This game is so flawed, it's impossible to create a tactic

First of all let me get this out of the way. This thread is not a moan at SI, it's a constructive thread about the flaws of the demo game and match engine and how it is unplayable. Often SI/Mods see something which is constructive and turn it to something deconstructive.

This has nothing to do with anyones tactic either. At first I thought it was my tactic but after going through the threads in tactics forum and following the simple rules of 2/3 notches between each unit and making simple tactics/instructions I have come to the conclusion it has nothing to do with the tactics at all.

The fact is, the match engine is full of holes, bugs and settings that don't work, making the simple tasks such crossing, passing, creative freedom etc impossible to master.

The theories in the tactics forum all follow a logical system. In theory it does work, and in practise, it should do also.

But why does the theory on paper work but not in practise? Well it's the bugs and poor programing of the match engine.

Starting at the back with keepers

After noticing my keeper keep kicking the ball toward the strikers and the ball bounces or gets intercepted to the other keeper. I set it so he distributes it to the MC, He doesn't. I thought maybe he has no creativity. So I give it a bit more creative freedom. He does the same. I change it so he only passes to the defenders, giving the keeper short passes. He still doesn't obey me and still kicks it straight to the other keeper.

OK I leave that, it's not that important.

Defenders

I noticed while playing weaker teams, their defenders have very good interception. So I give my MCs higher creative freedom, through ball often (TB). That doesn't work. Give my strikers run forward often so they can use their off the ball ability to find space so the MC can give them a ball. That doesn't work. I give MC's direct passing, TB. That doesn't work. I give MC mix passing, TB, Long passing, TB. That doesn't work.

Midfielders

I cannot get wingers to cross the ball, instead they pass to the full backs or to MC. I put cross the ball often it doesn't work. I give them cross from byline it doesn't work. Give them through ball - often, that doesn't work. Give them direct passing, CB and TB, that doesn't work.

No mater what I change, how much I change or what I tweak, nothing works.

This is because the match engine is seriously flawed, poorly programed and full of holes. You can't make wingers cross because there is a bug which stops them from crossing, and instead makes them pass the ball.

You can't create many chances in the last third of the pitch because defenders have a high interception rate.

Keepers cannot pass to wingers, MC or defenders because there is a bug which makes them kick to towards the other keeper.

The demo is basically pointless, making a tactic that may look like it's working now in the demo game won't in the real game with patch because the settings, programing will all have been changed.

SI this is why there is so much moaning in the forums because you give us a poorly developed game and we test the game for you, work out what works, what doesn't.

Edit: forgot to add the standing still bug where players stand still also makes tactics making hard as they stand still instead of passing, crossing, shooting.

This game is so flawed, it's impossible to create a tactic[/Quote]

No it's not.

I have created a couple of tactics that work well, and produce more realistic football (stats wise) than previous versions of FM.

Starting at the back with keepers

After noticing my keeper keep kicking the ball toward the strikers and the ball bounces or gets intercepted to the other keeper. I set it so he distributes it to the MC, He doesn't. I thought maybe he has no creativity. So I give it a bit more creative freedom. He does the same. I change it so he only passes to the defenders, giving the keeper short passes. He still doesn't obey me and still kicks it straight to the other keeper.

OK I leave that, it's not that important.

If he is not doing as you say then you need to give him less creative freedom not more.

Defenders

I noticed while playing weaker teams, their defenders have very good interception. So I give my MCs higher creative freedom, through ball often (TB). That doesn't work. Give my strikers run forward often so they can use their off the ball ability to find space so the MC can give them a ball. That doesn't work. I give MC's direct passing, TB. That doesn't work. I give MC mix passing, TB, Long passing, TB. That doesn't work.

Try short passing and "run onto ball", it works for me.

As for the midfielders I haven't played enough games to give it a really good suss, but I haven't had any trouble yet. I'm using very similar tactics to what I have used for the last few versions and everything looks fine, winning most of my games with the old tactics. Sure they need to be tweaked every year but I'll look into that a bit more when I start playing the proper version.

Are you guys watching the game in full match?

The bugs are there

Dangerous freekick --> Pass it back to defender

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=58142

Cross from deep

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=58054

Goalkeeper distribution does not work

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=58780

Anyway I forgot to mention the way players stand still, also stops the flow of games and gives the opponent an advantage. Even if you up the temp, he still stands there and think.

And I had keeper on low creative freedom, I give it a bit more thinking that may help.

You can't just come out and post a thread saying the match engine is buggy, flawed, and what not... if you say something like that you'll get pretty fierce criticism.

This is because the match engine is seriously flawed, poorly programed and full of holes. You can't make wingers cross because there is a bug which stops them from crossing, and instead makes them pass the ball.

That's a pretty blanket statement. Have you seen the match engine code?

I think a lot of the stuff you've said is situational. You've got to remember that the little guys running around on the screen are supposed to imitate people, who all make rational choices; if my coach told me to only play direct passing football, I would do my best to submit to that request... but I'm not going to do it if there's a better option, like a short ball or even a long ball. As I said, situational. I've found that the match engine is very sensitive to tactical decision making. But, then again, that's my 2c. I've found on the whole that this engine is far superior to anything we've witnessed in the past. Games are more realistic, goals are harder to score, etc.

What I am saying is things like defenders have a high interception rate, wingers unable to cross, keepers kicking ball to other keeper, freekicks -option to shoot but they do a short pass, 5 people standing as wall during a freekick in centre cricle or where the angle is impossible to score, players standing still during attacking plays etc etc.

These are bugs are hoes in the match engine that tweaking tactics are of no use as the match engine will keep doing those things stated above.

The problem with using somebody elses tactics is that what works for their team wont work for your team unless you both have the exact same players and the exact same circumstances.

You couldnt take Real Madrids ideal tactics and expect Rangers or Spurs to play well using them.

At the end of the day its down to you as the manager to understand your own players and to understand the team as a whole.

You cant just order them to play your way, you need to build a team that compliments eachother.

EDIT:

Wingers can cross, Kyle Lafferty, Nacho Novo, Aaron, and John Fleck all make regular crosses for my Rangers team *usualy with Kris boyd scoring on the end of them*

The problem with using somebody elses tactics is that what works for their team wont work for your team unless you both have the exact same players and the exact same circumstances.

You couldnt take Real Madrids ideal tactics and expect Rangers or Spurs to play well using them.

At the end of the day its down to you as the manager to understand your own players and to understand the team as a whole.

You cant just order them to play your way, you need to build a team that compliments eachother.

EDIT:

Wingers can cross, Kyle Lafferty, Nacho Novo, Aaron, and John Fleck all make regular crosses for my Rangers team *usualy with Kris boyd scoring on the end of them*

You don't get it. Even if I have the best crosser, say Beckham and I set him to cross often and he has the right conditions to cross. Beckham won't make a cross because the bugs make him do a short pass instead.

EDIT:

Wingers can cross, Kyle Lafferty, Nacho Novo, Aaron, and John Fleck all make regular crosses for my Rangers team *usualy with Kris boyd scoring on the end of them*

It doesn't matter if they are good crossers or not. If someone has 5 for crossing. If I set him to cross often he should cross often even if 90% of the time the crosses are very poor.

To quote from a slightly unusual thread of the past:

“It is not she. You are not looking at her correctly. Learn to look at her with new eyes and you will see the deeper beauty she now holds . Far deeper than she ever did in her youth.”

^ agree the ME has alot of potential. And the things that work, does work well, it does do what it's suppose to do. But it's the bugs and holes in the match engine that make things difficult. Simple things which should have been spotted.

Example there is obvious too many injuries in FM09. Now I cannot combat this injury bug no matter how much I sub someone, or give them light training he will ways have a high chance of injury even if his injury proneness is 0. There is still a chance he will get injuried. Bugs likes this has a large affect in the game and a large affect how you do things. Suddenly I have to change my training schedule to from light to very light and give him 3/4 days off and only play him 1 a fortnight to reduce injuries.

What we find here is people changing their tactics to work around the bugs, even if it means playing more long balls to even represent a cross ball then so be it. Even if it means me putting 3 up front to shoot from long distance to combat the high interception then so be it. Even if it means playing very high tempo to combact the standing still bug then so be it. This is when it becomes unrealistic.

As you've been told in the Bugs forum, if you honestly think it is an issue then start collecting evidence. If you're watching full matches keep a word document open and make a note of these things happening. For example

30:21

Winger picks up ball out wide but parallel to box. He passes 20 yards back to full back despite having options in the box, room to cross and Cross Often from Deep plus Mentality 17 plus Creative Freedom set to 1. Player decision attribute is 12

At the same time make a note of when he does cross it in similar scenarios to see if his decisions are disproportionate relative to the scenario and his tactical settings as you understand them.

Then save the pkms and upload them in the bugs forum.

I know many will retort 'I'm not paid to test this game' but if you are going to come on the official forum and declare that something is a bug, you need to back it up with evidence rather than sweeping statements that may well be distorted by human nature whereby the bad sticks out more than the good.

Just to clarify I'm not attacking you or your right to come on here and complain. All I'm saying is if you really believe something to be an issue then anecdotal observations are not going to help.

It doesn't matter if they are good crossers or not. If someone has 5 for crossing. If I set him to cross often he should cross often even if 90% of the time the crosses are very poor.

And like i and others have said multiple times...

Wingers CAN and DO cross.

I listed all of the wingers i use in my team and they almost always cross.

If you cannot get your team to cross a ball then dont blame the game, because everybody else can.

You keep saying bug but I need evidence for that. My wide players are crossing, and even one cross will prove you wrong that it is a bug if your argument is deductive... If it's not deductive, then it's not a bug. Either way, you are wrong.

Re: the injury bug

I have noticed the high number of injuries. However, they are mostly occurring in the pre-season.

What I did to combat this problem: Lighten the training, and lessen the fixtures. I usually have 2 or 3 games before my first competitive match.

During the competitive season, across multiple saves, I've only had three or four players out of contention with injuries. Seems pretty usual in real life situations as well.

If you've ever played a decent level of football, you'll notice that pre-season often leads to a high level of injuries as it is an intense level of fitness work, when the body is not completely used to that environment. Trust me, I know. To date I have: torn ligaments in my ankle, broken toes, had heel problems (both feet), spent time out with knee injuries (both knees, separate occasions) and had a torn sartorius, and a plethora of other niggles and pulls. Most of them occurred in the pre-season in warm up matches

The only "bug" that I can see with injuries is perhaps the sensitivity of injuries during the pre-season. During the season proper, it seems to settle.

I think we should just ignore this guy.

He is not making sense at all. If he doesn't like the match engine, he doesn't have to play FM. Instead, he should play FIFA or some other console game. That way he will not have to worry about tactics. Everytime, he pushes the button for shoot, the player will shoot; every time he pushes pass button, the player will pass.

This is a football managment game. Of course, the players will not follow you 100% of the time. There are so many things you need to take into consideration first: Do you have the right players for your tactic? How is your team morale? Did you just implement your tactic? Since it takes a while for the team to play the way you want them to play. You cannot change your tactic every game, which sounds like is what you are doing.

You keep saying that your wingers are not crossing. Do your players have good dribbling and crossing skills? Do they have good mental stats? Is the opposition doing something to stop your wingers?

If you are new to the game, then you need to be more humble and don't make blanket statements. You don't even understand the concept of creative freedom. You need to turn it down, if you want the team to follow your instructions, not the other way around.

I was also getting incredibly frustrated with this game because I could not find a single way to get shots on goal and my team doing what I wanted. But then I realised I shouldn't be so lazy just by moving sliders around and hoping for the best - instead I spent nearly an hour looking at every single stat of every single player. I then gave each player a full list of individual instructions based on their strengths and guess what.... so far won 6 in a row and haven't conceded in 5!

i find it interesting that the notion that one could compile the data and investigate all possible causes, rather than starting with a blanket generalization based on a very limited dataset, gets so little traction amongst SI forum posters.

i've seen a bazillion threads over the years about how the game's flawed, etc. almost none that just described the behavior that could lead to such sweeping conclusions *without* the sweeping conclusions.

if the OP's goal is to post a polarizing, half-argued polemic, success is imminent. if the OP wanted to actually solve any problem, i suspect that any attempts to solve said problem will be drowned out in the storm in a teacup that the OP has created.

keep up the work; these forums are entertaining, even if they're not much else.

Deltaroad is right.

I'm suffering too with a ME that does not follow my basic instructions.

Is the first time this has happened im so obvious and coarse way, since FM saga

Game flow appears to be "on the rails" (IMHO), maybe to accomplish semplified 3d issues..

I doubt a patch will solve because it appears to be a structural choice of SI programmers

Cheers

If you want evidence the game is flawed look at the bugs forum, SI has commented that this is a bug that is a bug or that is an issue that they are looking it.

I am merely saying because the game is flawed this is why you cannot create a working realistic tactic because the bugs stop simple instructions from working. The only way you can do it is to work around the bugs which results in unrealistic tactics.

My wingers run and cross the ball consistently throughout the match. I was getting very frustrated but your team seems to develop the further you get into the season. My midfielders are making the passes, my wingers are assisting and i'm finally putting it in the net.

OK what sttings do you have for wingers to cross.

Men 12

CF 12

Crossball often

Now does passing have an affect on crossing, do they cross more with direct passing? or mixed?

Run with ball and forward runs?

Does through ball have an affect on crossing?

Are you guys watching the game in full match?

The bugs are there

Dangerous freekick --> Pass it back to defender

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=58142

Cross from deep

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=58054

Goalkeeper distribution does not work

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=58780

I must say I haven't noticed any of these bugs but then I'm only watching in Key Highlights. Okay, maybe the keeper distribution goes over the strikers a bit too often, but not so often I'd call it a bug. Hey, maybe I'm wrong.

I notice on these threads a) only one of them is acknowledged by SI, and b) no one has uploaded PKMs yet.

As with all perceived bugs, if people do not upload enough PKMs and game files for SI to look over then the bugs will never be addressed, either to be fixed or for SI to say "It's not a bug, here's why..."

Not saying these bugs aren't there, only that I've either not experienced them or they are not blanket faults. I know for certain my GK doesn't ALWAYS punt it the his opposite number, and has in fact sent it to my defenders, wingers, etc. As I said, he SOMETIMES kicks too far, but then they also do this in real life. I'll certainly be looking out for how often he does it in the future, though.

The bugs are more noticeable if you view them in full match. Loads of times my wingers run to the byline of have a space to cross they pass to the full back.

The key matches doesn't show this. they only show the times when the wingers actually cross and it becomes a dangerous/goal potential situation.

Yeah, start uploading PKM's somewhere so people can watch and see what you're talking about. It's difficult when you can't emulate the problem for yourself

And like i and others have said multiple times...

Wingers CAN and DO cross.

I listed all of the wingers i use in my team and they almost always cross.

If you cannot get your team to cross a ball then dont blame the game, because everybody else can.

I'm with Dougy, my wingers frequently cross into the area from the byline and only really seem to pull up and square it when there's no momentum to break past the FB/WB.

Players with a better left foot on the right wing or vice versa will cut back and inside more, but generally when playing on the 'footed flank' will aim to cross from behind the FB/WB.

My Keeper is still a bit frisky with distribution, but I'm working on that.

First of all let me get this out of the way. This thread is not a moan at SI, it's a constructive thread about the flaws of the demo game and match engine and how it is unplayable. Often SI/Mods see something which is constructive and turn it to something deconstructive.

This has nothing to do with anyones tactic either. At first I thought it was my tactic but after going through the threads in tactics forum and following the simple rules of 2/3 notches between each unit and making simple tactics/instructions I have come to the conclusion it has nothing to do with the tactics at all.

The fact is, the match engine is full of holes, bugs and settings that don't work, making the simple tasks such crossing, passing, creative freedom etc impossible to master.

The theories in the tactics forum all follow a logical system. In theory it does work, and in practise, it should do also.

But why does the theory on paper work but not in practise? Well it's the bugs and poor programing of the match engine.

Starting at the back with keepers

After noticing my keeper keep kicking the ball toward the strikers and the ball bounces or gets intercepted to the other keeper. I set it so he distributes it to the MC, He doesn't. I thought maybe he has no creativity. So I give it a bit more creative freedom. He does the same. I change it so he only passes to the defenders, giving the keeper short passes. He still doesn't obey me and still kicks it straight to the other keeper.

OK I leave that, it's not that important.

Defenders

I noticed while playing weaker teams, their defenders have very good interception. So I give my MCs higher creative freedom, through ball often (TB). That doesn't work. Give my strikers run forward often so they can use their off the ball ability to find space so the MC can give them a ball. That doesn't work. I give MC's direct passing, TB. That doesn't work. I give MC mix passing, TB, Long passing, TB. That doesn't work.

Midfielders

I cannot get wingers to cross the ball, instead they pass to the full backs or to MC. I put cross the ball often it doesn't work. I give them cross from byline it doesn't work. Give them through ball - often, that doesn't work. Give them direct passing, CB and TB, that doesn't work.

No mater what I change, how much I change or what I tweak, nothing works.

This is because the match engine is seriously flawed, poorly programed and full of holes. You can't make wingers cross because there is a bug which stops them from crossing, and instead makes them pass the ball.

You can't create many chances in the last third of the pitch because defenders have a high interception rate.

Keepers cannot pass to wingers, MC or defenders because there is a bug which makes them kick to towards the other keeper.

The demo is basically pointless, making a tactic that may look like it's working now in the demo game won't in the real game with patch because the settings, programing will all have been changed.

SI this is why there is so much moaning in the forums because you give us a poorly developed game and we test the game for you, work out what works, what doesn't.

Edit: forgot to add the standing still bug where players stand still also makes tactics making hard as they stand still instead of passing, crossing, shooting.

Unitil wwfan / rashidi1' s full Posting later in the week, try a split ment of 8 GK/DC &10 DL/DR/DMC(MCd) & 12 AMC(MCa)/MR-L &14 FCs. Its a good base used with / implemented to the predefined 442Def, 442Stnd & 442Att.

hey Deltaroad, maybe your players just dont respect you enough... lol

try fining them for not obeying your every order...

now seriously, i have no problem... i actually avoid crosses(managing Montrose)... but i tried just to see if they'd cross... i saw alot of crosses, mainly from my left-winger, Black, although i only scored once...

my goalkeeper never passed the ball to the other 'keeper... although he usually passes to the opposing midfielder...

the thing is, as others have said, if your coach tells you to cross, but you know you'll only send the ball to the opposition, and at the same time you see someone in better position, you'll pass to that other guy...

try studying your players, see the type of tactics that would go well with them... then use friendly matches to try different settings... just cause crossings work with a certain team it doesnt mean it will work with another team... even a single player might make the diference...

i got lucky... my prefered formation is a 4-4-2 losangle(did i type it right?) style... it worked well with montrose after i tried a certain setting

First of all let me get this out of the way. This thread is not a moan at SI, it's a constructive thread about the flaws of the demo game and match engine and how it is unplayable. Often SI/Mods see something which is constructive and turn it to something deconstructive.

This has nothing to do with anyones tactic either. At first I thought it was my tactic but after going through the threads in tactics forum and following the simple rules of 2/3 notches between each unit and making simple tactics/instructions I have come to the conclusion it has nothing to do with the tactics at all.

The fact is, the match engine is full of holes, bugs and settings that don't work, making the simple tasks such crossing, passing, creative freedom etc impossible to master.

The theories in the tactics forum all follow a logical system. In theory it does work, and in practise, it should do also.

But why does the theory on paper work but not in practise? Well it's the bugs and poor programing of the match engine.

Starting at the back with keepers

After noticing my keeper keep kicking the ball toward the strikers and the ball bounces or gets intercepted to the other keeper. I set it so he distributes it to the MC, He doesn't. I thought maybe he has no creativity. So I give it a bit more creative freedom. He does the same. I change it so he only passes to the defenders, giving the keeper short passes. He still doesn't obey me and still kicks it straight to the other keeper.

OK I leave that, it's not that important.

Defenders

I noticed while playing weaker teams, their defenders have very good interception. So I give my MCs higher creative freedom, through ball often (TB). That doesn't work. Give my strikers run forward often so they can use their off the ball ability to find space so the MC can give them a ball. That doesn't work. I give MC's direct passing, TB. That doesn't work. I give MC mix passing, TB, Long passing, TB. That doesn't work.

Midfielders

I cannot get wingers to cross the ball, instead they pass to the full backs or to MC. I put cross the ball often it doesn't work. I give them cross from byline it doesn't work. Give them through ball - often, that doesn't work. Give them direct passing, CB and TB, that doesn't work.

No mater what I change, how much I change or what I tweak, nothing works.

This is because the match engine is seriously flawed, poorly programed and full of holes. You can't make wingers cross because there is a bug which stops them from crossing, and instead makes them pass the ball.

You can't create many chances in the last third of the pitch because defenders have a high interception rate.

Keepers cannot pass to wingers, MC or defenders because there is a bug which makes them kick to towards the other keeper.

The demo is basically pointless, making a tactic that may look like it's working now in the demo game won't in the real game with patch because the settings, programing will all have been changed.

SI this is why there is so much moaning in the forums because you give us a poorly developed game and we test the game for you, work out what works, what doesn't.

Edit: forgot to add the standing still bug where players stand still also makes tactics making hard as they stand still instead of passing, crossing, shooting.

It's not flawed. You're obviously just a sh|t manager.

If you're talking about FM09 then I don't see what you're talking about. To me FM09 seems to be the first rendition of Football Manager in a long time that I actually manage to create a reasonably successful tactic with. If you would for some reason be talking about FM08, then I completely agree.

It's not flawed. You're obviously just a sh|t manager.

Very constructive, I cant believe youve left school.

Hi, in real life crosses are blocked all the time and games are full of interceptions. Maybe you don't really want a football simulation? This version is the most realistic to date. In a premiership season 80% of the games are atritional battles with some freak shows and a sprinkling of classic games.

Midfielders

You can't make wingers cross because there is a bug which stops them from crossing, and instead makes them pass the ball.

Since Abdellaoue is playing as winger, and even with cross ball set to rarely, I definately must be doing something wrong then..

Just be careful with words like always or never

Very constructive, I cant believe youve left school.

I have left School. Have you? Clearly not, as your punctuation isn't exactly top notch So i'd recommend you go BACK to School, unless, of course, you're still there?

It's not flawed. You're obviously just a sh|t manager.

I believe so too

I have no problem with my tactics, or the team playing well... i really think that this is the most realistic ME ever....

the only problem could be the injury bug.... but i believe that is just minor...compared the other new features of the game

It's not flawed. You're obviously just a sh|t manager.

BULL SH|T !!!!!! Ive been playing around with a long running game of mine recently and have come to the conclusion that player created tactics and instructions are pretty much useless!! Now I'm not bitching because I cant win a game , far from it - I'm currently in charge of Chelsea in 2021, having previously managed Farsley, Crystal Palace, Ghana, Israel, Atletico Madrid and Ajax ( So redirect all the ''you cant play the game/ you suck balls at FM/ tactics are simple etc... etc..'' comments to someone else)

So anyway I agree with a lot of the points made. I'm starting to come to the conclusion that the game, both in and out of match mode is pretty much all set on rails because :

-Players ignore most instructions. As a manager, the main contribution you seem to make as to how the team play is the formation they run out. Everything else is up to the players, such as 100% defensive set DCs who gladly run up for EVERY corner or free kick.

-If you replay a game for any reason the results will pretty much be the same any time. Ive noticed this from my PC crashing in the past, but I played a game over 5 times yesterday and had the same result everytime .... with the opposition scoring without fail in the last minutes of the match

-When it comes to the FA cup, League cup, World cup, european cup its a fix. You wont be drawn randomly from every other team in the pot, more like a select 3 or 4 (As in my current game I have been drawn in the Champions league against Ajax 3 out of 5 times)

For me, if FM09 doesnt show at least a little improvement then I'll probably stop playing the game .... well by playing I mean just sitting in front of the PC whilst it goes about processing what is in effect a pre-rendered set of events

-When it comes to the FA cup, League cup, World cup, european cup its a fix. You wont be drawn randomly from every other team in the pot, more like a select 3 or 4 (As in my current game I have been drawn in the Champions league against Ajax 3 out of 5 times)

OK, let's run the probability there in slo-mo. There are 8 teams in Ajax's pot. So the probability that you (assuming you're in a different seeding pot from Ajax) will face them in any given season is 1/8.

The probability that you'll face them in a specific three seasons in a set of five seasons is (1/8)^3 * (7/8)^2, which is 49/32768.

The probability that you'll face them in some set of three seasons is ten times higher than that (there are 5!/3!2! ways to pick three objects from five), which is 490/32768.

The equivalent probabilities for four or five games against Ajax are 35/32768 and 1/32768, so the probability of at least five games against Ajax is 526/32768.

Assuming a reasonably constant set of 24 potential opponents, the probability that you'll get at least one of that set three times in five years is quite a lot higher still... and all of a sudden, you've got something you'd expect to happen quite frequently.

(Real life example: Armenia and Ukraine were in the same qualifying group for four consecutive international tournaments.)

OK, let's run the probability there in slo-mo. There are 8 teams in Ajax's pot. So the probability that you (assuming you're in a different seeding pot from Ajax) will face them in any given season is 1/8.

The probability that you'll face them in a specific three seasons in a set of five seasons is (1/8)^3 * (7/8)^2, which is 49/32768.

The probability that you'll face them in some set of three seasons is ten times higher than that (there are 5!/3!2! ways to pick three objects from five), which is 490/32768.

The equivalent probabilities for four or five games against Ajax are 35/32768 and 1/32768, so the probability of at least five games against Ajax is 526/32768.

Assuming a reasonably constant set of 24 potential opponents, the probability that you'll get at least one of that set three times in five years is quite a lot higher still... and all of a sudden, you've got something you'd expect to happen quite frequently.

(Real life example: Armenia and Ukraine were in the same qualifying group for four consecutive international tournaments.)

Well done on the maths there but perhaps i didnt make myself clear. I believe it is a known issue in the game that if you were to save before a cup draw, then run the draw several times you will get the same small number of teams over and over again.

So maybe the european cup was abad example but it was the most resent to mind that I had tried this on - the FA cup would a better one to try as there are no pots definining whom can be drawn against whom. There are no recent instances that come to mind but I remember with FM07 running the draw over a few times and seeing who my team were drawn against. I noticed that if you saved on the day of the draw instead of drawing against the whole 'pot' you would be drawn consistantly against the same teams again and again. If you saved a day or two before the draw the result wouldnt be the same teams but would still be from a small group of only three or four teams

most of these issues are confirmed as a bug and yet people still claim they don't exist Classic.

Goalkeeper distribution - they ignore the settings and lump it down the middle of the pitch most of the time. This is related to a bug with defenders whereby they miss a large percentage of these aimless long kicks and let the strikers through on goal, resulting in keepers getting double digit assists by the time the 6 months are up. This issue is being fixed for the patch. It does exist.

Wingers not crossing the ball despite player instructions is another issue that's being fixed. It does exist, Si have acknowledged it.

Some of you people need to remember that oxygen is real too, even if you can't see it.

most of these issues are confirmed as a bug and yet people still claim they don't exist Classic.

Goalkeeper distribution - they ignore the settings and lump it down the middle of the pitch most of the time. This is related to a bug with defenders whereby they miss a large percentage of these aimless long kicks and let the strikers through on goal, resulting in keepers getting double digit assists by the time the 6 months are up. This issue is being fixed for the patch. It does exist.

Wingers not crossing the ball despite player instructions is another issue that's being fixed. It does exist, Si have acknowledged it.

Some of you people need to remember that oxygen is real too, even if you can't see it.

Congratulations, you have won the worst anology of the week award.

Its a bit hard to believe that

1. Wingers NEVER cross

2. players NEVER follow tactics

when i have with my own eyes seen John Fleck, Steven Naismith, Chris Burke, Lee McChulloch, Nacho Novo, Demarcus Beasley, Kyle Lafferty and Aaron Niguez all make crosses for my Rangers team with my Strike force of Kenny Miller and Kris Boyd being on the recieving end more often than not.

The OP didnt even realise that giving players more creative freedom means they would listen to you less for spaghetti monsters sake.

First of all let me get this out of the way. This thread is not a moan at SI, it's a constructive thread about the flaws of the demo game and match engine and how it is unplayable.

That's so weird... I coulda sworn that I've been playing the FM09 demo for the last couple of hours...

I guess it must have been something else :confused:

I think we should just ignore this guy.

He is not making sense at all. If he doesn't like the match engine, he doesn't have to play FM. Instead, he should play FIFA or some other console game. That way he will not have to worry about tactics. Everytime, he pushes the button for shoot, the player will shoot; every time he pushes pass button, the player will pass.

This is a football managment game. Of course, the players will not follow you 100% of the time. There are so many things you need to take into consideration first: Do you have the right players for your tactic? How is your team morale? Did you just implement your tactic? Since it takes a while for the team to play the way you want them to play. You cannot change your tactic every game, which sounds like is what you are doing.

You keep saying that your wingers are not crossing. Do your players have good dribbling and crossing skills? Do they have good mental stats? Is the opposition doing something to stop your wingers?

If you are new to the game, then you need to be more humble and don't make blanket statements. You don't even understand the concept of creative freedom. You need to turn it down, if you want the team to follow your instructions, not the other way around.

I knew there had to be one

No it's not.

I have created a couple of tactics that work well, and produce more realistic football (stats wise) than previous versions of FM.

i agree, its really not that bad.

most of these issues are confirmed as a bug and yet people still claim they don't exist Classic.

Goalkeeper distribution - they ignore the settings and lump it down the middle of the pitch most of the time. This is related to a bug with defenders whereby they miss a large percentage of these aimless long kicks and let the strikers through on goal, resulting in keepers getting double digit assists by the time the 6 months are up. This issue is being fixed for the patch. It does exist.

Wingers not crossing the ball despite player instructions is another issue that's being fixed. It does exist, Si have acknowledged it.

Some of you people need to remember that oxygen is real too, even if you can't see it.

How long, I wonder, before the Post that asks "when will SI sort out this oxygen issue?, For Fxxx sake pull your socks up SI!!!!!"

LOL

I'm just sick and tired of the goalkeeper distribution thing. The 'ask defender to collect' think IIRC has been implemented in FM07, so it's now three years running and it simply does not work. If your oppositon has more than just a lone striker, there is no chance for goalkeeper to pass it to defender because the game engine deems such pass 'too risky' and the defender's programming is not smart enough to make him take a few steps back and collect it (like it happens in real life all the time).

I'm sorry, but having cultured defenders I want my build-ups starting from the back and each and every goal kick means gifting possession to the opposition, usually to their goalkeeper. I am simply not buying this game (no-one cares, I know; frustration makes me write this) because this bug drives me crazy and it has been reported in FM07 and FM08 and nothing has been done to repair it. I don't really know what all the testers are doing and I don't understand why SI is so slow with repairing game engine bugs.

Another year, another disappointment.

Congratulations, you have won the worst anology of the week award.

Its a bit hard to believe that

1. Wingers NEVER cross

2. players NEVER follow tactics

when i have with my own eyes seen John Fleck, Steven Naismith, Chris Burke, Lee McChulloch, Nacho Novo, Demarcus Beasley, Kyle Lafferty and Aaron Niguez all make crosses for my Rangers team with my Strike force of Kenny Miller and Kris Boyd being on the recieving end more often than not.

The OP didnt even realise that giving players more creative freedom means they would listen to you less for spaghetti monsters sake.

Congratulations on not being able to read! You ignored the fact that SI have acknowledged these problems, and then inferred a point in my post that doesn't exist!

I didn't say, anywhere "NEVER", nor did i say that all players don't adhere to player instructions. So, good job there.

I'm just sick and tired of the goalkeeper distribution thing. The 'ask defender to collect' think IIRC has been implemented in FM07, so it's now three years running and it simply does not work. If your oppositon has more than just a lone striker, there is no chance for goalkeeper to pass it to defender because the game engine deems such pass 'too risky' and the defender's programming is not smart enough to make him take a few steps back and collect it (like it happens in real life all the time).

I'm sorry, but having cultured defenders I want my build-ups starting from the back and each and every goal kick means gifting possession to the opposition, usually to their goalkeeper. I am simply not buying this game (no-one cares, I know; frustration makes me write this) because this bug drives me crazy and it has been reported in FM07 and FM08 and nothing has been done to repair it. I don't really know what all the testers are doing and I don't understand why SI is so slow with repairing game engine bugs.

Another year, another disappointment.

Agree with the GK dist thing. Violently disagree with the final comment - am loving this demo more than Sheridan Smith in an inapproriate dream!

Agree with the GK dist thing. Violently disagree with the final comment - am loving this demo more than Sheridan Smith in an inapproriate dream!

I do not have this problem, my GK (Friedel) is sharing long kicks with distributions to the defence appropriately. No problem (Creative Freedomy - 3).

As I am only playing a demo game, I didn't delve very deeply into training/tactics area. I manage Chelsea, bought in 2 players Srna & Ashavin and adopted a 4-4-2 diamond attacking tactic. This allowed both wingers to get to the bye-line and cross and also brought Lampard into lots of threatening positions outside/in the box.

My alternative attacking alternative is move my wingers in towards MC position to play narrow and 5potential goal scorers. This have proved successful so far by simply scoring more goals than my opponents - Am joint top of EPL - leading on goal difference.