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Is it possible to train a player so he becomes a natural in a particular position?


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Took me 3 years to train Ganso to natural in SC position. Doesn't always work though as I think it depends on hidden stats but younger they are the more chance of them becoming natural I believe. I've also done it for a few other youth players.

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you can train a player to become natural, depends on hidden versatility attribute how quickly i think, obv need to play them regular in new position also

i had a player at Hearts, Stephen Hendrie who is right footed left back (which i hate), i retrained him to play right back and i think within one season he was natural, since sold him to Villarreal and 2 years later he is only competent in the right back slot, so i think u need always to keep training him in the position. Silly really since when they reach natural it should never be lost imo.

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you can train a player to become natural, depends on hidden versatility attribute how quickly i think, obv need to play them regular in new position also

i had a player at Hearts, Stephen Hendrie who is right footed left back (which i hate), i retrained him to play right back and i think within one season he was natural, since sold him to Villarreal and 2 years later he is only competent in the right back slot, so i think u need always to keep training him in the position. Silly really since when they reach natural it should never be lost imo.

I had a similar situation and now just keep them training in that position permanently even though it says natural. I agree it shouldn't say natural if he can lose it.

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I had a amr Brazilian who looked like i could turn into a Rb... and he had no positional rating there and it took about a year or year and a half to become natural and is now described as a full back. He might have had good adaptability tho. Maybe another player might have learnt it quicker or slower.

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I bought a promising player who was a natural AMC but only competent as an MC. I never gave him any position training, I just played him as an MC. After 60 games in two seasons at that position, he is listed as a natural MC. He was only 18 when I bought him so that helped I think.

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In my current Villarreal save, Ive retrained Borja Valero to an AMC.

He was "competent" before, now got accomplished and then, after a few months I took the positional training away and after the season, hes still accomplished and been shown as his 2nd best position.

do you think, during the summer vacations or during a long term injury, he could turn back to "competent" ???

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just discovered something pretty extraordinary :D

Ive retrained valero to an AMC from july till decembre of the first season, then I took away the positional training, so that he could focus on his general schedule and he was a first steam starter, now coming to the ed of the season, he became natural in this position and hes currently not training this position. do you think, as long as he only plays at this position, he wont lose this "Natural" status?

valero.jpg

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I had a amr Brazilian who looked like i could turn into a Rb... and he had no positional rating there and it took about a year or year and a half to become natural and is now described as a full back. He might have had good adaptability tho. Maybe another player might have learnt it quicker or slower.

Player just got called up because of his 2nd nationality to play as a Right-Back for Portugal :D 1 cap 1 goal lol - Hopefully he will stay first choice. I'm going to remove his RB training too. Will let people know if it goes away.

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If you've taken his retraining away, it'll disappear regardless of what you do.

Thats not true, i have re-trained players to become natural in a position and stopped that training and they have stayed natural in that position, only certain players lose it.

I agree thats wrong, if you learn to that extent you dont forget it quickly.

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The only annoying thing is you have to continue training him in that position if you want him to retain it, otherwise it'll be gone in weeks/months.

This! So annoying! When they become natural you still have to train them in that position and it takes off from training schedule. Once they become natural it should stay that way without still needing to train them in that position.

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If you've taken his retraining away, it'll disappear regardless of what you do.

Not true TBH. I retrained Cleverley to be natural MC and removed that from his training but continued to use his as a first choice MC and he is still natural MC 2 seasons after he became natural MC.

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I've never had a play drop down from natural once it's been trained and took them off new position training. Now in 2017 and still natural after 5 seasons.

Because you constantly play him in that new position?

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Because you constantly play him in that new position?

Nope retrained him to striker and now play him as AML/AMR or MC. He's not played striker in 3 seasons for me.

I've noticed same with others who get to natural too.

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Only happens if you play them regularly on that position though right?

edit: Didn't saw Cleon's response..

That's what I thought.

I had Cleverley became natural MC after one season and Ravel after 3 seasons. Tom was first choice and Ravel was second. When they became natural I stopped retraining them and Cleverley kept his new position while Ravel lost it after couple of month as he wasn't playing regularly.

Though Cleon's response suggests something else...

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That's what I thought.

I had Cleverley became natural MC after one season and Ravel after 3 seasons. Tom was first choice and Ravel was second. When they became natural I stopped retraining them and Cleverley kept his new position while Ravel lost it after couple of month as he wasn't playing regularly.

Though Cleon's response suggests something else...

I think it's down to hidden stats, adaptability to if they'll keep it or not, but not 100% on that.

I've managed to do this with quite a few players and none of them have lost their new position several seasons on. I was always led to believe though that they had to be atleast carry on playing the position they were trained for.

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If you've taken his retraining away, it'll disappear regardless of what you do.

Not true (well if it is it is a bug) once you have got him to level X he should remain their as long as you play him in that position regularly.

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I think it's down to hidden stats, adaptability to if they'll keep it or not, but not 100% on that.

I've managed to do this with quite a few players and none of them have lost their new position several seasons on. I was always led to believe though that they had to be atleast carry on playing the position they were trained for.

Not down to Adaptability. Adaptability is how well they adopt to playing in another countries and in different football cultures, It would come down to Versatility. Still good to know that they don't have to continue playing in new position regularly.

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Not true (well if it is it is a bug) once you have got him to level X he should remain their as long as you play him in that position regularly.

So would odd game a season keep him trained? As i've had a few who play different positions now regular. But maybe 2 times a season play in the position I trained them for? How long til you see the decline?

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I retrained Ravel Morrison to be a right winger, took him a season, another 7 later and he has never lost that ability, also retrained a player Lewis Milne to be a left winger, again took a season, and he has been natural ever since.

Still playing them same position?

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Still playing them same position?

Morrison yes, Milne this season had now changed to be through the middle because of his age and lack of pace, but im in April and he hasnt played there except a few odd games here and there this season and he still has natural left mid. I'm sure it was red when i first stated the game, but cant be 100% sure.

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Morrison yes, Milne this season had now changed to be through the middle because of his age and lack of pace, but im in April and he hasnt played there except a few odd games here and there this season and he still has natural left mid. I'm sure it was red when i first stated the game, but cant be 100% sure.

Aye Milne starts as unconvincing on left. So you've experienced same as me then not losing their position when not playing them anymore. Would be good to know if the odd game in the natural position is why they keep it though.

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Yeah you could be right, the odd game here and there could be what helps them keep the knowledge. I think of Milne as my own Ryan Giggs lol.

Im 11 i retrained a few players from red to natural but its pretty irrelevant as i dont know if it works different in 12.

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The only annoying thing is you have to continue training him in that position if you want him to retain it, otherwise it'll be gone in weeks/months.

Neh you don't have to. I have taken many players off position training and they remain Natural indefinitely. On the other hand if he falls back to Accomplished you know for sure that he needs to train in that position for the rest of his career.

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As far as I'm aware you can train any player to become natural in any position (bar GK), however the catch is you must play them in that position semi-regularly. Once you retrain a player to being natural in a new position, they can go backwards too if you stop the training or you don't play them in the new position, which can be annoying if you want to get one player better in two or more different positions. So if you have a CB, and you want to get them to be both a SW and a DM, you should just choose one and go with it, rather than get one to accomplished and then start working on the other, as once you do that, he'll lose the progress he made initially on the first position you tried to teach him.

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Not true (well if it is it is a bug) once you have got him to level X he should remain their as long as you play him in that position regularly.

I'd prefer it if the positional model was completely redone.

A player's position should be determined by where he is played. Where he plays should not be determined by his position.

His attributes would suggest a natural pre disposition towards certain positions, but it shouldn't be anywhere near as set in stone as it is now.

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Not true (well if it is it is a bug) once you have got him to level X he should remain their as long as you play him in that position regularly.
That doesn't sound like "natural", really...

If a player in the database is, say, natural at M C, then he will forever be natural at M C even if you never play him there (and you can't "train M C as a new position"). In contrast to the "faux natural" that is described in this thread.

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That doesn't sound like "natural", really...

If a player in the database is, say, natural at M C, then he will forever be natural at M C even if you never play him there (and you can't "train M C as a new position"). In contrast to the "faux natural" that is described in this thread.

We don't actually use the word Natural in the game anymore because it is misleading people to think like that.

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We don't actually use the word Natural in the game anymore because it is misleading people to think like that.
Still, it should be possible for us to retrain a player to be as good as the same state ("natural") as players in the database, no?

I'd argue that most youngsters don't have a natural position... Positional experience matters a lot less for a youngster, and the "penalty" for learning a new position is a lot less. This is why a lot of youngsters have very "chaotic" positional graphs.

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Good responses...if all are true, then i've learned two things that seem counter-intuitive to me:

1. You can TRAIN someone to the "Natural" level. I always thought natural was the position they were "born" to play. I thought "Natural" was the status given to the position the player takes most comfortably, regardless of skill or training. You can teach a player to be "Accomplished" at another position, but I've always thought of Natural as something that can't be taught.

2. You can LOSE natural status. Somehow you lose something that it supposedly natural to you, by standing a few metres to the left every Saturday for a year. To me, the game really shouldn't understand the difference between natural status earned during your save, and natural status the player starts with in the database (after all, how does the game know WHEN this status was attained? It could have been the week before the start of the game!). By this logic, your backup goalkeeper should "forget" how to play goalkeeper after two seasons on the bench.

Intuitively, i feel like Natural status should be...Natural! Cannot be earned, cannot be trained. It would be like training someone to be a Crocodile. You're either a natural Crocodile, or you're not.

Also intuitively, i feel like "Accomplished" status should remain with the player, just based on what that word means in the English language. Once you've become an "accomplished" player at that position, you can't "unaccomplish" that part of your life. It will always be with you. There really should be a point where the player has successfully "earned" the right call himself a left winger, for example, and no amount of playing as a right winger will take that right away from him.

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Not true (well if it is it is a bug) once you have got him to level X he should remain their as long as you play him in that position regularly.

Well, that's definitely not true (bug or not)... I've had players that was trained to natural and played in that position at least once a week. After 3-4 weeks they went back to accomplished. Other players, though, do retain their level when playing the same position occasionally.

I believe it also has something to do with how much PA>CA. I find that when players have problems retaining their level they are also close to be fully developed (according to ass man and coaches).

But the latter is just my unscientifically observations :)

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