Mysterious sudden drops in condition during matches

I have noticed that in lots of matches i play one or more players will suddenly see their condition drop from 90% or so to 60 or 70%. I know that this happens when they are injured but can continue playing, but prior to the 11.2.1 patch i would always see something in the ME or in the text. Now i only notice it when i open the match ratings ever now and then during the match. This is getting to be quite an annoyance, because sometimes some of my better players can only play a half after their condition has mysteriously dropped, i.e. without the mention of a bad tackle or injury, to somewhere in the 60s. Has anyone else experienced this issue...?

Yep, happened to me a few times.

That's not frequent but yeah it happens also to me. No " green flag " injuries are involved, suddenly the condition falls down to 50-60% all of a sudden.

For me this is really something that bothers me a lot more than other issues reported with 11.2.1 like current tactics and so on. Really hope someone from SI will see this thread, because it's the kind of thing that many users will not really notice. I'm quite sure it has nothing to do with players picking up knocks, because i still see plenty of mention in the text off that during matches. Posted a message about this issue in the official 11.2.1 feedback thread as well, but nobody has responded to that yet. Do hope more people will start noticing this issue so it can be fixed for the next patch.

In my four seasons managing Grasshoppers, I've never ever seen one of my players get a Green Injury cross. It's either the white one, or just a sudden drop in condition to 60-70%. Before the patch, at least the Motivation widget would show whether the player can continue with the knock or wants to come off, now even that does not show.

Are this players match fit? I have only seen drops below 60% when I started with players which were not 100% fit.

They are, it's just completely random. Sometimes it even happens with players that are brought on at half time, put them on and 10 minutes later their condition is suddenly in the 60s or 50s without any noticeable reason.

Mine were Kubi. As an example i've seen players in the second half after say 65 mins on 70-80% and on say 70 mins they suddenly drop to 50-60%. I never start a player unless he is above 95% fit.

It seems totally random.

EDIT: Can't be too sure but i think when you sub the player on 50-60% condition, as soon as he comes off his condition goes back to what it was before it dropped..

I think its a knock that has no chance of putting the player out for further games, if you keep them on, their fitness will slowly climb again.

This is quite ridiculous it must be said, and a major issue. 1 of my players at half time had a fitness level of about 85%, give or take-15mins later, it was 66%. No other player had fitness as low as him at that point. No word on any injury, or anything. Just a sudden drop, for no apparent reason. Very very annoying.

Match fitness and condition is not the same. A player can have 95% condition, but this may drop during a match when he is tired or not match fit.

I think most of those drops are caused by minor knocks, probably in combination with the match fitness of the player.

I think its a knock that has no chance of putting the player out for further games, if you keep them on, their fitness will slowly climb again.

In GENERAL this happens, like on every other version of FM but in this case due to this new bug, which is not caused by a knock, no, the players fitness does not slowly climb back up.

Match fitness and condition is not the same. A player can have 95% condition, but this may drop during a match when he is tired or not match fit.

I think most of those drops are caused by minor knocks, probably in combination with the match fitness of the player.

Sorry i don't agree and think there is an issue here. If what you are saying is true why is there not a gradual decline in condition if it is due to general tiredness? Also with knocks fitness always goes back up (which still happens to other players but not for the ones seemingly affected by the new rapid drop).

Also it only started for me with 11.2.1. and once a player condition suddenly drops it does not go back up and just gets lower whereas with a knock it slowly climbs again.

Completely agree with dave byrd, with me it also only started after 11.2.1 so i have decided to go back to 11.1.1. It really is a bug since there is never a mention of a knock or anything, if there was i would have no problem with it and it wouldn't be an issue. But now it's just completely random and it means i have to keep an eye on player condition all the time. So this has to be a bug, either in the way that condition drops for no reason or it is simply so that knocks that players pick up are not mentioned in the text or viewed in the ME. Either way it is a very annoying issue that bothers me, and apparently dave byrd too;), a lot more than any tactics bug which can easily be worked around.

Also it only started for me with 11.2.1. and once a player condition suddenly drops it does not go back up and just gets lower whereas with a knock it slowly climbs again.

Patch 11.2.1 has no changes in match engine, tactics or any other part that has an influence on player conditions during a match.

I usually control player conditions in my matches regularly and there are just a few drops below 60%, which I think are normal. If it happens complete random, it does not look like a general bug, as most bugs have a cause and effect.

Patch 11.2.1 has no changes in match engine, tactics or any other part that has an influence on player conditions during a match.

OK, i should have said going from 11.1.1 to 11.2. and 11.2.1. Where did i say it was OK in 11.2? Why are you so against this? Just because it doesn't happen to you doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I know the difference between a knock and this sudden random drop that the players do not recover from.

Patch 11.2.1 has no changes in match engine, tactics or any other part that has an influence on player conditions during a match.

This maybe true, but now that i am back on 11.1.1 i no longer have the issue, so it has to be related to the 11.2 patch if you believe in logic

This maybe true, but now that i am back on 11.1.1 i no longer have the issue, so it has to be related to the 11.2 patch if you believe in logic

It would be a good idea to play further with the 11.1.1 patch and see if it does not happen in the long run and than post it it the bugs forum. I'm not sure if it is an issue or just something that was not recognised before. Since the release of 11.2 it´s bug hunting time in this forum.

I don't feel its a bug, i see it as a realistic addition to the game. In real life players pick up knocks all the time and for a short period of time they hobbling, it concerns injuries which shouldn't keep them out of the rest of the game, but will affect their preformance till they "run it off" i.e A player stepping on you toes

I don't feel its a bug, i see it as a realistic addition to the game. In real life players pick up knocks all the time and for a short period of time they hobbling, it concerns injuries which shouldn't keep them out of the rest of the game, but will affect their preformance till they "run it off" i.e A player stepping on you toes

You might want to read the above few posts. We are NOT talking knocks here (knocks have been in the game for donkeys years and are not an 'addition').

I don't feel its a bug, i see it as a realistic addition to the game. In real life players pick up knocks all the time and for a short period of time they hobbling, it concerns injuries which shouldn't keep them out of the rest of the game, but will affect their preformance till they "run it off" i.e A player stepping on you toes

I would not be complaining it was knocks we were talking about, it's random drops in condition without the mention of a knock/bad tackle/injury. Now it may be that these drops are caused by knocks but every time this happens there is nothing mentioned in the tv view or in the text. This makes the drops very unpredictable, random, and very annoying because it feels your players suddenly get tired for no reason at all.

Having the same issue, only in preseason so far, with the same save I was using in 11.1.1 - currently I'm 60 minutes into a match and it's happened 5 times so far! I'll stick it into the bugs forum if it carries on into the season...

It's maybe worth to take weather conditions into account. Does it happen all the times or could be bad weather one of the factors?

I would not be complaining it was knocks we were talking about, it's random drops in condition without the mention of a knock/bad tackle/injury. Now it may be that these drops are caused by knocks but every time this happens there is nothing mentioned in the tv view or in the text. This makes the drops very unpredictable, random, and very annoying because it feels your players suddenly get tired for no reason at all.

Plus they don't recover, like they usually do with a knock.

It's maybe worth to take weather conditions into account. Does it happen all the times or could be bad weather one of the factors?

No. I play in Brazil in the summer.

No. I play in Brazil in the summer.

That is bad weather.

Has anyone logged it in the Bugs Forum. Best way to get a response from SI. If you put it under the Match Engine Thread probably Glen Wakeford will reply to you.

Has anyone logged it in the Bugs Forum. Best way to get a response from SI. If you put it under the Match Engine Thread probably Glen Wakeford will reply to you.

True, but if there is no indication when it does happen it is something hard to catch, that's why I did ask to have an eye on special circumstances, like weather, match fitness, or player positions, age etc.

Isn't it possible to move this thread to the bugs forum somehow..? If it would help solving the issue for the next patch then that would be best i think. I'm sure we are not the only users experiencing this issue, but if no SI members see it here then it might be best to move it there.

Patch 11.2.1 has no changes in match engine, tactics or any other part that has an influence on player conditions during a match.

I usually control player conditions in my matches regularly and there are just a few drops below 60%, which I think are normal. If it happens complete random, it does not look like a general bug, as most bugs have a cause and effect.

I made a thread soon after the latest patch released with regards to players fitness,I decided to start a new game with the same team (Ipswich),I had built a good side with my old save so bought pretty much the same players as I did before,actually 1 or 2 extra as I was able to sell players now

I am basically using my subs on or just after half time because the players are exhausted,by the end of the game I 4 or 5 players below 60 and not unusual to see 1 or 2 below 45.As I said this is basically the same team I had made prior to the latest patch and the players were never knackered like this.

I used to use my subs for injuries or tactics but no chance of that now,when someone is having a nightmare of a game I have either used all my subs or dare not risk "wasting" a sub.

How heavy are the training routines your players are on, and what is their stamina stats?

I made a thread soon after the latest patch released with regards to players fitness,I decided to start a new game with the same team (Ipswich),I had built a good side with my old save so bought pretty much the same players as I did before,actually 1 or 2 extra as I was able to sell players now

I am basically using my subs on or just after half time because the players are exhausted,by the end of the game I 4 or 5 players below 60 and not unusual to see 1 or 2 below 45.As I said this is basically the same team I had made prior to the latest patch and the players were never knackered like this.

I used to use my subs for injuries or tactics but no chance of that now,when someone is having a nightmare of a game I have either used all my subs or dare not risk "wasting" a sub.

I'm sure what you are saying is true, but it's not really the same issue. We are talking here about players having 90% condition one second falling to 60% a second later without any obvious indication as to why this happens, i.e. no knock/injuries/bad tackles.

Will just add that in a game,this was only 1 game mind that a player dropped to 29% after ....22 mins!

I checked the players status as I thought this had to be an injury or knock but there was nothing,I waited for 10 mins and he recovered to 34% but then dropped again so had to sub him.

This has to be related to the last patch as as I said earlier these are the same players I bought before the patch and nothing like this was going on,they have the same stats.they are at the same club,they are on the same training so it has to be patch related.

Will just add that in a game,this was only 1 game mind that a player dropped to 29% after ....22 mins!

I checked the players status as I thought this had to be an injury or knock but there was nothing,I waited for 10 mins and he recovered to 34% but then dropped again so had to sub him.

This has to be related to the past patch as as I said earlier these are the same players I bought before the patch and nothing like this was going on,they have the same stats.they are at the same club,they are on the same training so it has to be patch related.

Well that does sound exactly like what we are discussing here. And yes i am also quite sure it is patch related. I had noticed condition was dropping quicker generally, but that didnt bother me so much as it also did for AI players. But yes, condition does rise slightly usually after a sudden drop, by about 5 points after which they start dropping again.

I'm sure what you are saying is true, but it's not really the same issue. We are talking here about players having 90% condition one second falling to 60% a second later without any obvious indication as to why this happens, i.e. no knock/injuries/bad tackles.

Sorry if I never made it clear but it is players losing there condition (maybe 30%) in 1 go,sure not all the players but I have to use my subs for the players this is happening to,I am using all my subs come either half-time or at the latest 60 mins so I can not make changes later for players becoming tired in a normal way,I will be playing later tonight so will count how many this is happening to and take some screen shots.

Thanks, i would do more testing and post screenshots myself, but i got so annoyed with this issue that i went back to 11.1. None of the issues fixed by the 11.2 patch bothered me nearly as much as this condition drop thing does.

hmmmm.......I noticed this myself and thought i was odd, not enough games to put a finger on it sand say weather it is or isn't right.

One thing Ive noticed is it seems to happen to the same two players everytime in my game, as anyone else expreinced, noticed the same thing?

Well I was a bit busy tonight so have only played 1 match but honestly this is turning out to be a total game breaker if it continues.

I had 3 players hit by this sudden loss of condition,I had to sub 1 at half time,he was at 58%,he was 54 after 33 mins with no injury or knock,then had to use the other 2 subs before the 60th min,my left and right midfielder's both at less then 60,to make matters worse I had my striker injured on 67 mins so played with 10 men.

I started after the last patch again but it seems I gave up a save because something was annoying(unable to sell players),now I have something that is totally game breaking.

2 things I can not understand...

1.Why some people do not have this happening,I have the same players in my team and this was never a problem,same team,same tactics,same club,same training...I find it very strange.

2.If it is patch related(which I feel it must be)then how on earth this could get through testing beggar's belief,It seems they sorted an annoyance and threw in a game breaker.....

For people that have said they do not have it can I ask if you have the condition widget showing?

I really am at a loss how this can only be happening to certain people.

I have to say I enjoy the game so far since patch 11.2, but I noticed this as well.

I'm pretty sure this is the result of knocks; I see it quite frequently after heavy challenges when watching full matches. The player's condition seems to either go back up after a while or stay at the lower value for more or less the rest of the game without decreasing much. There's no green cross as he's not injured, just shaken or whatever. I've never considered it a bug, but if no message pops up about it in the commentary then that sounds like something that should be addressed.

yeah, it happens to my players sometimes too. as soon as they made the bench, their fitness condition increased from say 60% to the fitness level of the other player. Is it that the players don't want to play and pretend to be injured? If so, why is that so?

I see this a lot, both my players and the opposition. I've refused to patch up to 11.2/11.2.1 so for me this happens with the 11.1 version.

Regardless of what some of you are arguing, for me I have no complaint - I interpret is as a knock which i missed because i watch extended highlights and not the full 90 mins.

more worrying for me, i had a player sent off in a reserve game which i wasn't watching. i wanted to know if i should punish him or not, so i went to the match report to check the cause. There was absolutely no mention of the incident!

This happens every game to my central midfielder. I thought it was simply because in my formation I was asking too much of the player in that position, but since I bought a new midfielder with 20 stamina and 18 natural fitness I've decided this cant be the case. I'm not sure at what point it happens, but somewhere between half time and the 70th minute the players condition drops from 85-90 at half time to 60-65.

Never seems to happen to any other players in my team, just whoever plays in my one central midfield role.

I had a look at this last night after reading it on here. And noticed the condition of my striker drop to 60% after 40 mins with no injury or knock. I checked on his player profile and it said he was Tired. He was the only player that game that this happened too, and so i checked the rest of the team and they were all Match Fit. Next Game another player dropped to 56% after 30 mins and checked his player profile and it said he was Severly Lacking Match Fitness/Pratice. So pretty sure that it is linked to that, as none of my other players have this problem if they are Match Fit/Superb Condition or Fully Fit, which is understandable.

Some players condition are lower then others and the end of some games as there postion is alot more demanding ie my Box to Box Midfielder is always more tired for obvious reasons.

there is never a mention of a knock or anything, if there was i would have no problem with it and it wouldn't be an issue.

This but I'm not sure it happened so often. I need to check honestly.

My view is that this is working as intended, and I haven't noticed significant changes since 11.2.

If you watch a match on full, or even extended, you'll probably see these coinciding with collisions, heavy tackles, etc.

Yesterday, after a corner, one of my players was rolling around on the floor and his condition dropped to 70%. It wasn't counted as a knock and if it hadn't happened in a "highlight" I wouldn't even have seen it, there would just have been a sudden drop with no apparent cause.

My view is that this is working as intended, and I haven't noticed significant changes since 11.2.

If you watch a match on full, or even extended, you'll probably see these coinciding with collisions, heavy tackles, etc.

It has nothing to do with the way you view matches. It also happens during highlights. The amount of times it happens and the fact that the condition of the player hardly rises after the sudden drop indicates it is not merely an issues of knocks being picked up. Just make sure you have the widget displaying player condition on all the time and you will probably see it happening too. Furtermore, now that i am back to 11.1.1 i have not noticed the issue anymore at all. So that tells me there is definitely an issue here. An issue that is much more of a game-breaker than any of the issue regarding tactics and transfers that were there before. Those issues i could live with and workaround, this is something that has made me had to go back to the previous patch.

It has nothing to do with the way you view matches. It also happens during highlights. The amount of times it happens and the fact that the condition of the player hardly rises after the sudden drop indicates it is not merely an issues of knocks being picked up. Just make sure you have the widget displaying player condition on all the time and you will probably see it happening too. Furtermore, now that i am back to 11.1.1 i have not noticed the issue anymore at all. So that tells me there is definitely an issue here. An issue that is much more of a game-breaker than any of the issue regarding tactics and transfers that were there before. Those issues i could live with and workaround, this is something that has made me had to go back to the previous patch.

Im sorry but until i see anything different to what i said in my above post, i wont consider it a game breaker....

This happens to my team to,strange thing is the first season was fine nothing out of the ordinary, but halfway in to my second season and players who have 95 to 99% fitness before a match drop to 45% after about 30 Min, to be fair it has only happened to one player during the last 2 games, so not sure if it's a bug or if my players are getting bad tackles.