Team Talks: Things I wish we could say

Good ideas!

I'd also like to see something related to certain times in a match. E.g.: let's try and go for a goal in the opening minutes! Be patient and carefl, especially in the first 20 mins! etc.

So, I was one of the most resistant users to Team Talks. I spent most of FM'06 and FM'07 resenting them, and in fact kept my FM'05 career going just so I wouldn't have to deal with them.

Well.. I've embraced them in FM'08 .. and now that I have, I have ideas.

In particular, I've been paying attention to certain situations, and I'm discovering things that I want to say to my players in team talks which I'm not able to.

Individual Talks:

"This is your chance"

Type: Individual, Pre-match or Half-time

Meaning: This is your chance to impress me.

Unlocked: For club players who have demanded playing time, to youngsters, or to fringe players. For national team fringe players and debutants.

Impact: Increased motivation. Especially useful at halftime during a friendly, when bringing on the second string. Also useful for starters in a friendly, Cup, or mid-season game. A successful match for the player might increase expectations of future playing time. An unsuccessful match might lower their self-evaluation, demotivating some personalities, but motivating others to work harder in the Reserves.

"Earn your place"

Type: Individual, Pre-match or Half-time

Meaning: Earn your place in the first team.

Unlocked: In Reserves, Friendlies, National U-21s, National U-19s, U-18s, etc.

Impact: Increased motivation for players with ambition or those demanding playing time. Like "This is your chance", a successful match might increase their expectations, while an unsuccessful match might lower their self-evaluation.

"Pick up where you left off"

Type: Individual, Pre-match, International

Unlock: Where is it? I had guys on an 8 or a 9 in group play, and wanted to say "Pick up where you left off" as an individual talk, but didn't have the option. I can understand it being gone if there has been a month and several club matches since our last international match .. but in tournament play? Please!!

"Expect better"

Type: Individual, Pre-match, International

Unlock: Same argument. My 'keeper got a 4, and I really wanted to be able to say "I expect better" on his next match.

"Calm Down"

Type: Individual, Half-time

Meaning: Calm down

Impact: When given to players who looked nervous or temperamental in the first half, helps to settle the player in the second half. Especially useful for players carrying a yellow card or arguing with the ref. *Not* useful for those struggling with the pressure of expectations, and of course contradictory if the pre-match talk was "I expect a performance" or similar.

"I want to see more from You"

Type: Individual, Half-Time

Impact: Just like "I want to see more from you" as a team talk. In particular, I find myself wanting to use this on a superstar who is at a 6 or a weak 7. "Disappointed" isn't quite the wording I want .. I just want to see more from my best player.

"Keep up the good work"

Type: Individual, Half-time

Impact: Combines "Encourage" and "Pleased" a bit, with a clear indication that the job isn't done yet. Most useful for individuals on a 7 but who are making a noticeable contribution (dangerous runs, strong defense, clean sheet, etc). Gives a bit of recognition for their work, without letting them think that they can slack off in the second half.

"Good Work"

Type: Individual, Full-time

Impact: I've had times where I wanted to use this as an individual talk, e.g., calling out a player's hard work when I've noticed him hustling a lot, but he's on a 7. Maybe it speaks to his motivation and/or work rate? I'm not exactly "Pleased" with him, but I am acknowledging his contribution specifically.

Team Talks:

"We have to win today"

Type: Team, Pre-match or Half-time

Meaning: This is a must-win game.

Unlocked: For last-day battles. Possibly enabled only when a draw is insufficient but a win is.

Impact: Increased motivation, especially for Determined players, but also increased pressure. Somewhere between "We can win" and "I expect a win". Changes interpretation of half-time speech slightly: "Disappointed" with a tie score is very understandable, or may even become "I want to see more from you."

"All we Need is a Draw"

Type: Team, Pre-match or Half-time

Meaning: Defines a draw as a win for this match.

Impact: Increased motivation, especially for determined players if the team falls (or is) a goal behind. Especially useful as a half-time team talk when a goal behind, kind of like "I want to see more from you" - in fact, we might split it so that "I want to see more" isn't always the right thing to say when a goal behind. Slightly reduced pressure, as you're not talking about a win. Best for tough away matches, last-day relegations battles, or the final match of a group stage. Changes the interpretation of other team-talks: sets the stage for you to be "Pleased" with a nil-nil draw after, or "Delighted" with a win.

"Our fate is in our hands"

Type: Team, Pre-match

Meaning: Take care of business on this pitch, and we don't need to worry about other results.

Unlock: Kind of like "We have to win", only its enabled for the team that's up top. For example, on the last day of the Premiership, we're a point ahead of Chelsea but playing West Ham. Win, and we're champions .. but we could still back in with a Chelsea loss.

Impact: Increased motivation, increased pressure, much like "We have to win" - maybe skewed a little more towards motivation and a little less towards pressure.

"Result not important"

Type: Team, Pre-match

Unlock: This needs to be enabled for matches which can't impact our final standings. E.g., if on the last day of the Premiership, we can finish no higher or lower than 8th place, I want to say that the result isn't important, but I am watching the performance.

"The pressure's on them, not us."

Type: Team, Pre-match

Unlock: Underdog

Impact: Used to relax underdogs, maybe even replacing "The pressure is off" for heavy 'dogs.

"Work Hard."

Type: Team, Pre-match, Half-time

Unlock: Underdog, a man down, etc.

Meaning: One of those "Make Our Own Luck" type speeches, "Work Hard and Good Things Will Happen."

Impact: Used to encourage underdogs against stronger opposition, a team trailing by a goal at HT. Might also be useful for inspiring a team performance at HT when down by a man on a first-half red card. Might replace "I expect a win" in situations where the latter is clearly unreasonable.

"Enjoy the 2nd Half"

Type: Team, Half-time

Impact: I was up 6-0 at halftime; I just wanted the players to go out and have fun in the second half.

"Quit embarassing yourselves."

Type: Team, Half-time

Impact: I was down 0-5 at halftime - I was more upset than "Disappointed", but I didn't "Expect nothing less than a win". With that scoreline, I just wanted to appeal to their professionalism, maybe get a goal or two for personal pride!

"Keep up the Good Work"

Type: Team, Half-time

Meaning: I'm pleased, but the job isn't done yet.

Impact: Combines some of the meanings of "encourage" and "pleased". Should be acceptable to say with a one or two goal lead, or for underdogs who are still holding on to a draw at half time. The idea here is that it would combine a slight hint of "pleased" with a clear indication that the job isn't done yet. It might actually be a "No Impact" item: something that rarely goes "wrong" but doesn't "inspire" much either.

"Good Work"

Type: Team, Full-time

Impact: A neutral alternative. Used when the team was expected to win, and did, but not spectacularly. Different from "Pleased"; implies more that they did what I expected of them.

"Mission accomplished"

Type: Team, Full-time

Impact: Variation of the above. Used when we've gotten exactly what we needed out of the match, e.g., solid draw away from home, the one point we needed to clinch advancement out of a group, or a solid 2-0 win over lower-division Cup competition. Doesn't imply that I'm "Pleased", it implies that the club did exactly what I expected them to. Might follow on perfectly from things like "All we need is a draw."

"That was sloppy"

Type: Team, Full-time

Unlock: We won 1-0, or 2-1, against a team we were expected to beat, and the side looked uninspired.

Meaning: I'm not exactly "Disappointed" with their play, that's a bit harsh, but I want to let them know that I was unimpressed. I imagine that in that situation, the options might change to "Disappointed despite the win", "That was Sloppy", "Good work", "Pleased", "Delighted".

Impact: Definitely not praise, but not a particularly harsh criticism.

"Let's put this one behind us"

Type: Team, Full-time

Unlock: We lost heavily.

Meaning: I'm not happy with that, either, but let's focus on the next match.

Impact: Might mitigate some of the negative morale impact of a team's loss .. but should be demotivating if overused, or maybe if used during a long running winless streak. In particular, I wanted to say exactly this when playing in a tournament where I'd won my first two matches, played a fringe lineup in the third match, and lost heavily. If I had the ability to say anything to my team, I'd have said "Look, we were already through, let's just forget about this match and focus on the quarter-final on Wednesday."

Yep I agree that kind of thing would be excellent

Some good ideas.

Too often after a result i feel like saying something that just isn't there.

Some good ideas.

Too often after a result i feel like saying something that just isn't there.

I agree with you!

You should be able to do a mini-talk to a sub who you're bringing on. Just something like "make them work"

Some great ideas in there Roqy; at current there's just not enough options available, so to see some extra additions such as the one's you've come up with would be great.

Some really good ideas in there definitely,gotta say I agree with them all.One other thing i'd like to see is being able to talk to specific areas of the team.For example if I'm just after winning 4-3,most of the team will more than likely be on 7's or thereabouts.however,if I'm not happy with conceding 3 goals I either have to individually criticize the back 4/5 or else say I'm disappointed in the team performance which is silly after a win.What I want to be able to do is say to the attackers well done,but be able to criticize the defense as a unit at the same time,its just something that annoys me after some matches

You should be able to do a mini-talk to a sub who you're bringing on. Just something like "make them work"

That's a nice idea that is, when bringing on a subsitute it would be great to be able to give them a little team talk along those lines. It could make a big difference to the outcome of the game if used wisely.

Some good ideas. The one thing I am dearly looking forwad in Fm09 is team talks.

What about the option:

"Throw a Shoe at Becks"

What about the option:

"Throw a Shoe at Becks"

There's no real need for that is there? Try to cut it out please.

Some good ideas.

Too often after a result i feel like saying something that just isn't there.

most of the things i would like to say would prob be censord

I think that these are great suggestions. It certainly widens the range of things that could happen and what effect your talk has on the game. I find sometimes that when I say something during the team talk, the effect on the game/what eventually happens in the game is far too predictable. What I am really trying to say is that this area of the game is currently too easy to work out - you only have to see that with Wolfsong's advice on team talks - so these ideas are certainly what the game needs.

Team talks are a great idea, but like transfers they really need to overhaul this.

I think that these are great suggestions. It certainly widens the range of things that could happen and what effect your talk has on the game. I find sometimes that when I say something during the team talk, the effect on the game/what eventually happens in the game is far too predictable. What I am really trying to say is that this area of the game is currently too easy to work out - you only have to see that with Wolfsong's advice on team talks - so these ideas are certainly what the game needs.

Yeah .. that's a slight side to what I'm trying to say: right now it feels like my team talks have become almost "by rote", and definitely too predictable ... while at the same time, I often find myself unable to say the thing that I really wanted to say.

One other thing i'd like to see is being able to talk to specific areas of the team.For example if I'm just after winning 4-3,most of the team will more than likely be on 7's or thereabouts.however,if I'm not happy with conceding 3 goals I either have to individually criticize the back 4/5 or else say I'm disappointed in the team performance which is silly after a win.What I want to be able to do is say to the attackers well done,but be able to criticize the defense as a unit at the same time,its just something that annoys me after some matches

Yeah, I'm definitely with you on wanting that one ... but to be fair, I can get that effect by saying "Disappointed" to the four backs and GK, while giving my midfield, attackers, and subs all the team talk. I posted the ideas I did along the lines of "Here are some updates we can make without rewriting the entire system".

Oh, and I'm not sure that these are aimed at FM'09 ... I think this is the right time to be making suggestions for FM'10 .. as on a year-long development cycle, the time we-the-consumer are all concerned about what is going to be in the first patch is the time SI are deciding what is going to be in the next version of FM.

. . .

Hey, anybody else feel like having a go at writing a couple? Are there any that I've missed?

Some great ideas there. This is an area of the game I have felt needs improving for some time.

Personally, I would like to see more team talks more relevant to current situations. As mentioned in the op, saying 'This is your chance' to players who have been complaining about lack of first team football. I'd also like to see individual comments for players who have kicked up a fuss about moving to a bigger club (something like 'I still expect you to put in a professional performance').

I'd also like the team talks to reflect the status of the match more. In cup games, we already have 'you just need one more goal' and 'you've got one hand on the cup' at half-time. In crunch league games, what about 'we can win the title today' or 'promotion is within our reach' or 'we've got to win to stay up!'

In two-legged games, the team-talks need to be overhauled too. The AI seems to confuse the situation of the match score and aggregate score and pre-match options are usually limited. 'We can still win this', 'An away goal can kill off the game' or 'We got through, but we shouldn't have lost this game' would better reflect the situations faced in these games.

As usual, some great ideas. This has regularly been discussed as an area of the game that not only needs attention but needs expansion and these go a long way towards that. I particularly dislike, at the moment, when the game decides what options are available and the one that I want to use is not available and this should be fixed for future versions.

Lots of good ideas, but I'm very unsure on teamtalks. I've also been a huge critic of them since they were introduced, but unlike you I have found them far worse in FM08 than previous because their effect is higher and you can no longer go for the inoffensive "Encourage" when 2-0 up!

I've always said that in real life there are an infinity of possibilities for a real team talk and that the manager can tailor his team talk as he goes depending on how his players are reacting which you can't get in FM - it's just a soundbite team talk. Trouble is the existing team talks just don't do what they say on the tin so adding a whole plethora of new options would add so much confusion I think it'd be even worse unless they could be sorted out - again though I don't want them to be too predictable, but at the moment they are a bit of a lottery for someone who is not willing to read some guide put together through exhaustive testing of many different situations - I want to be able to select a team talk that I think seems sensible and not have it backfire so completely that it makes my tactics and anything I do in the 2nd half totally irrelevant!

e.g. Don't let your performance drop - Intuitively that is a very simple team talk with one meaning and one meaning only that cannot possibly be misunderstood, yet so often it result in my players' performances going through the floor. Ideally I would like to be able to combine this team talk with also letting the players know I am pleased with their 1st half - the main aim being to let them know they are doing well, but the job is only half done and they shouldn't get complacent.

Maybe individual team talks are the way to go, but how realistic are they? I have never been in a real football dressing room at half time so I have no idea what goes on. Does the manager give a general team talk and then speak to lots of players individually as well? Presumably he still expects the general team talk to apply to those individuals also - he just wants to give them an extra word in addition to that?

Totally agree!

I would like a "extra training this week" option after a particularly bad performance.

You should be able to do a mini-talk to a sub who you're bringing on. Just something like "make them work"

Yes! Yes! Yes! Make it happen!

Lots of good ideas, but I'm very unsure on teamtalks. I've also been a huge critic of them since they were introduced, but unlike you I have found them far worse in FM08 than previous because their effect is higher and you can no longer go for the inoffensive "Encourage" when 2-0 up!

I've always said that in real life there are an infinity of possibilities for a real team talk and that the manager can tailor his team talk as he goes depending on how his players are reacting which you can't get in FM - it's just a soundbite team talk. Trouble is the existing team talks just don't do what they say on the tin so adding a whole plethora of new options would add so much confusion I think it'd be even worse unless they could be sorted out - again though I don't want them to be too predictable, but at the moment they are a bit of a lottery for someone who is not willing to read some guide put together through exhaustive testing of many different situations - I want to be able to select a team talk that I think seems sensible and not have it backfire so completely that it makes my tactics and anything I do in the 2nd half totally irrelevant!

e.g. Don't let your performance drop - Intuitively that is a very simple team talk with one meaning and one meaning only that cannot possibly be misunderstood, yet so often it result in my players' performances going through the floor. Ideally I would like to be able to combine this team talk with also letting the players know I am pleased with their 1st half - the main aim being to let them know they are doing well, but the job is only half done and they shouldn't get complacent.

Fair enough, glamdring.

I've got much the same frustration you have about the "do what it says on the tin" approach .. personally, I think team-talks should rarely if ever have a *negative* outcome and especially not as negative as they do now.

Sure, if I crank up the pressure on a team full of players who can't handle pressure, that should have a negative effect .. but the whole "demotivating the players at half time" seems completely unrealistic to me, especially when we're dealing with professionals at the top of their game.

From my playing days, I can't remember a single team-talk which I felt demotivated me - where in FM'08, I've had some really odd results.

After winning the first two games of group play and guaranteeing themselves first in the group stage of a tournament, I put the backups in for the third game and told them that the pressure was off .. IRL, I think that would be pretty understandable: we've locked up first place, so lets just have fun and put in a good showing. We were down 0-5 at halftime, so I got disappointed or angry with them at half-time .. and because I'd said that the game didn't matter, they got even more confused and we wound up finishing out 0-8. (My backups weren't *that* bad!)

My hope in providing more options is basically that, with more options available, there's a better chance of each of them doing exactly what they say on the tin ..

.. but yes, in general, I'd like to see team-talks softened so that its less likely to come up with one that inspires a great performance, or triggers an awful performance.

From a purely simulation perspective I love the idea of more variety in team talks and feeling as if I'm getting to say what I want to say, but from a purely gaming calculative perspective more options equals more grief.

The way I see it works is that team talks give an artificial boost/hit to player performance. How it does this I'm not entirely sure (morale -> attributes, attributes directly, increased probability of 'successful' decison making,...?). So to me adding more options would just give the illusion of more control assuming they maintain the current range of possible team talk effects. It would refine the scale but the range would still be the same. And refining the scale just adds to more ambiguity especially if all team talks are available regardless of the specific scenario.

But even if they made the team talks more varied based on a wider spread of 'unlock' triggers rather than having every option available at all times (which is probably not doable because of the input/output nature of it), it would still be an illusion of control. I say this because I'm assuming a multiplier effect and that regardless of the number of options given the range remains the same and the same range is applied to both team's team talk to negate any unfair advantage effect.

So consider the current system. Let's say the range is +10% Attribute Boost to -10% Attribute Hit. The range has to remain fixed in my opinion for continuity and fair play. So for a particular scenario you get 9 options and depending on the player each of these options has an effect

(+10%, +7.5%, +5%, +2.5%, 0, -2.5%, -5%, -7.5%, -10%)

So if SI consider the current team talk effect to be what they want it to be then they will keep the same range. Hence all you'd really be doing is changing the wording with the effect remaining the same. Adding more options would be refining the scale and this can add to the annoyance factor (see the whole 'why 20 notches for the Mentality slider' complaint).

What I do find intriguing is the focused effect. So certain choices can effect certain attributes only and that effect can depend on player personality. That to me would be an interesting way to go but as you and others have mentioned I'm of the opinion that it is an overdone effect. There's too many reports of scenarios like you described (5-0 down at half time) to make it purely about tactics. It's the type of thing where I'd love to be able to find out actual professionals opinion of team talks. Sure I can understand a younger player who has doubts being helped by the right words from his manager, but a 25/26+ year old with 100s of matches worth of experience?

It's also interesting what you and pcmeister mentioned about the predictability of it. It shows for me that SI can't really win in that much like the 'too accurate staff reports' there will always be FMers on either side of the argument. In this case it's me who does not want even more team talk choices and even more figuring out what the hell went wrong. It's hard enough as is to figure out whether it was tactics, team talks, morale, players making dumb decisions or just bad luck without adding more to the confusion.

So yes more options would be nice to make for more 'control', a more involving experience and more variety. But fundamentally there's only so much they can do: Decrease Performance -> No Effect -> Increase Performance. Refine that scale and it adds to the confusion. Widen the range and it can result in crazy things. As it stands my experience of it (and others based on postings on here) is that the range needs to be made narrower.

As always, Am, I love your ideas. I've read this thread Pre- problems, and althouhg I didn't get around to commenting on it, I do think that the majority of what you've said is needed

A post I made a while ago, just to add the thread.

Just keep playing as you are - Kind of like the current 'Don't let your performance drop', but more clearly defined.

Try to hang on to the lead - If you are a smaller club winning in a gme you are not expected to.

If we win this we'll get out of the relegation zone/ into the playoffs/ go top... - For if any of the scenarios apply.

I know you made a mistake, but focus on the rest of the game - For if an individual makes a mistake in game. (half time)

Keep your head up after today - If an individual makes a mistake in game. (full time)

I need a goal from you - To a striker.

An expansion on this idea is the introduction of team talks for substitutes - like when a player is brought on, something could be said.

A few examples include:

Help protect the lead - If you are in front in a game; more likely for defence or midfield.

I need a goal from you - If you're behind and you bring on a striker, or perhaps a midfielder.

For the substitute teams talks of course some of the current options would be available, such as 'You have faith', or 'Expect a performance'.

That post would look better if I could figure out the bold tags and what not.

I really want the possibility of saying what I'm usually thinking when I'm losing.... GET YOUR FU**ING AR**S IN GEAR YOU OVERPAID BUNCH OF KN**BHEADS!

I think I'd be single though if i shouted it while my girlfriend was asleep or watching big brother though lol

SI: Can't you just hire Amoroq?

SI: Can't you just hire Amoroq?

LMAO.. I am a game developer. They have my e-mail.

GazTheDood - good stuff, exactly the sort of thing I was thinking of .. p.s., the code for bold tags etc is exactly the same as on the old forum .. but if you're used to using the GUI, there's a setting you can do in your personal profile to "Use Advanced Interface" or something, it'll give you all the things you're used to: B I U, fonts, etc.