Jugster Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 I'm interested to know if the playing field for the player's team compared to the AI teams, is level? The reason I ask is because I just played away at Fulham who had a team that consisted of what could only be called third division players. Only their two centre backs would pass as Championship players. Their formation was a 4-4-2 diamond, but the advanded midfielder was a defender so highlighted in red, the left winger was a centre midfielder, so highlighted in yellow. The entire defence had yellow cards for the start of the second half. By comparison, my team is the best in Europe, there's only one Arsenal player and one Man Utd player who would get into my squad at all. But despite changing the tactics at halftime, bringing on fresh forwards and midfielders,etc, the game finished 0-0 with chances at 3v10. If their team was SO bad, with players out of position, against a team with fresh players, in the right positions, playing the right tactics, it should have been a slaughter. If the situations had been reversed, I would imagine that I would have blown away. The reason it wasn't, I suspect, is because the team were in the middle of one of their "mysterious loss of form" spells. This doesn't affect the chances created, it only affects the goals scored. This occurs every so often, where the team, despite playing open and attacking football, suddenly stops scoring, despite dominating games and chances. BTW, this "form" doesn't seem to apply to either european or cup competitions, just the league. In the current spell we've lost away twice and at home to WBA despite dominating the game again. Overally, there are now 7 losses, 28 games into this season. It's too many, when you have the best team. BTW, I have cover for every position on the field that are virtually as good. My cover for Rooney is Torres. Before anyone start muttering, idiot, play the tactics etc, I've already won the Prem twice, the FA cup once, the Euro Cup and the Champions League. I find that you tend to lose more games at the start of the season until your team "scoring form" stabilises and you go on a winning run. If you play away to the other good teams at the start, you lose too many games and don't win the title. If you don't have hard fixtures at the start, you only lose a couple, get on the good "form" run and will win the title. Typically, losing 4-5 games on the title winning season, but 6-8 on the season when you don't. MArc has commented that this isn't supposed to be a macro-management game, endlessly tweaking to grind out results, but I find that this "form" aspect dominates the entire game, so that when you team suddenly and for no reason, can't score enough, you have to macro-manage to get results. So, the question is, is this a level playing field? If it is, then I don't think player quality influences the results enough and I find results are too dominated by scoring form. BTW the morale for the players - which you alluded to being the source of form before - is almost always superb throughout. That said, I do love the game though, so would like these comments to be taken as observations for possible tweaks, not pointless criticisms. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fraggle Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 I've noticed similar patterns of form too. Something I see quite often is I will batter a team by 20 shots to 2 but end up drawing 1-1 or losing 2-1, and my goalkeeper gets ratings of 1-3, even though I know hes one of the best goalkeepers in the world. However, I've been telling myself it's just human nature to remember these freak incidents, as after all I do usually win the league so I guess I must be winning most matches fair and square! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI Staff Marc Vaughan Posted February 13, 2011 SI Staff Share Posted February 13, 2011 The playing field is 'level' within the game there is no bias given against a human side - often human managers are rather 'gung ho' in their approach to the game and this can lead to somewhat unusual result statistics. For instance if you always attack in a Keeganesque manner then now and again a team WILL manage to sit back and counter attack effectively against you, hitting you on the break and winning while putting enough bodies behind the ball the rest of the time to nullify your teams threat. If you want to avoid this occasional fate then watch the matches a little more closely and if you feel theres a danger of this, ease off your attacking nature - consider switching on counter attacking yourself and trying a more subtle approach ... drawing the opposition out from their defensive stance a little and aiming for fewer but clearer cut chances, that sort of thing. (but to be honest a LOT of people enjoy the cut and thrust of exciting attacking matches more than the chess like tendancy of combating tactics, if you're one of these then thats fine ... people remember Keegan fondly because of the attacking nature of his sides after all - just remember they did lose matches now and again that they would probably have won with a little more defensive steel ..) PS - You appear to be achieving quite a decent level of success from what you're saying - with regards to the level of talent in your side and you current form, you're obviously several years into the game - are the 'name' players of today STILL as good as they were .. especially if they're now bench warmers for your side (which can affect both a players morale and ability if they go long periods without playing) ... I find its easy to get complacent and field a player because he's great in real-life, forgetting sometimes that my game world is 4 seasons on and he's really ready to be put out to pasture in it ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI Staff Marc Vaughan Posted February 13, 2011 SI Staff Share Posted February 13, 2011 I've noticed similar patterns of form too. Something I see quite often is I will batter a team by 20 shots to 2 but end up drawing 1-1 or losing 2-1, and my goalkeeper gets ratings of 1-3, even though I know hes one of the best goalkeepers in the world.However, I've been telling myself it's just human nature to remember these freak incidents, as after all I do usually win the league so I guess I must be winning most matches fair and square! Might I ask who you have in goal - it sounds possibly like he might have a similar issue to David James when he was younger, that is an inability to focus if he's not given much to do. There is a hidden 'concentration' stat in the game which is used to simulate how well focussed players stay during a match, say if you're defending for 85 minutes then a ball is punted long from defense, is your lone striker aware and attentive enough to be the first to react to it? ... this stat affects that sort of thing. Generally speaking younger players have lower concentration stats than older ones and it can evolve/grow as a player matures (and normally does in fact). If you're playing as a big club battering sides then having such a keeper can be rather detrimental at times EVEN if he's a good keeper ... as Liverpool found out with James during some matches. (just a thought - it might just be bad luck on the behalf of your side, without knowing exactly 'how common' it is I can't truly say ...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fraggle Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 The keeper I was talking about is a regen, and I think what you mentioned about the age and concentration probably explains it. He is maybe 20 now I think but I used him since he was 16. My entire team is very young so I guess they are prone to collapsing mentally. I guess If I think about it in a real life situation I was asking for trouble! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI Staff Marc Vaughan Posted February 14, 2011 SI Staff Share Posted February 14, 2011 The keeper I was talking about is a regen, and I think what you mentioned about the age and concentration probably explains it. He is maybe 20 now I think but I used him since he was 16. My entire team is very young so I guess they are prone to collapsing mentally.I guess If I think about it in a real life situation I was asking for trouble! Yeah young players are far more 'gusty' in general - when things are going for them alls well, but they might not have the mental strength and grit to keep going when something goes against them - there are exceptions but an entire team with kids is more than a little on the risky side (personally I always try and keep a 'core' of experienced players to help any youngsters along). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlecW81 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 I have to agree that sometimes the results are way too random. The squad I have assembled in 3.5 seasons since taking over Cheltenham, is already mid-table premiership caliber, and I'm in the championship (although 1st place in februrary). So you might be saying "why are you complaining?" Because I'm only 2pts clear at the moment. I should be wiping the floor with the rest of the league, yet it seems my hardest matches are always against bottom feeders, be they home or away. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI Staff Marc Vaughan Posted February 15, 2011 SI Staff Share Posted February 15, 2011 So you might be saying "why are you complaining?" Because I'm only 2pts clear at the moment. I should be wiping the floor with the rest of the league, yet it seems my hardest matches are always against bottom feeders, be they home or away. If you find your struggle against certain types of side (big clubs, relegation bound clubs, clubs with tall strikers, fast wingers or whatever) then try and think about 'why' that might be - perhaps your side is best going forward and struggle against sides who are happy to sit deep and conceed posession only breaking for sporadic attacks (this can be disasterous for sides where they have a young keeper who might not have the best concentration and thus be unprepared when an attack does finally come his way - think of Liverpool when they had a young David James in goal). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stonfiesta5 Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 could i just ask a question, i dont know if im just being dim or if im just completely missing something......... How do we know if the other team has tall strikers? Ive looked all around the player stats and things and cant find anything about height. have i missed it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI Staff Marc Vaughan Posted February 15, 2011 SI Staff Share Posted February 15, 2011 could i just ask a question, i dont know if im just being dim or if im just completely missing something.........How do we know if the other team has tall strikers? Ive looked all around the player stats and things and cant find anything about height. have i missed it? Its 'cruder' in visual implementation than on FM PC because of the space - thus 'heading' incorporates both jumping and heading accuracy/power on FMHi - so basically if the opposition team have high heading abilities they're likely to be tall (or good jumpers) as well as decent headers of the ball. (behind the scenes the attribute is two seperate items - which are then combined to give the visible value) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stonfiesta5 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Ok, so thats the reason why crouch has good heading stats then? Personally i think crouch is terrible at heading irl.......but its the joining up of stats and him being tall that gives him a 17 in heading. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stonfiesta5 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 ooops, finished my post early...... im finding something isnt quite right with this game, there is definately something in this loss of form thing, ive started various games with different levels of teams and find that i can go on masisve streak without losing and barely drawing then all of a sudden the nil nils come in. no matter what tactics i use against certain teams i cannot get a result. i find myself scratching my head thinking wtf far too often. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugster Posted February 16, 2011 Author Share Posted February 16, 2011 Just FYI, I'm up to 2018 but no, I don't play people because of their reputations, it's because of their stats. When they start to slide they go to the bench, then out the door if they can't contribute or start whingeing. Anyway, the form thing happens regardles of any tactics, player quality, attacking or defending styles, which is the point i was making. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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