This game is damn hard....

....and I love it

It's so nice to see a major mainstream developer not just not dumbing down their game, but, if anything, adding more complexity and difficulty to it. Yes, the tactical system is pretty opaque at times, and I'm sure I'll be starting on FM '10 long before I've gotten anywhere near a decent understanding of how to play '09 well. Yes, I'm sure I'll go on 20 game loosing streaks while desperately trying to find out whats wrong. Yes, I'll be screaming in frustration at the game on many occasions. Yes, its damn hard, but, to me, thats a damn good thing. Why? Two reasons, firetly, longevity. Being able to look at how I'm playing and think how much better I could be makes me want to play more. Secondly, the sense of achievement. The harder something is, the better it feels when you suceed. I'd rather spend a month of sheer frustration followed by that glorious moment when it finally clicks, then be able to win the Premiership with Stoke on my first try.

Games these days are being horribly simplified - I'm a big fan of MMORPGs, but since World of Borecraft, everything is so tediously simple and aimed at the lowest common denomiator of the instant gratification crowd that they're no longer fun. RTS games are the same - compare RA3 to the original C&C for example. A lobotomised monkey could complete the campaign of the former, while I've still never managed some of the later NOD missions in C&C. So it's great to see SI standing up for those of us who like their games to be a real chalenge.

It's true, I find this game harder than the '08 one. Haven't found the right tactic yet, but well, there's time for that...

The new features are grand, but the one thing I wanted from 09 is for my tactics that worked well in 08 to be obsolete.

Having to go back to the drawing board is worth every penny of the £30 or so I paid for the game

Found season one really difficult. Signed loads of players and I was getting inconsistant results.

Second season things have settled down. Tweaked my tactics and I'm making more use of the player confidence etc widgets in game, only signed a few additions to the teams and its going much better.

I saw my first game on the demo and with standard tactics my team was just running around like headless chickens. Of course i was frustrated and the last thing i wanna do is mess around with tactics for hours, as i come from the German approach to football manager which is more chairman oriented. But it is a challenge and as it was said before that is something you dont find often in computer games these days. So the frustration immeditaley changed into the strong desire to get FM. Should arrive this week...

yes gota agree it rock but its that that makes me like it even more,having to tweak tactics here and there all time something ive never really done.on my man city game at moment only got 1 point in 7 games rock bottom only bought 1 young brazilian aswell kerrison.but love it for some silly reason:thup::p

4 tactics ther was a thread on it and they said 4-3-2-1 was good.

loads of ppl tryed it and it seemed 2 work!!

I dunno I think its fairly easy just won a minor priemership in my first season with Wellington Pheonix. Signed 2 players, and played 4-4-2 all season. I lost a few games, I was embarressed in a few games, but ultimately I wom most.

This version seems to be all about picking a system and getting the right players into the roles within that system. I lost games I should have won because I had the wrong players in certain roles. Once I realised this and tweaked the roles to suit the player or switched the player to another player (who suited the role better) I started to win.

yeah I agree, my first season with Rangers I won 3 lost 2 and drew 3. I was 11 points off the pace and I got a 4-4-2 formation which worked and I won the league on goal difference. Will try it on another team once I have had a good few season doing this one. I refuse to play with 1 striker, I can never bring myself to do it.

in the demo the forward and backward arrows are there but no cutting inside to left or right is available ! is this just for the demo ? my tactic in fm08 is one or two wingers cutting inside behind the two strikers in a 442, i use attacking mid playmakers instead of traditional wingers but it seems i wont be able to do this in 09. ive tried just giving the same instructions to the wide players and team tactics - but just having forward arrows and ive played 5 games like this and it isnt what i want, matius fernandez and arshavin are playing far too wide and not cutting inside often enough . . . . please help and sorry if this is not the right topic !

thanks

Difficulty:

I don't know. I haven't found it particularly hard yet, but then I am playing as Arsenal at the moment. Pushing United hard in the league and in the semis of both real cups, after winning the mickey mouse cup. Then again Arsenal IS easy mode...

Wingers inside arrows:

Yes rob, this is the wrong thread for it. It's been discussed to death. That arrow meant they played wide when defending but as AMC's when attacking, which just wasn't realistic. Tweak your tactics to get them playing how you want, or compromise and just have them central with high creative freedom and/or free roles?

in the demo the forward and backward arrows are there but no cutting inside to left or right is available ! is this just for the demo ? my tactic in fm08 is one or two wingers cutting inside behind the two strikers in a 442, i use attacking mid playmakers instead of traditional wingers but it seems i wont be able to do this in 09. ive tried just giving the same instructions to the wide players and team tactics - but just having forward arrows and ive played 5 games like this and it isnt what i want, matius fernandez and arshavin are playing far too wide and not cutting inside often enough . . . . please help and sorry if this is not the right topic !

thanks

The arrows no longer exist in FM09. They only show forward runs ie often/mixed/rarely. To get your wingers to cut inside regularly is beyond my knowledge but if you look in the tactics forum, they have a very interesting tactics bible which will help you no end I am sure.

in the demo the forward and backward arrows are there but no cutting inside to left or right is available ! is this just for the demo ? my tactic in fm08 is one or two wingers cutting inside behind the two strikers in a 442, i use attacking mid playmakers instead of traditional wingers but it seems i wont be able to do this in 09. ive tried just giving the same instructions to the wide players and team tactics - but just having forward arrows and ive played 5 games like this and it isnt what i want, matius fernandez and arshavin are playing far too wide and not cutting inside often enough . . . . please help and sorry if this is not the right topic !

thanks

Well, it's not the right topic really, nor is it the right forum but I'll throw out a few things I've picked up so far from the game and the forums.

Firstly, the arrows in FM09 aren't the same as in 08 and earlier. They don't tell the player to move to the position. Instead, they're just a visual representation of the forward runs slider.

Secondly, the arrows in 08 never really allowed your players to "cut in", at least in the sense of picking up the ball wide, then coming inside with it. Instead, they meant that when the opposition had the ball they were wide players, but the moment your team picked it up, they moved inside, ignoring everything going on until they reached the new position. SIlly, and the reason they were cut.

To make wide players cut inside, here's a few setting that should help: Narrow Width, Rarely Crossing, playing "wrong footed" wingers (ie left footer on the right side), Creative Freedom and Free Roles. Also try PPMs.

yh its well hard.. i didnt fink being charlton would be a walk over but to be honest thought id do better!!! its better being harder!!! any1 been charlton?

Yes, so far its definately harder than 08, but on the other side this game has followed a somewhat similar route atleast since 05. So everybode kind of getting into it faster when a new game comes out, not so this time.

I play a favourite in coca-cola ligue 1 and im definately struggling more in 09 than earlier versions. But this game feel better, more real than earlier, except for training that doesnt work at all for me.

Did a treble with barcelona in the first season.

My match record in the leagues was 0 losses, 1 draw and the rest were wins.

So it isn't THAT hard I think.

Whilst I am trying to enjoy the full game I am find it frustrating. As a premier side I am struggling against all the teams I play. Agree a lot harder them FM08. It reminds me of a strategy game were each game you play is like a mission in that you have to set your tactics/strategy/plan right to win the mission/game. So I think it is a lot deeper then previous iterations.

No bugs as such to blame as long as you follow reasonably sensible stuff on player training and so on, it's just that it's hard to get the players playing a decent game.

I even downloaded WWFAN & his colleagues 50 page "pdf" file on how to play FM09 but it really is a hard slog. Not as instantly enjoyable as it seems you have to tweak so many things to get players who would normally play their natural game to play half way decent.

Perserverance and cheating I think will be my preferred play..---only joking re the cheating but I am reloading to see what tactics actually work with what tweaks.

I am using various tactics as recommended by the T&T forum boys but not with any great success. I do notice however that my ass man's feedback tells me some players finding it hard to motivate themselves playing for me!!! That could have an impact on the performance of the team..e.g. they think I am too inexperienced to be managing a premier team.

K:)

Did a treble with barcelona in the first season.

My match record in the leagues was 0 losses, 1 draw and the rest were wins.

So it isn't THAT hard I think.

The lobotomised monkey I mentionned could probably win with the players Barca have

Try taking over a team in, say, the Championship in England. For me at least, even the bottom end teams weren't that hard to get promoted in the past, but it seems much harder this time round.

'Course, for some people, it probably just clicks straight away, while the rest of us have to spend ages working it all out

Yep that's the link to get the file as well. A very good deep read.

I would very much suggest looking at this thread - http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=61144

It won't help you create a 'super' tactic, but it'll certainly help you understand tactics and make it easier for you to make your players play how you want them to play.

Yeah, I've read that, taken much of it on board, made some improved tactics, and yet I'm still soooooo far away from understanding the intricacies of the game. And I love it. That I can read 50 odd pages of incredible information and still have so much more to learn. This is a real game, not the mindless trash that most big developers make these days

Strange I found the game a bit easier so far. The assistant's feedback and the players' confidence level has been great help to me atm

My first save was with Man Utd and i thought that was way to easy.. played until christmas and didnt lose a game... I got bored of that so i started with St.Patrick's in the Irish league and now it's very hard and fun..

Still trying to find some way to win the league beginning my 3rd season, very hard to get decent players to play for me even though i can afford them.

I really like that challange, it makes me more addicted to the game then ever.

sum of u think your great managers wen ur teams like barca and man u n u get a lil bit of succes but uv got it made for you there! try a challenge! well played to all you players who like challenges!

sum of u think your great managers wen ur teams like barca and man u n u get a lil bit of succes but uv got it made for you there! try a challenge! well played to all you players who like challenges!

Some of us think we're great linguists when we type out whole words.

Text speak isn't allowed on these forums.

And as for playing with big clubs, are those of us who support a bug team supposed to shun them in our first game of FM09 in favour of a "challenge"? Surely outdoing the likes of Fergie and Wenger is an equal challenge?