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fujitsu
07-04-2010, 11:34
Hi everyone!

I wanted to consult the members of the forum about an ethical dilemma that I have:
I have just achieved promotion to the Premiership and as I consider that I needed reinforcements in almost every area I made a total of 15 transfers in. Only 4 of them included a transfer fee and all the others were free transfers. It was a continuous process and i didn't buy all those players at once but during the whole period starting from March (end of contract) till the closure of the first transfer window in August. Of course, as I was buying I was selling as well to come to a situation that I needed to sell two of my new recruits (free transfers) as I found better players at their positions. I received some healthy 2.5 millions for them (though their price was twice that amount).

Now, i was wondering if that is considered cheating as when I thought about it, it doesn't happen in real life, at least I cannot think of any similar exemples. So my questions are the following:
1. Do you consider the total amount of 15 transfers in unrealistic?
2. Do you consider the practice to sell new free recruits for a transfer fee during the same transfer window? (in my case they spent the pre-season with me but later I found better options)
Thanks

The Chosen One
07-04-2010, 11:39
1. No
2. No

but that's just me.

petey_g
07-04-2010, 11:42
Wouldn't say so. They are all things clubs COULD do if they wanted.

Vangelis21
07-04-2010, 11:42
I have heard this same thing more than 5 times in the running week...!
Why do you think it is cheating? I will give you my opinion and I hope you understand some things about football and video games!

1) Cheating is doing something that takes advantage and exploits the game with ways that were not included in the original version of it. This definition varies among people but after a reserach in the forums i find that this one is te most shared one.
2) Transfers is one of the most vital aspects of football. In real life many times teams buy players (with any fee) and as soon as they see that they are not suitable for their team, they sell them to someone else. See it this way. You have the opportunity to buy a care with 3k and sell it for 10k. Wouldn't you do it? Would it be cheating? ;)

I hope i helped!

robertcornell68
07-04-2010, 11:54
This is the first thread I've ever seen when the answer to "is this cheating?" is "no."

Congratulations.

scoot4nat
07-04-2010, 11:54
I have heard this same thing more than 5 times in the running week...!
Why do you think it is cheating? I will give you my opinion and I hope you understand some things about football and video games!

1) Cheating is doing something that takes advantage and exploits the game with ways that were not included in the original version of it. This definition varies among people but after a reserach in the forums i find that this one is te most shared one.
2) Transfers is one of the most vital aspects of football. In real life many times teams buy players (with any fee) and as soon as they see that they are not suitable for their team, they sell them to someone else. See it this way. You have the opportunity to buy a care with 3k and sell it for 10k. Wouldn't you do it? Would it be cheating? ;)

I hope i helped!

Didn't Dietmar Hamman move from Bolton to Man City in the same window a few years ago?

15 players would be unrealistic for an established team but having just won promotion I don't think it's that unlikely. Maybe 10 would be more indicative of teams coming into the Premiership.

tak
07-04-2010, 11:58
I think it is cheating. Let's face it, you never buy and sell players instantly.

Vangelis21
07-04-2010, 12:13
We all do! and if you don't then you obvisouly don't know how to run a club. In my country this has happened thousands of times. At least once a year

lutontown1991
07-04-2010, 12:18
This is the first thread I've ever seen when the answer to "is this cheating?" is "no."

Congratulations.

Exactly :thup:

Just sounds like good business to me mate. Good luck in the prem

Eugene Tyson
07-04-2010, 12:23
Eh Newcastle have been promissed 15m to bring in players for the premiership campaign, with the possibility of more.

You can bet your bottoms dollar there will be a clear out and new faces at newcastle. Maybe not 15, but a good few.

Nothing wrong with rejuvenating your squad. I sold 5 players in the summer for 120m, that's not cheating, they were good players that had no future playing under me, so I sold them when they were hot.

Same as buying in players, buy them if you can afford them and they help you win. Nothing wrong with that.

cmd1989
07-04-2010, 12:25
I wouldn't say either cases is "cheating", just getting the most out of free transfers (I bet a lot of lower league clubs do this when they gain promotion). To be honest if you need to bolster your squad but don't have much money to spend, then it is the only thing you can do.

As for the selling part, I signed Milevskyi for Arsenal in my 3rd season (10.2 database) and planned on making a tidy profit (his value was 7.5m!) but I decided not to as he fit into my team very well and ended up outscoring a woeful Dzeko who cost me 22m in the first season and is on around 25k a week compared to 89k a week. Milevskyi also went onto become the PL signing of the season.

My advise is, if you can easily afford the wages, keep them on board just incase you have any major injuries/suspensions. You never know, they might just grab you a few important goals.

Graham FM
07-04-2010, 12:36
no problem with what you did so no its not cheating

dafuge
07-04-2010, 12:41
I don't think this is cheating, especially since the players were originally signed with the intention of playing them rather than for making a profit.

If, however, you were purposefully exploiting the fact that you can sign players on frees and immediately selling them for profit, then I think that would be a bit dodgy.

SCIAG
07-04-2010, 12:42
No, there will be an in game punishment for signing so many players (lack of gelling/harmony) so it can't be cheating.

Syze
07-04-2010, 12:43
In summer 2006 Leeds singed David Livermore from Millwall and a few weeks later when they signed Kevin Nicholls from Luton they sold Livermore to Hull. This was all done during pre-season.

Ty
07-04-2010, 12:45
Never seen such a clear case of cheating in all my life :rolleyes:

But seriously, it's not cheating. You can now play your game with a clear concience. :thup:

Ty
07-04-2010, 12:46
Oh, and didn't we sign David Nugent, and then Harry instatly wanted to sell him to afford someone else? I am sure that was the case, typical Harry.

FrazT
07-04-2010, 12:55
1. No but it is unusual
2. No

fujitsu
07-04-2010, 12:56
well, thanks a lot to all of you for your opinions.


I don't think this is cheating, especially since the players were originally signed with the intention of playing them rather than for making a profit.


Indeed that was the reason why I decided to go ahead with this transfer policy. I really signed them with the intention of playing them and I played them during the whole pre-season... also i would have kept them in my squad but i have such limited funds for transfers and wages (overall 150 000 pounds/week for the whole team and a max for key player is 18 000 pounds/week) that i couldn't afford it.

thejambo
07-04-2010, 13:11
ever so slightly off topic, but here goes.

When you first gain promotion, the status of the club has not yet been upgraded, and as such the players you can sign still see you as a championship club. Never mind the garunteed promotion. So at this stage, you (as do many others) sign the best standrad of players that are willing to come to you.

As the season ends and new one begins,...season summary, new fixture list etc... the status of the club is upgraded to a premiership club. Now lots of players that were not willing to come to you, and as of yet are undecided on there future will now happily sign for you...as a premisership club!!

its something i would love to see fixed. Even if your still actually in te division below, it should recognise that promotion has been achieved and they will be playing in the league above the coming year.

Back to topic,,,

for that reason it is a slight flaw in the game and is not cheating! IMO

dafuge
07-04-2010, 13:14
That's a very good point actually and it the reason why I always wait for the new season to start before signing new players.

On the other hand, if you ever get relegated from the top flight you can arrange a few transfers before the new season starts to take advantage of it.

fujitsu
07-04-2010, 13:24
Indeed that's a very good point thejambo!
It is true that when I signed these players I was not even sure if I'm gonna make it to the premiership. I was hoping for a playoff spot at the best but even to my own surprise I managed to secure automatic promotion. And then suddenly when I gained promotion and the new seasons began some really good players became interested to join in.

thejambo
07-04-2010, 13:28
That's a very good point actually and it the reason why I always wait for the new season to start before signing new players.

On the other hand, if you ever get relegated from the top flight you can arrange a few transfers before the new season starts to take advantage of it..

Yeah i try to just praise the players that im interested in, untill the turnaround comes, then put the bids in.

Being able to grab a few higher level players before going down is the up side of the small glitch!!

i suppose it bothers me so much coz im gettin promoted more often than relegated!! :)

pandemonium
07-04-2010, 15:09
Iirc Milan bought vieira as a youngster and they sold him right away to Arsenal, so no, it's not cheating

llama3
07-04-2010, 16:42
No & No, totally legitimate actions

RHankin
07-04-2010, 16:51
Roy Keane signed around this number of players at the transfer window for sunderland - most went straight into the reserves or out on loan (many from celtic as i recall)
There are incidents where players are bought and sold within very short time frames - David Unsworth Signed for Villa from West Ham and then went to Everton within a week! Per Kroldrup was signed by David Moyes who sold him to Fiorentina (I think) after only about half a match

RHankin
07-04-2010, 16:52
Don't forget Man Utd bought Jon Obi Mikel for a very small fee and sold him to Chelsea for 10m before he even left his Norwegian club!

dafuge
07-04-2010, 17:05
Iirc Milan bought vieira as a youngster and they sold him right away to Arsenal, so no, it's not cheating

Although he barely featured in the first team he was there for over a year.

SCIAG
07-04-2010, 17:31
Per Kroldrup was signed by David Moyes who sold him to Fiorentina (I think) after only about half a match
Half a match is misleading though, he was at the club for ages.

Don't forget Man Utd bought Jon Obi Mikel for a very small fee and sold him to Chelsea for 10m before he even left his Norwegian club!
Also misleading. When Chelsea tried to sign Mikel, Man Utd produced a contract Mikel had allegedly signed with them, and Chelsea had to compensate them for it.

reflection22
07-04-2010, 17:44
I thought this had been fixed now though? Seems that way to me anyway. A few days after being promoted to the Premiership with Doncaster on 10.3, I had a massive load of bigger-name players become interested in joining me, including frees, who would never go to a Championship club, so the game must have recognized where I would be playing in the following season. I tied up the likes of Burdisso, Blasi, and Zaki on frees just a few days after my promotion was confirmed. None of these players were interested in me before that.


ever so slightly off topic, but here goes.

When you first gain promotion, the status of the club has not yet been upgraded, and as such the players you can sign still see you as a championship club. Never mind the garunteed promotion. So at this stage, you (as do many others) sign the best standrad of players that are willing to come to you.

As the season ends and new one begins,...season summary, new fixture list etc... the status of the club is upgraded to a premiership club. Now lots of players that were not willing to come to you, and as of yet are undecided on there future will now happily sign for you...as a premisership club!!

its something i would love to see fixed. Even if your still actually in te division below, it should recognise that promotion has been achieved and they will be playing in the league above the coming year.

Back to topic,,,

for that reason it is a slight flaw in the game and is not cheating! IMO

deltablue
07-04-2010, 19:02
It's fine if you don't take it too far and get a load of players on free's just get saleable assets, but there's nothing wrong in trying to rectify a mistake. I remember a time when I arrived at a brazilian 3rd div club (for the 1st time) back on 05 an didn't know what the general standard was, so I ended up buying most of a squad, then found out I could get players that were much better so bought some of those and even got rid of a some players I'd bought a few weeks earlier to make room.

phd_angel
07-04-2010, 19:04
Totally ethical and realistic. Dramatic times require dramatic measures!