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View Full Version : Kewell worth more then first thought...



matty_boy08
21-09-2008, 06:02
Ok i am in 2009 with Man City, just played birmingham who have Harry Kewell.
He scored 2 goals and set one up. As i have just sold my starting AM for $30m
I need a new AM, so i submitted an offer of $22m Birmingham's board accept on
behalf of their manager they felt it was an offer they couldn't refuse. So i thought to
myself why pay $22m when i could pay $18-20m so i withdrew the offer and submitted a new
$19m offer. I got a message back saying that they would sell him for nothing less then $29.5m.

HAHA, couldn't believe this.

FM_returner
21-09-2008, 06:11
Ok i am in 2009 with Man City, just played birmingham who have Harry Kewell.
He scored 2 goals and set one up. As i have just sold my starting AM for $30m
I need a new AM, so i submitted an offer of $22m Birmingham's board accept on
behalf of their manager they felt it was an offer they couldn't refuse. So i thought to
myself why pay $22m when i could pay $18-20m so i withdrew the offer and submitted a new
$19m offer. I got a message back saying that they would sell him for nothing less then $29.5m.

HAHA, couldn't believe this.

Haha, Birmingham upset with you for messing them around? Nice realism there. :)

Smac
21-09-2008, 06:12
This is typical of how the AI 'negotiates'.

Want a Rug? 10 Euros!

How about 8 Euros?

Want a Rug? 15 Euros only!

toon army 06
21-09-2008, 06:30
Ok i am in 2009 with Man City, just played birmingham who have Harry Kewell.
He scored 2 goals and set one up. As i have just sold my starting AM for $30m
I need a new AM, so i submitted an offer of $22m Birmingham's board accept on
behalf of their manager they felt it was an offer they couldn't refuse. So i thought to
myself why pay $22m when i could pay $18-20m so i withdrew the offer and submitted a new
$19m offer. I got a message back saying that they would sell him for nothing less then $29.5m.

HAHA, couldn't believe this.

how daft buying a player based on one good game make sure to check his stats and check to see how good he played against your team the fact he scored twice and set one up does not mean he played good for the whole game or even anytime during the game.

matty_boy08
21-09-2008, 06:45
how daft buying a player based on one good game make sure to check his stats and check to see how good he played against your team the fact he scored twice and set one up does not mean he played good for the whole game or even anytime during the game.

I understand mate,
But i am an aussie so i love harry.:o

backpackant
21-09-2008, 08:00
a) He's now in demand and b) he's probably a valuable member of the squad and they don't want to lose him.

Try waiting a couple of weeks and then bidding again. $18million? Is that Aussie money or U.S.? If it's Aussie, isn't that about 6million UK? In the game Harry's still pretty good so AU$22million might not be unrealistic.

matty_boy08
21-09-2008, 09:03
umm thats aussie money sorry for not mentioning.
Yeah but i find it funny that the board accepted it at $22m
then asked for $29.5.

nick1408
21-09-2008, 11:26
i think it is delibrate in the game so you don't keep offering a lower price until you pay the lowest possible for any player

Neji
21-09-2008, 11:30
If the board accepted your offer before, then maybe this is what the manager wants, rather than the board?

Gerry-Atric
21-09-2008, 12:05
Ive noticed you could bid 29 million for a player for example, then Chelski bid 25 and then accept their offer too, you try dropping your and they reject yours! why does this happen??

Wakers
21-09-2008, 12:17
I don't like that people are defending this. It's clearly poor AI.

Hopefully this has been fixed for FM09.

wardog
21-09-2008, 13:18
Ive noticed you could bid 29 million for a player for example, then Chelski bid 25 and then accept their offer too, you try dropping your and they reject yours! why does this happen??

There could be a number of reasons. Chelsea and the selling manager may have a good relationship where as the manger may have a fairly poor opinion of you.

Secondly again you would be peed off if somebody done that to you

matty_boy08
21-09-2008, 13:31
There could be a number of reasons. Chelsea and the selling manager may have a good relationship where as the manger may have a fairly poor opinion of you.

Secondly again you would be peed off if somebody done that to you

So could that mean that im a Birmingham favoured person but the managers hated personal.:confused:

dane0
21-09-2008, 13:50
The whole transfer module has been rewritten for FM2009, so I think that it's safe to say that this form of AI was poorly implemented and that it will be fixed for FM2009. If it was going for realism, it should merely put up a mention saying that since the club had received your former offer, they will not settle for anything less than the value you already proposed. Then that would be realism. Also, if it were to realistic, they shouldn't want to accept the former, lower, offer, if you just cancel the transfer and try again a day later. It's simply poor AI, nothing else, so don't try to defend it.

Dalimyr
21-09-2008, 15:11
So could that mean that im a Birmingham favoured person but the managers hated personal.:confused:
Possibly, yes. As manager of Man Utd I tried to buy Robin van Persie as cover for my wingers. He was valued at 6.75m and getting on a wee bit, so I pushed my luck and offered 6m. Juventus then put in a bid of 5m the day after. Arsenal accepted Juve's bid and rejected mine, with the poor relationship between myself and Marcelino (the Arsenal manager) being the reason for the rejection. I offered 9m, and was still rejected, so I offered a little more, and a little more...it wasn't until I offered 12m (over double what Juve were looking to spend) that I finally had my bid accepted. Turned it down because I felt I was paying far too much for him, and went with a slightly younger (and better) Tranquillo Barnetta from newly-relegated Newcastle for 10m :D

philly_flyer10
21-09-2008, 15:51
I don't like that people are defending this. It's clearly poor AI.

Hopefully this has been fixed for FM09.

They will defend anything, its clearly wrong and nothing to do with relationships. Its happened with me with teams Ive never even played or ever spoke about.

SI seem to agree with us which is why they have completely rewritten the transfer engine.

IbrahimAliMaher
21-09-2008, 21:21
Possibly, yes. As manager of Man Utd I tried to buy Robin van Persie as cover for my wingers. He was valued at 6.75m and getting on a wee bit, so I pushed my luck and offered 6m. Juventus then put in a bid of 5m the day after. Arsenal accepted Juve's bid and rejected mine, with the poor relationship between myself and Marcelino (the Arsenal manager) being the reason for the rejection. I offered 9m, and was still rejected, so I offered a little more, and a little more...it wasn't until I offered 12m (over double what Juve were looking to spend) that I finally had my bid accepted. Turned it down because I felt I was paying far too much for him, and went with a slightly younger (and better) Tranquillo Barnetta from newly-relegated Newcastle for 10m :D

Wouldn't not wanting to sell to a team in the same league come into play here too?

toon army 06
23-09-2008, 03:26
I understand mate,
But i am an aussie so i love harry.:o

there is no time for the old friends act when it comes to buying players at the end of the day you get the sack they don't if the team does bad.

tingting
23-09-2008, 04:58
Possibly, yes. As manager of Man Utd I tried to buy Robin van Persie as cover for my wingers. He was valued at 6.75m and getting on a wee bit, so I pushed my luck and offered 6m. Juventus then put in a bid of 5m the day after. Arsenal accepted Juve's bid and rejected mine, with the poor relationship between myself and Marcelino (the Arsenal manager) being the reason for the rejection. I offered 9m, and was still rejected, so I offered a little more, and a little more...it wasn't until I offered 12m (over double what Juve were looking to spend) that I finally had my bid accepted. Turned it down because I felt I was paying far too much for him, and went with a slightly younger (and better) Tranquillo Barnetta from newly-relegated Newcastle for 10m :D

This is different. You are buying a player from your arch rival and naturally they will be unwilling to sell you a player except for a largely inflated price (i know silvestre went from manutd to arsenal but thats real life :D). While the AI behavior with regards to the transfer negotiation is understandable (and rightly so :)), there is a serious problem with negotiation a transfer with AI. For example five years into the game, i took over as the manutd manager and bid for billy sharp who was at sunderland. now i have a good relationship with roy keane so i was hopeful of getting the player for a lower price than the actual asking price. So i sent in an enquiry. sunderland wanted 14.5 million (in pounds) for a player valued at 6 million. i bid 11 million and a sell on clause of 10% and sunderland came back asking for 17 million!!! Hopefully this problem has been rectified for the new version :)

MNM
23-09-2008, 09:37
there is no time for the old friends act when it comes to buying players at the end of the day you get the sack they don't if the team does bad.

It's just a game man....

Mike7077
23-09-2008, 09:41
This is typical of how the AI 'negotiates'.

Want a Rug? 10 Euros!

How about 8 Euros?

Want a Rug? 15 Euros only!

Nice analogy. Here's how an attempted transaction recently went for me;

Me: "How much is that rug?"
Them: "This rug is not for sale."
Me: "I will cross your palm with 20 for that rug."
Them: "I will accept a deal for this rug of 27."
Me: "How about 24.50?"
Them: "You can have this rug for a deal starting at 82."
Me: "I'll do my rug shopping at another flea market, I think. Ta-ta, now."

glamdring
23-09-2008, 10:20
I don't see much wrong with the scenario in the 1st post. That's not to say I don't see lots wrong with the transfer market in general, but not in that one scenario.

You agreed a deal, then went back on it and tried to offer less so they said screw you then, if you want to mess us around we'll mess you around and do exactly the same in the opposite direction.

Just because the manager demanded 29.5 million though doesn't mean that is what you have to pay, it just means their board didn't intercept your lower offer, but may well do so again if you offered the 22 million again rather than the 29.5 million that the manager asked for. I also find that you get more offers accepted if you make them non-negotiable - tends to cause the opposing club's board to step in more often.

sirdez24
23-09-2008, 14:37
If you were prepared to offer an amount to the extent that you put in a formal bid, why would they then accept less? Have you tried bidding $22m again?

philly_flyer10
23-09-2008, 15:05
Nice analogy. Here's how an attempted transaction recently went for me;

Me: "How much is that rug?"
Them: "This rug is not for sale."
Me: "I will cross your palm with 20 for that rug."
Them: "I will accept a deal for this rug of 27."
Me: "How about 24.50?"
Them: "You can have this rug for a deal starting at 82."
Me: "I'll do my rug shopping at another flea market, I think. Ta-ta, now."

Exactly why I had to use another program to find out what they will accept. The negotiation is beyond ******** in FM and Im glad they totally rebuilt it.