is height an important stat in fm?

i was reading through a couple of threads, notably the arsenal one in the data issues forum....and i was lead to beleive that the jumping stat rather than height is the issue regarding who wins the ball first aerially rather than height being an important factor!

it is a strange issue because there are tremendous small players like sagna for example who can leap and have a great jump on them! but the stat cant be upped because it means they will outjump the crouches of this world!

now, how can zigic be beaten to the ball aerially by a smaller defender when hes about 6'9?

surely the game has to take into account height (if it doesnt) or is it too hard to implement?

i was reading through a couple of threads, notably the arsenal one in the data issues forum....and i was lead to beleive that the jumping stat rather than height is the issue regarding who wins the ball first aerially rather than height being an important factor!

it is a strange issue because there are tremendous small players like sagna for example who can leap and have a great jump on them! but the stat cant be upped because it means they will outjump the crouches of this world!

now, how can zigic be beaten to the ball aerially by a smaller defender when hes about 6'9?

surely the game has to take into account height (if it doesnt) or is it too hard to implement?

I would say height is not an issue. It's just a fact, rather than a stat. Just like being born in Cardiff doesn't contribute to your game, it's just a stat. Heading and jumping are the ones you should look at, along with maybe agility? I dunno.

Thats what I think anyway

I never look at height as I would expect most defenders to be 6 ft-ish anyway.

6'9 doesn't mean he's going to be good at heading. Peter Crouch is a good bit taller than a lot of Premiership defenders but isn't winning all the headers. Also Jan Koller against Northern Ireland a couple of seasons ago Aaron Hughes had him in his back picket and noticeably smaller (I think Koller was near 6'9).

yes but is zigic really going to be beaten to the ball aerially? even if he jumps a small amount hell be higher than most centre halves

zigic is a good player aerially too

Of course he's going to be beaten to the ball, it's football. Otherwise he would win every header he ever attempted and there is no chance on earth that that is going to happen.

Compare it to a keeper who is 6'4 and can catch a cross so has the added extension of his arms and he jumps and still gets beaten to the ball by 6ft defenders and strikers.

It's entirely possible.

In game though it would be dificult to tell and even if Zigic was supposed to win most headers you couldn't tell if he lost out because of good defensive position stealing in, in front of him, because of the 2d system.

i think you'll do find zigic wins a lot of headers in the game...

same as emile heskey in mine...man its like a tank brushing his way thru...

when i bought zigic for arsenal once he diddnt win as many headers as i thought he would! was quite low match to match, sometimes less than 30% or so out of attempted! but i made him a target man and tm feed was to head

i just think height should be an issue myself

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by thebigman1985:

i just think height should be an issue myself </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Height is an issue; it is used (partly) to determine the jumping attribute. Jumping effectively measures the maximum height that a player can achieve. So Peter Crouch, who is tall but can't really jump very well, would have a similar jumping stat to someone who is shorter but can jump higher, if they reach roughly the same height.

The answer is that "jumping" is used to determine how high a player can get to a ball.

Height is used as a control on the development of the jumping attribute through a player's career, but is not actually used in the match engine calculations.

Just try to use a small player as target man and you will see if height is important

SI have stated that height is largely cosmetic, used to regulate the development of the Jumping attribute, which is by far the major contributing factor in determining ariel battles.

but height should be an issue as well as strength when contesting aerially

thats why crouch is awful in the air, relative to his height, because hes weak as hell! hes also not got the best technique

ah well, i guess when the game is basically stats it must be hard to implement physical attributes to certain skills

i just found it strange height relates to the jump

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jimbokav1971:

No. Have a read of this. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>That's it, I'm so using Cahill as a target man.

The match engine thinks of "Jumping" as a measure of "How high can he get his head?"

In the "real world", we tend to measure "Jumping" as "vertical leap", e.g., "How much distance can he put between himself and the ground."

Shift to look at it the first way, and its fine: a 7'6" guy who can't jump very high earns a higher Jumping than a 5'2" guy with a tremendous vertical leap .. because the 7'6" guy can get his head higher.

i know

but its a bit of a random way to do it

when the jumping ability of sagna is better than crouches

of course height is important

I think it takes the jumping stat into account more to be honest

From PaulC at SI---

"The answer is that "jumping" is used to determine how high a player can get to a ball.

Height is used as a control on the development of the jumping attribute through a player's career, but is not actually used in the match engine calculations."

so tall players get a boost in jumping, but you don't have to look at height when finding players... as it's been added to their jumping.

example

a player that is 6'4" and can jump 34" will still have a higher jumping attribute that someone who is 5'10" and can jump 34"

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jase19:

example

a player that is 6'4" and can jump 34" will still have a higher jumping attribute that someone who is 5'10" and can jump 34" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Last night - Shaun W-P and Jolene baby anyone?

SWP jumped while Lescott was facing his goal and was concentrating on clearing the header and so was unaware of SWP.

SWP exerted his strength in the challenge causing Lescott to lose his balance and subsequently his heading was affected.

The goal was an og, not SWP winning the aerial challenge and directing the ball into the net.

I think there was a case for a foul by SWP, but ultimately he anticipated the situation better then the Everton defence and caused them to make a mistake.

Howard should have communicated better with Lescott to let him know about SWP.

I though Everton deserved a draw, especially after Chelsea lost Obi Wan Kenobi.

That's what I saw, others may have different views. That the great thing about football - every one has got an opinion

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jase19:

so tall players get a boost in jumping, but you don't have to look at height when finding players... as it's been added to their jumping.

example

a player that is 6'4" and can jump 34" will still have a higher jumping attribute that someone who is 5'10" and can jump 34" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, the jumping attribute takes into account the height of the player and how high he can jump. The height in the player profile is just cosmetic and not used in the engine.

So, two players with equal jumping attribute can get their head equally high when jumping for the ball regardless of their height. This means that, if one of them is shorter, he has the ability to jump higher (more jumping 'power').

Which one of them actually wins the header is probably the sum of many things - for example anticipation, positioning, strength, sportsmanship ...

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jase19:

so tall players get a boost in jumping, but you don't have to look at height when finding players... as it's been added to their jumping.

example

a player that is 6'4" and can jump 34" will still have a higher jumping attribute that someone who is 5'10" and can jump 34" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, the jumping attribute takes into account the height of the player and how high he can jump. The height in the player profile is just cosmetic and not used in the engine.

So, two players with equal jumping attribute can get their head equally high when jumping for the ball regardless of their height. This means that, if one of them is shorter, he has the ability to jump higher (more jumping 'power').

Which one of them actually wins the header is probably the sum of many things - for example anticipation, positioning, strength, sportsmanship ...