FM09 - Really The Holy Grail?

I have had a go at the demo, and all I can say is that it simply hasn't convinced me to shell out for it. As a hardcore CM/FM player from the first release in the 90s, I have been satisfied with the improvements in the game year on year. FM08 did really well with a good 2D match engine.

So, now 09 is here and I am left feeling a little flat actually. Firstly, the 3D engine is not so great, but it is okay. Maybe if they had put in the stadiums for each club in the background to up the authentic feel it would make it worthwhile. Hope this can be done. Then there is the much-vaunted "interactive" side of the game, with the press conferences you can now attend. Ho hum...it's all the same questions and outcomes, only worded differently. The game picks up on your answers and gives the same feedback as 08, but the grammar is tweaked to fool us. Come on Miles Jacobson, you really can't squeeze that by us. As for the tactics, it had better be a bug in 09 or else it really sux. The tactics are limited, players can only run straight up and down, and the winders can't have their runs stretched to the byline. Is this to accommodate the 3d engine perhaps?

As for Assistant Manager feedback, it simply isn't where I expected it to be. Sorry SI, but I think you have bowled us a googly here. I am not convinced that this game has taken a massive step forwards. I should know, I own every single copy of Champ Man/FM ever made by you. I will give the demo another go, and try and remain objective, but for now I feel disappointed - for the first time ever on a release of this excellent game btw.

Those FM gamers out there who haven't progressed beyond 07 yet, you may well enjoy the step up to 09, but I think a lot of 08 players are going to be left feeling a bit empty, especially after all the hype and excitement. I just don't feel this version has made the giant strides expected of it, and so I am left feeling a bit disappointed. A bit like french kissing your granny, I suspect!

I agree with a fair bit of what you said, but the assistant manager info on match days is brilliant- its pretty much what ive always needed. I can now play a half, look at his feedback and try and rectify what is going wrong. From the demo game, this might be the first version where I can actually build my own tactics sucessfully.

however, the shoddy stadium thing really bugs me, wish they hadnt even bothered as it detracts far more than it adds.

There's info in the tactics forum about the new tactics thingo.

I think it'll just take a bit of getting used to, maybe make us think more about our tactics. The AIs use of arrows in 08 was starting to annoy me anyway.

A bit like french kissing your granny, I suspect!

And please don't make anyone think about that ever again.

I'll agree that the press conferences are a pointless aspect of the game, albeit clamoured for by the kind of people who would see SI start fannying about with cosmetic irrelevancies such as stadiums and crowds.

I'm not sure that the conferences have much effect on the team, although I am not watching that closely since I keep restarting the demo in order to escape wounded teams. A patched demo would have been nice, it might eliminate one of the two major issues with the game, the other being hardware compatibility. (Which is far from SI's fault)

I disagree on the tactics module tho, SI have explained the arrows over and over again, and on the whole the movement both on and off the ball seems better like this. The previous arrows were just unrealistic.

You mention the 3D engine. I like the engine and accept that the 3D graphics are good enough for a first incarnation. Are you griping about the actual engine or about the graphics. I ask 'cos many of the people complaining avbout the graphics are of the ilk that would expect FIFA or PES graphics in FM. Firstly you'd be looking at about a 7GB install, and half the hardware used to run the graphically light FM would simply not cope. FIFA runs well on current hardware because all it consists of is graphics and ridiculously repetitive preordained animations. Same for PES although that always been graphically ugly regardless.

As far as I'm concerned the AM feedback has improved. Perhaps you could share your lofty expectations that we might all understand your disappointment with it.

I think FM09 will be amazing when its patched, probaly be better if you are running it on a top end PC also.

its the holy grail of footie manager games yes mate have you tried cm or fifa lately,yes fm as its problems but the other 2 have more

I didn't enjoy 08 but I love 09...so there goes your theory

I'm enjoying the demo a lot, but I had to give a little bit of time. I was very frustrated with the tactical side of the game, but I'm starting to get a feel for it now. It's much more fun when you're doing well I think this years game is a big step forward and I can't wait for the full game. I was disappointed with FM08 as the boxed version and both patches had bugs that ruined the enjoyment for me, especially on games lasting many season. I have played the demo every day since release and except for some minor annoyances I have not noticed a single bug so far. The bug with injuries is odd, because everyone seems to get it except me. I've started four different games and never had more than 3-4 first teamers out, and rarely gotten players injured for more than a month.

I agree about the press conferences though. It's too repetitive and it quickly becomes a boring chore. I also get the impression that leaving it to the assistant has a bad effect on performance.

Well Delmeister, you've clearly lied to us all in your post. You claimed to own every single copy of CM/FM ever made, but I know for a fact that there is a copy of FM08 on my shelf that belongs to me.

As for the Holy Grail, well that all depends on your point of view. What one man claims is the Holy Grail is just a cup to somebody else. Never really cared for religion myself, and I'm certainly not going to elevate a game to that status.

I think some of you are being a little over critical, the 3d is fantastic. I know it may not be perfect but come on it's totally revolutionised the games future and i really understand my tactics more because of it.

That's just my view.

What I think is that it's a bit silly when people call themselves 'hardcore fans' and then actually doubt following the game for longer after a little test on the demo.

If you're doubting anything, I don't quite think you're 'hardcore'.

What I think is that it's a bit silly when people call themselves 'hardcore fans' and then actually doubt following the game for longer after a little test on the demo.

If you're doubting anything, I don't quite think you're 'hardcore'.

The 'Hardcore' will be the chaps posting with evidence and information in the bugs forum rather than simply ranting in here and not contributing in any meaningful way.

GQ such a toilet these last few years. Nothing but trolling by people who have lots of complaints and little discussion or evidence to offer.

The more I played the FM09 Demo , the more I enjoyed playing it . The only issues for me are :

1)The fact that under 18s are INE to play for the academy , even though the rules state you can have 3 players max over the ague of 18.

Thanks for the feedback guys. Look, let me just say this, I had been following the build up to 09 closely like any other FM lover, and I just think its been over hyped. The 3D engine is nice because it is fun to watch your team run around in their colours, but the movement is all too predictable. Anyone ever play that rubbish manager game with Sir Bobby Robson on the cover? They had pretty good 3D but it was predictable. The press conferences still suck, and the tactics haven't sold me yet. I am now into my fourth run with the demo, and although I am enjoying it, I am still not blown away, and that is what annoys me. SI have hyped this game up a bit too much, but I guess that's the commercial world for you. As for those of you who won't see any wrong ever, don't reply to this post about how I am just whinging and I should rather contribute by looking at bugs and such like. A hardcore fan isn't someone who spends his time reporting on bugs, a hardcore fan is someone who plays the game non-stop because they enjoy it and believe in it. This is a general discussion forum, and I am voicing my opinion on my gaming experience. I couldn't care less about technical issues, because I trust SI to fix those for us as they have always attempted to do. I just don't think that this version is a massive leap ahead in the genre. And don't throw FIFA and CM at me either, because I don't bother with those boring games at all. I have always stuck to the Collyer brothers' version because it is easily the best (wonder what they're doing now). So, in a nutshell, 3 demo games completed, into my fourth go and still my mouth isn't quite watering at spending many hours playing this version. So what's wrong with being disappointed?

Only stuff that really bothers me :

My left back for copenhagen who havent scored a goal for 4 years is my topscorer

Way too many long range goals

Way too little goal when 1 and 1 with the keeper.

Of course also the injuries but that should be fixed with the patch.

I have had a go at the demo, and all I can say is that it simply hasn't convinced me to shell out for it. As a hardcore CM/FM player from the first release in the 90s, I have been satisfied with the improvements in the game year on year. FM08 did really well with a good 2D match engine.

When I first played the demo I felt the same, but after a few games started to enjoy it a lot more. I genuinely feel that FM has taken a big step forward this time round with the first steps into 3D

So, now 09 is here and I am left feeling a little flat actually. Firstly, the 3D engine is not so great, but it is okay. Maybe if they had put in the stadiums for each club in the background to up the authentic feel it would make it worthwhile. Hope this can be done.

I agree that when you fist see the 3D it doesn't really blow you away. However, once I found my favoured view (sensible soccer style for me) and started watching the 3D I realised just how good it was for tweaking your tactics until the team were actually doing what you wanted them to. On top of that I've already seen some fantastic bits of play being shown as well as some excellent goals being scored. On the flip side I've also seen some dodgy things happening in the 3D, and the lack of crowds and stuff like that can make it feel a little unfinished. However, for a first step I feel it's very good and I'm confident it will get better and better over the nextcouple of years.

Then there is the much-vaunted "interactive" side of the game, with the press conferences you can now attend. Ho hum...it's all the same questions and outcomes, only worded differently. The game picks up on your answers and gives the same feedback as 08, but the grammar is tweaked to fool us. Come on Miles Jacobson, you really can't squeeze that by us.

I love the new press conference feature. I was always one of those people who had imaginary press conferences in my head before big games so I like the fact that the media interaction has been expanded on in this way. I've also noticed that what you say does have an effect on your players, but I'm also glad to see that this effect is not too exagerated all the time. I also love the fact that you can just send your assistant to these if you're not interested in doing them yourself.

As for the tactics, it had better be a bug in 09 or else it really sux. The tactics are limited, players can only run straight up and down, and the winders can't have their runs stretched to the byline. Is this to accommodate the 3d engine perhaps?

So far I've struggled a little with tactics in the demo, particularly to get players to get into the box and not just shot from distance constantly. but the more I watch the game in extended highlights using the 3D, the more I feel that the user has much more of a grip on the tactical side of the game this time round. It no longer feels like trial and error, I can actually see my instructions being carried out a lot better in the game now. And I have to say that I'm having no problems getting my wingers to the byline, in fact this is one of the things I found satisfyingly easy to make happen.

As always when a new version is released it takes a while to get used to tactics. However, I think the removeal of the crazy arrows will be a good thing. Players now need to pay attention to width, mentality and creative freedom a lot more, but it makes for much more realistic things happening on the screen, and much more realistic tactics being successful.

As for Assistant Manager feedback, it simply isn't where I expected it to be. Sorry SI, but I think you have bowled us a googly here.

I'm a little confused about this bit. Where would you have rather have seen this?

As someone who constantly asked for this type of feature throughout FM08 I'm very pleased to see its inclusion. I also can't think of a better place to put it, surly having it during the match is the only place to have it. That way you can look at tactical feedback on the fly and make adjustments as you go. When watching a full match to try and perfetc your tactics it's very useful to have the feedback as you go.

I am not convinced that this game has taken a massive step forwards. I should know, I own every single copy of Champ Man/FM ever made by you. I will give the demo another go, and try and remain objective, but for now I feel disappointed - for the first time ever on a release of this excellent game btw.

Those FM gamers out there who haven't progressed beyond 07 yet, you may well enjoy the step up to 09, but I think a lot of 08 players are going to be left feeling a bit empty, especially after all the hype and excitement. I just don't feel this version has made the giant strides expected of it, and so I am left feeling a bit disappointed. A bit like french kissing your granny, I suspect!

I disagree, I feel that this is a big step in the right direction for FM. My only two concerns with the game at the moment are how slowly it runs on my PC compared to '08 and the fact that as of yet I haven't really been able to make a successful tactic that doesn't involve my players scoring every goal from outside the box.

The first of those issues is smply down to the fact that my PC's 4 years old and needs an upgrade, so I can accept that. It would have been nice, however, if SI had allowed those with older PC's to just use the 2D engine with no great loss in performance.

The second issue is just down to the fact that I haven't got used to the tactics in '09 yet.

OP: I feel like this every year, but every year I buy it and within a month I've forgotten all about the old version. If I wasn't on the forums half my day I wouldn't even have noticed a lot of the minor bugs (one-on-ones, which isn't a problem for me strangely, and the crossing problem for two egs).

I'm not blown away by the demo, but then I've been restricted to two or three hours every couple of days. Looking forward to work settling down so I can have a proper go at it.