unforgiveable mistake in the new patch!

Many people here wouldn't care about this but the new patch completely ruined thousands of players' FM pleasure.

In the latest version (8.0.2), the best two sides in Turkish League, Fenerbahce and Galatasaray are doomed with bankruptcy within one or two seasons into the game due to a coding error - which means it can't be fixed with the editor. The ticket prices of those two clubs are very low and they keep losing money drastically. Interestingly, Fenerbahce has the second highest average ticket price in Europe after Arsenal (yes, this is true - I am not lying, source: Deloitte) but still SI made this huge mistake.

To make matters worse, I have just read in Turkish FM forums that the testing team found this error while testing the Beta version two days ago but SI refused to fix it as they wanted to release the patch on the 14th of February.

I have been playing CM and FM since god knows when, always with my beloved Fenerbahce. There is no way I will keep playing now. And the same situation is also valid for many other Fenerbahce and Galatasaray fans.

Thanks SI(!) for this ridiculous error and not fixing it despite knowing!

Many people here wouldn't care about this but the new patch completely ruined thousands of players' FM pleasure.

In the latest version (8.0.2), the best two sides in Turkish League, Fenerbahce and Galatasaray are doomed with bankruptcy within one or two seasons into the game due to a coding error - which means it can't be fixed with the editor. The ticket prices of those two clubs are very low and they keep losing money drastically. Interestingly, Fenerbahce has the second highest average ticket price in Europe after Arsenal (yes, this is true - I am not lying, source: Deloitte) but still SI made this huge mistake.

To make matters worse, I have just read in Turkish FM forums that the testing team found this error while testing the Beta version two days ago but SI refused to fix it as they wanted to release the patch on the 14th of February.

I have been playing CM and FM since god knows when, always with my beloved Fenerbahce. There is no way I will keep playing now. And the same situation is also valid for many other Fenerbahce and Galatasaray fans.

Thanks SI(!) for this ridiculous error and not fixing it despite knowing!

It just makes it more of a challenge.

No it ruins the realism of the turkish leagues. In a few yers the 2 top teams become poos and this effects pretty much everythinh, like transfers, teams can´t keep players, finances ruined...

I wrote about it in the bugs forum yesterday. -> http://community.sigames.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9482076743/m/9142029083

And can you find a woraround for this problem, like you did for defoe? That´s a challenge!

shouldn't this be raise in the data forum?

That is poor form on SI's part but unfortunately that's the way of the commercial world. If sales of FM in Turkey don't contribute significantly to their profits then thsi won't be seen as a pressing issue if the desire release date is necessary to satisfy their business needs.

There is a workaround I could suggest but it is a highly unrealistic one. But if helps you play as your favourite team then f realism.

Run a test game to figure out the ticket pricing then adjust your team's maximum/minimum/average attendance to compensate for this loss in revenue. This way you can approximately get the revenues you feel represent those of your team.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fgu82:

Many people here wouldn't care about this but the new patch completely ruined thousands of players' FM pleasure. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would love to know where you get your stats from.

Also, to the original point. Yes, its an error. There are bound to be a few overlooked. I'm pretty sure that, with the other two "major" problems, SI will re-release the patch with the major coding errors fixed.

And also, why cant you change ticket prices in the editor. (I've not used the Editor since FM07, and you could there.)

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by isuckatfm:

That is poor form on SI's part but unfortunately that's the way of the commercial world. If sales of FM in Turkey don't contribute significantly to their profits then thsi won't be seen as a pressing issue if the desire release date is necessary to satisfy their business needs.

There is a workaround I could suggest but it is a highly unrealistic one. But if helps you play as your favourite team then f realism.

Run a test game to figure out the ticket pricing then adjust your team's maximum/minimum/average attendance to compensate for this loss in revenue. This way you can approximately get the revenues you feel represent those of your team. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Our HR found a woraround, but it´s also quite unrealistic. It is to make the stadium capacity of the teams 100.000 and 200.000 and increase the average attendance.

who cares??? i mean, who plays the turkish leagues? i sure as hell dont!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Skunner:

It just makes it more of a challenge. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No it doesn't. It just makes it impossible to play the Turkish leaugue in a realistic way.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NepentheZ:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fgu82:

Many people here wouldn't care about this but the new patch completely ruined thousands of players' FM pleasure. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would love to know where you get your stats from.

Also, to the original point. Yes, its an error. There are bound to be a few overlooked. I'm pretty sure that, with the other two "major" problems, SI will re-release the patch with the major coding errors fixed.

And also, why cant you change ticket prices in the editor. (I've not used the Editor since FM07, and you could there.) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know how many copies of FM2008 were sold in Turkey, assuming an approximate value of 15000-20000. 60-65% percent of Turkey support either Fenerbahce or Galatasaray so there is good chance they would start games with those clubs. And I've just read in the bugs forum that the other big Turkish side, Besiktas also suffer from the same problem, which means 90% of the FM players in Turkey are cursing on SI right now.

Coding problems can't be fixed with the editor, that's why we are so upset.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mattyspurs76:

who cares??? i mean, who plays the turkish leagues? i sure as hell dont! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I do. Many other do. If you don´t care, don´t even write here then.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fgu82:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NepentheZ:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fgu82:

Many people here wouldn't care about this but the new patch completely ruined thousands of players' FM pleasure. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I would love to know where you get your stats from.

Also, to the original point. Yes, its an error. There are bound to be a few overlooked. I'm pretty sure that, with the other two "major" problems, SI will re-release the patch with the major coding errors fixed.

And also, why cant you change ticket prices in the editor. (I've not used the Editor since FM07, and you could there.) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know how many copies of FM2008 were sold in Turkey, assuming an approximate value of 15000-20000. 60-65% percent of Turkey support either Fenerbahce or Galatasaray so there is good chance they would start games with those clubs. And I've just read in the bugs forum that the other big Turkish side, Besiktas also suffer from the same problem, which means 90% of the FM players in Turkey are cursing on SI right now.

Coding problems can't be fixed with the editor, that's why we are so upset. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It´s is not annoying only for them who plays with these teams, it is the same for the ones who plays with other teams in the league. Who want the top clus in the league to get bankrupt in a few years. Totally unrealistic. Make the league unplayable.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mattyspurs76:

who cares??? i mean, who plays the turkish leagues? i sure as hell dont! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's a pity that offensive language is banned in the forums. As Deza said, if you don't care, don't write here.

Fenerbahce and Galatasaray have much greater fanbase that many world-famous clubs. And you can't believe how many FM & CM websites there are in Turkey - the game is quite popular here.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mattyspurs76:

who cares??? i mean, who plays the turkish leagues? i sure as hell dont! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

that is a very arrogant and selfish thing to say.

Just because you dont want to play a certain league, it does not mean that no one else does. FM is meant for everyone, not just you...

i think the main point is overlooked here.

Here we have the long awaited saviour patch from SI - which comes with a workaround! - Great testing there. If it only takes a few mins to adjust the database then why didnt they do that before they released the DB!?

And here less than 24 hours later another problem which(i havnt seen proof for) SI could have fixed before release.

I think SI are great for responding to try and fix it all, but the forums have been dead just waiting for a proper game - ideally before FM09. And there was no fan pressue to get this relase out for valentines, so why rush it?

Im just about to boot up my game(which hasnt been touched in months) and i hope it shows me a worthy predacessor to an otherwise solid series.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mattyspurs76:

who cares??? i mean, who plays the turkish leagues? i sure as hell dont! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You sir are an arse.

With a bit of luck you'll do us all a favour and turn that yellow card into a red before long, therefore ridding us of your presence and not forcing us to read crap like you've written here.

As for the original point, I haven't installed the 8.0.2 patch yet, I have no intention of doing so until I've gone as far as I can with my current Gateshead save which I'm enjoying immensly. However, I imagine this is very annoying for those people who want to play as either of these two teams. Unfortunately editing that stadium capacity may be your only choice, but to be honest you really shouldn't have to.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Neville_Roach:

i think the main point is overlooked here.

Here we have the long awaited saviour patch from SI - which comes with a workaround! - Great testing there. If it only takes a few mins to adjust the database then why didnt they do that before they released the DB!?

And here less than 24 hours later another problem which(i havnt seen proof for) SI could have fixed before release.

I think SI are great for responding to try and fix it all, but the forums have been dead just waiting for a proper game - ideally before FM09. And there was no fan pressue to get this relase out for valentines, so why rush it?

Im just about to boot up my game(which hasnt been touched in months) and i hope it shows me a worthy predacessor to an otherwise solid series. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

SI was aware of these problems before they released 8.0.2. At least the knew about this turkish issue. Our HR found this problem when testing the patch a few days before the release, but because SI was in a rush to release the patch for valentines day, they had locked the 8.0.2 code so nothing could be fixed.

And why are this thing about to release a patch in valentines day. Everyone was expecting 8.0.2 at the end of this month. Unfortunately this release rush made this patch not as good as I and others hoped.

to fgu82 :

Does your issue happens when you are starting a new game choosing the 8.0.2 updated database or simply any database with the patch 8.0.2.

If you isolated this issue to the latest 8.0.2 DB update , you may check with the DB editor the latest transfers ( or any other causes ) that may be causing the "financial break down" of these two clubs.

sorry I just saw you said "it can't be fixed with the editor" , so definitely in the code ... sorry

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Yvan B.:

to fgu82 :

Does your issue happens when you are starting a new game choosing the 8.0.2 updated database or simply any database with the patch 8.0.2.

If you isolated this issue to the latest 8.0.2 DB update , you may check with the DB editor the latest transfers ( or any other causes ) that may be causing the "financial break down" of these two clubs. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This issue has to do with the coding. The values for gate receipts is given correct in the db for these teams. But some coding in the game makes this values dropp very much to an unrealistic value. And this make these teams to lose many millions every year because of too low gate receipts.

Could you not increase the ticket price to a level that combats the problem of low gate recipts or is it that the crowds are low which in turn gives you a low gate recipt?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Arsenal71:

Could you not increase the ticket price to a level that combats the problem of low gate recipts or is it that the crowds are low which in turn gives you a low gate recipt? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don´t think this issue can be fixed by editing in the editor, like the defoe problem. If it was like that, a solution would had come up already. This has to do with the coding and can only be fixed by SI.

The current 8.0.2 file is going to be replaced by another one which does not contain the Tottenham/Portsmouth glitch. SI should also fix this issues for the updated file.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mattyspurs76:

who cares??? i mean, who plays the turkish leagues? i sure as hell dont! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

As the OP has already stated - it will affect these two major clubs and thus the Champions League and the transfer market.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by macawber:

The current 8.0.2 file is going to be replaced by another one which does not contain the Tottenham/Portsmouth glitch. SI should also fix this issues for the updated file. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Really hope that

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Deza:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Arsenal71:

Could you not increase the ticket price to a level that combats the problem of low gate recipts or is it that the crowds are low which in turn gives you a low gate recipt? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don´t think this issue can be fixed by editing in the editor, like the defoe problem. If it was like that, a solution would had come up already. This has to do with the coding and can only be fixed by SI. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Have you tried? The defoe problem has a work around as with diarra's.

Wouldn't a fix be to use the editor and pump up the cash of the 2 teams but make sure you don't spend it on transfers so it negates the loss?

These are all temporary workarounds at best. After a couple of seasons both teams become unmanagable. The only real solution seems to be a fix by SI.

There have been many bugs, errors, etc. in the CM and FM series so far - and there will be many more in the future, it's inevitable. But I have always thought that SI guys were doing their best and sort the problems as soon as they could.

But this time is different. The head of Turkish testing team just wrote in the Turkish CM & FM forum that (turkpostal.com - it's all in Turkish anyway) "SI was aware of this problem after the BETA testing feedback but they said it is too late to unlock the code and fix it as they wanted to release the patch on St. Valentine's day". It makes me mad. If only they delayed a couple of more days, we wouldn't be complaining here. I really can't understand why SI chose to be so negligent!

Any official response?

That's it for me. As a long time fan of the game going all the way back to CM2 SI have finally lost me as a customer. The way I see it is that I've paid for a faulty product from a manufacturer that has failed to resolve major known issues.

As customers in any other industry we would be entitled to ask for our money back but unfortunately we are now expected to wait and pay another 30 quid for the next release of FM. Thanks SI but you can stick it.

despite it seems like a blow for SI, i think it will be dealt with in next patch update along with defoe problem.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> The way I see it is that I've paid for a faulty product from a manufacturer that has failed to resolve major known issues.

As customers in any other industry we would be entitled to ask for our money back </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You do realise that would not fly in court?

Don't think it would be worth anyone's while taking on the might of SI in a court room over a 30 quid computer game.

Probably what SI are banking on!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zidan172:

Don't think it would be worth anyone's while taking on the might of SI in a court room over a 30 quid computer game.

Probably what SI are banking on! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Shouldn't the suit be filed against Sega anyway?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by mattyspurs76:

who cares??? i mean, who plays the turkish leagues? i sure as hell dont! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Obviously the person who started the topic cared, what if it was your spurs that happened to, and the SI folks just said 'Who cares', Exactly, so just hush.

And guys I really hope this doesn't keep you away from FM, Everyone makes mistakes and SI are not GOD they are human beings so give them a chance to correct their mistakes.

why is it that people seem to want to settle every minor problem in court these days?personally i think it would be amusing to watch someone rack up hundreds of pounds of legal bills, to get their £30 back. more power to you I say.

Its a shame that the patch still isnt perfect, and i do feel for you, it is most annoying to have a game ruined in that way. all i can suggest, as a temporary measure, is to uninstall the game and then reinstall and load back to the 1st patch (i.e. November's) so you can carry on and wait for this to be fixed.

I hope you have a save to go back to before you got financially raped up the Tottenham, so your game isnt a total write off

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by zidan172:

As customers in any other industry we would be entitled to ask for our money back but unfortunately we are now expected to wait and pay another 30 quid for the next release of FM. Thanks SI but you can stick it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Go to your retailer and plead your case then. They're the ones who would give you your money back.

It's unfortunate when errors like this appear but SI will have a look at it I'm sure.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Si BHA:

We wouldn't rush the patch out knowing that there's a specific, big issue. Everyone here is now fully aware of the problem and we'll see if there's anything we can do to rectify it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And what about the Bord Confidence bug ?

You guys surely had to be aware of that problem and still it wasn't solved in any acceptable manner.

I really wonder why the complete Board stuff wasn't simply deactivated. If it's impossible to get it properly running, there is always the simple solution to remove it. It's surely not like the board stuff is an integral part, that can't be taken away from the rest of the game.

god, touchy sods...i only gave my opinion.

probably because i dont know the league so i dont bother loading it up, i presumed there were others out there the same but i guess not.

Were not 'Touchy Sods'

Just don't like rude people coming to the forum and looking out for themselfs and only themselfs.

im out there and im the same, the difference is that just because i dont load it up doesnt mean that i dont expect anyone else to load it up. Its just a little consideration for you know........ other people, imagine it was the english league that was cocked up totally. or if I turned round and said "tottenham cant expand their stadium in reallife, so why can they on FM?" would you not moan about that.

Its not people being touchy, and at the risk of recieving a booking myself, its you being ignorant of what other people think and hat there priorities are compared to yours.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Si BHA:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Silrog:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Si BHA:

We wouldn't rush the patch out knowing that there's a specific, big issue. Everyone here is now fully aware of the problem and we'll see if there's anything we can do to rectify it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And what about the Bord Confidence bug ?

You guys surely had to be aware of that problem and still it wasn't solved in any acceptable manner.

I really wonder why the complete Board stuff wasn't simply deactivated. If it's impossible to get it properly running, there is always the simple solution to remove it. It's surely not like the board stuff is an integral part, that can't be taken away from the rest of the game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well it depends on what board confidence problems you're referring to. Problems such as the board not recognising who you've lost to (so lets say you don't get far in the Cup because you drew a big club) are not easily fixed in a patch. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is extremely sad to read. Sadly the board confidence is the very reason long term games are very difficult on FM 2008.

I am sad that this has occured with FM 2008. I really could see plenty of potential in this release, the new features looked like they would really add to the game.

Sadly this release is flawed in ways which make my style of play impossible. Expectations above and beyond what is realistic, being sacked for bad luck, are all issues which are sadly not good enough. The board are far too critical, if you look at the threads on the first page you will realise this.

I can't say nothing else really, I didn't expect it to be fixed either. I just hope you can all get FM 09 back on track and with a product I can enjoy.

(I am not one to whine either!)

Can not SI make a quick fix for that ?

If not then the only solution is to make a trainer and edit money real time yourself.

Thanks for the offical response Si BHA, let's hope something will be done to rectify this.

Yet, was the head of Turkish testing team lying when he said the patch was released despite SI knowing the situation?