[theoretically] Is it possible to win a league with any team?

If you studied everything in minute detail, took care of all aspects of management to an obsessive level; team talks, tactical, training, player/media interaction, and everything else, could you win the league with any team?

This is only a game after all and it has many weaknesses (I'm assuming), so is it possible?

Silly, slight-of-fancy question, I'll admit, but I'm just curious as to just how far you could get if you really put in the effort...

Short answer : Yes.

Long answer : Yes.

You'd need some luck though. But any clubs in the same league can be the winner. But when it comes to continental competitions, that's a different story.

Well this is how I play the game normally. It can take me weeks and weeks to complete a season, such is the care I put into every aspect of the game. I like to think I'm pretty good too; on FM10 I made Southampton the greatest club in the world in 25 years (though I got promotion from both L1 and the CCC through the play-offs), and then just yesterday I completed a bizarre treble with my League Two Basingstoke Town side, of the league, Johnstone's Paint trophy and FA Cup. Granted that is my greatest FM achievement ever, but I find it funny when people accuse me of cheating (nobody on here thankfully), only to discover they literally have the assman do everything and take no notice of training, tactics, youth development, finances etc etc. I'm not sure what those people expect? If you put the time in you will reap the rewards.

Obviously everyone is entitled to play the game as they see fit, but I've always tried to take an extreme hands-on approach to every save I've had (bar a test one with Borussia Dortmund last year, where - surprise surprise - I did nowhere near as good as on my other saves). I think it would be nigh on impossible to win something like the FA Cup with a poor BSS team, but you could probably win the league with them. I've just negotiated my way (just) into the Europa League group stages - there is no way I'll win it, not least because of the opposition quality, but also being part of five competitions in total (Europa League, League One, FA Cup, Carling Cup, Johnstone's Paint trophy); but I'll make sure I give it my best damn shot. Things like rotation need planning out, and it's it's things like that which can take hours of time (and then typically get ruined by an untimely long-term injury...).

If you want to be totally successful, you must, must meticulously plan in all aspects of the club. And besides, it's all the more satisfactory when you do win!

My playing style is as following.

1. Pick a low league club from weak country. (My fav : Sweden / Norway)

2. Climb up to top league of the nation.

3. Work on acquiring talented youth and normally it takes me 3 seasons to start dominating the league.

4. Once I am confidently dominating the league, I venture into UEFA champions more seriously. Entering the group stage is the top priority since that 7m euro reward is dream money for any Swedish / Norway club.

5 (Optional) I obtain few feeder clubs and play with them since dominating a league is boring in long term.

For the record, I've never won a UEFA champions with any of my Sweden and Norway clubs so far. I spent 12 seasons with a swedish club. I am now doing a Norway club right now which has slightly better income than Sweden.

Not with really ANY team, I'd say.

I'm sure you can vastly overachieve with any team if you play the game on full game mode and if you are able to spot and analyze strengths and weaknesses, but winning the title? I'd doubt that you could win the EPL or La Liga with its smallest minnows.

That being said I'd trust someone to achieve something between 3rd and 6th with really any team.

****, does this mean I suck as a manager because I cant win the EPL with Arsenal! I keep losing to teams like Stoke city, feel like im in the shoes of Arsene Wenger, now I know how he must feel after 7 years of no trophies

My playing style is as following.

1. Pick a low league club from weak country. (My fav : Sweden / Norway)

2. Climb up to top league of the nation.

3. Work on acquiring talented youth and normally it takes me 3 seasons to start dominating the league.

4. Once I am confidently dominating the league, I venture into UEFA champions more seriously. Entering the group stage is the top priority since that 7m euro reward is dream money for any Swedish / Norway club.

5 (Optional) I obtain few feeder clubs and play with them since dominating a league is boring in long term.

For the record, I've never won a UEFA champions with any of my Sweden and Norway clubs so far. I spent 12 seasons with a swedish club. I am now doing a Norway club right now which has slightly better income than Sweden.

Sweden a weak nation??? Ok, in terms of football league, perhaps...

Anyway, this is very similar to my approach in every FM game (I obviously play in Sweden). Have unfortunately only ever reached quarter finals of the Champions league with a swedish team. It's really hard to get to that last level I feel... Not that it's unrealistic (quite the opposite), but it's still sad.

Good luck Fabian

Quick answer to the OP: Not if I'm the manager!!

Overall, I think that a smaller, more competitive league (where the gap between the best and worst teams are pretty small) offer the best opportunity to win the competition with any team. But as for the better leagues in the game, particularly top-level leagues, it would be very difficult indeed

Nobody could win the Premier League in the first season with Swansea without cheating, fact.

Nobody could win the Premier League in the first season with Swansea without cheating, fact.

You do realise someone will probably work to do that now just to prove you wrong? Won't be me though . It probably is possible though, would take a lot of luck though and some expert finds in the transfer/loan market.

You do realise someone will probably work to do that now just to prove you wrong? Won't be me though . It probably is possible though.

They can try all they like lol, the greatest FM player in the world wouldn't be able to do it without cheating.

Of course they could, if you were able to get your tactics right for every game and to be able to understand how the match engine works to eliminate your teams shortcomings then you could do it. It'd be incredibly hard, but it is possible on FM.

It's not 'fact' that they wouldn't be able to do that with Swansea; just extremely unlikely.

Of course they could, if you were able to get your tactics right for every game and to be able to understand how the match engine works to eliminate your teams shortcomings then you could do it. It'd be incredibly hard, but it is possible on FM.

No they couldn't. You could get your tactics absolutely perfect for every single minute of every single game but Swansea would not be able to win the league.

It's not 'fact' that they wouldn't be able to do that with Swansea; just extremely unlikely.

I'll give you that. There's a 0.01% chance then.

Took you less than 60 seconds to change your mind with 2 posts there technique, its a game, if you know how to play the game properly you can get whatever you want from it at whatever odds. The only way it is impossible for Swansea or any team to win any league, is if the game is hardcoded in such a way that it makes it impossible. The game doesn't do that, if you get your tactics right and spot on FM you will beat Man Utd, Chelsea etc. Getting your tactics right is very difficult, you can win games without playing the right tactics by getting lucky, you can lose games by having your tactics almost right but missing the final thing that makes it right.

If you got your tactics perfect, for the whole 90 minutes you would win by definition, if your tactics were perfect it is only possible to win. You can't have your team perfectly prepared tactically for an opponent and lose, because by definition it wasn't perfect.

Took you less than 60 seconds to change your mind with 2 posts there technique, its a game, if you know how to play the game properly you can get whatever you want from it at whatever odds. The only way it is impossible for Swansea or any team to win any league, is if the game is hardcoded in such a way that it makes it impossible. The game doesn't do that, if you get your tactics right and spot on FM you will beat Man Utd, Chelsea etc. Getting your tactics right is very difficult, you can win games without playing the right tactics by getting lucky, you can lose games by having your tactics almost right but missing the final thing that makes it right.

If you got your tactics perfect, for the whole 90 minutes you would win by definition, if your tactics were perfect it is only possible to win. You can't have your team perfectly prepared tactically for an opponent and lose, because by definition it wasn't perfect.

That is the whole point. What you have said there is not true, Swansea could play tactically perfect for 90 minutes and one moment of genius from a top Premier League player would result in them losing the game. The players they have are no as good as the players they will be playing against every single week, even more so when they play the top 6 teams in the league.

No tactic in the world can legislate for individual brilliance from an opposing player when that opposing player is leaps and bounds ahead of any of your teams players in terms of quality.

Sweden a weak nation??? Ok, in terms of football league, perhaps...

We are talking about football manager, aren't we?

Sweden isn't a good nation to coach in, let's say compared to, English or German.

Let's just leave it at that and not go into politics.

I'll give you that. There's a 0.01% chance then.

Pretty sure it's possible, someone did it with Blackpool last year to prove someone else wrong. there was around 6 or 7 transfers paid over 48 months, sales of a few players, a few brought in on a free and a few loans and they won it. Wasn't by a large margin but they did it, and they never cheated..

Pretty sure it's possible, someone did it with Blackpool last year to prove someone else wrong. there was around 6 or 7 transfers paid over 48 months, sales of a few players, a few brought in on a free and a few loans and they won it. Wasn't by a large margin but they did it, and they never cheated..

They cheated. You are foolish to believe they didn't.

No tactic in the world can legislate for individual brilliance from an opposing player when that opposing player is leaps and bounds ahead of any of your teams players in terms of quality.

Yes but leagues are not won or lost with one player or one game, your right you may not always beat the top 6, but it is definitely possible, and if you manage good results against the smaller teams then it would be very possible. You may not win every game, but you dont have too. If your good enough at this GAME then yes it is possible, unlikely, but very possible with the right input on your part.

@Technique: I've beaten top clubs in Europe with my IFK Göteborg (Roma, Inter, Man Utd, Arsenal, etc) in the Champions league the first couple of seasons of the save (i.e before the AIs completely destroy their sqauds). It therefor stands to reason that with a club like Swansea (higher reputation club, higher reputation league, better starting squad and bigger budget) you can beat those clubs too. Yes, it's gonna be difficult to win games consistantly throughout an entire season but definately not impossible.

edit: the truth is that the individual player's performances that you speak of has to be extremely good to overcome the significant handicap the computer controled teams have due to their (often) very poor tactics.

FM is a game, all games have limits that if you find out what they are can be used to achieve an outcome you desire. You don't need to legislate for individual brilliance, if you know the game inside out Barcelona would be 4-0 down before Messi could even go on an amazing run and slot the ball home. It doesn't matter if in real life Swansea would get trounced, FM is variables put into a match engine that jumbles them about for a bit, plucks out the bits that make up highlights, chucks them into the display as best as it can so you can see the little players waddle about on the pitch and slot the ball home.

One single variable won't work for everygame, but if you could understand your opponents from the match reports, and make adjustments then its possible.

They cheated. You are foolish to believe they didn't.

What a nob.

if you get some good free transfers you can get lucky and win the league with Swansea in the first season. It all depends on the defending and the type of players you bring in. I wish to prove you wrong, however I'm too busy to be bothered about it! Anyone taking him up on the challenge?

If all of your points are true then FM is totally unrealistic then? And there would be no need for me to ever buy players to improve my squad.

No tactic in the world can legislate for individual brilliance from an opposing player when that opposing player is leaps and bounds ahead of any of your teams players in terms of quality.

But a broken leg can prevent it from happening...

I somehow always 'play better' against on-the-paper better teams when I tell my men to go in hard on the tackles, especially against fancy ball movers with little stamina

My biggest issue in those fights.. (erm.. I mean matches :o ) are if I get card happy judges :-/

What a nob.

Ironically you've made yourself look like one just by posting that comment.

Ironically you've made yourself look like one just by posting that comment.

Well your there dismissing other peoples views without taking any into consideration. You've made your point that you feel it's impossible and that is your opinion. We've all seen it so leave the thread instead of continually repeating it. We've heard it move on. Also to say someone is cheating when you don't know the person or haven't even viewed the thread is insulting. Just because you probably couldn't do it (like many of us) doesn't mean it's impossible. People find ways and means and pour weeks worth of time into a season. So yes it's possible, without cheating, to win the Premier league with any club.

If all of your points are true then FM is totally unrealistic then? And there would be no need for me to ever buy players to improve my squad.

FM is realistic to the point of the initial data you use is real, the second you click continue it becomes a game completely detached from reality, except for the fact you use real life data. No one i saying it would be a walk in the park, but FM is a game with a set of variables that can be exploited if you know how. Also no one said it would not involve improving the squad.

If all of your points are true then FM is totally unrealistic then? And there would be no need for me to ever buy players to improve my squad.

If you can cultivate your understanding of the game to a point where you know exactly what every stat point does to each individual notch, and can look at the opposing players and make a distinctive conclusion of how to render them inert then yes you could take over a team and only replace when you needed to.

Most of us don't have that knowledge, we take better players in order to make up for our shortcomings tactically. Most of us can't look at our team and decide "right he's up against Messi today, better move the defenders defensive slider up two, his creative freedom down one, put his passing up five notches, change the corner/free kick/throw in settings for attack & defence" because you would have to put enormous effort in and balance it all around the core changes to the team. Some people who play FM have a far better understanding than others at the baseline, but don't go to an awful lot of effort micromanaging every aspect, other players don't know as much from memory but look at scout reports, look at opposing players and try to adjust their tactics to compensate. Both can be equally successful or equally unsuccessful, when both are combined you tend to find people going on insane unbeaten runs, or accomplishing incredible feats.

I found the limits of FM09's match engine with Keirrison to get him to score so many goals, I haven't done it before or since, it was a one off where my ideas and tactics slotted into the game in a way the game couldn't handle. On FM09 with almost any team I could do rediculous things, I was getting Fram from Iceland into the final 16 of the champions league and such by scraping through with a 4-4-2 formation that worked amazingly well. On FM10 and FM11 I won less couldn't get it to work right, so far on FM12 I've not won anything with any team. That's just the way it happens sometimes.

If you can cultivate your understanding of the game to a point where you know exactly what every stat point does to each individual notch, and can look at the opposing players and make a distinctive conclusion of how to render them inert then yes you could take over a team and only replace when you needed to.

Most of us don't have that knowledge, we take better players in order to make up for our shortcomings tactically. Most of us can't look at our team and decide "right he's up against Messi today, better move the defenders defensive slider up two, his creative freedom down one, put his passing up five notches, change the corner/free kick/throw in settings for attack & defence" because you would have to put enormous effort in and balance it all around the core changes to the team. Some people who play FM have a far better understanding than others at the baseline, but don't go to an awful lot of effort micromanaging every aspect, other players don't know as much from memory but look at scout reports, look at opposing players and try to adjust their tactics to compensate. Both can be equally successful or equally unsuccessful, when both are combined you tend to find people going on insane unbeaten runs, or accomplishing incredible feats.

I found the limits of FM09's match engine with Keirrison to get him to score so many goals, I haven't done it before or since, it was a one off where my ideas and tactics slotted into the game in a way the game couldn't handle. On FM09 with almost any team I could do rediculous things, I was getting Fram from Iceland into the final 16 of the champions league and such by scraping through with a 4-4-2 formation that worked amazingly well. On FM10 and FM11 I won less couldn't get it to work right, so far on FM12 I've not won anything with any team. That's just the way it happens sometimes.

Good post.

I too felt FM11 to be far more challenging than the previous versions, but FM12 is a step back so far for me. In particular it's much much easier to maintain a good spell and keep players from getting complacent than in FM11 (in which I always had a big lead early on in the season, only to drop tons of points mid- or end- season). I've never really had a slump on FM12 and I'm several seasons in.

Yes. Anything is possible.

In theory, every single team playing against the worst team in the league could get 4 red cards in the first few minutes, giving the weaker side a ridiculous advantage (and I don't think FM enforces that match abandonment rule when enough red cards are shown... 10 red cards, anyone?).

But is it likely? Probably not...

You can win any league with any squad because it all comes down to 1 of fm's biggest flaw for year, tactic player a bigger part than the actual players you have. Where in irl 8/10 a championship would lose to real madrid the ai seems to think that if you set your tactics right you can stop the likes of ronaldo, hugain ect. You could be the best tactition in the world but in real life that does'nt mean you can stop ronaldo from skinning your player all the time. Everyone knows messi cuts in from the right flank onto he's stronger left foot, doesnt mean the defender can stop it!? in real life id say it's 30% tactics and 70% players, but in fm it's 60% tactics 40% players (at best!).

Definitely POSSIBLE, just unlikely with some clubs.

If you were to choose Norwich or Swansea for example at teh start of the game, you could cheat by re-starting every match you lose, until you win it - therefore, it's obviously POSSIBLE for it to happy, it would just take a massive amount of luck.

They cheated. You are foolish to believe they didn't.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but I think that's a fairly naive viewpoint. Overperforming in FM is miles easier than overperforming in real life.

In FM08 I managed to win the Serie A title in 2016 with a Sampdoria side relegated not last season, but the season before. To be fair the game has gotten substantially more difficult since then, but even so I trumped the odds without cheating.

unlikly, unless you save before each match and reload until result goes into your favour. but dont thats cheating.

i have had some strange ones on mine.

currently approaching febuary 2012 as man utd. unbeaten, been top of the league for month... liverpool were unbeaten until january with more points (stupid draws) they dip in form and lose 2 on the bounce after 4 draws.

chelsea are sat in 9th O.O

swansea are in the league cup final

if you force a player on his weaker, thats how you do it IRL, it just doesnt always work.

I would be tempted to try to prove you wrong, but then again you'd only write it off as cheating. I never ever reload, but I couldn't really prove that, could I?

I never ever reload, but I couldn't really prove that, could I?

Tehcnically there is a way to prove it but only if you started a new game and never saved it. Go to "Game Status" and it says how many times the game has been saved and the last time it was saved.

I'd say that given time, you could win a league with almost any team. The only exceptions I can think of are the hard-coded amateur clubs like Queens Park and (if you use a lower league add-on) Corinthians. However much you perfect your tactics, if you can't attract players of high calibre or retain your best youths, I don't see how you can win the league. With every other team, providing the board is patient enough, you can gradually build up your resources and hone your tactics to rise to the top.

Nobody could win the Premier League in the first season with Swansea without cheating, fact.

cleon could ???

I'd like to see someone take a small team to a league title. I mean a small team in a big league, like the aforementioned Swansea.

I couldn't do it because I couldn't even stay in the Liverpool or Spurs job the first few months of the season

2 differant saves.

swansea in league cup final on my man utd

and west brom won it on another.

I managed to get Hyde promoted twice, both seasons media prediction was 24th. BSN 2nd place, BSP through last playoff spot.

I'd like to see someone take a small team to a league title. I mean a small team in a big league, like the aforementioned Swansea.

I couldn't do it because I couldn't even stay in the Liverpool or Spurs job the first few months of the season

Easy, I could take any team to any title in all honesty.

I finished 2nd with Sunderland in the first season on FM11 for some reason a 4-4-2 with two DMC's was lethal. Campbell, Bent and Gyan all scoring a goal a game and with monthly payments I signed Eden Hazard who was a complete beast. Most I have managed since with Sunderland in the first season was a 6th place finish. I had a load of luck but finished around 7 points behind Arsenal we managed to win quite a few game that we should have been hammered in.

I'm pretty sure plenty of the tactical geniuses could do it.

Even more people if you sell a few players for money up front and replace with 48 month transfers etc.

Easy, I could take any team to any title in all honesty.

I challenge you to do it then! Norwich, Premiership. Bet you couldn't.

EDIT: Seriously, how? Is it a case of "it's easy when you know how..."?