I made a big mistake which led to me getting the sack!

Ok so i started a new game unemployed and after 16 games Crewe offered me the job as they had sacked their current manager and were lying in 22nd place without a win in 12. I took over and managed to get a couple of loan signings in before I then changed their tactics around and by the end of the season I finished 8th just 1 point off the play offs which my side let me down on the last day and I would have made it and perhaps got promoted.

Anyway in the 2nd season I started looking at the wage bill as every month I was losing alot of money. Something like 140k per month. It looks as though 90% of my squad was getting paid stupid money and then getting appearance fees plus bonuses after x amount of games. I'm not a fan of this. So in pre-season I decided that I would get rid of the players that were getting paid over 1k plus shifted any players that just weren't good enough to play for me. I decided to sign some young blood on better wages that would eventually get me some profit. I then sacked my current backroom staff and got some decent staff in on alot lower wages. I planned this as a 2 year plan. Sign mediocre young players that would progress in the first season and then in the second season then push for the play offs.

This is where I went wrong. I released too many good experienced players and I signed quite a lot of youth players. These players were actually quite decent but due to a lack of experience in my squad I managed to get 2 wins in 12 before the chairman got tired of it and has now just sacked me 22 games in. I wasn't too impressed as I had got together what I thought would be a really good squad in a year or twos time. Perhaps I should have signed these players just for my "youth team" and then progressed with last years squad until they were actually good enough. Anyway I took a chance and it got me in trouble. I enjoyed it though.

I now feel sorry for Crewe as i've left them in a bit of a mess. It looks like they are going to fall out of the football league. Im sorry Crewe I still loved managing you!

Has anyone else done anything like this before and either failed or succeeded I would like to know your stories.

I do this all the time. Too many changes too soon leaves you quite butt sore! I managed not to do this with the last team I took over and they have really progressed. Working with what you have is usually the best way to succeed.

I don't usually make too many changes at once, no. I do usually sack most of the backroom staff in my first season though. If you still want to manage them you could always add a new manager and take them over and continue your work!

The only time I got away with making a lot of changes was with Real Madrid when I basically bought a new team in pre-season. They all had highly professional personalities and just got on with it.

With small clubs those veterans are essential, even if they're not as good on paper. I've also trashed teams by overdoing the new broom approach.

Too many changes is definitely a problem. I will try to keep a squad of 17 players (minimum) from the original squad, and will sign up to 5 players to bring the total squad size to 20. Players I don't want in the squad I will try to sell (even give away on a free) or release them but I don't set the status to not needed, always backup as upsetting players is not a good plan (Perhaps I should have told Andre Villas Boas this)

That will be it for me in the first season, except for setting up my 3 tactics.

In the summer, I will try to sign a new backroom staff, and replace anyone out of contract etc. I also try to limit it to 3/4 signings per season, although in the lower leagues, this can be difficult (I am currently a VERY cash strapped welling in 2025 and after releasing a couple of players, a couple of retirements and a few players refusing new deals, I have 9 players in the team!!!! So I have no choice but to sign a stack of players.

Well i decided to holiday and get the computer to apply for jobs for me. 18 months on Crewe are now out of the football league after finishing 24th. I have now taken control of league 2 side Macclesfield Town. They have decent players with some transfer funds available. I'll not be doing the overhaul this time around. 4-5 players signings minimum!

I always like to sign a couple of oldies but goldies who are on their last legs and dropping down a tier or two to help the loads of youngsters I sign. There are two categories - last season hoorahs where they have excellent mental attributes but their legs are shot. Sign them on a season-long contract so that you've got a cool head or two when the going gets tough. Then there are those whose careers have spluttered and are willing to drop a league or two, but who can still put in a proper shift for a few seasons. They can hang around for a bit (2-4 seasons) until the youngsters have progressed enough to take over. It's always worth looking for old players whose contact is unlikely to be renewed, are listed for free or who've already been released. If they're still at a club, it sometimes pays to wait for them to be released, as their wage demands often plummet when they're unattached.

This means that at the start of my career my teams are always full of 17-20 year olds and a handful of 30-38 year olds.

You don't need to keep the dross at your club, but it really pays to have a few veterans, especially as captain.

I make the changes in 6 month cycles.

June buy youth and players better than I currently have, replacing the worst players and strengthening positions.

Then I sell fringe players/players I don't need or use in January

Might sign some players in January if I need backup players

June comes around - I'll sign some players better than my current crop in the positions that need straightening the most.

January - sell the fringe players/players I replaced from the June buy

January - might buy or loan a player if I need backup players.

This seems to keep squad harmony relatively good and doesn't upset the tart.

Generally then I can get a team that's better than what I started in about 6 transfer windows, or 3 seasons basically.

I don't think that too many changes are in itself a problem. Too much loss of CA is more serious, though. You should have kept a good 1st XI.

In my experience, the "too many changes" gelling problems set in already at 5-6 new players in and a similar amount out. With Andorra I changed all 25 players in one season and still got promoted, and at least 15 new players in second season and got promoted then as well. The same thing in the 3rd season in BBVA. The team was significantly improved, though. I signed players that were already good, though - no young talent would be good enough for the league above in just one season, so imo it is pointless signing young players before you reach the Premier League because by the time they have reached their potential you should have moved on years ago.

In any case, 5 in 5 out and you have a gelling problem which as far as I can tell will not be worse if that was 25 in and 25 out. If you plan on re-shaping the club from top to bottom, you might as well do so as fast as possible - but change for change's sake is pointless; at the very least the new players must suit your tactic better than the ones you kick out.

yeah too many changes early on especially if yor not getting results is a bad thing....... .. it sounds like your tried to complete a 5 year plan in 2 seasons lol...

I don't think too many chances is a problem either, if they're the right changes. Sometimes it's just needed.

In my first Truro season after they got newly promoted to BSS in FM2011, I had 23 players in, and six out. 18 in on second season, and a fair few out. 14 in on the 3rd season, and 22 out. Ends up less in, more out for a couple of seasons, but I continued to bring in around 10 players a year till we started challenging for the EPL title.

It can work - but you really do need to have a decent CA to them all. Plus, go more for current ability than potential in lower leagues. If you can get both, great, go for it, but you often wont be holding into these players for long, if you can get the talent to get back to back promotions.

I think they can be though Krald.. it even says it in the FM handbook... Changes that you may think is perfectly fine and logical the club could take a different way but the main thing is simply results... if you are winning all the time then the changes wont matter even the most extreme but if you get rid of players especially the higher earners who are probably seen as the first teamers and you then lose some games .. despite it being the correct way forward you can get sacked....I remember once in one game I player I sacked 4 or 5 reserves because I couldnt sell them even for free and I simply wanted to free up wages so I could purchase a player and I got hammered for it and got the chairman's famous ' we have faith in you' speach... and then got sacked the same way the OP did.....

I raised a call with SI at the time and they explained that because I sacked so many players in a short time and then had a few bad games thats why I got sacked....... despite it being the right thing to do at the time.

The key though it always results... you can pretty much do what you want if you keep winning