So, FM11 doesn't know the rules of football

Firstly, this is here, as I highly doubt it's a bug, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I've just seen a penalty taken, hit the post, and scored by the same player, directly from the rebound. That wouldn't be a goal in real life, so why is it here?

Disappointing that for all the advances that have been made in recent years (ME, Player Interaction etc.) that the rules of football are yet to be fully implemented.

there is nothing that says he cannot score the rebound, your thinking of the rule where a player cannot kick the ball again from a free kick until either an opp player or team mate has touched it, i dont think it comes into effect in this situation.

The same player can score from a goalkeeper's fumble, so why not from the post?

there is nothing that says he cannot score the rebound, your thinking of the rule where a player cannot kick the ball again from a free kick until either an opp player or team mate has touched it, i dont think it comes into effect in this situation.

"The kicker may play the ball a second time (possibly scoring a goal) if the ball rebounds off the keeper; but not if the ball rebounds directly off the posts without having touched the keeper or any other player."

As swarfega said, you can't touch the ball again directly from the rebound.

Hm! Learn something new every day. I haven't seen it in the game though.

fair play it appears im wrong!

Unless the ball is touched by the keeper, it cannot be played again by the penalty taker.

Did the GK dive anywhere near the ball?

Was there anything in the match report about the keeper touching the ball?

The keeper did go the right way, which is why I had to watch the replay pretty carefully, and the commentary, didn't seem to touch the keeper, it just said that it'd hit the post, then it came straight back out to the taker, who scored.

This is an area SI need to improve on. The indirect free kick isn't in the game (despite them being awarded occasionally) because there's no coding for most of the indirect offences like playing the ball twice. Hence penalties being awarded for impeding, and goals being scored from free kicks from offsides.

Hence penalties being awarded for impeding, and goals being scored from free kicks from offsides.

I've never seen either of those things happen lol

The keeper did go the right way, which is why I had to watch the replay pretty carefully, and the commentary, didn't seem to touch the keeper, it just said that it'd hit the post, then it came straight back out to the taker, who scored.

What about the match report?

Ironically, Ibrahimovic has just scored a penalty for me in the CL after scoring from a rebound off the post. The goalkeeper (Casillas) went the complete opposite direction. Until now, I never realised this shouldnt happen so I dont have a PKM unless I can go back to a previous game and get it?

Ironically, Ibrahimovic has just scored a penalty for me in the CL after scoring from a rebound off the post. The goalkeeper (Casillas) went the complete opposite direction. Until now, I never realised this shouldnt happen so I dont have a PKM unless I can go back to a previous game and get it?

You can if it wasn't too long ago, go to your fixture list and click on the scoreline, then go to "match controls" and click "save".

I'd suggest filing it away somewhere safe as SI aren't always as responsive at this time of year.

TBH I did not know this. I learned something today.

I just had this happen in my victory over Barca. Valdes dove the right direction, but I think the ball hit the post and not the keeper. The ball came right back to my taker who promptly put it in the net for a goal.

Good spot, pret

We should start a new thread somewhere for rules that most people don't know, cos i sure as heck had no idea about that one!

Weird, I've seen it allowed in real life so had no idea. Guess I shouldn't expect match officials to know the rules!

This has been around for a while. I'm pretty sure it happened to me in FM08 too.

Weird, I've seen it allowed in real life so had no idea. Guess I shouldn't expect match officials to know the rules!

Off topic, sorry, but...... in my real life game 2 tuesdays ago our player was fouled in the box and the referee gave an indirect free kick. I went crazy, what is he doing, how is it not a penalty/red card etc etc etc. Turns out that this particular league says slide tackles aren't allowed (!!!!) and if you do it then it's not a 'real' foul so it's only an indirect free kick.

A few weeks before an opponent managed to convince a referee that the guy being brought down by the goalie wasn't a goalscoring opportunity because a defender (the only other person back) was on the line. Was he going to save the shot? Not unless it's right at him. It's an opportunity, that's all it needed to be. Another indirect free kick.

Crazy.

Anyway, as you were...

Off topic, sorry, but...... in my real life game 2 tuesdays ago our player was fouled in the box and the referee gave an indirect free kick. I went crazy, what is he doing, how is it not a penalty/red card etc etc etc. Turns out that this particular league says slide tackles aren't allowed (!!!!) and if you do it then it's not a 'real' foul so it's only an indirect free kick.

A few weeks before an opponent managed to convince a referee that the guy being brought down by the goalie wasn't a goalscoring opportunity because a defender (the only other person back) was on the line. Was he going to save the shot? Not unless it's right at him. It's an opportunity, that's all it needed to be. Another indirect free kick.

Crazy.

Anyway, as you were...

Was the Ref a copper from Sheffield, per chance? Sounds about right for that useless git who is supposed to be the best Ref in England..

Off topic, sorry, but...... in my real life game 2 tuesdays ago our player was fouled in the box and the referee gave an indirect free kick. I went crazy, what is he doing, how is it not a penalty/red card etc etc etc. Turns out that this particular league says slide tackles aren't allowed (!!!!) and if you do it then it's not a 'real' foul so it's only an indirect free kick.

A few weeks before an opponent managed to convince a referee that the guy being brought down by the goalie wasn't a goalscoring opportunity because a defender (the only other person back) was on the line. Was he going to save the shot? Not unless it's right at him. It's an opportunity, that's all it needed to be. Another indirect free kick.

Crazy.

Anyway, as you were...

Very strange rules. It should have been a penalty, although as far as I know technically having a player back as cover does negate a sending off and reduce it to a yellow - although refs often do that regardless.

In defence of refs they have an impossible job. They must do, it's the only reason I can think of for why they're so ****ing useless.

We should start a new thread somewhere for rules that most people don't know, cos i sure as heck had no idea about that one!

Actually, A very good idea!

Straight from the horse's mouth:

[...]If, after the penalty kick has been taken:

the kicker touches the ball again (except with his hands) before it has touched another player:

- an indirect free kick is awarded to the opposing team, the kick to be taken from the place where the infringement occured

[...]

The goalpost situation is just a variation of this law. TBH though, it is very unlikely for this to happen IRL because (1) few penalty kicks hit the post, (2) very few times the ball rebounds towards the center of the penalty area and (3) the penalty kicker stops after the kick, the opposition defenders run and it's very unlikely they will not get to the rebounding ball first.

I must say this is not a problem in any of my saves. I have had this a couple of times where the ball hits the post or the bar and my penalty taker just stands still until somebody else touches the ball

Swarfega - where did you get this from as I do not think that it is correct - although I am sure you got this from an official source so i could be wrong.

I know from a penalty shoot out that once the ball is kicked no one can follow up on a rebound etc, but other than this I thought you could.

Swarfega - where did you get this from as I do not think that it is correct - although I am sure you got this from an official source so i could be wrong.

I know from a penalty shoot out that once the ball is kicked no one can follow up on a rebound etc, but other than this I thought you could.

"He must not play the ball again until it has touched another player"

On page 43

No, Swarfega's right, I've known that rule for ages now. http://www.talkfootball.co.uk/guides/rules_of_football.html#p Not an official source but you'll find the same rules anywhere, another player has to touch the ball before the taker of a direct freekick or penalty can touch it again

EDIT: Damn!

Fair enough - I have been following football for 30 years and never knew this. I wonder if the players do! Wouldn't it be funny if a penalty was taken and rebounded to the taker and knowing this he had to leave it alone. You could imagine the stick he would initially get from the players and fans.

Saying this though - there must be instances where the taker has scored on a follow up save by the keeper and the goal given. Might just google this one and have a look to see if it is enforced or not.

Fair enough - I have been following football for 30 years and never knew this. I wonder if the players do! Wouldn't it be funny if a penalty was taken and rebounded to the taker and knowing this he had to leave it alone. You could imagine the stick he would initially get from the players and fans.

Saying this though - there must be instances where the taker has scored on a follow up save by the keeper and the goal given. Might just google this one and have a look to see if it is enforced or not.

Actually scrub what i said as you can follow up and score - it is only if it hits the crossbar/post and reounds to you!!

Saying this though - there must be instances where the taker has scored on a follow up save by the keeper and the goal given. Might just google this one and have a look to see if it is enforced or not.

That is a goal though, since another player has touched the ball after the penalty was taken.

I was baffled to see this given as offside... the last person to touch the ball is clearly a defender :confused:

With my (very) limited knowledge I was doing a mental run through of how you'd code the cure for this, had to stop when people started crossing the road to avoid me:D

Can we get a ruling on this...? [video=youtube;WKKNxUOJmyk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKKNxUOJmyk

Very strange rules. It should have been a penalty, although as far as I know technically having a player back as cover does negate a sending off and reduce it to a yellow - although refs often do that regardless.

In defence of refs they have an impossible job. They must do, it's the only reason I can think of for why they're so ****ing useless.

It sounds like this is some 5 a side (or otherwise small-sided, a chance it is 11 vs 11 though) league in Canada which doesn't use FIFA's laws, and instead only awards a penalty if it is a goalscoring opportunity.

The referee has to factor in all sorts of things to work out whether it is a clear goal scoring opportunity, one of which is the location of other players. Essentially, if the ref thinks a goal is very probably about to be scored if the player isn't fouled, then he should send off the player who fouls him (or handles the ball).

This penalty proves this rule.

FWIW, so did Zenden when Middlesbrough won the Carling Cup, but I think that was just because everyone missed it. He somehow managed to kick it twice without hitting anything else.

Last season my sunday team had a penalty against us, the taker hit the bar and was then 1st to touch rebound. We got a free kick for it.

Always believed this to be the rule!

Unless the ball is touched by the keeper, it cannot be played again by the penalty taker.

not quite true, if its touched by any member of the defending team, the taker can play the ball

Interesting fact - the penalty taker is allowed to pass the ball to a member of his own team who can score as the penalty is deemed missed and open play resumes

Interesting fact - the penalty taker is allowed to pass the ball to a member of his own team who can score as the penalty is deemed missed and open play resumes

Mr Henry and Mr Pires wouldn't advise you try that one.

Although it did work for Mr Cruyff.

Position of the Ball and the Players

The ball:

• must be placed on the penalty mark

The player taking the penalty kick:

• must be properly identified

The defending goalkeeper:

• must remain on his goal line, facing the kicker, between the goalposts until the ball has been kicked

The players other than the kicker must be located:

• inside the field of play

• outside the penalty area

• behind the penalty mark

• at least 9.15 m (10 yds) from the penalty mark

Procedure

• After the players have taken positions in accordance with this Law, the referee signals for the penalty kick to be taken

• The player taking the penalty kick must kick the ball forward

• He must not play the ball again until it has touched another player

• The ball is in play when it is kicked and moves forward

not quite true, if its touched by any member of the defending team, the taker can play the ball

Interesting fact - the penalty taker is allowed to pass the ball to a member of his own team who can score as the penalty is deemed missed and open play resumes

The law on this is quite clear.

As soon as you take the penalty kick, you CANNOT touch it until another player has touched it.

That includes passing it to another team member.

It must hit the goal keeper, or your own player can pass it to you. But you must not touch it again.

You could tap it forward (playing the ball forward as per the laws) and your player could run in and try to score (Henry & (I think it was Reyes?) Reyes did it at Arsenal)

The ball must move forward and you can't touch it until another player has, from either team.

This is an area SI need to improve on. The indirect free kick isn't in the game (despite them being awarded occasionally) because there's no coding for most of the indirect offences like playing the ball twice. Hence penalties being awarded for impeding, and goals being scored from free kicks from offsides.

How can you score from a freekick from an offside ? That would have to be about 80 yards from goal ?

It's common sense... you wouldn't expect a player to be allowed to dribble the ball from a PK, hitting the post doesn't make any difference!

Common sense isn't that common though Joe. I'm a ref myself, and I get slaughtered all the time for applying the laws correctly because people don't understand them properly. I've always thought players should be made to sit tests on the laws of the game before being allowed to play, and should be made to re-sit those tests every couple of years. I'd also make all professional players referee games under cameras and have all their decisions scrutinised for the 90 minutes too. Would soon improve behaviour.

Robbie Savage did that recently. He said it made him think about it more and how difficult it was for refs. In the first 90 seconds of his first refereeing game in a friendly he had to make a choice to send someone off or not. He followed the letter of the law and afterwards he revealed how he agonised over it.

Do we really want FM to apply it to the letter of the law? Or to allow the odd offside. the odd wrong decision? I do. That's football. Until video replays are used to determine things, I want that unpredicability. Heck sometimes it works in my favour. But you rarely see people say "Hey the ref made a mistake and I won!!!" It's only when it goes against us that we're outraged.

Robbie Savage did that recently. He said it made him think about it more and how difficult it was for refs. In the first 90 seconds of his first refereeing game in a friendly he had to make a choice to send someone off or not. He followed the letter of the law and afterwards he revealed how he agonised over it.

Do we really want FM to apply it to the letter of the law? Or to allow the odd offside. the odd wrong decision? I do. That's football. Until video replays are used to determine things, I want that unpredicability. Heck sometimes it works in my favour. But you rarely see people say "Hey the ref made a mistake and I won!!!" It's only when it goes against us that we're outraged.

Agreed. I liked Robbie Savage a lot after that. He had the bottle to do it and see what it's like. It's not a simple thing, and you do get those decisions about whether to use some discretion or not, and it's a nightmare.

Wish more fans would do it too. Stop us getting the abuse and violence.