Being penalised for overachieving

Why does this happen in FM?

EG, get a team promoted and then somehow get them into the top half or into Europe the following season and the board expects you to repeat the success no matter what.

Say Birmingham or Wolves finished 8th this season, would their managers job be in jeapordy if they were in 15th place the following season IRL?

No, their position would be even stronger because the board would know the manager is capable of success.

Like how Billy Davies was supported by Derby after unexpectedly getting them promoted to the Prem?

Like how Billy Davies was supported by Derby after unexpectedly getting them promoted to the Prem?

The difference is in FM you get sacked by keeping them, was Davis on his way to relegating them? Knowing him, he might also have been sacked because the was a mouthy ******.

i agree. I got 10th with wolves after choosing fight to avoid relegation, the next season they wanted a top hal finish, i think a secure mid table would have been the better option. I do think that it does ask alot, especially if you win the CL and then next year the minimum expectation to win it again? something that no team has ever done?!

Totally agree. I got promoted in a Betis game and managed to get European football. Season after I was on the verge of a relegation battle and was under so much pressure.

How about the fact that my squad had no where near the depth for a run in Europe, having only been promoted the season before

Although this happens to a significant degree in real life (take any number of mediocre teams that overachieve) the long-term confidence in FM maybe needs tweaking a little.

I wish there were an OPTION to not be fired in the game.

Although this happens to a significant degree in real life (take any number of mediocre teams that overachieve) the long-term confidence in FM maybe needs tweaking a little.

yes, i mean my farnborough save for example. I won the BSN (or south i cant remember), then i went up in the play offs from the BSP to L2, my expectation was to gain promotion in my first season in league football when 90% of my team were still part timers?? It seems to base it on last years results not where your team should actually finish.

I wish there were an OPTION to not be fired in the game.

Wouldn't take all the challenge out of it?

I would like a system where loyalty and success counts for something in the relationship you have with your club.

IRL I can recall Bill Kenwright saying David Moyes has a job for life at Everton or something to that affect.

But if you are managing your favorite club, why would you want to be fired? As I said, it should be an option for those looking for a unique gaming experience.

This is one of the annoyances in real life too. If a club has had unexpected success this will in the very most cases remain the standard of expectations. A lot of managers have got into trouble or even lost their jobs after not being able to repeat an overachievement. We may bemoan that and say that it's not right, but this is real life.

I see no reason why FM shouldn't reflect this.

Depends entirely on your chairman.

I won the league with Spurs (unexpectedly), and the following season they only wanted a mid-table finish.

That's actually pretty realistic. Countless managers have been criticised and even sacked for failing to match previous overacheivements. Of course it depends on the club, chairman, board and finances. But it does happen.

I think it totally depends on your board. I won the Champions League with Bradford when we were supposed just to make it to the second round, next year the expectations were to reach the semifinal, won it again and now even if I'm the hot favorite to win it again the board expect me to reach the semifinal.

The same goes with the Premier League. After finishing 12th when we were a sure thing for relegation, next season i was supposed to fight bravely against relegation. I finished 10th and my next goal was a safe mid table position. Finished 4 and then they expected to achieve qualification for an european competition. After that i finished 1-2-1 and the expectation remains the same qualification for an european competition.

yes, i mean my farnborough save for example. I won the BSN (or south i cant remember).

There would have to be an insane number of southern based teams at that level for Farnborough to compete in the Conf North

i think its as realistic as you can get.

besides, it works both ways as well, for example i managed to manage my Man United team into 5th position (going on holiday for a year didnt help) and then the next season, they only required a uefa cup finish with £150m to spend to add to my already talented squad.

I've noticed that a squads reputation changed dramatically depending where you finish in the league.

In my save I think it was someone like Canvey Island got put into the BSN. 2 teams from the South Coast got relegated iirc, so they were put into the BSN.

This is one of the annoyances in real life too. If a club has had unexpected success this will in the very most cases remain the standard of expectations. A lot of managers have got into trouble or even lost their jobs after not being able to repeat an overachievement. We may bemoan that and say that it's not right, but this is real life.

I see no reason why FM shouldn't reflect this.

How so? Fans that are not deluded know that their achievement may be one off, due to luck and other circumstances, and that repeating the feat should be extremely difficult. It's like Portsmouth winning the FA Cup in 2008 or any supposed relegation strugglers who managed to finish mid table. If Wolves had managed to finish 8th last season and you offered a Wolves fan the chance to finish 15th this season, he would take it.

Applies more to the smaller clubs though.

This is one of the annoyances in real life too. If a club has had unexpected success this will in the very most cases remain the standard of expectations. A lot of managers have got into trouble or even lost their jobs after not being able to repeat an overachievement. We may bemoan that and say that it's not right, but this is real life.

I see no reason why FM shouldn't reflect this.

How so? Fans that are not deluded know that their achievement may be one off, due to luck and other circumstances, and that repeating the feat should be extremely difficult. It's like Portsmouth winning the FA Cup in 2008 or any supposed relegation strugglers who managed to finish mid table. If Wolves had managed to finish 8th last season and you offered a Wolves fan the chance to finish 15th this season, he would take it.

Applies more to the smaller clubs though.

To be honest I think it reflects reality.

Look at Darren Ferguson at Peterborough - 2 straight promotions to the Championship with a small team, poor start to the season and he was out straight away. Many other managers have got teams in to the Premiership unexpectedly, then been sacked by Christmas the next season.

George Burley - 5th in Prem 1st season up, Relegation the next(UEFA Cup Qual via Fair Play) and sacked the following season, after 8 seasons in charge.(also played for the club)

close enough? , can't think of any more tho.

On the flip side though you have cases like Dario Gradi who, while having reasonable success with Crewe, wouldn't have lasted near the 24 years he had in RL if his career was replicated in FM.

On the flip side though you have cases like Dario Gradi who, while having reasonable success with Crewe, wouldn't have lasted near the 24 years he had in RL if his career was replicated in FM.

Theres probably a handful of relegations in there too.

FM only sees what happens in the current season, they need to tweak it so the last 3-5 seasons are taken into effect.

To be honest I think it reflects reality.

Look at Darren Ferguson at Peterborough - 2 straight promotions to the Championship with a small team, poor start to the season and he was out straight away. Many other managers have got teams in to the Premiership unexpectedly, then been sacked by Christmas the next season.

Thats not applicable, I know what happened there and it wasnt to do with football matters. Something else went on that cant be written here.

There would have to be an insane number of southern based teams at that level for Farnborough to compete in the Conf North

lol, as i said i couldnt remember

Thats not applicable, I know what happened there and it wasnt to do with football matters. Something else went on that cant be written here.

Maybe something else went on in your game that your board weren't allowed to tell you?

lol, as i said i couldnt remember

Ha, although in one of my saves Wealdstone are in the Conf North so not completely out of the question.

Pretty much who I was coming in to say about. Unfortunately it's the nature of the beast - do well, people will only expect more. Look at Darren Ferguson at Peterborough - overachieved to the point they sacked (although it was 'mutual consent') him for it.

Philly_flyer has already said he's ignoring that as there's supposedly some other reason. I've never heard of another situation with Ferguson at Peterboro. Frankly it's realistic, if you don't like having a downside to overachievement followed by underachievement, I suggest playing an easier game.