Appalling Match Engine

When are you planning to improve the match engine that is horrifically old and behind the current times? I mean with all todays technology that's the best you can come up with? Unrealistic movement, unrealistic play, unrealistic graphics, unrealistic matches. It's becoming beyond a joke really. What you class a clear cut chance has to be a tap in, becuase in every game each team will have about 5 chances that you see once or twice in a real game. You know top strikers would score them for fun as well. There's a ridiculous amount of Striker v Goalkeeper one on ones in the game and more often than not they are missed. At first i thought this was becuase i was just playing game after game where as you get 1 or 2 games a week in real life, but if you sitback and take note of how many chances there are in each game it's riduclous. Sometimes you will see 1 clear chance for a team in real life. It's becoming ridiculous that almost every game you can have the better spell, more possesion, more shots, better passing, great defending and then all of a sudden they score with their first or second shot. this happens in real life how much? every now and then, not every other game. The amount of times i've taken a lead, and then gone on to miss abuot 3 open nets is amazing.

Graphically, how is FM so poor in the graphics quality? I play on all the high settings, my pc is powerful enough (looking at it an iphone should be powerful enough). How are the graphics so far behind every other game on the market that's to do with football. Heck even 'Rugby League 2' for the ps3 had better graphics 10 years ago. The players look nothing like anything in real life, and i dont mean in terms of fifa's graphics, i mean in skin tones and so forth. I saw yakubu being a half caste and James Vaughan being as pale as can be. Simple things like the nets moving, or a nice looking variety of stadiums make things go that extra bit better. The graphics are terrible, i mean how can FIFA (fair enough they mainly focus on the match) have amazing graphics, about 300 times better than FM. Please don't bring up a common myth that it's PC, it can't handle better graphics.. ofcourse it can, and it doesn't the latest graphics card and so forth to run FIFA on the pc. I've been a massive FM fan for years and it's a shame that this has been so poorly done and neglected for years.

The real question is when are you going to revamp or at least give MAJOR improvements teh match engine? it's ruining the game for me. The rest of the game is very complex and to a very good standard and it's the match engine (and the soudns to go with) that seem VERY lazily done and neglected. DO you plan to address anything to do with the match engine? Or just come out minor addition like "Players can see more around them" or something.

- Flamers not wanted, real opinions (including opposing ones) are more than welcome.

Behind the current times?

There isn't a match engine close to this one. FIFA's is shinier, but that means absolutely nothing when it comes right down to it. This game has always been about gameplay, not graphics.

Gameplay > Polygons.

Behind the current times?

There isn't a match engine close to this one. FIFA's is shinier, but that means absolutely nothing when it comes right down to it. This game has always been about gameplay, not graphics.

Gameplay > Polygons.

Yes, it's way behind the urrent times, you think they can't come up with anything better than that? Everytime a player kicks the ball it looks like they are toe poking it and the player has never kicked a ball before in their life (which you'll notice when you see someone kick a ball for the first time, they dont bend their leg!)

If it was all about the gameplay then you wouldn't see players going mental sometimes and just a poor simulation of real play. The graphics would be furtehred, and as you've said FM's never really focused on the graphics, dosen't mean they shouldn't improve them though does it?

The gameplay in the match engine is terrible, i feel as though the physics involved are extremely non-real, the way they hit the ball, the moments and so forth.

I think that the game is more about the substance than the eye candy.

If they focused more on the graphics of the game then it would possibly be legitimately "unplayable." They would not have spent all the time that they have to create all of the intricacies behind how the games works behind the scenes which would severely hurt the game and it would not be the quality product that it is (some would argue that). In a Sim game i would rather have all of the game mechanics work as best as possible than have a steaming pile of crap that looks pretty.

When are you planning to improve the match engine that is horrifically old and behind the current times? I mean with all todays technology that's the best you can come up with? Unrealistic movement, unrealistic play, unrealistic graphics, unrealistic matches. It's becoming beyond a joke really. What you class a clear cut chance has to be a tap in, becuase in every game each team will have about 5 chances that you see once or twice in a real game. You know top strikers would score them for fun as well. There's a ridiculous amount of Striker v Goalkeeper one on ones in the game and more often than not they are missed. At first i thought this was becuase i was just playing game after game where as you get 1 or 2 games a week in real life, but if you sitback and take note of how many chances there are in each game it's riduclous. Sometimes you will see 1 clear chance for a team in real life. It's becoming ridiculous that almost every game you can have the better spell, more possesion, more shots, better passing, great defending and then all of a sudden they score with their first or second shot. this happens in real life how much? every now and then, not every other game. The amount of times i've taken a lead, and then gone on to miss abuot 3 open nets is amazing.

This will never be fixed in FM, it has been the rule since the match engine was created. Get used to it or just wait for another game, from another company.

Sorry If I sound harsh but it's the truth.

SI are actually doing a smart thing by using lower quality graphical representation; it allows a larger potential group of people to play the game. However, they can add a whole bunch of other possible animations to what we have now.

What a ridiculous post.

FM's match engine is by far the most advanced, playable version of what it is around. Any implication that it is 'behind the times' is not only inaccurate, but (at the risk of sounding harsh) quite stupid.

Everytime a player kicks the ball it looks like they are toe poking it .

Your players have feet? Mine are just dots. Is there a tick box or summat to show feet?

The animations are improved every year, but I think that as long as SI is only "polishing" the ME and not taking time off to come up with something new in that department, the animations are not real representations of the match second by second but pre-conceived sets of (a few) possible scenarios lasting the length of the animation sequence. Until all 22 players and the referee team behaves as small, separate programs with all the necessary parameters to simulate a football match, it is pointless developing FIFA-like graphics to represent the matches.

The only thing wrong with the 3D graphics is that it exists as an option. Should have stuck with 2D.

The only thing wrong with the 3D graphics is that it exists as an option. Should have stuck with 2D.

Why is 3D such a wrong move? It's only a different representation of the 2D, not a totally separate program that would enable the results between 2D and 3D matches to differ. If you don't think 3D is watchable in terms of graphics or how the players are animated, don't use 3D. Personally I have never gone back to 2D ever since 3D became an option. It's not perfect but still enjoyable.

Gather there will be a new match engine in FM12, if that helps.

Why is 3D such a wrong move? It's only a different representation of the 2D, not a totally separate program that would enable the results between 2D and 3D matches to differ. If you don't think 3D is watchable in terms of graphics or how the players are animated, don't use 3D. Personally I have never gone back to 2D ever since 3D became an option. It's not perfect but still enjoyable.

Because it took up development time (and bug fixing time), bumped up the required PC specs and was yet another feature for people to not enjoy and moan about.

I'd rather the time was spent on improving and fixing the core game itself, rather than adding another graphical representation.

The only thing wrong with the 3D graphics is that it exists as an option. Should have stuck with 2D.

well said, ill always use 2d you cant beat it,

The match engine is flawed, yes. But it is by far the best match engine ever in any management sim. Fifa Manager has the graphics and excellent animiations but the match engine logic in that game is a throw back to games that were around in the 1990's - to the point where most of the goals you score may as well be scripted. Fifa Manager actually had a half-decent match engine in their 2008 release but have totally ruined it over the last few years.

Unlike EA Sports & Bright Future, I think SI put more emphasis on the core gameplay of their game first and have only lately introduced a 3D representation (2009 ?). I'm sure the graphics will improve year by year and the flawed ME logic will improve with each release. But even in its current state its still in another league compared to what other games companies have produced.

3D > Commentary Only > 2D

Sounds like another "I keep losing" QQ. Sure, I get occasional frustrating losses, but with the right team, right tactics, it's not too frequent. Definitely not every other game.

As per the graphics, well one'd assume if they hired people and attempted to do a "modern" graphical engine to the point where they have to show faces as the quality is up to that level, then they'd either have to fork out for image rights which they probably couldn't afford, or just "approximate" the looks, which'd mean there'd be some people confused/annoyed at seeing Rooney looking half-way not-ugly!. I can see it now "QQ, rooney's not an ugly bleep, it's so unrealistic! fix it SI!".

3D > Commentary Only > 2D

Wait, what? Commentary over 2D?

3D > Commentary Only > 2D

Your mad!!

Sounds like another "I keep losing" QQ. Sure, I get occasional frustrating losses, but with the right team, right tactics, it's not too frequent. Definitely not every other game.

I hate this generalisation. I've had nothing but success on FM11 and I think the 3D is absolutely appalling too.

Wait, what? Commentary over 2D?

Your mad!!

He's not! The 2D was awful thinking back. They curled the ball into any corner facing a different direction!

I would rather have SI work more on the diversity in the goals scored and chances created and just the general football played instead of putting in more hours on the graphics.

1. Gameplay

2. No bugs

3. Graphics

Just be thankful you didn't buy Championship Manager 2010:

[video=youtube;O6Adq0cjN3Y]

Now tell me the FM match engine stinks.

Just be thankful you didn't buy Championship Manager 2010:

[video=youtube;O6Adq0cjN3Y]

Now tell me the FM match engine stinks.

Quality!!!!

3D > Commentary Only > 2D

I agree

3D is the best view to watch matches, commentary is the fastest and 2D is only good for setting up tactics.

Quality!!!!

LOL I just took a poke around youtube there are some other gems as well!

Also, to address the OP... a couple of years back FM didn't even have 3D. The game has never been about having an aesthetically pretty ME and for years we only had commentary or 3d. Yes the 3D has a few niggles but I think it's great! One of the things I love about the game is that it has never been graphically demanding and I can play it on my work laptop... it's a perfect fit for having on in the background due to the nature of the game.

I don't want this to ever become a game where they concentrate on the ME aesthetics.

I agree

3D is the best view to watch matches, commentary is the fastest and 2D is only good for setting up tactics.

I'd say commentary is only good for getting through a match quickly, while 2d is far superior because it allows you to see the tactic unfold

And that video posted was just pure awesomeness

It is amazing how many people confuse the match graphics for the match engine. Yes, the FM11 match graphics aren't as good as FIFA or PES, but in terms of how the three represent what happens in real football matches FM11 is a long way ahead. I'm not saying there aren't any problems with the match engine, there clearly are, but it is by far the best artificial representation of a game of football I have seen.

As for the graphics, EA Sports/FIFA franchise has been in 3D for circa 15 years compared to the circa 4 years of real FM development of the 3D representation. FIFA is also developed by a larger developer with a larger budget and the 3D is the core of the whole game. Where as on FM the 3D representation is just one small part of the overall game. There is plenty of room for improvement as to how FM matches look graphically, but it has already taken large strides in a small period, just compare how FM09 compares to FM11. FM11 is only the 3rd game in the franchise with 3D and is already significantly ahead of the first incarnation a mere two years previous. You will see improvements in this area year on year.

I'd say commentary is only good for getting through a match quickly, while 2d is far superior because it allows you to see the tactic unfold

I suppose it all depends on how you like to manage. I'm not much of a tactician, I prefer to stick to one basic system and then develop my players to fit into it.

Just be thankful you didn't buy Championship Manager 2010:

[video=youtube;O6Adq0cjN3Y]

Now tell me the FM match engine stinks.

The fact that this is the level of competition is one of the biggest issues, tbh. The same fundamental issues have repeated themselves ever since the 3D was introduced, but where are the disgruntled ones like myself going to go if we're not satisfied? I still want to get my management simulation fix.

The fact that this is the level of competition is one of the biggest issues, tbh. The same fundamental issues have repeated themselves ever since the 3D was introduced, but where are the disgruntled ones like myself going to go if we're not satisfied? I still want to get my management simulation fix.

Its hardly SI's fault that there isn't any competition is it.

Perhaps rather than trying to pick faults and break the ME you should just try appreciating it.

Everyone should try and break it - thats the best way of getting it improved.

Just be thankful you didn't buy Championship Manager 2010:

[video=youtube;O6Adq0cjN3Y]

Now tell me the FM match engine stinks.

HAHA! Talking about brain leakage...

Its hardly SI's fault that there isn't any competition is it.

Of course not, and I never said it was. But it can certainly breed complacency.

Perhaps rather than trying to pick faults and break the ME you should just try appreciating it.

I pay my money like everyone else, so I'm entitled to give criticism if I want to. I think there are a lot of excellent facets to the 3D and some great animations, I just get sick of the same issues existing time after time.

Just be thankful you didn't buy Championship Manager 2010:

[video=youtube;O6Adq0cjN3Y]

Now tell me the FM match engine stinks.

Yeah, but they did have a "pay what you like" campaign before its release.

Even at £1, after playing the demo... Nah!

Well, we've found the most rediculous OP of the year at least.

The pay what you like campaign came in when they realised noone was pre-ordering it

The pay what you like campaign came in when they realised noone was pre-ordering it

I actually played about 10-20 matches in a season for Derby on that demo. The second to last match I played convinced me to never play it again, the last wasn't too bad though. I just thought I had to beat Forest before stopping. Essentially, it ended 5-3 my way. Viduka scored a hattrick. This hattrick was the issue:

1 - The keeper drops the ball and doesn't feel it's his duty to deal with the ball sitting on the goal line with Dukes baring down on him

2 - Dribbles like Messi around 3 players and slows it home seemingly through the keeper

3 - I'm not sure, I think it was a throughball that everyone missed

Yeah...

Just be thankful you didn't buy Championship Manager 2010:

Now tell me the FM match engine stinks.

[video=youtube;DqCB7Ffiu7U]

And yes...I did buy that game.....

In regards to the OP though, I think you are focusing way too much on how the match looks instead of how it plays. Yes it has issues (nothing is perfect) but it is still very much the best out there.

And like others have said, it isn't very fair to to compare FM (which has only had 3D for what 3 years now) to FIFA or PES which have had 3D graphics for much much longer.

forget about updating the graphics and concentrate on updating your language, 'half caste' as you put it is a bit out dated isn't it?

Half caste can be taken as being quite offensive, actually.

Yes half caste is the slavery term, please call it mixed race and regarding the match engine I am fine with it, I think they did a good job on the 3D engine

lol CM 2010 was so bad it was funny

[video=youtube;x3mQTm70vdY]

3D > Commentary Only > 2D

this. (1010101010)

Just be thankful you didn't buy Championship Manager 2010:

[video=youtube;O6Adq0cjN3Y]

Now tell me the FM match engine stinks.

LMAO... ok that's just classic fail right there. To actually release crap like that.... anyway

Ok so FM's ME is better then the competition. Doesn't mean it's perfect, it still needs -logic- work, not just graphics. The graphics update it got with 11 is actually pretty good. But there is still a lot of stupidity you see in the ME. It's most annoying the difference between a win and a loss. Most wins a team will look very professional and realistic, then next week the team gets dealt a loss and they look like some drunk sunday footballers.

There is more then enough examples of logic failures, physics failures, and/or representation failures that could use work.

All that being said... the OP still sounds pretty trollish.

Because it took up development time (and bug fixing time), bumped up the required PC specs and was yet another feature for people to not enjoy and moan about.

I'd rather the time was spent on improving and fixing the core game itself, rather than adding another graphical representation.

Amen !

Just be thankful you didn't buy Championship Manager 2010:

[video=youtube;O6Adq0cjN3Y]

Now tell me the FM match engine stinks.

How...what...I don't even...

That's unbelievably bad

3D > Commentary Only > 2D

2D Classic > everything else!

Just be thankful you didn't buy Championship Manager 2010:

Now tell me the FM match engine stinks.

that is cheap shot tbh .. seen many AI and crap goals from FM as well. you never heard something called bug !!?

[video=youtube;4y2mruf1JqE]

[video=youtube;0KDPIt_Qnwg]

the guy is asking to improve AI and engine

tbh i don't care about engine

but AI.. oh GOD !! when i can ask my players to cross low ones .. is all high !! so have to stop them crossing .. and header goals from crossing is just force you to play 442 and have to have long tall strikers ..

yes FM have best AI over CM or FIFAM ..but still big way to improve the game AI

To be honest, neither of those videos are as bad as the CM ones!

To be honest, neither of those videos are as bad as the CM ones!

And that's what morons say... It's doesn't matter if it's as bad.. it shouldn't need to be worse to deserve improvement.

Stop being a fanboy and admit it has probably that need work.