Never known the sheer magnitude of this problem until now, i miss you!

Hi all,

Arrows! At first i didn't think i missed them that much, and thought they had accustomed for the stripping of arrows somehwere else in the game. But then came, along with getting older, an understanding for the game, and then my passion for 'total football', and therefore, barcelona in recent times. With this i wanted to recreate their tactic in FM, to cut a long story short, part of the formation is to have xavi LCM, and Buesquets RDM, so he moves alonnside xavi when attacking, as in real life, BUT, and here comes the anger, and dissapointment for no arrows, as IRL busquets (or anyone who plays as the holder) moves into CD, mainly when valdes has the ball, but when they have it in defence aswell, he does this because the two CB's spread wide, about 3/4 quarters into the FB positions. BUT NO, i can't do this! Because i can't have an arrow moving busquets from RDM/CDM, into CB with an arrow, COS THERE AREN'T ANY! Really annoying and dissapointing cos it prevents me from doing what i want and creating the 'perfect' tactic, they can have these as well as player roles etc! What do you think of the lack of arrows? I think a developed version of the fifa aroows on 'attack' and 'defence' would be excellent.

I agree with you 100%

I really miss the arrows and think the game would be better with them

I believe that the actual game mechanics are unchanged; player roles or the (oft maligned) sliders control the same thing, there just isn't a graphical representation on the tactics page. Check TTF '10 though, because I'm no expert.

I do agree as well, could be looked at soon.

Classic tactics?

the arrows are not missing. they are there. you decide to use them or not....

Hi all,

Arrows! At first i didn't think i missed them that much, and thought they had accustomed for the stripping of arrows somehwere else in the game. But then came, along with getting older, an understanding for the game, and then my passion for 'total football', and therefore, barcelona in recent times. With this i wanted to recreate their tactic in FM, to cut a long story short, part of the formation is to have xavi LCM, and Buesquets RDM, so he moves alonnside xavi when attacking, as in real life, BUT, and here comes the anger, and dissapointment for no arrows, as IRL busquets (or anyone who plays as the holder) moves into CD, mainly when valdes has the ball, but when they have it in defence aswell, he does this because the two CB's spread wide, about 3/4 quarters into the FB positions. BUT NO, i can't do this! Because i can't have an arrow moving busquets from RDM/CDM, into CB with an arrow, COS THERE AREN'T ANY! Really annoying and dissapointing cos it prevents me from doing what i want and creating the 'perfect' tactic, they can have these as well as player roles etc! What do you think of the lack of arrows? I think a developed version of the fifa aroows on 'attack' and 'defence' would be excellent.

Are you talking about the arrows from FM 08 and earlier?

Like these ones?

Or are you talking about the arrows that represent runs from deep in FM 09 and FM 10?

Arrows, as known in the old version of the game, were removed. They caused to much conflict in the game when also coupled with 'FWR'. Basically they were the fundamental downfall that led to so many Diabalo tactics.

They have been replaced with the following:

Run from Deep:

Rare: Back Arrow

Mixed: No Arrow

Often: Forward Arrow

If you want lateral movement then you need to look at 'roam from position'.

To my knowledge the game mechanics were unchanged, however, the old use of the arrows were removed.

ok, let me say it once more! the arrows are NOT missing from fm10! aderow's pic is from an older version but they wxist in fm10 too! why to say things that are incorrect?

Yes but if you then go to classic tactics you don't have all the new things, i want the new and the arrows. As for Iam, thanks but surely runs from position rare just mean stay where u r, and diagonal etc isn't FULLY covered by roam from position etc. I know what u mean but it still isn't perfect enough, it should be EASY for me to say tight, yaya toure i want you, when we have the ball in defence to go and cover at CB, and i want pique & puyol to split 3/4 into FB posiitons, yet i can't! Even fifa can do that!

If you choose the new settings then you can exploit the arrows without them being actually there. For example a full back with an arrow one position forth is now a full back with attacking attitude. you can't have both. simply because it is pretty much the same

The arrows helped make tactics which exploited the match engine, which is why they were removed.

How do you go sideways then, or diagonal?

for example any winger with the "inside forward" setting, goes towards the center

how do you get your b's to go sideway, and your cdm to go diagonally backwards

But you didn't get it. You cannot do the same things but you can have the same results by changing your setting a little. Even in real life the DB stay in the center, they don't roam left and right

but busquets moves into the CB position, & the 2 CB's spread, so how do i emulate that in the game?

The arrows helped make tactics which exploited the match engine, which is why they were removed.

I think they should remove corners as well, as there is a way to exploit it so you can score way more often than normal

I think they should remove corners as well, as there is a way to exploit it so you can score way more often than normal

Might as well get rid of the Editor too. You don't want anyone giving themselves an advantage at the start

Might as well get rid of the Editor too. You don't want anyone giving themselves an advantage at the start

Ah yeah. That shouldn't definitely be left out

I'll stop with that. Don't want the thread to go waaaaaaay off topic

but busquets moves into the CB position, & the 2 CB's spread, so how do i emulate that in the game?

An Attacking Libero comes quite close...

ehats that ?

ehats that ?

A libero is a free player who sits either just in front of your backs or just behind. An attacking one would play a la Beckenbauer, i.e. he will initiate the attacks, and will often look to get forward into the midfield (an Attacking Libero). The other kind is the classical catenaccio libero who sits behind the defense and kicks everything that moves (if it's not moving he just kicks it until it does).

I wouldn't say that playing with a Libero comes close. I've just experimented a bit and the best i can get is for the DC's to occasionally come to the level of the DM, but they barely at all move wide. In real life they would move into the space left by the wing-backs, which doesn't happen despite the fact they have Roam From Position. I did try giving them Move Into Channels which helped ever so slightly.

There is a clear issue if something like this isn't achievable. If anyone has managed to get their DC's moving laterally then by all means enlighten us. I think there is still an issue with movement but that SI felt this way was preferable, if not ideal, to people being able to make diablo tactics with the previous system of arrows.

110% AGREE. imean, even of f*****ng fifa ffs i got the shape absolutely perfect, n FM shuld be 100 times more in dpeth and better than them

While I understand the point of removing the arrows as it can be counter-intuitive (does mentality 20 make sense for a striker with one big long backwards arrow to sweeper?), I do miss sideways arrows. For example, a 4-3-1-2 with two sideways arrows on the wide central midfielders makes more tactical sense for teams like Milan where Gattuso and Ambrosini can spend quite a bit of time on the flanks but as much as a pure winger.

Being able to set width per player is probably a better system of course.

I think this is a very legit debate and hopefully SI will work on the issue, evaluate ups and downs. For casual players these may not matter but for hardcore fans who wants to challenge everything, this sound familiar? , they will be happy to have more depth and options.

Yes but if you then go to classic tactics you don't have all the new things, i want the new and the arrows. As for Iam, thanks but surely runs from position rare just mean stay where u r, and diagonal etc isn't FULLY covered by roam from position etc. I know what u mean but it still isn't perfect enough, it should be EASY for me to say tight, yaya toure i want you, when we have the ball in defence to go and cover at CB, and i want pique & puyol to split 3/4 into FB posiitons, yet i can't! Even fifa can do that!

Classic tactics include the new stuff as well.

The new tactics wizard just allows you to make multiple corresponding settings which make sense more easily and at once. The core beneath hasn't changed at all. The arrows are shown in classic tactics but what they do is there with the wizard as well.

So nothing has changed, but for the graphical representation as long as you use the wizard.

If people fail to recreate the way Barcelona are playing then this might be a limitation of the ME, but that's another story. You might try the clubs forum and see if there is a solution available in the Barcelona thread

The main problem is side arrows, that is just laughable that you cant even get side arrows! I mean, i have even recreated the bacra shape perfectly on fifa ffs!

Agreed. Lateral movement has been difficult, but FM10 has already seen a remarkable improvement on FM09 in that respect.

Check the wide play options in the tactics instructions

Might start a new thread to get a reaction from SI, as i might just be missing something or see if they are looking into it