Barca and Real Regens

Has anyone else noticed the quality of the regens coming through at Barca and Real Madrid in particular.

I'm in the summer of 2015 on my save and they have produced amazing players in abundance. Now I do realise that these teams have brilliant academies and coaches and therefore can produce world class players, but they have too many! Currently they have 11 players between them on the transfer list (6 Barca, 5 Real), one 21 years old the rest younger with the youngest being 18. Out of the 11, 9 would walk into pretty much any team in the world. One striker is 18 i think values at 7 odd million and is listed for 1.8 mil which Man Utd and Arsenal have bid.

I know these teams produce great players, but they also produce many average players that don't make the grade at the top level. Despite listing these 11 youngsters between them they have many more left over. I'm not complaining, i love the game, I have just found this a tad unrealistic. Anyone else feel the same.

(will post some screenies over the weekend)

Just look at the history books in Real's case, some of the greatest spanish players ever have come through the madrid ranks. And in Barce's case look at the present squad, Valdes, Puyol, Pique, Busquests, Xavi, Messi, Iniesta, Pedro and Bojan and even playing abroad there's fabregas. So I wouldn't at all say it's unrealistic.

Just look at the history books in Real's case, some of the greatest spanish players ever have come through the madrid ranks. And in Barce's case look at the present squad, Valdes, Puyol, Pique, Busquests, Xavi, Messi, Iniesta, Pedro and Bojan and even playing abroad there's fabregas. So I wouldn't at all say it's unrealistic.

I just think they have too many. Take barca for example selling 6 world class player under the age of 21 and they have plenty more not for sale. These players aren't unhappy or listed for loan ourely transfer listed

I found a similar thing on FM10.

How come they can produce so much great talent? I would love to be able to improve the standard of English talent coming through on my current save to the same extent!

I'll try and find the actual data, but you'd probably be surprised at the amount of players currently in Spanish Primera División who have come from Real Madrid's ranks. Barça seems to produce more top class midfielders and forward players that are useful for them, while Real Madrid produces a much higher amount of middle-high quality players, that aren't quite as good as to be useful for Real Madrid's first team, but end up making it into any Primera first team squad. I think Real Madrid are the ones with the highest amount of players in Primera teams who have come through their youth system.

I';m quite sure Barca probably have a fair few youth players about to come through who we don't know about yet irl. I feel this is finally FM becoming realistic in this area.

The formula for regens includes not only the level of youth facilities and recruitment, but also the club rep, and Real and Barca being the top 2 rep club in the world, that's what you get.

However, I think that their regens should have more foreign players, and maybe make sure that having 2 top rep clubs in the same county doesn't skew the level of Spanish regens as a whole compared to other countries.

Here's the data I've managed to grab from FM 2011 10.2 database. Please note there could be some errors, but I think it's pretty accurate. Players marked with an (*) next to their name are players who either are currently regular first team players in their team, or players who have previously been regular first team players in another Spanish Primera División squad. I've done this to attempt to distinguish the bench, "squad-filling" players from players who have actually been important either in their current team or in a previous Primera División one.

Players currently in Spanish Primera División who have come through Real Madrid's youth system:

Almería

- Miguel Ángel Nieto *

- Corona *

Deportivo

- Felipe (GK)

- Laure *

- Riki *

Espanyol

- Luis García © *

- José María Callejón *

- Kiko Casilla (GK)

Getafe

- Borja *

- Casquero © *

- Jordi Codina (GK) *

- Gonzalo (GK)

- Daniel Parejo *

- Miguel Torres *

Hércules

- Javier Portillo

- Tote *

Levante

- Valdo *

Málaga

- Fernando *

Mallorca

- Rubén *

- Enrique Corrales *

Osasuna

- Carlos Aranda *

- Javier Calleja *

- Juanfran *

Real Madrid

- Esteban Granero *

- Antonio Adán (GK)

- Álvaro Arbeloa *

- Íker Casillas (GK) © *

Racing

- Adrián González

Sevilla

- Álvaro Negredo *

Sporting

- Alberto Lora *

- Alberto Rivera *

- David Barral *

Valencia

- Juan Manuel Mata *

- Roberto Soldado *

Villarreal

- Borja Valero *

- Diego López (GK) *

I should make some notable remarks:

- Raúl and Guti just left Real Madrid this year to play in foreign teams (Shalke 04 and Besiktas respectively). Everyone knows they came through Real Madrid youth system and have been there up until this moment, presumably shortly before they finally retire.

- Eto'o recently left Barça to sign for Inter, but he was a world class striker for Barça for many years and he came through Real Madrid youth system.

- Álvaro Morata and Pablo Sarabia are regularly training and travelling with Real Madrid's first team this year, and both have already played at least one official match coming in as subs. These two are not included in Real Madrid's squad in the previous list because they're currently in Real Madrid Youth Team in FM's 10.2 database, not in the first team.

- Rubén de la Red had to retire early due to some irreversible heart problems, but he was a great central midfielder, first team player for Getafe for the time he stood there, and was already starting to enter Real Madrid's first team just before he had his blackout. He was a really classy player. A true shame his heart couldn't take it.

- There are some players who have been in Real Madrid Castilla or youth teams for one or two years and have gone away after that, so I think they can't be considered Real Madrid grown players. I've left those ones out of this list to try to reduce it to true Real Madrid ranks players (a good example would be Filipe Luis, who signed for Real Madrid Castilla and stood there for some time after moving to Deportivo).

- Of the 20 teams present in Spanish Primera División, there are only 5 of them who do NOT have any players who have come from Real Madrid youth system. Some of them are pretty obvious: Barcelona, Athletic de Bilbao (who only pick Basque players) and Real Sociedad (who only pick Basque or foreign players). All the other 15 have at least one.

Feel free to point out any mistakes I might have made

Raul's first year was at Atletico Madrid =)

lmao but that **** moved to the other side of town!

Samuel Eto'o also came from Real Madrid for those who would be surprised!

For some Barcelona players, you can take a look at Pepe Reina, Fabregas, Jordi Alba (Valencia) and Giovanni Dos Santos to name a few

A correction to the above post.

Samuel Etoo was bought from an african team when he was 17, I would not say he came through the youth ranks as he was pretty much immediately loaned out to Mallorca. Shame as even at 17 he looked really good and was playing as a right winger.

Diego Lopez moved to Madrid when he was 19 having played at Lugo (Third division), again he is not a youth product.

It is a common mistake to think that Real Madrid form these players. In Spain they pretty much buy them once they see potencial and then loan them out again. To give an example of another player at another team, Silva who is at Manchester City is a Valencia youth product but was formed at Celta vigo so they received a share of his transfer to Manchester city as part of developing the player.

As for the current Castilla team, a lot of them are brought in from other teams and not a product of the Real Madrid youth factory which would have to include them performing for Madrid C, cadets and juveniles.

Raul's first year was at Atletico Madrid =)

lmao but that **** moved to the other side of town!

Samuel Eto'o also came from Real Madrid for those who would be surprised!

For some Barcelona players, you can take a look at Pepe Reina, Fabregas, Jordi Alba (Valencia) and Giovanni Dos Santos to name a few

Raul played for Atletico B not Atletico First team. He joined Real when the Atletico president Jesus Gil disbanded the B team as he felt it was too expensive to maintain. Eventually they were recovered but by then Raul had left.

Yeah you're both right about Raúl, Eto'o and Diego López.

However, IIRC, I think the rules say they're considered home-grown players if they've been part of the inferior categories of a club from their 16 to their 18 years old. So Raúl should be considered Real Madrid home-grown player, since he moved to Real Madrid in 1992, when he was just 15 years old. Just like Leo Messi is considered a Barça home-grown player to all effects, since he came to Barça when he was only 14 years old.

Samuel Eto'o moved to Real Madrid in 1996 I think? (at least that's as far as FM history goes). That means he was 15 years old as well. Then he stayed one year in - one year out (loans to Leganés and Espanyol) untill 1999, when he was loaned out to Mallorca when at the age of 18. So I'm not sure about that one.

You're right about Diego López though, he moved to Real Madrid when he was 19 so he should not be considered a Real Madrid home-grown player.

Here's the data I've managed to grab from FM 2011 10.2 database. Please note there could be some errors, but I think it's pretty accurate. Players marked with an (*) next to their name are players who either are currently regular first team players in their team, or players who have previously been regular first team players in another Spanish Primera División squad. I've done this to attempt to distinguish the bench, "squad-filling" players from players who have actually been important either in their current team or in a previous Primera División one.

Players currently in Spanish Primera División who have come through Real Madrid's youth system:

Almería

- Miguel Ángel Nieto *

- Corona *

Deportivo

- Felipe (GK)

- Laure *

- Riki *

Espanyol

- Luis García © *

- José María Callejón *

- Kiko Casilla (GK)

Getafe

- Borja *

- Casquero © *

- Jordi Codina (GK) *

- Gonzalo (GK)

- Daniel Parejo *

- Miguel Torres *

Hércules

- Javier Portillo

- Tote *

Levante

- Valdo *

Málaga

- Fernando *

Mallorca

- Rubén *

- Enrique Corrales *

Osasuna

- Carlos Aranda *

- Javier Calleja *

- Juanfran *

Real Madrid

- Esteban Granero *

- Antonio Adán (GK)

- Álvaro Arbeloa *

- Íker Casillas (GK) © *

Racing

- Adrián González

Sevilla

- Álvaro Negredo *

Sporting

- Alberto Lora *

- Alberto Rivera *

- David Barral *

Valencia

- Juan Manuel Mata *

- Roberto Soldado *

Villarreal

- Borja Valero *

- Diego López (GK) *

I should make some notable remarks:

- Raúl and Guti just left Real Madrid this year to play in foreign teams (Shalke 04 and Besiktas respectively). Everyone knows they came through Real Madrid youth system and have been there up until this moment, presumably shortly before they finally retire.

- Eto'o recently left Barça to sign for Inter, but he was a world class striker for Barça for many years and he came through Real Madrid youth system.

- Álvaro Morata and Pablo Sarabia are regularly training and travelling with Real Madrid's first team this year, and both have already played at least one official match coming in as subs. These two are not included in Real Madrid's squad in the previous list because they're currently in Real Madrid Youth Team in FM's 10.2 database, not in the first team.

- Rubén de la Red had to retire early due to some irreversible heart problems, but he was a great central midfielder, first team player for Getafe for the time he stood there, and was already starting to enter Real Madrid's first team just before he had his blackout. He was a really classy player. A true shame his heart couldn't take it.

- There are some players who have been in Real Madrid Castilla or youth teams for one or two years and have gone away after that, so I think they can't be considered Real Madrid grown players. I've left those ones out of this list to try to reduce it to true Real Madrid ranks players (a good example would be Filipe Luis, who signed for Real Madrid Castilla and stood there for some time after moving to Deportivo).

- Of the 20 teams present in Spanish Primera División, there are only 5 of them who do NOT have any players who have come from Real Madrid youth system. Some of them are pretty obvious: Barcelona, Athletic de Bilbao (who only pick Basque players) and Real Sociedad (who only pick Basque or foreign players). All the other 15 have at least one.

Feel free to point out any mistakes I might have made

Impressive research. I'm not doubting they produce good quality league players.

The point i was making was between them they are selling 11 players that at their age (under 21) are world-class, for a small amount of their value.

In real life Barca wouldn't be selling an 18 yr old wonder kid valued at 7 million to man united or arsenal for 1.8 million

On the flip side, is this really representative of all of Barcelona/Real Madrid's youngsters?

Yes, they produce several excellent youngsters and plenty of "good" youngsters, but the rubbish ones also need to be considered. How many "rubbish" youngsters have they produced, too? As in, what proportion of all youngsters are actually "good"?

An example is Carlos Peña - failed at Barcelona B, and has not played in the top flight yet - and is 27.

Yeah you're both right about Raúl, Eto'o and Diego López.

However, IIRC, I think the rules say they're considered home-grown players if they've been part of the inferior categories of a club from their 16 to their 18 years old. So Raúl should be considered Real Madrid home-grown player, since he moved to Real Madrid in 1992, when he was just 15 years old. Just like Leo Messi is considered a Barça home-grown players to all effects, since he came to Barça when he was 14 years old.

Raul yes but the others are not home grown by any means. Interestingly Raul had an amazing scoring record at lower level but it was beaten by Soldado who has so far done...nothing.

On the flip side, is this really representative of all of Barcelona/Real Madrid's youngsters?

Yes, they produce several excellent youngsters and plenty of "good" youngsters, but the rubbish ones also need to be considered. How many "rubbish" youngsters have they produced, too? As in, what proportion of all youngsters are actually "good"?

An example is Carlos Peña - failed at Barcelona B, and has not played in the top flight yet - and is 27.

I would note Oleguer, currently on the bench at Ajax and I think even Ajax fans wonder what he's doing there.

I would note Oleguer, currently on the bench at Ajax and I think even Ajax fans wonder what he's doing there.

Indeed. I was shocked at the signing, nobody really knows what Ajax saw in him, and the funny thing is he played a couple of matches and then was sent to the bench straight away, lol.

Barcelona also like to give themselves a safety net when selling young players that are not up to their first team. By the way of buy-back clauses, in case the player eventually becomes the one Barca had hoped he would.

For example Marc Crosas at Celtic has a Barca buy back clause, even if Barca choose not to take him back if he realises his full potential they'll get 20% of any future transfer fee.

Barcelona's youth system is second to none, whereas as another poster said, Real have a lot of youth products move to other spanish sides and indeed throughout the continent, which is probably why they spend much more than their Catallan rivals in the Transfer Market.

Barcelona also like to give themselves a safety net when selling young players that are not up to their first team. By the way of buy-back clauses, in case the player eventually becomes the one Barca had hoped he would.

For example Marc Crosas at Celtic has a Barca buy back clause, even if Barca choose not to take him back if he realises his full potential they'll get 20% of any future transfer fee.

Barcelona's youth system is second to none, whereas as another poster said, Real have a lot of youth products move to other spanish sides and indeed throughout the continent, which is probably why they spend much more than their Catallan rivals in the Transfer Market.

Yeah, I think the way to describe it is that Real Madrid produce more quantity of 'useful' players in general, while Barça produce more quality players, top-class ones, that become useful for their very own first team. Also you've got to realize that Real Madrid makes a lot of money out of those "little" transfers here and there, selling lots of average players for prices in the region of 1-5M € (and retaining buy-back clauses like the ones you mentioned), with some notable exceptions such as Álvaro Negredo, who was sold to Sevilla for 17M €, a very good transfer seeing his performance seems to have been way below what was expected from him.

I think the Negredo transfer is a strange one. He did ok in his first season and the idea was for Madrid to buy him back but instead they spent money on other foreign players even though they said they trusted the home grown players. This may have affected his confidence and he has been used a lot as a substitute by the current Sevilla manager who is not the same guy that bought him so that may also be a factor. Either way if he clicks and performs as expected he could be a very good player, he may need another club or a chnage at Sevilla to make this happen though.

Yeah, I think his previous season in Almería was just fantastic. As a Real Madrid fan, I was really looking forward to see him play with the first team. But he was sold to Sevilla with a buy-back clause (I think around 25M IIRC), which I find alright if he wasn't going to get enough minutes (and he wasn't if they had Raúl, Van Nistelrooy, Benzema and Ronaldo playing as striker). They probably still wanted to see if he could really perform that well in a higher level team or something, hence the expensive buy-back price they were willing to pay. However, I'm pretty sure he would've stayed if Raúl had left the club that summer.

Then he didn't really live up to the expectation in Sevilla. Yeah they switched managers, but the matches he played, he didn't really cut it, at least he was nowhere near his level in Almería.

We'll see what happens these next years. He's still 25 so he has plenty of time to change the course of things, but he isn't playing much and he doesn't really seem to be doing much to prove his manager wrong when he does.