FM12.1.1, Morale IS Broken

I start this thread because I do seriously think morale since the patch update is broken. Such problems pre-patch were non existent. I hope anyone who agrees with me posts in this thread so SI we can help SI take notice and release a quick adjustment.

Anyway, I'll start by giving my save game scenario. 3rd year at Napoli in Jan, 12 clear of the league, in all competitions, not lost a game for god knows how long, always as friendly as possible to the players and have purposely made sure every player I've bought has the personality type to blend into the squad perfectly. You'd think all would be swell? Just coming off of a 10-0 victory...

WRONG.

I have ONE player who has 'Superb' morale (Cavani) and the majority of players are 'Good' or 'Fairly Good' with my starting AMR as 'Okay'. If the above situation doesn't put you in a 'superb' mood, then I think you ought to quit being a footballer...There's zero reason why my players shouldn't be feeling 'Superb' or 'Very Good' at the least.

Anyway, my next point is that I've seen a lot of people complain about a difficulty increase since 12.1.0. And this is simple to explain, if you have a low reputation manager, your players morale will be mediocre at best, and it will be almost impossible to get any positive reaction from them at HT/FT. This would be okay, if by the time you were a World Class manager like me, you could get positive reactions...but you can't...

As I said, I can't remember such problems pre-patch, but I think it's a small but significant issue to point out.

How is it a problem if you are 12 clear in the league, still in all competitions and just won 10-0?

How is it a problem if you are 12 clear in the league, still in all competitions and just won 10-0?

It's a problem because with low morale the following things are subject to happen:

1) Players will bottle it in big games.

2) Anyone starting a new game is subject to being smacked about.

3) It's not very realistic to have players on average morale when you're in a great position.

1) Well obviously they aren't bottling in big games.

2) New games are only a problem if you pick an unrealistically low reputation with a higher reputation club.

3) There are hundreds of things that affect a real person's morale, the position in the table is probably the single most important but far from the only relevant one. Morale is also (as your success shows) not a major factor in performance unless it is extremely high or low.

I would agree with anyone saying it would be handy to have more information on why a player's morale was the level it is, but disagree with anyone saying the current system is broken.

The new system is't perfect yet granted but remember its SI 1st attempt at something new and me personally think its a good start

1) Well obviously they aren't bottling in big games.

Unless a defender has 'superb' morale, they tend to 'play nervously' and particularly late game commit silly errors. This does happen in real life of course, but a player with the confidence of an experienced Serie A leader should be less prone to such mistakes.

I would agree with anyone saying it would be handy to have more information on why a player's morale was the level it is, but disagree with anyone saying the current system is broken.

I agree broken might have been a bit harsh.

I hope anyone who agrees with me posts in this thread so SI we can help SI take notice and release a quick adjustment.

Just a quick post to say I don't agree with you at all. I'm very happy with player morale since the 12.1 patch and have had no trouble in any of my three current saves.

IMO too morale IS broken since patch 12.1.

IMO the game difficulty has NOT been increased by this patch. Because making the user's players UNSTABLE is nothing more than a huge bug.

IMO too morale IS broken since patch 12.1.

IMO the game difficulty has NOT been increased by this patch. Because making the user's players UNSTABLE is nothing more than a huge bug.

Nothing could be more broken than morale being STABLE at SUPERB year after year after year.

Yeah, after being champions + winning champions league my players morale is still average and even after 3 season of best possible performance none of my players are listening to me when I try interacting... THIS IS 100 % BROKEN

IMO SI hast only increased the general player and staff controversy.

Nothing could be more broken than morale being STABLE at SUPERB year after year after year.

I agree here. But it just seems SI have gone the complete other end of the spectrum.

Plus, I bet you morale at Barca in real life would be 'Superb' 90% of the time.

I agree here. But it just seems SI have gone the complete other end of the spectrum.

Plus, I bet you morale at Barca in real life would be 'Superb' 90% of the time.

Why? They may be a champion team, but individual players can still be worried about their selection, their form, about relationships, contracts, etcetera. Superb morale should be the exception, not the norm as it was in 12.0.x. The new patch is a clear improvement.

Yeah, after being champions + winning champions league my players morale is still average and even after 3 season of best possible performance none of my players are listening to me when I try interacting... THIS IS 100 % BROKEN

IMO SI hast only increased the general player and staff controversy.

+ in this game players have become amazing pesimists. I'm sick of them refusing everything I want them to do. And this time it's not my reputation because I have started with max rep. + have been legendary good during 3 seasons. But still players are negative all way long. So you don't gain anything by performing well !!

Are you guys who are't getting any reaction using like the same team talks and same tones alltime because SI made some tweaks there as well as if you get repetative with your team talks players shall we say get bored if thats right word to use ? i know its hard not to be repetitive sometimes with only limited things to say but this could be your problems

I've started 3 diffrent save with sunday league rep semi pro and international and im getting good and bad reactions which i'd expect

+ in this game players have become amazing pesimists. I'm sick of them refusing everything I want them to do. And this time it's not my reputation because I have started with max rep. + have been legendary good during 3 seasons. But still players are negative all way long. So you don't gain anything by performing well !!

LoL at +1 your own post. Did you forget to log into your other account?

@ whilewolf: I know I have quoted my own post; because the 2nd post is based on that one...

**** my mistake some how I read it as +1 which looked like you trying to second your own proposal. Sorry.

I think the new morale system is much better.

Morale system is alot better now.

Its harder but I like it. My players previously were all on happy pills.

I think it's much better now, but could still be improved. I suppose that will always be the case though, however much they work on it.

What options are you using in team talks to get no reaction from the players btw? The only time I've had that happen is when I try to say "Do it for the fans", never had a reaction from anybody after saying that.

It is important to note that any positive or negative reaction in the changing room only lasts for 10 minutes or so or until the first goal is scored. After that, anything could happen. "Nothing specific noted" doesn't mean that you chose the wrong team talk. An all-green "looking motivated, gained confidence or fired up" could lose you the game if you don't score by the 30th minute, all depending on your squad's hidden mental stats of course.

I aim at avoiding complacency and nervousness rather than trying to fire them up, and that is a strategy I have had great success with.

SI wanted to make it harder to get players to "stick" at superb morale. By the looks of it they've made it too hard, especially after big wins- though was it an expected big win?

It might be worth posting in the bugs forum and uploading a save file to the FTP.

I think they made the game a lot harder now because of the morale changes. I play as Arsenal in first season and i almost never have anyone on superb morale even though i have continental rep and i'm first in the premiership. I hate to think playing a relegation battler with lower rep manager. I bet everyone would be on crap morale.

I think they made the game a lot harder now because of the morale changes. I play as Arsenal in first season and i almost never have anyone on superb morale even though i have continental rep and i'm first in the premiership. I hate to think playing a relegation battler with lower rep manager. I bet everyone would be on crap morale.

Morale is no longer just about winning. I took a very poor Southampton side to the EPL (that had been relegated with 11 pts the previous season) and kept them on green morale all season despite rarely being higher than 17th. Morale is, and has always been, context driven. It is not as simple as win = good morale, lose = bad morale.

I started a new game with Gremio... Have done extremely well (maybe unrealistically so) and prior to the update had extremely high moral.

I have never had such a successful first season with any team, though it is the first time I haven't hired/fired anyone in the first season too...

After the update, I continued playing as I had been. I saw a very sudden drop in moral and lost several games in a row to the point where I nearly blew the championship. After these losses I got handed 4 transfer requests from player who had been perfectly happy at the club a few weeks prior. Then I had a couple of easy win games, so managed to bring moral back to average and have maintained it there ever since.

What I have noticed with the new update is that individual players are getting to very high/very low moral depending on their form but the team as a whole is harder to get into the highs...

As someone else said - in real life it is rare to find a team that has v.high moral all of the time. But in this game we are very limited by what we can do to help the players fix poor moral. Real life issues that hurt a players preformance don't automatically make them want to leave the club like in this game.

I do think the moral is better now, but it is kinda frustrating when steam suddenly updates halfway through your season, you have big games coming up and you now have to learn a new moral system!

I can't believe it...how wrong you do your job. How can you put update with team talk bug??? I won in away game 2-1 and i said to my boys that i am happy, but 2 players seemed witched off, the rest non reaction... WTF??????????

Please explain how this can be possible?????????

I can't believe it...how wrong you do your job. How can you put update with team talk bug??? I won in away game 2-1 and i said to my boys that i am happy, but 2 players seemed witched off, the rest non reaction... WTF??????????

Please explain how this can be possible?????????

More details needed with this. However, if your team were expected to win, and only just scraped it 2-1 then why would they respond to happy. Sometimes, they expect a telling off, as they know they havent done well enough,

guys win is a win...players must be happy..i am the coach... what are you telling is not good..and wright

guys win is a win...players must be happy..i am the coach... what are you telling is not good..and wright

A win isn't a win. If you were expected to crush them 5-0, a 2-1 win is disappointing. If you created less chances than them they will also "believe" that they played badly. Praising wins and criticising defeats = bad management...

guys win is a win...players must be happy..i am the coach... what are you telling is not good..and wright

I'd avoid the 'not listening to advice' route. Morale is context driven. A 2-1 win against a team you are expected to beat does not need a 'well done' team talk.

team talks now don't work for me, started a game as psg manager and they reacted badly to everything i said

pretty bad update if u ask me, same as my arsenal save i returned to

I'd avoid the 'not listening to advice' route. Morale is context driven. A 2-1 win against a team you are expected to beat does not need a 'well done' team talk.

Where in his post does it say hhe expected them to win?

I was on a 52 game unbeaten run before patch now I can't win to save myself and to me makes the game less enjoyable and I can't be bothered playing it anymore I've got bored, I also was in champions league always got thru to knockout stages now can't buy a win, cheers SI I now have lost interest in the game because you have made it unplayable for me.

Yeah it all has to be taken into context. For example if Barcelona went on an 8 game winning run someone I highly doubt that their players would feel any different than if they were on a 3 game winning run. Success will always mean that it is harder to feel happier about achieving something you have already achieved if that makes sense.

I'd avoid the 'not listening to advice' route. Morale is context driven. A 2-1 win against a team you are expected to beat does not need a 'well done' team talk.

Then would you say 'nothing' or 'don't bet complacent' for next game?

Where in his post does it say hhe expected them to win?

I was on a 52 game unbeaten run before patch now I can't win to save myself and to me makes the game less enjoyable and I can't be bothered playing it anymore I've got bored, I also was in champions league always got thru to knockout stages now can't buy a win, cheers SI I now have lost interest in the game because you have made it unplayable for me.

He doesn't have to. This forum is nothing if not predictable.

Then would you say 'nothing' or 'don't bet complacent' for next game?

Don't know. Would depend on the context.

The problem is most don't look at the odds they see the (FAV) sign next to them without really looking at the actual odd, you could be 1-2 fav or a 1-10 fav.

A 1-0 win on a 1-2 fav is good

A 1-0 win on a 1-10 fav isn't so good

most people would praise both wins the same because they are a win.

to be honest, I have never made a sporting bet in my life, so i have no clue what the odds mean, I would have asumed the other way around.

It does detract from the game for those who do not enjoy micromanaging, your Assman should be efficient relative to his skill levels, yet my Assman of 16 determination, 16 man management and 18 motivating is as much use it seems, as the one I replaced him with, who had nothing over 8 in theses skill sets.

I find the current morale system much more realistic.

Previous to the most recent patch, I was able to get basically any team's morale to very good/superb across the board (almost irrespective of results!), but post-patch I find 'good' to be the most common, with a couple above and a couple below even when on a great winning streak.

Plus - clearly morale is not affecting the OP's save in a negative way

to be honest, I have never made a sporting bet in my life, so i have no clue what the odds mean, I would have asumed the other way around.

It does detract from the game for those who do not enjoy micromanaging, your Assman should be efficient relative to his skill levels, yet my Assman of 16 determination, 16 man management and 18 motivating is as much use it seems, as the one I replaced him with, who had nothing over 8 in theses skill sets.

Since the fans and the players take the pre-match odds as Gospel Truth and a Commandment from God, not taking notice of that when choosing team talks is a big mistake.

Since the fans and the players take the pre-match odds as Gospel Truth and a Commandment from God, not taking notice of that when choosing team talks is a big mistake.

Rubbish, i very rarely look at odds before choosing a team talk, they are not gospel or anything close.

Rubbish, i very rarely look at odds before choosing a team talk, they are not gospel or anything close.

To you, no, but to the players... yes. That's what decide their reaction to whatever team talk you choose.

Rubbish, i very rarely look at odds before choosing a team talk, they are not gospel or anything close.

To you, no, but to the players... yes. That's what decide their reaction to whatever team talk you choose.

EDIT: in addition to more circumstancial factors, of course

So glad I've been playing offline with steam and haven't updated yet.

Yeah, after being champions + winning champions league my players morale is still average and even after 3 season of best possible performance none of my players are listening to me when I try interacting... THIS IS 100 % BROKEN

IMO SI hast only increased the general player and staff controversy.

Dont have this problem on my save, generally most of my players do listen to me, I admit some dont if I get the judgment wrong, but hey that life. Morale isnt broken at all its been tweaked and makes the game harder, better and more realistic imo. No more happy pills for the players.

[quote name=Candre168;7431207.

Anyway' date=' I'll start by giving my save game scenario. 3rd year at Napoli in Jan, 12 clear of the league, in all competitions, not lost a game for god knows how long, always as friendly as possible to the players and have purposely made sure every player I've bought has the personality type to blend into the squad perfectly. You'd think all would be swell? Just coming off of a 10-0 victory....[/quote]

Depends who you thumped 10-0, were you expected to win. ie Man U would be expected to thump York City, just because they have doesnt mean the morale would jump to superb as they are expected to. It would jump a little bit, however if York beat Man U the drop in morale would be far worse than the rise from the win

It definitely hasn't been changed for the better. My save game with Sunderland ended when I experienced some strange results when patching to 12.1. I have now started a new game starting as a former international. The Newcastle job came up and I got it. 2nd game Swansea at home, I dominate miss loads of chances and a penalty. Team-talk I give is good effort despite the result I'm pleased. Every single outfield player has the response looked to switch off. Now I can understand a few players doing that but the whole team?

Are you really pleased to draw at home to Swansea, or were you frustrated you didn't win?

I was frustrated I didn't win but given the current position and morale of the squad I didn't want to sound to harsh after all we gave it a good go.