Football Manager is unrealistically easy for bigger teams

I am surprised that nobody else becomes mad when reading topics like these:

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=49384

These people either cheat or support my view and opinion that the game is unrealistically easy and very boring if playing a bigger team.

Never in the history if football things were that easy even for the most reputable clubs like Man Utd etc...

Note: scroll down to read more info I added, or click here http://community.sigames.com/showpost.php?p=1764103&postcount=39 to go directly. Please read it before replying.

I am surprised that nobody else becomes mad when reading topics like these:

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=49384

These people either cheat or support my view and opinion that the game is unrealistically easy and very boring if playing a bigger team.

Never in the history if football things were that easy even for the most reputable clubs like Man Utd etc...

I have never cheated on my save, only thing I have done is started the whole game over if thats called cheating, being able to know and get the like of Sankhare, Sakho, Saivet. But yeah its easily unrealistic to become a powerhouse with a top club, even with a mid table team its possible to make that club better than the best.

I'm surprised you agreed with me as you are undermining your own achievement by that.

Your topic was mentioned to show what I'm taking about just an example and nothing specific against you though:)

I'm surprised you agreed with me as you are undermining your own achievement by that.

Your topic was mentioned to show what I'm taking about just an example and nothing specific against you though:)

Well...I just play my game to make myself feel good, the game is the way it is and I can't change it or it can't change until FM09 is out so I just get on with it, but I do know the game is easy but I don't think about it. But I do think of it this way...the regen quality is poor is FM08 so I do have to put in alot of effort in finding talent.

I am surprised that nobody else becomes mad when reading topics like these:

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=49384

These people either cheat or support my view and opinion that the game is unrealistically easy and very boring if playing a bigger team.

Never in the history if football things were that easy even for the most reputable clubs like Man Utd etc...

Personally i think the difficulty of FM08 is just about right. Not everyone has the time or desire to scrutinise every tiny aspect of the game in order to gain success due to the game being as difficult as real life.

When i see a thread like Navie's i don't get angry, i think this person is clearly enjoying their game which is what FM is all about.

isnt that's why we bought this game ??? to enjoy ourself...

i dont buy games [any games] to think hard and work hard..i had enough of that with my real life anyway...

lol

I see your point, but I would never start with a top division team anyway - god forbid in the top half of the table - no challenge. When you play the lower leagues, then you get to realise what the game is all about and a whole load of tactics and strategy come into play... it's like driving a car, some people prefer automatics, I'd like to think real geezers drive manual

Personally I find it unrealistically (and almost not fun) difficult, especially with a lower league team.

you can be winning a match and go defensive with 3 min left and the opposition will score twice.

I am surprised that nobody else becomes mad when reading topics like these:

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=49384

These people either cheat or support my view and opinion that the game is unrealistically easy and very boring if playing a bigger team.

Never in the history if football things were that easy even for the most reputable clubs like Man Utd etc...

You find it boring, but they enoy it, so don't play as a big club then. I don't mean to be flippant, but other peoples games don't affect yours and you can play how you like it, from what I can see you're complaining about other peoples games rather than the game itself.

unrealistically easy? Maybe. Boring? You got no proof, the guy seems to be enjoying himself. Also, just because something has never happened before does not mean it never will. Madness? No, not really. however, SPARTA!!!!

I see your point, but I would never start with a top division team anyway - god forbid in the top half of the table - no challenge. When you play the lower leagues, then you get to realise what the game is all about and a whole load of tactics and strategy come into play... it's like driving a car, some people prefer automatics, I'd like to think real geezers drive manual

I agree with you completly on this one.

However, I must say that we are all different right?

This guy who plays with ManU obviously likes playing with them, gives him joy and he knows some basic stuff how to play FM and all and he enjoys it...why not?

I know that it wouldn't give me any joy (not because its ManU, it's because it is a very strong club ), but at the end of the day we're all different

Thank god we have countless number of small clubs to play with, and they only have few super clubs:)

Any big team can dominate for a decade or two, by simply grabbing the wonderkids - something impossible in real life.

If it is too easy for some people to dominate with big teams then so be it. They are taking the easiest route. If the game were made such that even the easiest route to success were very difficult then the rest of us who like to manage smaller clubs would just give up because it would be utterly impossble.

If a game is too easy it is trivial to make it more difficult for yourself. If a game is too difficult then it is very hard to make it easier for yourself without cheating or using other people's tactics (which I consider cheating for myself).

the rest of us who like to manage smaller clubs would just give up because it would be utterly impossble.

It feels like that sometimes.

i never bother with playing any premier league club as its just too easy

Not only top clubs. If you get the worst BSP side, in 10 years you'll be on top again and winning Premier League 12243141231 times in a row.

Not only top clubs. If you get the worst BSP side, in 10 years you'll be on top again and winning Premier League 12243141231 times in a row.

Only if you take a win at all costs and by any method mentality. People who do that and then complain it is too easy are, frankly, irrelevant.

Only if you take a win at all costs and by any method mentality. People who do that and then complain it is too easy are, frankly, irrelevant.

Exactly.

The difficulty level is perfectly fine. If you want an easier ride you can take one of the decent to strong top division clubs. If you want no real challenge pick Chelsea or Arsenal. For a challenge you need to look at the lower leagues or teams in financial trouble.

For the game to be 'completely realistic' it should be impossible to take a lower league club anywhere near top divisions. But take that part away and there will be nothing left for a huge amount of players to enjoy.

Besides, people bragging about taking a conference side to the premiership title and CL in consecutive seasons are simply lying or cheating, period.

IMO the balance is just right, in terms of difficulty level.

I find it odd that some people complain about being good at the game, you want the difficulty turned up to 11.

Masochistic tendencies, that's what you've got.

tbh i have seen people struggle with the likes of arsenal, man u, chelsea, liverpool.

it is very very easy with these teams but only once you get a good tactic or it will be inconsistant. i dont think its too unrealistic its a game for gods sake.

if you find it too easy dont be bigger clubs.

Äktsjon Männ

Besides, people bragging about taking a conference side to the premiership title and CL in consecutive seasons are simply lying or cheating, period.

this isnt true. depending on what club you are. i have managed to take oxford united to CL in consecutive seasons once you try it a few times and get the right players in, its very manageable. not everyone is lying because they do a good job at a club.

i think some people do lie alot on these forums but just because you take a club from conf to prem in consecutive seasons doesnt mean you are lying or cheating. period.

Only if you take a win at all costs and by any method mentality. People who do that and then complain it is too easy are, frankly, irrelevant.

Ok, maybe next time i'll bang my head with a club and become offically mentally ********, that way the game might be fun and challenging.

Anyway, i still think the game should have a difficult level. There would be the easy level, which is how the game is right now. And the hard level, with more realism where it's practically impossible to get the worst BSP side and get promoted, unless you do a really good job, or after years trying to get promoted, and that would also please those who wants to manage a big club and still have a challenge season after season. Don't need to call it "easy" and "hard" levels, SI could give them a different name. But i hope we get that one day, i think it would please everyone. The way it's right now, is not very democratic, people shouldn't be forbid to play and have a challenging fun with a top club.

Besides, people bragging about taking a conference side to the premiership title and CL in consecutive seasons are simply lying or cheating, period.

This is the biggest pile of rubbish I've ever heard. After about 20 seasons you see the likes on Walsall in the Prem and so If you were playing as a smaller team than Walsall you will get to the prem quicker than that.

This is the biggest pile of rubbish I've ever heard. After about 20 seasons you see the likes on Walsall in the Prem and so If you were playing as a smaller team than Walsall you will get to the prem quicker than that.

You don't take a conference team to premier league winners in consecutive seasons without cheating and using exploitative tactics and player guides. Fact. What AI can or cannot do with teams like Walsall (League 1 aren't they?) is completely irrelevant.

The game is challenging enough for most people. Making it harder will result in loss of customers for SI and as such is not likely to happen. Difficulty levels are something that SI have been unwilling to consider so I wouldn't expect to see this anytime soon either. Just take a very poor team in a very poor league and use LLM rules. If you still find it easy then there really is no way a game aimed at such a huge consumer base is ever going to challenge you anyway.

Difficulty level is a must. What about people that wants to manage a top club but still have a challenge?

I wouldnt call it easy. Im Rangers and despite 5 seasons on the trot won tis 6th season is by far my hardest. i lost my star man for £39M to Arsenal and all of a sudden im back on a level playng field with Celtic and Dundee Utd arent far behind.

Difficulty level is a must.

I wouldn't mind difficulty levels at all. But as I said it's not likely.

What about people that wants to manage a top club but still have a challenge?

You can't just go and splash the cash on the Messis, Ronaldos and Robinhos and then whinge that the game is not realistic or challenging enough. It has to be possible to build these fantasy teams because many people play it just for that. But you also have an option not to go down that route.

The best way to play is not to look on the good player guides etc.

The only time I ever did that was to open the editor and see the -10 players and sign them for my Rangers team to see how I would do - didn't last long a few months tops

Exactly.

For the game to be 'completely realistic' it should be impossible to take a lower league club anywhere near top divisions. But take that part away and there will be nothing left for a huge amount of players to enjoy.

i agree with the first sentence, it should be. but winning pl & cl with conference team in 10-15 years would be no fun for me and big flaw in the game.

Ok, maybe next time i'll bang my head with a club and become offically mentally ********, that way the game might be fun and challenging.

Anyway, i still think the game should have a difficult level. There would be the easy level, which is how the game is right now. And the hard level, with more realism where it's practically impossible to get the worst BSP side and get promoted, unless you do a really good job, or after years trying to get promoted, and that would also please those who wants to manage a big club and still have a challenge season after season. Don't need to call it "easy" and "hard" levels, SI could give them a different name. But i hope we get that one day, i think it would please everyone. The way it's right now, is not very democratic, people shouldn't be forbid to play and have a challenging fun with a top club.

the only way of achieving this is to have an option, to not be able to start in top league clubs (pl, ch, d1...) with slow progression and changing jobs to higher leagues.

but i agree that 'people shouldn't be forbid to play and have a challenging fun with a top club'.

Try leagues with different rules for more of a challenge. The inability to buy big name players in the MLS makes it pretty tough to stay on top for more than a few seasons.

If it is too easy for some people to dominate with big teams then so be it. They are taking the easiest route.

They are not "taking the easy route", they are playing the game as they want to, just as people who start unemployed or in a low league club are playing the game in the way they want to. Starting out at a small club is not an intrinsically better way to play the game and doesnt make you a "better" type of person, it is simply a different approach.

I agree with the OP about it being too easy at the top.

It's no so much a matter of the whole game being easy, but of the difficulty level being unbalanced. It can be challenging getting to the top, but once you're there it's ridiculously easy to stay there. Typically once you win the league for the first time, you go on to win it every season until you stop playing. Also, when you get a lower league team promoted it is extremely rare to get relegated again. It's like progress is almost inevitable - you never finish in a lower position than in the previous season.

I find this seriously hampers my enjoyment of the game because steady progress up the leagues system just doesn't feel like much of an achievement.

I think it's a matter of "learning" the game. In my first periods it was a challenge, but now I've figured out most aspects of the game and are finding it very easy. In the save I'm currently on I took the premier title in first season, reached the CL finals (lost though) in second season and are looking pretty good at the title again and all this with Aston Villa. This must be evidence that it's too easy. I mean Aston Villa getting out on top of Man U, Chealsea, Liverpool and Arsenal in the 07/08 season... Hehe

I'm looking forward to 09 in terms of what I hope to be a more strict transfer budget and system, and perhaps a game which is not so exploitable.

I like to play as Arsenal alot and also have a lower league team in a different save. I play as Arsenal not because I want an 'easy' game, I just like managing Arsenal players and feeling like Arsene Wenger! Gaming for fun etc

I think it's a matter of "learning" the game. In my first periods it was a challenge, but now I've figured out most aspects of the game and are finding it very easy. In the save I'm currently on I took the premier title in first season, reached the CL finals (lost though) in second season and are looking pretty good at the title again and all this with Aston Villa. This must be evidence that it's too easy. I mean Aston Villa getting out on top of Man U, Chealsea, Liverpool and Arsenal in the 07/08 season... Hehe

I'm looking forward to 09 in terms of what I hope to be a more strict transfer budget and system, and perhaps a game which is not so exploitable.

How where you in CL first seasson with Villa?

How where you in CL first seasson with Villa?

He said: "I took the premier title in first season, reached the CL finals (lost though) in second season"

The problem for me is that I usually do career games, so by the time I'm at the top - its always easy because regens and AI managers are poor. It becomes way too easy by the time 2020-2025 rolls around.

More board interference would help let things more difficult. but i'm pretty sure nobody would like it.

I read all the replies, thanks for your opinions. I need to add that, in that same mentioned topic that i listed as an example, I had a good conversation / argument with another user and we came to some interesting stuff and they're mentioned below but first let me tell you about my recent save with Man City.

I just had a game as Man City and I have won the league 3 times in the first 4 seasons beating the AI big four who had better squads but it was still very easy for me to attract players like Messi, Aguero and co but I did not do so just signed "normal talented" to see how difficult the game is.

Now think with me and tell me if this is realistic:

3 FA Cups.

2 Champions League.

1 League Cup

3 Premiere League.

9 Trophies in 4 years with a team that is a bit far from being 5 stars team like Chelsea or Manchester United.

so the game is not only easy for currently bigger teams with exceptionally good XIs, but for the potentially bigger ones as well, or in other words, team where money is available like Man City as I did not excessively buy and still manged to win pretty much everything, what would be the case then had I decided to buy top top players?

Now back to what I said earlier, in the other topic the user won 11 leagues in a row and here are the odds of doing so in a very minimized and simplified real life calculations. I will ignore competitions other than the PL and teams outside the big four to keep the calculations simple... If I would count other teams than the big four then it will be even closer to zero.

CASE - ODDS

Finishing first 11 times in a row assuming only one of the big four is able to win the league: 2.38418579 × 10-7.

Finishing first 11 times in a row assuming only one AI team is capable of challenging you: 0.00048828125.

Finishing first OR second 10 times in a row assuming the big four teams never change: 0.0009765625

I agree that if the game becomes more difficult it will lost most of its average players who consist most of this community. But it's still not fair for talented / experienced players, so the only solution as I see things, is as mentioned by some in this topic, is introducing a difficulty level but I think it does not have to be a traditional one and I think me and SI have the same view on this. Introducing a traditional difficulty level is tricky and troubling thing because many users will find the gap too big between levels and just the fact that you have chosen to play on a certain level will spoil your experience in the game as users who chose easy and won everything will feel they are cheating and users who still win at hard will fee that the game is too easy, and the normal might be hard for beginners etc etc... many problems, nobody will be satisfied.

I think a "smart" one might be better, if the game detects you are winning everything that is to be won for like 8 years in a row or any other unrealistic number, it might inform you that you were moved to the "next" difficulty level and the game then changes some stuff, before you start thinking this is a bad idea, let me finish.

by "stuff" I do not mean that suddenly the AI becomes unbeatable and the match engine becomes biased towars the AI making it unplayable, I just meant that the AI teams do better transfers, enforce better tactics and the bigger teams become a bit more stronger by wasting less points whilst playing smaller ones, just like Chelsea in the Premiere League, they raised the bar then United needed to match it. What I think should happen is that other teams start matching or reaching that bar and not staying where they were before the bar was raised. This will be mentioned as news to you in your inbox that "teams x and y decided to raise the bar and do fundamental changes to stay competitive with you " or the "chairman of team x decided to do a,b,c changes because he feels his team is underachieving in the past 10 years" or something like that, not only it will increase the realism of the game, it will also add to the experience and make the game feel more challenging in general and will give the user a feeling that the AI is aware of him.

Thanks for reading... waiting for your comments on my suggestion.

I think the game lacks the random factor when you're playing with big teams. Having the best players and the best manager doesn't mean winning it all in real life, but it means that in FM. IRL morale is much more volatile than in FM, and also more individual. You can have the team on winning ways in real life and one of the first eleven players has very poor morale for loads of possible reasons. In fm, if you keep winning, his morale will always be "superb". Also, adaptation should come more into play (like players who simply cannot adapt to playing for a given club). Bergessio was a Benfica player last season. A terrible one. This year, he's back in Argentina and scoring for fun, earning the first cap for the National Team. This is almost impossible in FM.

I'd say once ANY team gets to the prem and survives 2 seasons its guaranteed you're going to the top (I'd say within 5-10 seasons). This is often due to teams liek Man Utd and Chelsea sacking their managers at a drop of the hat and hiring morons who play 4-2-2-2, a good example of another type of idiocy from these managers is the players played by them and the players released by them, in my current save (Notts Forest 2011-12) Chelsea are using Scott Sinclair as their loan striker, O.K he's a good player but wtf reason is there for Chelsea not signing one of the top 20 strikers in the world? Also Man Utd use Manucho (who has scored 18 goals in three seasons) over Rooney (God in FM terms and maybe real life) in their big games (I check the big teams games to get an idea of how to play against them).

However I still struggle to see how people have the success they do in the first two seasons (with teams like Sunderland, Spurs etc...), unless they use scouting tools/player suggestion threads/ they have too much knowledge of players from previous games, i.e: if you know who the best 17-19 year olds are in Bolivia.

ok wow i must just really suck at this then. even with your arsenals and your chelseas, i still have a fight for the title every season. ive only won the league with arsenal once. i never walk it, its always a fight and i usually come up just short. and when im at middlesbrough or sunderland or any mid table prem team, i get them realistic if unspectactular results. i find the difficulty perfect for me.

i think the difficulty has gotten a lot better since 06 were i can take a mediocre side half way throught the season from 17th to 4th on a regular basis and win most leagues with average clubs. 08 is more realistic and SI seem in my opinion to be improving the game and the realism, every year.

Although I'm not 'very good' at FM I do agree with the OP - for reasons I'll come back to.

I think it could become too easy with 'big' teams, even for someone that's not got a great grasp of the game. Personally, although I'd like to play with Inter as that's been the team I've supported for nearly 20 years, I think it'd get too easy even for me. Therefore I play with Rangers in the English premier league, which still lets me play in a good league with a reasonable side, but because of my ability level it's still a great challenge for me. Frankly, if SI made the game harder as default, I'd just go back to the 'game' Champ Manager, rather than this 'simulator.'

Now back on-topic. IF I did play as Inter, and as I think it would, the game would become easy and after a little while my gameplay became robotic, why not have the OPTION for other clubs to re-structure and become competitive again?

I've been playing these games since the first edition, and the difficulty level is already there in my opinion - manage a small team. If you make them successful move to another small team or a relegated 'giant' to help them back to their greatness. It all just adds to the fun, for me anyway. Over the years I've started checking teams results IRL because I've managed them in games LOL - teams I'd normally never have given a second thought to.

So let's have a difficulty level as a selectable option if need be. But don't alienate us 'lesser' players by making it 'too' hard as a default

i dont think the game is too unrealistic at all, its a little unrealistic, but not as much as the OP is saying, i mean after all it is a game, but all that aside, whats to say that in real life you couldnt go on to win as much as the fella in the other thread..

theres no reason man utd in real life couldnt win 11 seasons if they managed to sign all the players a manager would want.. its not very likely, but its not impossible, so theres no point posting up all those equations and the like coz most people dont really care, i know i dont lol

there are many ways to make the game harder for yourself like attribute masking, and fake player names, and lower league managing, but seeing as though most people have been playing this game for nearly a year now, everyone knows where to look for players, which makes the game a lot easier, even for LLM.. i remember when FM08 first came out i thought it was extremely hard ( not hard enough to make a pointless thread and start whinging though ;D ) and im sure when the next instalment of the series comes out the game will become hard again..

but when you break it all down and look at it properly, in the end, it is a game, and not only is it just a game, but probably the most accurate football management sim going atm, im sure if alex ferguson had a user interface which he could access at any time and see who is unhappy / happy, and have the ability to search for players looking for certain attributes and have the ability to unsettle players at the touch of a button then he would be winning 11 seasons in a row..

but thats not the case, and its the same if you flip everything all around, if SI had the ability to code into the game the total random things that happens irl, such as injuries and the effects certain injurys have on team morale, media interferance not only affecting players morale but affecting a clubs reputation making them look undesirable to potential transfer targets and all the rest of the nasty stuff that happens in real life they would, and i am aware that the game has these features but not to the extent of what happens in real life, and i dont think the game will ever have the features as accurate as in real life coz its just too difficult, and if they did find a way to emmulate everything that happens irl then the game just wouldnt be fun, who would want to play a game where you could do everything you possibly could to succeed only to have say the media sour your fans against u and causing your board to sack you..? i know i wouldnt..

in the end i think SI are ever evolving, its a totally different game from what it was back in CM1 days, and im pleased with the way the game is evolving, if you want a more realistic managerial experience, coach a local U-8's team, or alternatively get your coaching certificates and apply for a profesional management job, if you want a lifelike management in the comfort of your own home and your not happy with FM then i think youve struck out..

keep up the good work SI!

The problem for me is that I usually do career games, so by the time I'm at the top - its always easy because regens and AI managers are poor. It becomes way too easy by the time 2020-2025 rolls around.

I think it's even earlier than that, in one save I ended up at Barcelona in 2018 and destroyed everything, winning 6 trophies in one season. I resigned and moved to relegation candidates VFB Stuttgart and saved my save game.

I think it's too easy to find good and talented players, especially for big clubs. I don't think that match engine is too easy, it's just that human manager has an unfair advantage over the AI when it comes to finding quality players.

I think it's too easy to find good and talented players, especially for big clubs. I don't think that match engine is too easy, it's just that human manager has an unfair advantage over the AI when it comes to finding quality players.

Again that's dependent on the club you are managing and whether or not you mask attributes. If you're managing in the lower leagues you won't be able to afford to send scouts to various destinations to unmask attributes so it's very difficult to sign the best players, you can make transfers as hard or as easy as you wish tbh.

Maybe the new transfer module will maintain/improve upon the competitiveness of AI sides in the longer term.

There should be a difficulty level for Lyon and Psv in real life. It's normal that the game becomes more easy because you know who the good players are. If you play it LLM style it will not be easy anymore.

what do you lot think about a "smart" difficulty level like I mentioned above?