Has the progress of Football Manager 2010 been impeded by FML?

This is not a rant, but a serious concern. I think it's noticeable that the so-called "polish" applied to this years game has been inconsistent, and as we're nearly in March the only reason I can think of that there's no January update yet is because all effort is being diverted to fixing the broken mess of a game that is Football Manager Live. It's a real shame and disappointing for those who just want to play the normal game.

I hope someone can reply amicably to this post, unlike in the football manager live forums where my posts about FML were inexplicably deleted.

It's not been hampered at all as they have different teams working on both games.

I think this years ME is from FML.

I believe its a different team working on both versions so it shouldnt really affect however I have noticed that a lot of features in the standard FM seem to be taken from FML. This may sound good except that those playing FML do not constitute your average player since you need to subscribe to play FML, iow pay for the priviledge and I dont see that many ppl doing much of that.

As I understand it from what has been posted in the forums:

A) FML & FM are different games with different staff working on each.

B) The ME is shared to a certain extent and FML allows SI the ability to test/improve it much more regularly than if just FM existed.

There's only two components of the games that have dual development, being the ME and the tactics creator. Both of which have improved dramatically because of the extra feedback this generates.

Everything else has separate teams. No development time is lost on FM because of FML.

I'm aware they have different teams working on both games BUT I find it hard to believe they just hired a completely new bunch of identical developers to make that game.

when you look at it the development of the single player game has been inexplicably lacking lately, and I can't see any other explanation

The FML dev team have all been recruited exclusively to work on FML, none are poached from FM or work on both projects, Paul C isn't even an exception really because there's only one ME.

In fact the FM team and testing team have been greatly expanded in the past couple of years so your assumptions are doubly innaccurate.

I'm aware they have different teams working on both games BUT I find it hard to believe they just hired a completely new bunch of identical developers to make that game.

when you look at it the development of the single player game has been inexplicably lacking lately, and I can't see any other explanation

how has it been lacking? As far as i'm aware the January update has always come out around the end of February or the start of March. Fm 10 is greatly improved from fm 09. It sounds to me like someone has grown impatient waiting for the new patch.

I believe not. Fm is a great game much better than 09

how has it been lacking? As far as i'm aware the January update has always come out around the end of February or the start of March. Fm 10 is greatly improved from fm 09. It sounds to me like someone has grown impatient waiting for the new patch.

I believe it was released on valentine's day last year. This year we're probably looking at a valentine's day 2011 release

I believe it was released on valentine's day last year. This year we're probably looking at a valentine's day 2011 release

SI have always said February/March, today is the 24th February.

Would you rather they released it on 14th February unfinished or when it was ready

I think this years ME is from FML.

that says it all

There's only two components of the games that have dual development, being the ME and the tactics creator. Both of which have improved dramatically because of the extra feedback this generates.

Everything else has separate teams. No development time is lost on FM because of FML.

Don't get too upset what i'm going to say next.

Your reply feels like a political right answer. It is pretty much what politicians use to minimize the panic if anything is wrong. It is political right answer and I'm sorry if I offended you any others...

Oh snap... I remember something, its two games, FML and FM and the people that work SI (i'm guessing that is little under hundred) is divided for yearly installment? I thinking that is so little number of people for a game that is so complexed, even if FM has lot more personnel then FML.

To be honest I think that FM made developments and introduce stuff From FM05 to FM07 that was consistent when The baseball and Hockey games where also being released. After ditching this games and a lot of people was disappointed by it, things for me began to see features that where released without functioning what was suppose to be like Board Confidence in FM08 or the Press Conferences in FM09 and FM10.

To be honest don't know if reducing the number of games was good thing or not. The only thing I know - and can be pure coincidence - is that when SI ditched those games and focussed on FM and FML, i feel that things have been a bit out of hand.

Your reply feels like a political right answer. It is pretty much what politicians use to minimize the panic if anything is wrong. It is political right answer and I'm sorry if I offended you any others...

It can't be political as politics and the truth have very little in common. There are two separate teams. Full stop.

A couple of projects relating to tactics/ME overlap the two games. Nothing else does bar some interesting idea swapping.

It can't be political as politics and the truth have very little in common. There are two separate teams. Full stop.

A couple of projects relating to tactics/ME overlap the two games. Nothing else does bar some interesting idea swapping.

I only said it feels like a political right answer. I did not say I didn't believe you.

I say its just a lack of competition in this specific genre. FM10 has way too many clear cut bugs (superkeepers, clear cut goals, HORRID transfer market [big clubs bidding for **** players]) etc.

I believe it was released on valentine's day last year. This year we're probably looking at a valentine's day 2011 release

I can't count the number of times SI have said it will be released at the end of February/start of March. If we get halfway through March and there is no patch feel free to rant then. The fact that the third patch is released a little later this year means nothing, there might just be a lot of data that needs changing and if you can't wait a few more weeks i guess i should point out that many games never have patches released despite obvious issues. So count yourself lucky SI would even bother to help you.

Last year, we are lucky to get the patch on valentine's day; it sure surprised everyone. However, the time frame for the 3rd patch did not change and has not passed. SI has not broken promise regarding patch.

Sure, we all want to get the patch ASAP. Truthfully, i feel 9.3 is great, but could be better had they work on it for extra 2 weeks and relaese it at the end of feb. I recall, last year SI did get criticised by some fraction of people for not taking that 2 weeks.

No, like everybody said it's different teams anyway. Would be interesting to see FML sales compared to FM though, I tried FML and it just was not for me, I can't see why anybody would pay for it monthly subscription.

why should we need to wait half the year for the game to work properly? si have had nearly 6 month to fix the game. not a rant i'm just saying lol

Game works fine in my opinion, only thing that annoys me is the one v one situations (had arshavin miss 9 one v ones against bolton course it means opposing teams dont score as many either)

the 1 v1 isnt reall affecting me all that much as the bug only comes from certain types of 1 v 1 apparently, but ive played the game from lauch with no problems, and i know alot of people who are the same, but im also not denying that there are alot of people with problems, but the minority of people with issues shout loudest like normal.

So all in all id say no FML hasnt happered the progress of FM10

why should we need to wait half the year for the game to work properly? si have had nearly 6 month to fix the game. not a rant i'm just saying lol

Because it's a very complex game with a lot of different scenarios and possibilities that could happen in the game.

The game is complex and there is no denying that, What I'm saying if the complexity of the game is little too much for such team that is devided into two games, making the team working on FM a small one.

The game is complex and there is no denying that, What I'm saying if the complexity of the game is little too much for such team that is devided into two games, making the team working on FM a small one.

It doesn't work like that.

If FML didn't exist it wouldn't mean more people working on FM it would simply mean less people working at SI

The FM team has actually expanded since FML came around. Nobody working on FML was previously a member of the FM team either.

That sounds good thing, but still question that if the size of your team is enough to handle so much stuff that the game has. Personally the bugs we saw and features not working as suppose too, makes me wonder if the Fm team is overwhelmed and thus end product suffers from it.

That sounds good thing, but still question that if the size of your team is enough to handle so much stuff that the game has. Personally the bugs we saw and features not working as suppose too, makes me wonder if the Fm team is overwhelmed and thus end product suffers from it.

But that's nothing to do with FML. I'm sure if SI thought they would benefit from having more people and if they could afford it then they would employ more people, but they're the experts and they're doing a very good job of it so far.

But that's nothing to do with FML. I'm sure if SI thought they would benefit from having more people and if they could afford it then they would employ more people, but they're the experts and they're doing a very good job of it so far.

Did I mentioned FML in my Quote? I was talking of FM and FM alone. What I'm saying I think for a game this complex and with year release, the team working on FM is way small.

I'm just saying this from what I see from each release since FM08.

Personally FM has left to wow me since FM08. But I have to say pretty much they did an excellent job for FM07.

Did I mentioned FML in my Quote? I was talking of FM and FM alone. What I'm saying I think for a game this complex and with year release, the team working on FM is way small.

I'm just saying this from what I see from each release since FM08.

Personally FM has left to wow me since FM08. But I have to say pretty much they did an excellent job for FM07.

It may not be possible or productive to enlarge the team by much if anything, each branch of the tree is generally the preserve of one person because you usually can't have two people working on the same piece of software.

My my, so many experts in software development on this forum. Why don't you all team up and make your own Football Manager game!

My my, so many experts in software development on this forum. Why don't you all team up and make your own Football Manager game!

There are those who have, which I believe is why we're all here:)

It may not be possible or productive to enlarge the team by much if anything, each branch of the tree is generally the preserve of one person because you usually can't have two people working on the same piece of software.

So diminish the complexity of the game and the number of new features until the ones that are in game are fixed and working as it should.

My my, so many experts in software development on this forum. Why don't you all team up and make your own Football Manager game!

... :confused: