for MU

Maybe it is different.

But have you ever thought you were using 3d at the start of the season when your team is rusty and text later in the season when your players know your tactic inside out and have Geled completly?

You really think PaulC is going through thre trouble of writing three different match engines for the three different view modes?

The match result is determined the minute you click 'play' (and until you change tactics after which the results using updated tactics have been determined), the dice have been rolled, the end result is set. Changing view mode does not (in my experience) cause the match result to be recalculated.

From a software engineering point of view the view has (and should have) nothing to do with the match engine.

Well, can not say agree. I play 3D, key highlight only at the beginning, and of course, couldn't find an effective tatic so after 9 games, could score only 10 goals. After that, I created 4312, then now, I have been played 40 matches, scored 76 goals (u must remember first 9 games I scored 10). My ratio now GS : 1.9, GC : 0.7 . These included (I am playing R.Madrid)

R.M - Roma : 5-3

Roma - Real : 3-1

R.M - Bara : 3-3

A.Madrid - R.M : 0-2

Villareal(2nd at the time I played against them) - R.M : 0-3

R.M - Arsenal : 3-0 (Heinze got red card at 11th min)

Barca - R.M (S/Cup) : 4-2

R.M - Barca (Spanish cup) : 4-0

Sevilla - R.M : 2-3

Of course I have some ending 0-0 or 1-1, lost 4 matches so far.

I recommend if you play 3D, choose extend mode, keep an eye on where u control the ball, where not. Also it's right suggestion from assit manager about the gap between D, M, F. Before I had them, but now I dont have them any more. Some time, if assit manager says : The gap between our M and F too far big, our opponent keep the ball there (or sthing like that), I tweaked individual mentality then it disappeared, also my possesion increased.

That's my opinion.

Maybe it is different.

But have you ever thought you were using 3d at the start of the season when your team is rusty and text later in the season when your players know your tactic inside out and have Geled completly?

I'm restart current season from 1st game and disabled 3d&2d.

PS Some later I'm submit screenshots.

I'm restart current season from 1st game and disabled 3d&2d.

PS Some later I'm submit screenshots.

That's fair enough but how do you know these games would not finish the same way if you watched it 3d.

The answer is you will never know it's just something in people's head because you are giving 3 ways to view a match.

I'm restart current season from 1st game and disabled 3d&2d.

PS Some later I'm submit screenshots.

Doing a season is irrelevant as too many variables involved.

If you honestly want to test it take control of two sides, set up a friendly and just replay the match with same team talk at beginning and same tactics (or load up your current save and take control of the team you are next scheduled to play). Not exact but 10 or so in each and a look at the match stats should give you the answer. In fact just look at the first 45 minutes to remove the impact of half time team talks. Even then you still have the effect of player morale/motivation changing within the match which is out of your control.

I was bottom of the league with Villa after 6 games with only 2 pts using 3D. Im now gone back to 2D and won my first game at home to Liverpool 4-3 after being 0-2 down at h/t. I noticed while using 3D that my team was hardly having shots on goal using highlights but the opposition even some mediocre teams (inter-toto) had more goal attempts ?

I was bottom of the league with Villa after 6 games with only 2 pts using 3D. Im now gone back to 2D and won my first game at home to Liverpool 4-3 after being 0-2 down at h/t. I noticed while using 3D that my team was hardly having shots on goal using highlights but the opposition even some mediocre teams (inter-toto) had more goal attempts ?

As i said above how do you know it wouldn't have turned around the same if you were still using 3d?

There is no way anyone knows if it makes a difference because you can't watch the same match with all 3 highlights options.

I am using 3d and am scoring goals and defending well at the same time it all comes down to teams getting used to tactics.

It is a myth, like the chap said previously they could not spend time writing 3 match engines.

There is the underlying match engine code (which determines the result of the match), and three views (or representations) of that code, these obviously being:

1. Text

2. 2d

3. 3d

Whether someone has more success in one view or the other means either

A) They may make better tactical judgements when watching in one particular view.

B) It's just coincidental that your change in form has occured at the same time when you have also changed views.

C) They suffer from confirmation bias i.e they interpret information in a way that confirms their preconceptions.

It's all coming from the same engine!

I have always believed that limiting the match view options in all versions of FM has a significant effect on results. I only ever watch key action at the most. I play online with a friend and he seems to have worse results than me. Might be nothing.

its a complete myth text = 2d = 3d

The fact that the game works out the result before the game even kicks off ( and only tactical changes/substitution trigger a recalculation ) further disproves your theory

No matter how you view the game, it will always be the same result.

No matter how you view the game, it will always be the same result.

I remember in EHM when you "coached" the game you'd score much more goals then when you just saw the result with your head coach in charge.

This could be the same in FM.

On another note, what about holidaying a game ticking : use formation and use tactic? Would the result be the same, IF you would make the same substitution as the ass man did?

whats all this tosh about the game deciding the result before it kicks off?

what a complete load of rubbish.

that would mean no amount of in-match tweaking or subs would change the game.

whats all this tosh about the game deciding the result before it kicks off?

what a complete load of rubbish.

that would mean no amount of in-match tweaking or subs would change the game.

you could try reading ?

The result is decided before kick off, and then recalculated every time you tweak/change formation or make a substitution

you could try reading ?

The result is decided before kick off, and then recalculated every time you tweak/change formation or make a substitution

is that fact quoted from a programmer on the game? or is it a favoured opinion/assumption?

is that fact quoted from a programmer on the game? or is it a favoured opinion/assumption?

IIRC its confirmed by the devs, programmes runs the match before we play, and then we see the visual representation of the cpu's calculations, however everytime any sort of tactical change or substitution is made then the game recalculates the match based on these changes

IIRC its confirmed by the devs, programmes runs the match before we play, and then we see the visual representation of the cpu's calculations, however everytime any sort of tactical change or substitution is made then the game recalculates the match based on these changes

oh well, i'm sticking with the text for now:D

for the first time ever i've played until october with arsenal and i've won all my competitive games: P11 W11 F32 A2.

Never come close to those standards in 3D (and i'm using IDENTICAL tactic to a previous season, although a few different players;))... although i obviously appreciate that the few different players are likely to have signficiantly contributed to my greater success now.

has anyone had a high scoring game from 3D mode?

oh well, i'm sticking with the text for now:D

for the first time ever i've played until october with arsenal and i've won all my competitive games: P11 W11 F32 A2.

Never come close to those standards in 3D (and i'm using IDENTICAL tactic to a previous season, although a few different players;))... although i obviously appreciate that the few different players are likely to have signficiantly contributed to my greater success now.

And the fact your 1 season further in, players bedded down and used to your tactics... etc etc

Seriously the devs have stated MANY TIMES In past versions that this perception of multiple engines is totally false, but hey if you dont want to believe them thats cool.

I remember in EHM when you "coached" the game you'd score much more goals then when you just saw the result with your head coach in charge.

This could be the same in FM.

On another note, what about holidaying a game ticking : use formation and use tactic? Would the result be the same, IF you would make the same substitution as the ass man did?

It doesn't happen on FM, the result will be the same regardless of how you view it. That is a fact:thup:

That is a fact:thup:

And yet weirdly it doesnt stop people believing it. Even when SI folks tell them otherwise... gues people ultimately believe what makes them feel better

This debate happens every year and every year either Miles, Marc or PaulC writes a long post explaining what the match engine does and why the views have no effect whatsoever, but every year people argue with the devs and then it gets quiet for a couple of months until the next release.

For people who worry... Don't. These are facts:

1) The view does not have any effect whatsoever on the match engine.

2) The match is calculated at the moment you click 'play' and whenever you confirm tactic changes. What does this mean for you? Nothing. Just play the game, have fun and don't worry about it.

Im not trying to add fuel to the already raging fire and i also think this nonsense that the views change match results but erm...iv had a 10 game winning streak with scores like 3-1, 4-2, 2-0, 3-0 with text and 2D view. I know the view has nothing to do with the engine but its kinda got me more wins. But hay im not complaining cos i love 3D view and will probably stay in it so i dont really care anymore:D

on a separate yet vaguely linked note... does anyone agree that the long pause during the setting up of a 3D match has to go down as one of the most irritating things in a game in recent years (or is my 2 year old PC just past it in terms of processing power?!)

Forget switching to text mode for better results. Get a good assistant manager and go on a holiday. It works wonders for your team!