SI need to find the balance between fun and realism!

The thing is that i really love this game from it's beginnings, when the game was called CM. The last 3 incarnations of FM are annoying me with too many tactical instructions and for me it's easier to build a good tactic without tactics creator, in old slider way. Whatever I'm doing I'm obviously doing it wrong. I don't play CM as much as I used to because the game is far too simple,and I love interaction that is missing in CM. This game is "trying" to be realistic, but I have seen so much unrealistic things in FM, and when that happens I want to break my pc.

Why I can't have good results with average teams, I don't like playing every time with barcelona or inter, where you have to win every competition. This game is getting overcomplicated every year, and I'm losing interest in it. I know it has to evolve, but I don't want to lose my nerves every time I start to play it. FM is losing fun element, it's trying to be as realistic as possible but you have to know that it's just a game. SI must do something for people who just want to spend a little free time to relax and enjoy the game. As I said CM was far too simple, but FM is starting to look like a real job and that is worrying me. I don't want to read manuals to play the game, I just want for example finish in 4th with fiorentina in my first season. Arcade element is completely lost in FM,you have to make thousands of decisions between matches and in the match to win.

I don't want it to be too easy, but why I must struggle every time? I hate to download tactics, I want to play with my own tactics and find the right balance but whatever I do, I do it wrong. For example I have outplayed all of my opponents in 10 rounds, but managed to win only one game. Every season starts fine for me, but after a while I'm playing much worse than I played in the beggining. I hate to win without creating decent amount of chances, I always prefer attacking football.

And the ME is unrealistic, too many long shots, mised ccc.... SI must find a way for those who just want to enjoy the game. I have seen someone mentioning difficulty levels and I was against that,but now I'm not so sure. I tried tweaking tactics during the match, listening to my assistants, tried everything and it just doesn't work. All of the great tactics in the tactics forum are great with great teams ,but no one managed to do something great with average (like fiorentina) team. Don't get me wrong, sometimes I do win something, but I don't win it with barcelona, chelsea or inter because I never play with them. What do you think, is this the way SI should go?

I enjoy finding talents and developing them, so I usually also go and download a tactic that will work, without much tweaking or instructions.

Try this tactic made by Mr. Hough found in the tactic thread http://www.filefront.com/17166223/AVD-MOD---Mr-Hough-4-1-2-3-Unbeaten-Final-Version.-Crdoba-Oct-2018.tac/

im doing reasonable with a small team.

Just an idea, to get you into it again

Here is how I play:

Default 442 tactic.

Rigid defence

Counter

This is all I have ever done to manage tactics.

During the game, I very rarely switch to attacking or to harder tackling.

Next, I ask my assistance to handle press conferences, pre-match stuff etc..

Now you pretty much have CM back.

You dont need to spend ages on defining tactics, as long as you have players that fit the default tactics (there are many to chose from, just pick one. Target man, playmaker, fast wingers, .... buy to suit the tactic)

Leave the tweaking to real freaks, but it isn't needed to be successful, not even with llm. A good transfer policy, as always, is.

I'm managing Palermo in my first save and have had back to back 2nd place finishes, only just getting pipped to the title by Inter in the 2nd season.

I'm playing with a small diamond with fluid control play. I have then got my players using short passing game and roaming with man to man marking when defending. Also using Pastore as a playmaker and its working a treat.

As Jelle says making good signings is vital. I think this is what has done me well as i have bought some good bargains from tranfers listed players. The best one being Balotelli who i got for £4m

Here is how I play:

Default 442 tactic.

Rigid defence

Counter

This is all I have ever done to manage tactics.

During the game, I very rarely switch to attacking or to harder tackling.

Next, I ask my assistance to handle press conferences, pre-match stuff etc..

Now you pretty much have CM back.

You dont need to spend ages on defining tactics, as long as you have players that fit the default tactics (there are many to chose from, just pick one. Target man, playmaker, fast wingers, .... buy to suit the tactic)

Leave the tweaking to real freaks, but it isn't needed to be successful, not even with llm. A good transfer policy, as always, is.

excellent advice

one of the best posts ive seen here for a while

I have never downloaded tactics and I love the realism of the game. Much harder than the ones before it. Each year it does get more complicated and difficult but I think that is a good thing. I would hate the introduction of 'difficulty levels' as I think that would ruin the game big time. Going average and small teams in FM11 does prove to be much more difficult than going big teams but over a few seasons, you can build an average team into a title challenger. You just need to be patient and understand that success with average/small teams can only be achieved after a few/many seasons, not just one or two.

The thing is that i really love this game from it's beginnings,when the game was called CM.The last 3 incarnations of FM are annoying me with too many tactical instructions and for me it's easier to build a good tactic without tactics creator,in old slider way.Whatever i'm doing i'm obviously doing it wrong.I don't play CM as much as i used to because the game is far too simple,and i love interaction that is missing in CM.This game is "trying" to be realistic,but i have seen so much unrealistic things in FM,and when that happens i want to break my pc.Why i can't have good results with average teams,i don't like playing every time with barcelona or inter,where you have to win every competition.This game is getting overcomplicated every year,and i'm losing interest in it.I know it has to evolve,but i don't want to lose my nerves every time i start to play it.FM is losing fun element,it's trying to be as realistic as possible but you have to know that it's just a game.SI must do something for people who just want to spend a little free time to relax and enjoy the game.As i said CM was far too simple,but FM is starting to look like a real job and that is worrying me.I don't want to read manuals to play the game,i just want for example finish in 4th with fiorentina in my first season.Arcade element is completely lost in FM,you have to make thousands of decisions between matches and in the match to win.I don't want it to be too easy,but why i must struggle every time?I hate to download tactics,i want to play with my own tactics and find the right balance but whatever i do i do it wrong.For example i have outplayed all of my opponents in 10 rounds,but managed to win only one game.Every season starts fine for me,but after a while i'm playing much worse than i played in the beggining.I hate to win without creating decent amount of chances,i always prefer attacking football.And the ME is unrealistic,too many long shots,mised ccc....SI must find a way for those who just want to enjoy the game.I have seen someone mentioning difficulty levels and i was against that,but now i'm not so sure.I tried tweaking tactics during the match,listening to my assistants,tried everything and it just doesn't work.All of the great tactics in the tactics forum are great with great teams,but no one managed to do something great with average(like fiorentina)team.Don't get me wrong,sometimes i do win something,but i don't win it with barcelona,chelsea or inter because i never play with them.What do you think,is this the way SI should go?

Fiorentina is not an average team really.

If you want to play a game where tactics don't matter all that much, become manager of a Seria C2 team, instead of Seria A. It's more about the quality of the players there then the type of tactic because you can have a huge difference in player quality between 2 teams in the same league. It's very satisfying to do good in lower leagues, work your way up, train your youths, etc... then to start at the top already.

I'm not a great tactical genius either, but I try to let my best players play on their most favourite spot. So I figure out a tactic that allows them to do that and then fill in all the empty spots. I don't do much more than that really and it seems to work ok.

I know that fiorentina aren't average:),i decided to play with them cause i thought and was sure i could finish in top 4.Media prediction 8th place,i couldn't resist playing with them.I finished the demo 1st with lille with my own tactics,but didn't continue because of small database and only one league loaded.The thing is that most of my tactics work well in first quarter of the season,but after that it keeps getting worse and worse.After that period whatever i do doesn't help.I hate when i'm not creating enough chances,i don't wanna spend 10 minutes playing just one match listening every advice assistant tells me to gain a draw against roma,milan,juventus.And if i want to beat them,the only way is counterattacking them,otherwise i'll end up losing with 2-3 goals.There must be something for those who are struggling with tactics,those who are losing with teams they should be winning.I know i'm not a manager,but this game should give me a feeling like i am a manager.But in last few years all that this game is giving me is frustration,after FM08 i can't find decent tactics.I really hate to download someone's successful tactic,and to win matches with it.I want to play with player and team instructions,duties and roles,until i find something that is giving me respectable result and enjoyable football to watch.

I have same feeling about FM11. Just finish first season with Bayern. Finished as second and I'm deeply disappointed with FM11, especially when the game suddenly set a "this team can't win" flag on me. I play the very same team as first half season. Lead by 7 point and I strength the weak link of my team, GK, by signing Akinfeev at winter break. Then I start a very good second half with 6win and 1 draw. All of sudden, I lost a unexpected game to Koeln. The next game, my players look like idiot concede 3 long rangers to Schalk and lost 1:3. After that they become amateur. Missing one on one, missing shoot with no keeper ahead, give away penalty easily when I had one goal lead. I try everything as a manager can do in game, encourage them, give a soft talk when they act like 11 idiots, show my anger, told MvB if he continue to give away unnecessary penalty after I got one goal lead three games in a row, I would transfer listed him. He dare to try me and I never play him since.

There are just too much to say about the game suddenly decide my team can't win. I lost a penalty shoot out to Bremem in Germany cup, yup you guess right, the reason I scored 3 but have to play penalty is Van Buyten giving away 2 penalty. Then I stop talk to media and my players. No team talk at all. My silence seems worked well, I won Inter and Hotspur with away goal advantage and play Barca in final. My point is why my team suddenly can't play football? Once you go wrong, you have to watch 11 idiots play football every week. Game preparation is 100% both on 442 and 4231 at second half and they even played worse than first half when it just at level of 60-80? I don't get it? Is it my tactics again?

It's no longer fun to play FM11. The manager talk things, are just giving SI a reason to code something like "this team sucks from now on" flag in game, so that ME can decide which team should play like idiot.

I have same feeling about FM11. Just finish first season with Bayern. Finished as second and I'm deeply disappointed with FM11, especially when the game suddenly set a "this team can't win" flag on me. I play the very same team as first half season. Lead by 7 point and I strength the weak link of my team, GK, by signing Akinfeev at winter break. Then I start a very good second half with 6win and 1 draw. All of sudden, I lost a unexpected game to Koeln. The next game, my players look like idiot concede 3 long rangers to Schalk and lost 1:3. After that they become amateur. Missing one on one, missing shoot with no keeper ahead, give away penalty easily when I had one goal lead. I try everything as a manager can do in game, encourage them, give a soft talk when they act like 11 idiots, show my anger, told MvB if he continue to give away unnecessary penalty after I got one goal lead three games in a row, I would transfer listed him. He dare to try me and I never play him since.

There are just too much to say about the game suddenly decide my team can't win. I lost a penalty shoot out to Bremem in Germany cup, yup you guess right, the reason I scored 3 but have to play penalty is Van Buyten giving away 2 penalty. Then I stop talk to media and my players. No team talk at all. My silence seems worked well, I won Inter and Hotspur with away goal advantage and play Barca in final. My point is why my team suddenly can't play football? Once you go wrong, you have to watch 11 idiots play football every week. Game preparation is 100% both on 442 and 4231 at second half and they even played worse than first half when it just at level of 60-80? I don't get it? Is it my tactics again?

It's no longer fun to play FM11. The manager talk things, are just giving SI a reason to code something like "this team sucks from now on" flag in game, so that ME can decide which team should play like idiot.

bloody hell, they turn you into a Middlesbrough fan ;-)

I use the old classic slider option for tactics, and probably always will, but have no issues with there being a tactics creator.

While i loved the cM games at the time, i'd really question those who don't want to have to bother with tactics or press conferences etc.

Call me crazy but i actually like the tactical side of the game, and have found that preparation is the key to getting anything out of games here.

I beat sunderland away 4-0 in the league, and had prepared massively for it. Then the league cup 3rd round, only had two youngsters in the team, but NO preparation, just told them to enjoy the game, and lost 4-2 at home.

I played wolves at home, did minimal prep because i was tired, lost 2-0. Played everton away, who hadn't lost all season, did my prep, beat them 2-0.

Without all this the game would be utterly boring. I don't change my formation EVERY game, but my tactics vary depending on the opposition, as it should be

I know that fiorentina aren't average:),i decided to play with them cause i thought and was sure i could finish in top 4.Media prediction 8th place,i couldn't resist playing with them.I finished the demo 1st with lille with my own tactics,but didn't continue because of small database and only one league loaded.The thing is that most of my tactics work well in first quarter of the season,but after that it keeps getting worse and worse.After that period whatever i do doesn't help.I hate when i'm not creating enough chances,i don't wanna spend 10 minutes playing just one match listening every advice assistant tells me to gain a draw against roma,milan,juventus.And if i want to beat them,the only way is counterattacking them,otherwise i'll end up losing with 2-3 goals.There must be something for those who are struggling with tactics,those who are losing with teams they should be winning.I know i'm not a manager,but this game should give me a feeling like i am a manager.But in last few years all that this game is giving me is frustration,after FM08 i can't find decent tactics.I really hate to download someone's successful tactic,and to win matches with it.I want to play with player and team instructions,duties and roles,until i find something that is giving me respectable result and enjoyable football to watch.

I'm sure every manager in the World gets frustrated quite often, so you are getting what you ask for here.

You can't just pick up a non-league team and expect to be Champions of Europe in 7 years, if it was easy it would be boring for the majority.

At the end of the day, the game is as easy or hard as you want it to be. The tactics wizard is a brilliant tool to help you build a decent tactic in a matter of minutes. You don't need to constantly tweak things, just switch strategies or use some shouts during games.

Also, you can leave a lot of tasks to your assistant; team talks, press conferences or even ask him to pick the team. So basically get yourself a good assistant and you have just switched on 'easy mode'.

When my striker is in position to shoot on goal,but decides to pass the ball to other player who is far away from penalty area,that's totally stupid.I do understand some things they do,it is maybe to stop people exploiting the ME,but this is totally ridiculous.I've lost my nerves trying to win,as gate2 said,after a while your players look like idiots.When the familiar level bars are all filled up with blue,for me it's time for alert.I don't understand what i'm doing wrong,why is everything so terrible after a while?Going from second place to place number twelve,do i need to completely change my tactics every 10 rounds?I was called a tactical magician(or something like that because of the modifications) in first rounds to sink to twelfth place after half of the season.There are too many unrealistic things in ME,stupid things that kills my wish to play FM.

I tried FM 10, went back to 09. Have tried 11, and although it's better than 10, it's not as fun to play as 09. It feels like a simulation. I'm going back to 09, I'm just trying to find out how to use the current database within that game so I don't have to edit lots of stuff in the data editor.

I'm sure every manager in the World gets frustrated quite often, so you are getting what you ask for here.

You can't just pick up a non-league team and expect to be Champions of Europe in 7 years, if it was easy it would be boring for the majority.

At the end of the day, the game is as easy or hard as you want it to be. The tactics wizard is a brilliant tool to help you build a decent tactic in a matter of minutes. You don't need to constantly tweak things, just switch strategies or use some shouts during games.

Also, you can leave a lot of tasks to your assistant; team talks, press conferences or even ask him to pick the team. So basically get yourself a good assistant and you have just switched on 'easy mode'.

That's the point,i'm not a fu..... manager.I signed a world class manager,tried to build a tactic with TC,tried ordinary tactics without too many of my instructions,tried all of the instruction and none of them work.I've tried everything with tactics,still nothing works.I want to play a game,i don't want to be a frustrated manager.It's the only game i play and i want to enjoy it.I don't want it to be too easy,but this is frustration only,i want to break my PC after playing it.Sorry for my language,but i'm totally nervous after playing FM:)

This is probably the first FM I'm watching 'Full Match' every game and the rewards are great, haven't been out of the top 4 all season with Everton.

It really does make a huge difference.

It makes a difference,but i don't have so much free time to watch every match from start till end.

I understand that, I'm only 20 odd games into my first season, but do you want to manage correctly or quickly?

How long are you trying your tactics for. You need to stick with one for about 15 games or so for the players to become fluid and gelled with a tactic.

I have same feeling about FM11. Just finish first season with Bayern. Finished as second and I'm deeply disappointed with FM11, especially when the game suddenly set a "this team can't win" flag on me. I play the very same team as first half season. Lead by 7 point and I strength the weak link of my team, GK, by signing Akinfeev at winter break. Then I start a very good second half with 6win and 1 draw. All of sudden, I lost a unexpected game to Koeln. The next game, my players look like idiot concede 3 long rangers to Schalk and lost 1:3. After that they become amateur. Missing one on one, missing shoot with no keeper ahead, give away penalty easily when I had one goal lead. I try everything as a manager can do in game, encourage them, give a soft talk when they act like 11 idiots, show my anger, told MvB if he continue to give away unnecessary penalty after I got one goal lead three games in a row, I would transfer listed him. He dare to try me and I never play him since.

There are just too much to say about the game suddenly decide my team can't win. I lost a penalty shoot out to Bremem in Germany cup, yup you guess right, the reason I scored 3 but have to play penalty is Van Buyten giving away 2 penalty. Then I stop talk to media and my players. No team talk at all. My silence seems worked well, I won Inter and Hotspur with away goal advantage and play Barca in final. My point is why my team suddenly can't play football? Once you go wrong, you have to watch 11 idiots play football every week. Game preparation is 100% both on 442 and 4231 at second half and they even played worse than first half when it just at level of 60-80? I don't get it? Is it my tactics again?

It's no longer fun to play FM11. The manager talk things, are just giving SI a reason to code something like "this team sucks from now on" flag in game, so that ME can decide which team should play like idiot.

So basically you just want to win, anything other than a win results in the game being rubbish. Nice.

When my striker is in position to shoot on goal,but decides to pass the ball to other player who is far away from penalty area,that's totally stupid.I do understand some things they do,it is maybe to stop people exploiting the ME,but this is totally ridiculous.

Because obviously, real players never make bad decisions. Or bad misses. Or are confused. Or have matches where they can't seem to be hitting a ball correctly. Bad things will happen, no matter how good your team or tactic is. And yes, now and then the ME will show a completely absurd situation, but if you can create a ME that does a better job at avoiding that, I'm sure SI will be happy to hire you.

I think the main issue with the dissappointed manager is that they expect to much (easy to challenge for the title with a mid-table team) and that they think attacking football is the place to be, and every shot should result in a goal.

I've found that, especially when playing teams that don't outclass the opposition, playing a more defensive strategy will cause far less frustration.

For one; the Benitez saying: when you don't concede a goal, you can't lose.

For two; the chances you do get on the counter will be much more clearcut, with more space for your strikers and will far more often result in a goal

For three; you will not get the illusion that you were by far the best team, because you shot on goal more than the opposition

You might get away with this for a while in the beginning, as the opposition might underestimate you and not keep enough players back, however, once they do, they'll be ready to give you the same treatment I sketched above. You will need some quality players to cut through well setup defences, or players will resort to making long shots because everyone else is covered.

Besides the offensive / defensive approach, another thing you might be over-estimating is the stats of your players. Do you have the players to break open defences? Do you have high pace strikers with a great "of the ball" stat? Are they composed enough to finish it? Can they cope with pressure? Are they determined? Are they experienced, or rookies? Did they get clear-cut chances offered to them?

Do you use a targetman up front that can hold up a ball, so other players can easily join in attack, giving you more options? Does he live up to his task?

Do you have one great playmaker? Creative, good passing, good "of the ball", good decisions, good acceleration, good cross? He can change a game on his own? Is he consistent?

Having a great playmaker / targetman can be the difference on many occasions, as they can turn around games on their own, even when a couple other players are down on moral.

There is no way to avoid losses, and their are no miracle strategies that will donate you every cup in the first season. However, if you create a more defensive tactic, you will not go on 10 game losing spreas with a team that is capable of finishin mid table. There will still be bad periods of course, and it will not work miracles until you have great players in your squad. But you do not have to tweak your tactics for every single game to be successful. I think tweaking them to much might even do you more bad than good as players will probably get a little confused.

That's the point,i'm not a fu..... manager.I signed a world class manager,tried to build a tactic with TC,tried ordinary tactics without too many of my instructions,tried all of the instruction and none of them work.I've tried everything with tactics,still nothing works.I want to play a game,i don't want to be a frustrated manager.It's the only game i play and i want to enjoy it.I don't want it to be too easy,but this is frustration only,i want to break my PC after playing it.Sorry for my language,but i'm totally nervous after playing FM:)

This game is not suited to you. Stop playing it, its as simple as that really now, this is not the game for you.

Maybe go play Fifa 11 and enter management mode in that, might be a little easier for you.

Acting like a fan-boy gets no-one no-where, Gd.

This game is not suited to you. Stop playing it, its as simple as that really now, this is not the game for you.

Maybe go play Fifa 11 and enter management mode in that, might be a little easier for you.

I'm playing CM/FM for about 10 years,it's the only game i play so please don't tell me what is and what isn't suitable for me.I didn't create this thread to argue with someone,it's cause i wanted to hear opinions.I know i won't win everything in first season,but i want to see my team improving after a while.I was so happy playing with wolfsburg(demo),although i did have only one win in 10 rounds,fact that i outplayed every opponent made me happy.I don't want to mount a championship challenge with some mid table team,but at least i want to see little improvements with how my team is playing and coping with my opponents.The thing is that they don't improve at all,they become rubbish after a while.

Acting like a fan-boy gets no-one no-where, Gd.

Yes, but when someone is complaining about having to manage a football team properly in a game called Football Manager, sometimes you simply have to call a spade a spade.

Acting like a fan-boy gets no-one no-where, Gd.

Look at the thread title cont.....

The point of the matter is, clearly this game is not suited to him.

The game is/was created to be as lifelike to real time management as possible, so they don't have to fnd a balance between anything, as that would go against the whole ethos of the game. To come on and state that they have to do such a thing is absurd to start off with....and then his reasoning gets even worse. Its basically because he is not winning every game. Nothing to do with being a "fan boy", probably the strangest, most innaccurate thing I have ever been called tbh.

Acting like a fan-boy gets no-one no-where, Gd.

Great to see reasonable people here,but i too am a fan-boy,frustrated fan-boy!

I'm playing CM/FM for about 10 years,it's the only game i play so please don't tell me what is and what isn't suitable for me.I didn't create this thread to argue with someone,it's cause i wanted to hear opinions.I know i won't win everything in first season,but i want to see my team improving after a while.I was so happy playing with wolfsburg(demo),although i did have only one win in 10 rounds,fact that i outplayed every opponent made me happy.I don't want to mount a championship challenge with some mid table team,but at least i want to see little improvements with how my team is playing and coping with my opponents.The thing is that they don't improve at all,they become rubbish after a while.

Then you have to put work into do get results, if you are not willing to put in work to do so, then it its quite irresponsible to come on here stating that SI HAVE to find a balance just to suit your needs. I'm not arguing with you, putting aside the immaturity of the thread title, it honestly seems to me like this is not the game for you if you don't enjoy playing it because you are not winning games or playing better than your opponants with an average- good team at the click of a button.

Look at the thread title cont.....

The point of the matter is, clearly this game is not suited to him.

The game is/was created to be as lifelike to real time management as possible, so they don't have to fnd a balance between anything, as that would go against the whole ethos of the game. To come on and state that they have to do such a thing is absurd to start off with....and then his reasoning gets even worse. Its basically because he is not winning every game. Nothing to do with being a "fan boy", probably the strangest, most innaccurate thing I have ever been called tbh.

I really can't argue with the point Gdawg is making. It's a management simulation game. Quite clearly, TWSOIA is having trouble simulating management. People who play FM11 properly don't have any of the concerns he's bringing up. Jelle Slaets gave fantastic advice above which he totally disregarded.

The only conclusion is that the game will never be suited to his needs.

Look at the thread title cont.....

The point of the matter is, clearly this game is not suited to him.

The game is/was created to be as lifelike to real time management as possible, so they don't have to fnd a balance between anything, as that would go against the whole ethos of the game. To come on and state that they have to do such a thing is absurd to start off with....and then his reasoning gets even worse. Its basically because he is not winning every game. Nothing to do with being a "fan boy", probably the strangest, most innaccurate thing I have ever been called tbh.

This is a game,when you're so good at management,why don't you try the job to see how it goes?

so they don't have to fnd a balance between anything, as that would go against the whole ethos of the game.

--

What!? The day that the game offers just pure simulation and no fun (and it's heading in that direction fast) will be a sad day for the game.

A lot of the people that still play FM from when they were younger are dragged back to it because of the enjoyment they get out of playing it, not specifically because it's so realistic. It isn't. It's the enjoyment factor. I probably agree that the OP is a buffoon, but I think if people are suggesting that SI have found a balance between realism and fun..hmmm..I think they've gone too far the former

so they don't have to fnd a balance between anything, as that would go against the whole ethos of the game.

--

What!? The day that the game offers just pure simulation and no fun (and it's heading in that direction fast) will be a sad day for the game.

A lot of the people that still play FM from when they were younger are dragged back to it because of the enjoyment they get out of playing it, not specifically because it's so realistic. It isn't. It's the enjoyment factor. I probably agree that the OP is a buffoon, but I think if people are suggesting that SI have found a balance between realism and fun..hmmm..I think they've gone too far the former

I've set up a basic 4-4-2, Standard philosophy with two attacking wide players as Blyth Spartans. It's now December and I haven't lost a game yet.

If anything, the realism needs upping more in my view as I'm just clicking continue and walking through games!

That's actually my advice to the OP - start in a minor league. Pick up a Conference South team and don't overcomplicate things.

This is a game,when you're so good at management,why don't you try the job to see how it goes?

Brilliant response. Very mature and constructive of you.

Anyway, in reply:

oh I don't know.....maybe its because it would be practically impossible for me to get a job in management having no past experience so i do the next closest thing which is realistic, and that is play a football managing simulation game?

so they don't have to fnd a balance between anything, as that would go against the whole ethos of the game.

--

What!? The day that the game offers just pure simulation and no fun (and it's heading in that direction fast) will be a sad day for the game.

A lot of the people that still play FM from when they were younger are dragged back to it because of the enjoyment they get out of playing it, not specifically because it's so realistic. It isn't. It's the enjoyment factor. I probably agree that the OP is a buffoon, but I think if people are suggesting that SI have found a balance between realism and fun..hmmm..I think they've gone too far the former

I'm going to say that I think most people who play the game now, would probably disagree with you tbh. Otherwise it would not be one the most popular longest running game. I think the majority of folk are very happy with the direction.

Yes there are changes that could/should be made, for all to discuss, but my primary debate is with the OP points which are absolutely ridiculous. imo, and many others, of course.

I'm going to say that I think most people who play the game now, would probably disagree with you tbh. Otherwise it would not be one the most popular longest running game. I think the majority of folk are very happy with the direction.

Yes there are changes that could/should be made, for all to discuss, but my primary debate is with the OP points which are absolutely ridiculous. imo, and many others, of course.

Dunno about that. We all love the football management games, but what are the other options? Go to CM? Yeah right. While there are features on the new game that I like, I feel it's just become too deep and vast to retain that sense of fun that used to be around.

so they don't have to fnd a balance between anything, as that would go against the whole ethos of the game.

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What!? The day that the game offers just pure simulation and no fun (and it's heading in that direction fast) will be a sad day for the game.

A lot of the people that still play FM from when they were younger are dragged back to it because of the enjoyment they get out of playing it, not specifically because it's so realistic. It isn't. It's the enjoyment factor. I probably agree that the OP is a buffoon, but I think if people are suggesting that SI have found a balance between realism and fun..hmmm..I think they've gone too far the former

I've seen threads like this in the past few years,and i must agree with you.What i don't like is when someone is accusing me that i want to win everything in my first season,no matter what team i pick,that's completely wrong.I don't want that,that would be totally unrealistic,i just want a decent level of enjoyment and a little improvements after a while.If i'm managing a relegation candidate,of course there's a big chance that i'll struggle most of the matches.If i need to wait 10 seasons(with wolfsburg,fiorentina,tottenham...)to win something,i'll wait but after 8 seasons i want to see some indications that i'll soon be able to challenge for something,but i don't see this now.I'm always signing best available staff on the market,trying to buy the best players to improve the club.

I'm going back to 09, going to be a good few hours manually editing the database. It's not that FM 11 is terrible. It isn't. It's much better than 10. But sometimes, less IS more.

Brilliant response. Very mature and constructive of you.

Anyway, in reply:

oh I don't know.....maybe its because it would be practically impossible for me to get a job in management having no past experience so i do the next closest thing which is realistic, and that is play a football managing simulation game?

Look at your post:this game isn't for you,stop playing it.It's also very mature.As i've said this thread is not for arguing,and i agree the thread title is a little stupid but i couldn't remember anything better for the title.I just want to say that this game needs to be realistic as possible but with fun element,and fun doesn't mean easy to win matches and trophies.This is just a game,it's not real life and nobody playing it will become mourinho.I don't play old CM so much time i used to because it's totally unrealistic and lacks options and interaction,but this is becoming the only DVD giving me a headache.

This is just a game,it's not real life and nobody playing it will become mourinho

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Oi! Less of that...I have the potential

That's the point,i'm not a fu..... manager.I signed a world class manager,tried to build a tactic with TC,tried ordinary tactics without too many of my instructions,tried all of the instruction and none of them work.I've tried everything with tactics,still nothing works.I want to play a game,i don't want to be a frustrated manager.It's the only game i play and i want to enjoy it.I don't want it to be too easy,but this is frustration only,i want to break my PC after playing it.Sorry for my language,but i'm totally nervous after playing FM:)

What do you mean when you say you've tried everything with tactics? Because the game has only been out a few days, sometimes you need to stick with something a bit longer to get any results.

I started a game with Liverpool and lost most of my friendlies against lower league opposition. I was a bit disappointed yes, but I stuck with the tactics as I felt they should work, and after a sticky start my team is playing well and winning games now.

Have you actually been sacked yet? As even if results aren't going well to start with, you should keep going until you are sacked. Then pick up another team or start over, and try something different. After you get sacked 20 times, then come back here and say you've tried everything.

The fact is this, its a simulation not an arcade game. If you want an easier experience then choose an easier management game. And I am not a fanboy, you can look over my previous posts to see that. Maybe you just need to take a step back, put aside everything you think you know about the game and start a fresh with no preconceptions. I sometimes do this and am pleasantly surprised by the results. The game has evolved, so must you I'm afraid.

Clearly we need to be able to bribe the ref's, I look forward to that SI, it's a long awaited feature. And it's perfectly suited for the reality concept freaks.

Plus the OP wouldn't have to cry himself to sleep every night, well maybe in jail after a few seasons, but thats another story.

So basically you just want to win, anything other than a win results in the game being rubbish. Nice.

Is this your so-called "constructive"? Don't take words from my mouth and stop act like a fan boy. It's not gonna help you in real life.

I accept defeat is part of football. What I don't understand is how come the game suddenly decide a team should play like idiot even when they have superior squad, well understanding of tactics? When the "this team cant win" tag is on, this game is not fun.

I have same feeling about FM11. Just finish first season with Bayern. Finished as second and I'm deeply disappointed with FM11, especially when the game suddenly set a "this team can't win" flag on me. I play the very same team as first half season. Lead by 7 point and I strength the weak link of my team, GK, by signing Akinfeev at winter break. Then I start a very good second half with 6win and 1 draw. All of sudden, I lost a unexpected game to Koeln. The next game, my players look like idiot concede 3 long rangers to Schalk and lost 1:3. After that they become amateur. Missing one on one, missing shoot with no keeper ahead, give away penalty easily when I had one goal lead. I try everything as a manager can do in game, encourage them, give a soft talk when they act like 11 idiots, show my anger, told MvB if he continue to give away unnecessary penalty after I got one goal lead three games in a row, I would transfer listed him. He dare to try me and I never play him since.

There are just too much to say about the game suddenly decide my team can't win. I lost a penalty shoot out to Bremem in Germany cup, yup you guess right, the reason I scored 3 but have to play penalty is Van Buyten giving away 2 penalty. Then I stop talk to media and my players. No team talk at all. My silence seems worked well, I won Inter and Hotspur with away goal advantage and play Barca in final. My point is why my team suddenly can't play football? Once you go wrong, you have to watch 11 idiots play football every week. Game preparation is 100% both on 442 and 4231 at second half and they even played worse than first half when it just at level of 60-80? I don't get it? Is it my tactics again?

It's no longer fun to play FM11. The manager talk things, are just giving SI a reason to code something like "this team sucks from now on" flag in game, so that ME can decide which team should play like idiot.

Personally, I think this story illustrates how much better FM is getting. Your team was on a roll and cruising to the title. You suffered one blip and collapsed under the pressure. The end of your opening paragraph completely sums up why you fell apart. You had absolutely no plan to get the team back on the road again and randomly switched between care and control in your managerial approach. This resulted in a drop in morale and your alienating one of your best and most experienced players, which is hardly going to help team performance. Since you've stopped making things worse, the team has managed to pull together a little bit and they might get you something out of the campaign. QUite simply, you panicked and the team responded as any team would, by falling apart.

To the OP: It seems to me that you have previously played FM by building one size beats all 'super tactics' through the slider system. You might still be able to do that if you can find a way to exploit the ME. Who knows? However, with the introduction of the TC match play has become far more dynamic and the AI tactics have become more robust and flexible. They change tactical approach in a logical and proactive manner. If you are trying to beat all these shifts in play by using one single approach, then you are putting yourself at a serious disadvantage. It will need to be able to unlock defensive tactics and defend against attacking tactics, all in one fell swoop. That's a big ask.

My advice would be for you to embrace the TC and explore its dynamism (i.e. the touchline instructions). You might not be any good at first but you'll soon learn how to react to different match scenarios. Once you do, enjoyment should increase. For me, the added dynamism has made the game far, far more enjoyable. Playing with classic tactics completely misses out on this experience.

Personally, I think this story illustrates how much better FM is getting. Your team was on a roll and cruising to the title. You suffered one blip and collapsed under the pressure. The end of your opening paragraph completely sums up why you fell apart. You had absolutely no plan to get the team back on the road again and randomly switched between care and control in your managerial approach. This resulted in a drop in morale and your alienating one of your best and most experienced players, which is hardly going to help team performance. Since you've stopped making things worse, the team has managed to pull together a little bit and they might get you something out of the campaign. QUite simply, you panicked and the team responded as any team would, by falling apart.

You completely have no ideal about my approach in game and jump to conclusion soon just base on your own assumption. Is this a new guideline instead of "it is your tactics"?

Even when I lead 7point in first half, my team did not "win it all". Base on their performance, usually I give soft team talk after fail to win. I know they play well, just the opposite is better or lucky. Players who did not perform well, I give him private talk and ask them to work hard next game. It works well. After a fine start of second half. I lost a unexpected game, I do not blame my players, it just unlucky. After that MvB start to perform badly in game, earn himself unnecessary red card, give away penalty when team have one goal lead. At the same time, my team start play like idiot. If Rooney sit on bench now, I see no reason in real life I should play MvB in my game. I had a feeling they do not play for win. It's kind of the result of game is "fixed" (or SI do implement such feature in FM11?). My team want to lose the game as many as they can. And I don't know why. Or you gonna to say I'm not demanding enough this time?

BTW I do not randomly change my team talk. I choose my tone base on their performance. It's just their performance is so random. So I have to response randomly as well.

The thing is that i really love this game from it's beginnings,when the game was called CM.The last 3 incarnations of FM are annoying me with too many tactical instructions and for me it's easier to build a good tactic without tactics creator,in old slider way.Whatever i'm doing i'm obviously doing it wrong.I don't play CM as much as i used to because the game is far too simple,and i love interaction that is missing in CM.This game is "trying" to be realistic,but i have seen so much unrealistic things in FM,and when that happens i want to break my pc.Why i can't have good results with average teams,i don't like playing every time with barcelona or inter,where you have to win every competition.This game is getting overcomplicated every year,and i'm losing interest in it.I know it has to evolve,but i don't want to lose my nerves every time i start to play it.FM is losing fun element,it's trying to be as realistic as possible but you have to know that it's just a game.SI must do something for people who just want to spend a little free time to relax and enjoy the game.As i said CM was far too simple,but FM is starting to look like a real job and that is worrying me.I don't want to read manuals to play the game,i just want for example finish in 4th with fiorentina in my first season.Arcade element is completely lost in FM,you have to make thousands of decisions between matches and in the match to win.I don't want it to be too easy,but why i must struggle every time?I hate to download tactics,i want to play with my own tactics and find the right balance but whatever i do i do it wrong.For example i have outplayed all of my opponents in 10 rounds,but managed to win only one game.Every season starts fine for me,but after a while i'm playing much worse than i played in the beggining.I hate to win without creating decent amount of chances,i always prefer attacking football.And the ME is unrealistic,too many long shots,mised ccc....SI must find a way for those who just want to enjoy the game.I have seen someone mentioning difficulty levels and i was against that,but now i'm not so sure.I tried tweaking tactics during the match,listening to my assistants,tried everything and it just doesn't work.All of the great tactics in the tactics forum are great with great teams,but no one managed to do something great with average(like fiorentina)team.Don't get me wrong,sometimes i do win something,but i don't win it with barcelona,chelsea or inter because i never play with them.What do you think,is this the way SI should go?

the most sensible title on any football manager thread of all time

my most hated realistic feature, goalkeeper errors dropping ball programmed badly to, it is realistic, but games are for fun not to feel like smashing laptop.

You completely have no ideal about my approach in game and jump to conclusion soon just base on your own assumption. Is this a new guideline instead of "it is your tactics"?

Even when I lead 7point in first half, my team did not "win it all". Base on their performance, usually I give soft team talk after fail to win. I know they play well, just the opposite is better or lucky. Players who did not perform well, I give him private talk and ask them to work hard next game. It works well. After a fine start of second half. I lost a unexpected game, I do not blame my players, it just unlucky. After that MvB start to perform badly in game, earn himself unnecessary red card, give away penalty when team have one goal lead. At the same time, my team start play like idiot. If Rooney sit on bench now, I see no reason in real life I should play MvB in my game. I had a feeling they do not play for win. It's kind of the result of game is "fixed" (or SI do implement such feature in FM11?). My team want to lose the game as many as they can. And I don't know why. Or you gonna to say I'm not demanding enough this time?

BTW I do not randomly change my team talk. I choose my tone base on their performance. It's just their performance is so random. So I have to response randomly as well.

Fine. Don't listen to advice. It's not like I know what I'm talking about anyway.

Personally, I think this story illustrates how much better FM is getting. Your team was on a roll and cruising to the title. You suffered one blip and collapsed under the pressure. The end of your opening paragraph completely sums up why you fell apart. You had absolutely no plan to get the team back on the road again and randomly switched between care and control in your managerial approach. This resulted in a drop in morale and your alienating one of your best and most experienced players, which is hardly going to help team performance. Since you've stopped making things worse, the team has managed to pull together a little bit and they might get you something out of the campaign. QUite simply, you panicked and the team responded as any team would, by falling apart.

To the OP: It seems to me that you have previously played FM by building one size beats all 'super tactics' through the slider system. You might still be able to do that if you can find a way to exploit the ME. Who knows? However, with the introduction of the TC match play has become far more dynamic and the AI tactics have become more robust and flexible. They change tactical approach in a logical and proactive manner. If you are trying to beat all these shifts in play by using one single approach, then you are putting yourself at a serious disadvantage. It will need to be able to unlock defensive tactics and defend against attacking tactics, all in one fell swoop. That's a big ask.

My advice would be for you to embrace the TC and explore its dynamism (i.e. the touchline instructions). You might not be any good at first but you'll soon learn how to react to different match scenarios. Once you do, enjoyment should increase. For me, the added dynamism has made the game far, far more enjoyable. Playing with classic tactics completely misses out on this experience.

Great post. And as someone else said "The game has evolved. So must you"

If you give up on this may I suggest the PSP version? It is simpler but great fun. May be too simple for you but might be just what you're looking for. I've come back to the PC version after a few years of playing that and wow...this version has certainly changed a lot. But I'm approaching it completely differently for the way I used to and I'm having a blast!

Fine. Don't listen to advice. It's not like I know what I'm talking about anyway.

Just addmit you're wrong. You are no god, no one expect you to be right about everytjing.

In this thread, you made a failure assuming I'm not happy because losing at the first place and came out with those "advise". Actually my situation is not what you assumed. For your imformation, I only listed at 7th 2 month after season start. At that time I had fun finding right players/tactic for my team. After I drop my personal favor 4231, adapt to 442 which my team is more familar with. I start wining since. I even had some great come back win when my players responsed well to my halftime talk and tactic change. Suddenly the "this team can't win" tag is on me. And my players start to play like idiot and you call it reality?