Value of a player linked with league reputation?

Had noticed this for some time but decided to make a note of it in my final save for the game. Started in League One and found that the value of a player constantly falls down regardless of the fact that he is one of the best players in the league (and the inverse is also true on some occasions) For example, playing as Sheffield Wednesday in the first season, i bought George Boyd for 2.5 million. Regardless of the fact that he was the best player in the league with 26 assists and 10 goals, his value fell to around 1.5 million before experiencing a slight bump when i was playing in the Championship the next season (and he was at his peak with 24-25 years of age)

Found a similar story in my next two jobs...John Fleck was my best signing as a Wigan manager in Jan 2014 (he was 23) he experienced a dip in value that season as i was relegated to the Championship (understandable) and a slight bump when i was promoted back to the Premier League the next season before i was able to buy him for 6 million as the Fenerbahce manager in 2018. Had a good first season when i played him as a winger (11 assists and 5 goals in 24 games) and a better second season when i played him as a striker (21 goals and 9 assists in 30 games) yet Liverpool was able to purchase him for just 4.2 million in his third season. Another important signing was a striker named Nicolas Riquelme...bought him for 13.5 million (may be i did pay over the odds) but he has had three very good seasons and scoring at an avg of a goal every 2 games yet his value has plummeted to 1.6 million. A player in better form was a regen who i played sometimes on the wing and sometimes as a striker..scored 40 goals and 23 assists in 90 games yet his value is 2.6 million.

This "situation" is really visible now when i am managing one of the best teams in Europe (Ajax) in one of the top six leagues on the continent. The club had bought a 23-year old winger for around 12 million before i was offered the job. He was the best player in the league last season....scoring 10 goals and 21 assists in 38 games with an avg rating of 7.40 (including 3 assists and 4 goals in 8 Champions League game starting from group stage) yet his value was half of what he had been payed (around 6.25 million as i approached April) and now it is 3.9 million even though he has scored 9 goals and 7 assists in 17 games so far. I had also bought what i believe is one of the best left wingers in the game..a 22 year old Mexican who has started the season on fire with 21 assists and 6 goals in 22 games with avg rating of 7.89...yet his value fell from 9.5 million (the transfer fee) to 8.5 million and i believe that it will fall further.

The crux of such a long post is that the value of the players continue to fall regardless of the fact that they have been some of the best players in their league. I could understand about the fact regarding lower leagues or when you get relegated (that is realistic) but playing in leagues outside the "top four" you will struggle to even recoup what you had payed unless you have gotten a bargain or you have bought a high potential youngster whose value increases over time (regardless of the fact that he might display an average form) I initially thought that it was to do with player CA/PA so i checked the players' value in Genie. The Mexican winger that i am talking about has a CA of 165 and a PA of 185...Riquelme has a CA of 150, the other Ajax winger has a CA of 169 and a PA of 190. This means that the main thing affecting the value of a player is league rep.

However we have seen players who go to less glamorous leagues yet command big transfer fees (this is important because i find that usually AI clubs refuse to pay anything more than 200% value of a player) Suarez was bought for something around 6.5 million by Ajax, yet a couple of seasons later he was sold for 21 million. Twente had bought Bryan Ruiz for 5 million yet sold him 2 seasons later for 14 million. My point here is...shouldnt the value of a player be linked to the form he displays rather than the team/league he plays form?

I see what you mean in my save at the moment. I had a cracking DC/FC (i know, weird) for ajax valued at £9.5M and sold him for £20M to Man City. His value stayed at £20M for a bit then rocketed to

£35M.

My only here point would be that as FM players we can see most of the players stats, so we can be fairly sure that if there's a player tearing up the BSP with all 20's he'll be able to cut it in the top leagues. However if this happened in real life it would be difficult to judge say his tackling ability against such inferior players, i.e. a player with tackling of 14 would win most tackles in the BSP. So IRL people would probably say: Oh yeah he can do it in a lower league but does have the ability hidden away to cut it in the top flight?. So buying him would be risk, lowering his value. Although that's on the assumption that league reputation and ability in that league are closely related.

Just some of my thoughts Sorry if haven't explained myself very well, I got quite confused half way through!

I see what you mean in my save at the moment. I had a cracking DC/FC (i know, weird) for ajax

Its not really wierd at all. Chris Sutton, Dion Dublin and John Charles among others all played in both positions.

the thing is that players have a peak value when they are about 23, as from that point on it is unlikely that they will improve much and a club that buys the player will be able to sell him for a good price again. So every year older than 23-24 he gets he will depreciate in value. Sounds like you paid a lot though.

Its not really wierd at all. Chris Sutton, Dion Dublin and John Charles among others all played in both positions.

Chris Sutton and Dion Dublin in a sentence with John Charles. I never thought I'd see the day.

the thing is that players have a peak value when they are about 23, as from that point on it is unlikely that they will improve much and a club that buys the player will be able to sell him for a good price again. So every year older than 23-24 he gets he will depreciate in value. Sounds like you paid a lot though.

Should qualify that - unless they are a genuine superstar and not just showing the promise to be.

the thing is that players have a peak value when they are about 23, as from that point on it is unlikely that they will improve much and a club that buys the player will be able to sell him for a good price again. So every year older than 23-24 he gets he will depreciate in value. Sounds like you paid a lot though.

Should qualify that - unless they are a genuine superstar and not just showing the promise to be.

What qualifies a player to be a superstar though? His looks...or his love life? Here is a player who has consistently owned the Dutch league in the past three seasons. In 80 league games he has scored 32 goals and made 56 assists from a winger position. His Champions League record reads 24 games 7 goals, 12 assists and 3 MOMs...all against tough teams because i started the competition in the group stage in all the three seasons. I paid 9.5 million for this player so i dont think that i paid too much.

Liverpool paid 20 million for Downing this season and the consensus is that they paid too much for him. But if he has that sort of record in the next three seasons do you think his value will be less than 20 million? Real Madrid paid 80 million for Ronaldo..again an amount that was thought to be too much...but he has been one of the two best players in the La Liga since he joined Madrid...do you think that they will be selling him for anything less than what they paid for? Let us leave the big teams...Charlie Adam was one of the top 10 central midfielders in the Premier League last season...he was with a team that was relegated back to the Championship and he was 25 years of age...yet his transfer value of 7 millions means that Liverpool got him on a bargain.

I understand that FM being a game means that there are lot of limitations and it cannot apply human logic. But it seems that reputation plays too much of an important role in the game..be it league rep or player rep

The value of a player is linked to league reputation, and I don't see the problem with that, it's very realistic. A player valued at £2m for Sheffield Wednesday is worth a lot more to them than a £2m player is to Man Utd, since Utd are significantly richer. So if Wednesday sell someone for £2m, this is quite a windfall for them.

The point about losing money on players is true if you buy them from higher divisions, but it works the other way too - buy good players from leagues lower than your team and then sell them on for profit. In fact, you should never aim to buy players from teams that are better than you, it's always best to find good players from poor teams as they are better value for money.

Yes..i agree with you...value of a player lowering if he is transferred from a higher rep league to a lower rep league is realistic no doubt..but the fact is that Ajax (with rep of 7,181 playing in the Dutch league with a rep of 5966) bought a right winger from Dynamo Kiev (with rep of 7579 playing in the Ukrainian league with rep of 5562) for 12 million. This player went on to score 34 goals and make 34 assists in 99 games with an avg rating of 7.36 over three seasons. Yet his value fell to 3.9 million and major European clubs like Everton (taken over by tycoon and won 2 epl and 1 cl) Bayern and Real Sociedad (same situation as Everton) were willing to offer just 8 million.

The same goes for the left winger...bought him from Lokomotiv Moscow (rep of 6730 and playing in the Russian league with rep of 5878) for 9.5 million. He scored 39 goals and made 72 assists in 111 games...yet his value fell to 6.75 before i had sold him off to Chelsea for 14 million (yes the 4.5 million represents a profit but he was one of the best left wingers in Europe over three seasons...i would have assumed getting at least 20 million for him) So in both the cases players came up from a lower division to a higher division. To be honest it wouldnt have matter what his value is but for the important fact being that clubs very rarely offer more than 200% of a value to a player...that meant that i was forced to sell two world class wingers on cheap as i already had introduced younger replacements (not too much of younger since the right winger was 27 when i sold him while the left winger was 26 which meant that both were at their peak)

yes but the on screen value is just an estimate based on a few things, contract length and value, rep, league rep. But the value of the player to the club is completely different. In your two examples what were their values before Ajax bought them? Dont confuse the on screen valuation with club valuation, they are two different things entirely.

When you sign a player, the transfer fee will be his value. Over time, that value adjusts to the club's and the league's reputation. This goes both ways. So if you are Milan and sign a player for free, his value will be higher than if you are Sheffield Wednesday signing the same player. If you paid, say, £1m for him to either club, after 6 months or so he would be valued 230k in SW but 3.5m in Milan.

It costs more money to buy players from Milan than from Sheffield Wednesday. That's all there is to the transfer value. How doesn't it make sense?

I agree that club reputation should be more dynamic. It seems to fit AI clubs, which aren't likely to perform above their standing, but for human-controlled clubs it feels slow and cumbersome when you win everything with Dag&Red for 10 years straight, becoming the best and richest club in the world... but all your players would still rather go to Chelsea which relegated to The Championship...

Yes..i agree with you...value of a player lowering if he is transferred from a higher rep league to a lower rep league is realistic no doubt..but the fact is that Ajax (with rep of 7,181 playing in the Dutch league with a rep of 5966) bought a right winger from Dynamo Kiev (with rep of 7579 playing in the Ukrainian league with rep of 5562) for 12 million. This player went on to score 34 goals and make 34 assists in 99 games with an avg rating of 7.36 over three seasons. Yet his value fell to 3.9 million and major European clubs like Everton (taken over by tycoon and won 2 epl and 1 cl) Bayern and Real Sociedad (same situation as Everton) were willing to offer just 8 million.

The same goes for the left winger...bought him from Lokomotiv Moscow (rep of 6730 and playing in the Russian league with rep of 5878) for 9.5 million. He scored 39 goals and made 72 assists in 111 games...yet his value fell to 6.75 before i had sold him off to Chelsea for 14 million (yes the 4.5 million represents a profit but he was one of the best left wingers in Europe over three seasons...i would have assumed getting at least 20 million for him) So in both the cases players came up from a lower division to a higher division. To be honest it wouldnt have matter what his value is but for the important fact being that clubs very rarely offer more than 200% of a value to a player...that meant that i was forced to sell two world class wingers on cheap as i already had introduced younger replacements (not too much of younger since the right winger was 27 when i sold him while the left winger was 26 which meant that both were at their peak)

So you bought a player for £12m, but how much was he actuallyvalued at before you bought him?

As others have said, his value will be whatever you paid for him when he first arrives at your club, decreasing over time.

It might be "realistic", but for example the decrease in Value at Ajax makes it rediculously hard to sell players for a decent amount of cash, for example in FM11 Suarez at me (while performing greatly) would never leave for the 26 million he did in real life, just because his ingame value being about 6 million the whole time. You can say "just don't sell him then", but that is hard to do in the trading house that the Dutch league is. The distance in value is way too much, for example a rubbish player for eeh... lets say... Aston Villa, costs millions if you want to buy him (and of course the rediculous English wages ), even if the club wants to get rid of him. This while clubs like that from England can just easily pick up great players for really cheap in the "lower european leagues".

sorry to sound harsh but complete nonsense. I play in Scotland, my top player was worth £6m, i sold him last season for £22m, i bought a german midfielder for £150k, sold him for £11m 5 years later, his on screen value was £3.5m, if the player is good enough teams will pay good money for them, despite what the on screen value is.

sorry to sound harsh but complete nonsense. I play in Scotland, my top player was worth £6m, i sold him last season for £22m, i bought a german midfielder for £150k, sold him for £11m 5 years later, his on screen value was £3.5m, if the player is good enough teams will pay good money for them, despite what the on screen value is.

Is this happening in the saves where you have edited all clubs to have Sugar Daddies and world-class managers?

Just asking because AI clubs very rarely sign players above 150% of the face value. It does happen, just too rarely in FM11.

yes but the only clubs i edited were in scotland and none of the sales have been to other scottish clubs.

yes but the only clubs i edited were in scotland and none of the sales have been to other scottish clubs.

That would surely increase the reputation of the SPL greatly, so it isn't really comparable to an unedited game. It is easy to sell players from the best clubs and leagues, something completely different from a less prominent club in a smaller league.

Well the rep has only now reached a par with the german league which has taken 22 seasons, but the rep has been much lower for the whole game and have made huge profits on players the whole way through this game, never had an issue selling players for easily 4 or 5 times their values. Obviously there values are now slightly higher, although still not near the 3 big leagues, i have one player valued at £18m who has world class rep, the next best is two at £10m the rest between £1m and £7m so the values are not sky high, and these only really went up to these levels after my first champs league win, anyway, it doesnt take away the fact i have made huge profits on good players no matter what their stated value has been.

First off, let me say that what i have written so far...i have nothing against the game...not saying that there is a bug nor saying that it is broken. Nor am i saying that the AI clubs never ever pay 200% of the transfer fee of the player that i had bought (milnerpoint..i had bought two guys in another save as Dortmund...a Brazilian FB for 2 million (18 years of age) and a 19 year old Uruguayan winger for 3.6 million from FC Zurich..sold them for 74 mllion and 57 million after 5-6 years though their value too had increased by that time...what was the age of your German midfielder that you had bought? And from which team..and what was his form in the last couple of seasons before you sold him) .

That said...i believe it is a fact that when you buy a fairly older player (above 23-24 years of age) and unless you have bought him from some obscure leagues, his value will remain same(ish) if he is consistently playing in your team (will be first to say that i have not made any tests...just got this feeling from observation) My point here is...the insistence of the AI club to be a maximum of 200% for a player...regardless of the fact that the price in question is too low, regardless of the fact that a player has been one of the best in Europe over a period of time, regardless of the fact that i have not transfer listed, regardless of the fact that he is at his peak.

I dont know how much the right winger was valued at Dynamo before he was bought for 12 million (he was bought before i came to the club) but it is a safe bet to say that he might have been valued at around 5-6 million (again i dont know..i am just assuming this) The left winger was valued at 5.5 million and i had bought him for 9.5 million. Yes his value increased to 6.75, yet he was 22 when i had bought him..so his value would have risen even if i had not bought him)

To be frank, the main point of my post is not about value. I mentioned value because of the fact that that is what an AI club sees when bidding for a player...it will easily bid 80 million for a 40 million striker...who is in good form...but will refuse to bid more than 8 million for a great winger just because his value is 4 million?. My point here is the 200% cap seemingly set for most of the transfers regardless of the price. Now i would agree that if an AI club bids 80 million for a 40 million striker...may be that might be excessive...but are you trying to say that a bid of 8 million and 14 million for two of the best wingers in Europe over the last three seasons and who are at their peak is realistic?