Wonderkid with PA 157?!

I only use fmrte to correct accidental mistakes but i stumbled upon this baffling piece of stat AFTER i splashed out 25m for a 20year old "wonderkid".

This guy is right footed, does not have any amazing hidden stats and in the information tab he is described by the game as a wonderkid. He has CA 149 but a PA of only 157. My team is rated on the highest level by the game reports at the moment i.e. messi, ronaldo etc get 4.5 stars and i am in the premier league in 2015.

i had a few quid to spend on a winger so it was either this supposed wonderkid that i could mold into a world beater or an already baked player with more

CA but possibly less PA.

so i scouted this player for 3 games with 2 different scouts (one JPA 19 JPP 20 WWY 19, one JPA 20 JPP 20 WWY 20) and they both gave me 4 star PA ratings and 3 star CA ratings. I realise that there scope for them to get it a bit wrong on a 20 year old but from my experience 4 star PAs for 20 year olds mean around 170-180 PA. Also why does the game describe him as a wonderkid?

Just when I thought I was beginning to understand this game...

Wonderkid means high CA at a young age, it has nothing to do with PA. Scouts estimate PA based on CA and age so it's not surprising they've got it a bit wrong in this case.

Plenty of "wonderkids" in real life, that has stopped developing at an early age, isn't there?

I had a player with a CA of 156 he scored 20 goals and assisted 20 in 40 matches. He also won English player of the year and Champions league best player, his average rating was higher than Aguero, Tevez and David Silva. It is possible that a player with a PA of 157 could become a great player.

Had a left back at Fiorentina, he won world defender of the year a couple of times. I checked his Hidden Stats at the end of his career - he only had a PA of 147.

CA and PA are not the only attributes that make a player "world class".

This defender was just a work horse and played outstanding every single game, whatever way I had him set up in the system. Nobody could touch his spot in the team.

It's still possible for a guy with "only" 157 PA to become a 4 star player for a high reputation club. If they get really lucky with their attribute spread they might become World Class, or near at least, in a single postion/role, in the same way that a player with 200PA but a poor attribute spread will only become a good player. I've won titles in top Leagues and Champions Leagues with no players above 157 PA, partly because the AI is rubbish at squad building but mainly because a player with 157 CA and the right attributes is a damn good player.

As Aktsjon Mann said, a wonderkid is just a player who is below a certain age who has a CA above a certain value it doesn't take into account the PA of the player. Sounds like your player is one that only just qualifies as a wonderkid.

I won the league with Sunderland and the highest PA was 157.

Does P.A measure ability, or effectiveness. I thought it meant ability, which is why i'm surprised that any wonderkid could have so low a P.A. There's a difference between being very talented and very successful/effective, I'm thinking of players like Denilson (the '90's Betis one) and of course many others, truly phenomenally talented players, but who didn't go on to have maybe quite the stellar career (imo) that some lesser able players have. Whilst other factors may have limited their careers, it certainly wasn't their level of ability.

Loads of players in all sports have had huge levels of ability, but not a commensurately huge level of success, but isn't P.A be a measure of pure ability, rather than pure effectiveness? Could any player have been more naturally talented than say, Denilson, but I don't remember his P.A being anywhere near 200. Managers often fall in love with an underacheiving player's pure ability and believe that they could be the key to unlocking that potential; surely those players should have very high P.A, if not very high C.A.

Are those players effectively, the misunderstood genius, the high risk/reward, huge upside type, properly present and reflected in F.M?

So, anyway, what is P.A in the game, pure ability, or genuine effectiveness?

Potential Ability...

Bit of common sense really...

Potential means how good they could become, but not how good they will become. They need the right training and tutoring to reach their PA.

I didnt know that scout reports work that way. That is definitely more realistic than how I thought it would be. Anyway don't get me wrong, I 've had a few players with around 150 CA that were amazing performers and even won the champions league like that. no arguing there. My only gripe is that I splashed the cash on this bloke expecting him to be the next bale or something. He has a really good attribute spread as well - had he had a higher PA he would have been class in 2-3 seasons. Anyway thanks for the insides into scout reports and everything.

I don't know what my top goalpoachers CA is, but I reckon it is 160 +- 5. He is rated as my 4th best striker by the staff, and was given 2.5 stars by all my scouts when I signed him at 19. He is about to become Sevilla's all-time leading league goal scorer, and if you can do that with a CA of 160ish then that is one hell of a player! I use to think 180 PA players are automatically better than 160 CA players as well, but its just NOT the case.

If a player has a good personality and good 'attribute combinations' then he can be a top top player, end of story.

I had a player with a CA of 156 he scored 20 goals and assisted 20 in 40 matches. He also won English player of the year and Champions league best player, his average rating was higher than Aguero, Tevez and David Silva. It is possible that a player with a PA of 157 could become a great player.

sfg, from my understanding if you subtract CA from PA then you get a number eg PA 170 - CA 120 = 50 This allows your player (theoretically) to increase his attributes according to a weighting system for his position. for example +1 in pace for a winger is worth more of that difference than +1 pace for a CB. So if your player has this PA to reach and is in a good age and has a high professionalism attribute and you keep him happy most of the time (as in his morale) and you play him enough and you train himwell and your coaches rating and facilities ratings are good, he should reach that potential eventually. As you can see there is a lot of scope for variation.

I don't know what my top goalpoachers CA is, but I reckon it is 160 +- 5. He is rated as my 4th best striker by the staff, and was given 2.5 stars by all my scouts when I signed him at 19. He is about to become Sevilla's all-time leading league goal scorer, and if you can do that with a CA of 160ish then that is one hell of a player! I use to think 180 PA players are automatically better than 160 CA players as well, but its just NOT the case.

If a player has a good personality and good 'attribute combinations' then he can be a top top player, end of story.

A player with 160 CA can become a world class player performance wise some people are just obsessed with PA and CA.

CA and PA don't mean everything at least not to me. It's all about distribution.

it is distribution, i have looked in geniescout and found PA 190+ that are worse then 165's

In past FM's it was either 170 or 175 for a player to potentially go worldwide can't 100% remember, but its now 160 so I can see why he could have wonderkid description.

A player with 160 CA can become a world class player performance wise some people are just obsessed with PA and CA.

+1 on that one mate.

Too many people concerned with what a player's attributes look like, not enough people concerned with how they perform.

Too many people concerned with what a player's attributes look like, not enough people concerned with how they perform.

Biggest problem with FM (players).

Too many people concerned with what a player's attributes look like, not enough people concerned with how they perform.

Isn't it reasonable to say that how a player performs is a function of their attributes and the role they're put in, assuming that the hidden attributes are included in that consideration?

That being said, if the player is doing well then obviously his attributes are adequate for his role and there's no need to fret over whether he has enough [insert random attribute here] or not.

To respond to the OP, Ross Barkley is quite similar on my current save. End of season 2, he wins player of the year while on loan in the Championship and is labeled a Wonderkid, with 137 CA and 154 or so PA. Reputation probably plays into it - a locally known player of a certain CA/PA is not going to be considered a wonderkid, but a highly touted prospect for a top division club with the same skill level might be. Performing well in an established competition would probably give him the exposure and subsequent reputation gain to allow the wonderkid label.

It does looks like you've been slightly unfortunate there. The description of wonderkid is only influenced by CA, and not PA unfortunately. As others have said, PA isn't everything. But unless he has a killer attribute spread (and judging from your post it doesn't sound like he does), then he'll never be the world beater you were hoping he'd be when you signed him.

Maybe not a world-beater, but its still possible to sculpt one hell of a role player, depending on what his strengths and weaknesses are, ofc.

It does looks like you've been slightly unfortunate there. The description of wonderkid is only influenced by CA, and not PA unfortunately. As others have said, PA isn't everything. But unless he has a killer attribute spread (and judging from your post it doesn't sound like he does), then he'll never be the world beater you were hoping he'd be when you signed him.

I'm the biggest club in the world and have a 2 star rated striker who bangs them in.

Although not as good as my 3 star winger who I've had for years who is guaranteed to get 20 assists every season who never once wins any award or gets a national team call up

it is distribution, i have looked in geniescout and found PA 190+ that are worse then 165's

The thing about star rating and PA is that it is very much tied up into age. This player here has been stuck at 2 stars CA for at least two years. Yesterday he became 2,5 star CA, while PA has dropped from 4 to 3,5 over the course of this season.

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Unfortunately he is 21, and next season when he turns 22, I believe his PA will drop, likely to 3 stars. He was a wonderkid, but is now described as a flamboyant midfielder. However, his performances has always been excellent, so I don't really care.

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His crossing is excellent despite being only 12 (11 up to last month), so most of his record-breaking assists are crosses from the byline. So yes it is how he performs that counts.

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Edit: what I am getting at here is that he may -never- have had 175+ in PA, which may have explained his early peak and more-or-less stagnation. I haven't checked his CA/PA.

^ What's his personality like though? It could be that he has always had the PA, but will never achieve it due to possibly low professionalism and/or ambition.

^ What's his personality like though? It could be that he has always had the PA, but will never achieve it due to possibly low professionalism and/or ambition.

I'm not at that computer now, but he had 15 Determination and Resolute personality iirc. I tutored him into 17 and Ambitious now (also iirc), and that helped a little.