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Forget 3D enhance 2D


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I know there has been a lot about this but, frankly, there's not much to discuss at the minute as we wait for details of the new game.

All I'm saying is personally I would like to see the graphics side of the 2D slightly (and I emphasise the word slightly) enhanced. Just to give more of a feel of whats happening.

Fair enough, there is TOO much talk about 3D and all that sort of stuff but this is strictly about ideas for for 2D and is a fair discussion. So, who agrees and any ideas on how?

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Personally, I think the entire 2D graphics could be made much better.

For a start, how about having stands about the pitch? Ok, you couldnt see the full stands, but it could at least look like you werent having a kick around in the park. Maybe even have some hoardings as well.

You could have a tunnel that the team comes out to. Pitch invasions when you avoid relegation, get promoted, win something.

And how about trophy presentations on the pitch? I would LOVE it if when you one something the commentary continued, each player got a medal then your captain lifted the trophy, then all those 2D dots went on a lap of honour.

Also, maybe even throw in weather conditions as well?

Ok, I know I might be getting childish, but anything that increases realism and makes the game more fun, without compromising the 2D graphics engine, could be considered surely??

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So thats 3 posts ,3 agreements. Nice. I am genuinely interested to see how many people are for this. With all the talk of 3D this is a subject that has been overlooked but would make the match experience hugely better. After all whats the best part of football? The match.

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It may sound like a small detail but even adding stuff like some more shadow on the players with give you more of a sense of height. Maybe even consider the option of tilting the overhead view. Champ man did it and although the colours and look of the icons etc was horrible it really does show you more. Its hard to explain why but it just does give you more of a feel of the passing and movement.

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3D is the only way to take this game forward to an another level. Just look at the game graphics on CM2009 3D engine and you'll get the idea. You can see it on youtube. The match experience will be huge!!!

If they could get a 3d engine that worked perfectly, and I mean perfect, and looked amazing then yes. This is very hard to achieve though to be fair. Even if they had the new Fifa match, I'm still not sure it would be right and you can understand peoples concerns about losing some of the magic of the game. However some match simulation is definately required and an improved 2D would give even the most stubbon fm fan the chance to get even more feedback from their team.

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Yeah. i really like 2D, but its needs more individuality and personality.for example, stands unique to each stadium, goal celebrations better described, and a way to tell if a player has gone to ground(its increadably frustrating to see a dot standing still in the middle of the pitch, so i should be able to tell if he is down injured)

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Yeah. i really like 2D, but its needs more individuality and personality.for example, stands unique to each stadium, goal celebrations better described, and a way to tell if a player has gone to ground(its increadably frustrating to see a dot standing still in the middle of the pitch, so i should be able to tell if he is down injured)

Cool. A few features like stands etc wouldn't do any harm. I'm more for the concentration on player icons and all that stuff. You have to be careful. As soon as you mention things that sound "gimmicky" the FM faithful lose all interest.

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Personally, I think the entire 2D graphics could be made much better.

For a start, how about having stands about the pitch? Ok, you couldnt see the full stands, but it could at least look like you werent having a kick around in the park. Maybe even have some hoardings as well.

You could have a tunnel that the team comes out to. Pitch invasions when you avoid relegation, get promoted, win something.

And how about trophy presentations on the pitch? I would LOVE it if when you one something the commentary continued, each player got a medal then your captain lifted the trophy, then all those 2D dots went on a lap of honour.

Also, maybe even throw in weather conditions as well?

Ok, I know I might be getting childish, but anything that increases realism and makes the game more fun, without compromising the 2D graphics engine, could be considered surely??

They are good points but I doubt there'll be in this year.

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To be honest I am entirely happy with the 2D graphics as they are at the moment, subject to the criterion that what is on view infront of me matches as closely as possible what is actually going on of course!

Anything more complex and snazzy than a circle with "feet" to represent a player would add nothing to my enjoyment of the game. A manager blob I also couldn't give a toss about. Seeing stands around the pitch might be a nice touch, but would necessitate the pitch itself being smaller which I'm not really in favour of for something that is cosmetic.

Obviously I am not at all in favour of a 3d match engine.

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I don't really see how the 2D could be improved to improve the actual matchplay. Anything that could be added would basically be cosmetic and have no real affect (or at least shouldn't have an effect), I like the idea of a manager dot, but I don't like the idea of stands if they are going to affect the pitch visuals.

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To be honest I am entirely happy with the 2D graphics as they are at the moment, subject to the criterion that what is on view infront of me matches as closely as possible what is actually going on of course!

Anything more complex and snazzy than a circle with "feet" to represent a player would add nothing to my enjoyment of the game. A manager blob I also couldn't give a toss about. Seeing stands around the pitch might be a nice touch, but would necessitate the pitch itself being smaller which I'm not really in favour of for something that is cosmetic.

Obviously I am not at all in favour of a 3d match engine.

I bet if they were to tilt the view slightly so you could see more of the height perspective, added a touch more shadow but kept the clean look of the current engine, not like CM's, you would change your mind.

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I bet if they were to tilt the view slightly so you could see more of the height perspective, added a touch more shadow but kept the clean look of the current engine, not like CM's, you would change your mind.

Wouldn't change my mind, tilting is a no, no from me and the 2D is perfect as it is IMO.

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Think of the possibilities.

I have, and I know it could look great, but my concerns are based on the representation of the actual football. FM's 2D representation of an actual game i.e. the player movement, passing, following tactics is 100 times better than any 3D representation i've ever seen, including Pro Evo and Fifa.

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I have, and I know it could look great, but my concerns are based on the representation of the actual football. FM's 2D representation of an actual game i.e. the player movement, passing, following tactics is 100 times better than any 3D representation i've ever seen, including Pro Evo and Fifa.

I agree. I don't want 3D. I don't want gimmicks. I don't want them too sacrifice game play and realism for looks. However circles from aerial view is wearing a bit thin. It has evolve just....just slightly.

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I wouldn't mind a tilted pitch if my team could always play downhill, but apart from that I can't see that it would add anything. If it ain't broke don't fix it - it can wear as thin as it likes for all I care - it works and it gives me as good an idea of what is happening as it can do really.

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A 3D engine would be great but would it be realistic enough.

If you look at all football games which are 3D you will notice that there are too many chances and goals for the time limit. In other words the games are made incredibly shorter. I say they stick with the same sort of engine and try and introduce 3D. NO great graphics, even less than LMA will do. But i think the quality of the engine is more important than how it looks. If they get the 2D perfect this year and then next year bring out a slightly 3D engine. But with CM going 3D and FifaM already being 3D we will need to step up soon and I say sooner rather than later

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some of the idea's above are brilliant, it's probably the one area of the game where SI can get away with making minor changes as opposed to overhauling the feature completely, and there won't be an uproar

i'd much rather see 2D spruced up, than a dodgy 3D, and it seems that everyone's opinion is that 3D could be brilliant - if it's perfect, which it won't be (prove me wrong SI!). there's nothing significantly wrong with 2D that can't be fixed, so no need for a "revolutionary" change here imo

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For a start, how about having stands about the pitch? Ok, you couldnt see the full stands, but it could at least look like you werent having a kick around in the park. Maybe even have some hoardings as well.

You could have a tunnel that the team comes out to. Pitch invasions when you avoid relegation, get promoted, win something.

Don't see thia as very important.

You also what it to be passible to have 'streakers' come on to the pitch? A clear dot running around like crazy.. ;-)

Think we need to fucus on the important bits.. The game on the pitch.

Next thing would be shops where druk dots walk around, fighting among blue and red fandots.. I would hate it.. ;-)

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You see, the stuff about pitch invasions, dots jumping about when they win and all that stuff is exactly what I didn't want this thread to get on to. This is purely about enhancing the look of the player icons etc to make the match better in a tactical sense and to get more feed back. Maybe the reason why barely no notice is taken when it comes to the match engine graphics is because people think the people in favour of it are overspills from a Fifa manager enthusiasts club.

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No need for 3D, would slow the game down, increase hardware requirements and for no real reason. Your mind fills in the blanks with the 2D engine much better than having a 3D engine could. Even dedicated 3D football games like FIFA and Pro Evo don't come close to capturing the feel in the 2D FM engine for me, so how could SI even come close?

Not forgetting, as has already been mentioned, the 2D engine itself is still a long way from perfection, so work on that first.

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I read the first few posts, but there was something on cm4 i think, where when the players fall over, or the goalie dives, the spot becomes smaller, do you think this would be good?

it couldnt hurt i dont think because at least it will give you an indication of whats happening rather than you thinking, 'WTF is he doing??/*?? and slamming the keyboard as you lose the CL final :(

To the op, i think there should be general upgrades like you said... wouldnt mind a couple more events and stuff happpeninng around the pitch while the game is in progress

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Don't see thia as very important.

You also what it to be passible to have 'streakers' come on to the pitch? A clear dot running around like crazy.. ;-)

Think we need to fucus on the important bits.. The game on the pitch.

Next thing would be shops where druk dots walk around, fighting among blue and red fandots.. I would hate it.. ;-)

I never suggested silly things like streakers interrupting the game.

I love the 2D match view, I certainly wouldnt want it changed. But the 2D view could still be improved to give a better atmosphere. Football takes place in stadiums with stands, trophies are presented and teams/fans celebrate when they win. Why cant this be represented in a football simulation?

The match engine has been discussed to death, and I am sure SI are aware of the need for further improvements to the, for example, regens, board confidence and transfer system. But that shouldnt given them a free pass from making other improvements that wouldnt impact on other parts of the game.

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You see, the stuff about pitch invasions, dots jumping about when they win and all that stuff is exactly what I didn't want this thread to get on to. This is purely about enhancing the look of the player icons etc to make the match better in a tactical sense and to get more feed back.

I agree completely. When somebody mentions 3d alot people think of FIFA or PES and all the graphical fluff and jazz that goes with those titles. For me a proper, rotating pitch with well animated players (even if they are small) would be a big step forward. At the moment I feel we do not get enough feedback from the current 2d representation. As someone said earlier, we often see two dots run toward each other, wiggle for a few seconds, then one will go past the other. Was the attacking player doing stepovers, moving the ball from foot to foot, dropping his shoulder or was he just unsure and looking to lay the ball off? We can't really tell from the 2d and commentary most of the time. The most frustrating part about the 2d is the representation of goalkeepers. When they concede a goal sometimes the ball just seems to go straight through them - did it go through his legs, between his hands, was he simply outdone by the speed of shot or did the striker skillfully place it over him - it is often difficult to tell if my keeper was at fault or not.

I would personally prefer the pitch to be just a little larger than the screen and to scroll with play (there could still be a little 2d overhead view in the corner so we knew where our other players were). This would create a bit more space on the pitch to see what is happening, especially in the crowded penalty areas. There seems to be a lot of decisions being made by the underlying match engine but using the 2d doesn't provide enough detail and feedback on this, so I often feel as if something is missing.

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  • 2 months later...
No, the way forward is to enhance the 3-D view. In about two years no one actually cares about 2-D anymore.

What does that even mean? No one cares for 2d anymore? Alright, no one cares. :rolleyes:

There are always those who get stuck in their ways and refuse to accept change, no matter how good the alternative is :)

There are also always those who jump on a bandwagon and give up on things. But whatever man, you like it, I don't.

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