A question about Marking

Hi everybody! I hope somebody can help me with this doubt:

Let's image I'm the manager of A.C. Milan...my central defenders are Thiago Silva(CB left) and Nesta(CB right).

Now...if I play a match against juventus my central defenders will face 2 striker...for example Toni (Right striker on the pitch) and Del Piero (left striker on the pitch).

I tell Thiago to mark Toni and Nesta to mark Del Piero (CB left vs ST right and CB right v ST left)...now...my question is...if tha AI manager decide to switch position between Del Piero and Toni...Thiago will continue to mark the right striker on the pitch? or will mark the one that i assigned him? (in this case Toni?)

Watching the game i found that by switching position the AI put my defence in crisis! because Thiago go to mark toni even if he is in the opposite side of the pitch after the position swapping with del Piero and Nesta go to mark Del Piero...and they are always late because they have to reach the opposite side.

It is possibile to tell Thiago to Man Mark the player that is playing as Right Striker? and not the name of the player?

Thank you for the answers.

If the opposition strikers switch your DCs will switch marking duties as well.

So in effect they mark the position not the name.

EDIT

Should point out that this is if they use the "switch position" instructions.

If they change tactic and physically move a player to another position your DC will follow the named player.

Thank you Cougar...so in this exemple: Thiago Silva will mark Toni...and, when Toni swap position with Del piero then Thiago Silva will begin to Mark Del Piero and not Toni?

If the opposition strikers switch your DCs will switch marking duties as well.

So in effect they mark the position not the name.

EDIT

Should point out that this is if they use the "switch position" instructions.

If they change tactic and physically move a player to another position your DC will follow the named player.

Yeah but when the original position of your defenders are not matching the strikers they are set to mark (name), the OP describes that the defenders start out in their original position and then have to run after the striker they are supposed to mark. I have experienced this myself, and subsequently stopped using specific marking on my Central Defenders after that as it is a useless feature once the AI manager sets them to switch position. I haven't tried this in FM11.3.

The solution (if what the OP describes is correct) is to not mark specific strikers with your CD's. The feature is really only useful for the right and left backs in that case.

Thank you Cougar...so in this exemple: Thiago Silva will mark Toni...and, when Toni swap position with Del piero then Thiago Silva will begin to Mark Del Piero and not Toni?

I believe thats the way its designed to work but as Biggus has pointed out in practice it doesn't always work.

If the strikers & DCs are lining up man for man personally just leave the DCs on a general "Man mark" instruction I find works best.

Just leave them on man marking (don't specify) and they will match up against the striker in front of them

Yeah but when the original position of your defenders are not matching the strikers they are set to mark (name), the OP describes that the defenders start out in their original position and then have to run after the striker they are supposed to mark. I have experienced this myself, and subsequently stopped using specific marking on my Central Defenders after that as it is a useless feature once the AI manager sets them to switch position. I haven't tried this in FM11.3.

The solution (if what the OP describes is correct) is to not mark specific strikers with your CD's. The feature is really only useful for the right and left backs in that case.

Yes, This is the problem.

What I wrote in the original post was only an exemple to better explain my problem.

In my actual save game I play with a 3-3-3-1 formation that i'm trying to improve match after match. I score a lot of gol but i concede a lot as well.

The tactic have 1 Sweeper with defensive duties and two full backs with defensive duties...what i'm trying to do is to have my FB right to mark the center-left striker and my FB left to mark the center-right Striker. So when defending i have a solid 3 man defence with 2 player marking the 2 opposite striker, and 1 sweeper that will cover any error, But when i have the ball the 2 full backs support the attack by playing wide leaving my team a lot of passing option. This kind of system work very well untill the AI decide to swap position...than it's a mess because my FBr has to run to the left of the field to mark the striker i assigned him!

It's seems strange to me that is not possibile to tell a player: you have to mark the player that play as Center-left Striker no matter is name !

I think the core issue here is that SI seems to be unaware of what the difference between "Man Marking" and "Zonal Marking" really is.

Man marking = the marker follows the markee around the whole pitch and his sole defensive task is to deny that player space and having the ball. This includes going to the bathroom, if necessary.

Zonal Marking = the marker is given a zone in which he will deny space, and any opposition player moving into that zone is to be followed until he leaves it.

In fact, there is no professional football club employing any of these two as such, not in modern football. Instead they use a mixture of both, where every player on the team is to mark forward-running players that falls into their zones of defence, and follow them until the team regains posession of the ball. Some clubs apply more following-around than others, so the actual implementation of marking is not either/or, on/off but a gradual increase from traditional zonal-like to traditional manmarking-like.

The Tight Marking tick-off box therefore makes little sense as well.

I hope that SI implements a slider bar with 20 tiers for marking in 2012, rather than maintaining the current, non-existing system.

It's seems strange to me that is not possibile to tell a player: you have to mark the player that play as Center-left Striker no matter is name !

I would rather say that it should be possible to tell a player: "mark THAT guy *name* no matter where you play and where he plays. Good old-fashioned tight man-marking! If you tackle him so he goes to the hospital, you're to follow him there too unless I say otherwise!"

I would rather say that it should be possible to tell a player: "mark THAT guy *name* no matter where you play and where he plays. Good old-fashioned tight man-marking! If you tackle him so he goes to the hospital, you're to follow him there too unless I say otherwise!"

You can do this, it's the other options we'd like to have. Because, as pointed out before, if the player is moved by the AI, your defender still keeps marking him. If you play with specific marking, you essentially have to babysit your players, because they won't think twice about running halfway across the pitch to mark someone, leaving massive holes in your defence.

Whereas 9 times out of 10 I want to tell my left back to take out the right winger, not specifically Jimmy McSpeedy who just happens to be playing there now; i.e. a form of man marking that's actual man marking, not the confusing "kinda zonal marking with a twist" that man marking currently is.

You can do this, it's the other options we'd like to have. Because, as pointed out before, if the player is moved by the AI, your defender still keeps marking him. If you play with specific marking, you essentially have to babysit your players, because they won't think twice about running halfway across the pitch to mark someone, leaving massive holes in your defence.

Whereas 9 times out of 10 I want to tell my left back to take out the right winger, not specifically Jimmy McSpeedy who just happens to be playing there now; i.e. a form of man marking that's actual man marking, not the confusing "kinda zonal marking with a twist" that man marking currently is.

Yeah he still keeps marking him, but at the same time he still plays in his position - so when the strikers switch position your defenders don't! That leaves you with a huge disadvantage.

I think the idea I posted above with a 20-point slider option instead of a on/off box would allow a man-marking system as you propose when put in the max man-mark position.

Zonal............................................mixed.........................................Man

Edit: the problem arrives when they play with a target/poacher duo up front. Then you want your Stopper to mark their Target Man, and your Cover to mark the Poacher. This is when both the current system and the system you guys propose (and mine) fails. The CDR and the CDL simply needs to switch places automatically if the AI makes his duo switch positions, as part of the mark specific player instruction - and that switch needs to be done at the same time as the strikers' so that it doesn't occur -after- a animation has started because then it is too late and the switch positions-feature becomes overpowered.

Yeah he still keeps marking him, but at the same time he still plays in his position - so when the strikers switch position your defenders don't! That leaves you with a huge disadvantage.

Edit: the problem arrives when they play with a target/poacher duo up front. Then you want your Stopper to mark their Target Man, and your Cover to mark the Poacher. This is when both the current system and the system you guys propose (and mine) fails. The CDR and the CDL simply needs to switch places automatically if the AI makes his duo switch positions, as part of the mark specific player instruction - and that switch needs to be done at the same time as the strikers' so that it doesn't occur -after- a animation has started because then it is too late and the switch positions-feature becomes overpowered.

Got you, I thought you meant the ability to tell the player to mark Fred Bloggs, but you mean mark Fred Bloggs, and if he switches, switch to the appropriate position as well.

Doesn't that open a whole can of worms if a player switches from, say, STR to MR? Do you really want your DC playing at DL/ML/WBL and how would you determine the position to move to (in particular, do you move to DL or ML in a 4-4-2)? But yeah, I can see this being a good option if the opposition are using the "switch position" option for their two strikers.

I hate specific man marking, in FM its only worthwhile to kill uber players like Messi. The AI always swaps around if you start using it on forward players or wingers.

The weird thing is generic man marking should work as the OP wants it to, but it doesn't cause as someone said its a weird mixed zonal/man system which is easy to drag out of position. This however is a long term problem in FM. Man marking and marking in general has always sucked. The most solid mistake free system is zonal imo, I barely ever use anything else.