I know what can take FM to the next level

No - not cute gimmicks like 3D match engine or press conferences.. the real meat behind the game which makes everyone loves it is the comprehnsive database

So my suggestion is to take that to the next level - my innovations include a list of 100-150 stats rather than the current 20-30, which allow players to be defined more fully - as well as taking things like height and weight into consideration

It would take a long time I'm sure + make it harder to keep on top of, but i think the majority of FM users would rather see SI invest their time in something like this than the last few years of gimmick features which people don't use (no offence, just tellin it like it is)

My 2nd enlightenment is to have the bulk of these stats "hidden" from the player - and at most have a graphical representation like the current one, as not to keep the player totally clueless on players

The Final Solution for all this is to have much more fluctuation in players stats, performances etc. and this would allow SI to work on introducing a better training system - like for example if you're Liverpool manager and want Lucas to be able to curl a ball, you have part of his training each week involve curling a ball.. stats like determination, workrate, discipline, natural talent etc. could determine how well he coudl adapt to new training situations - which also opens up the possibility of players dropping stats because theyre focusing on other things, as well as being able to fully train players in completely new positions more realistically, which would take into account attributes like "versatility". For the casual user, the boredom this could cause could be countered by having "presets" for certain positions

thoughts? :o

Would suit some hardcore players, but personally i'm happy with the stats system as it is. Last point about training sounds good though.

100-150 stats is waaaaaay too much. What are you going to add? I could think of about 8 things tops I'd like to see added. And it would take a lot of calculation for the ME.

Some people around here on the forums may like it, but what about the casual gamer? I think a regrouping of the stats may be better. Composure, finishing etc. should all be together. And height is already (indirectly through jumping and directly a little bit also as well too) present in the ME. Not sure about weight.

Training in general needs an overhaul and I like the way you're thinking there.

height isn't in the match engine which is one of my main problems - look at Tim Cahill.. he has jumping 17 or something - then look down the lower leagues, even at tall players - just because they have low CA they have lower jumping or strength than they should

TBH I think it'd be good to have away with the CA + PA levels entirely which are far too limiting and just have about 100 stats that represent players that can fluctuate depending on training, natural talent and things like that

height isn't in the match engine which is one of my main problems - look at Tim Cahill.. he has jumping 17 or something - then look down the lower leagues, even at tall players - just because they have low CA they have lower jumping or strength than they should

TBH I think it'd be good to have away with the CA + PA levels entirely which are far too limiting and just have about 100 stats that represent players that can fluctuate depending on training, natural talent and things like that

= PA

I don't see what's wrong with the attributes as they are now. What would you propose the extra 60 or so to be?

The Final Solution for all this is to have much more fluctuation in players stats, performances etc. and this would allow SI to work on introducing a better training system - like for example if you're Liverpool manager and want Lucas to be able to curl a ball, you have part of his training each week involve curling a ball.. stats like determination, workrate, discipline, natural talent etc. could determine how well he coudl adapt to new training situations - which also opens up the possibility of players dropping stats because theyre focusing on other things, as well as being able to fully train players in completely new positions more realistically, which would take into account attributes like "versatility". For the casual user, the boredom this could cause could be countered by having "presets" for certain positions

thoughts? :o

at bolded

with the point about training, i would think that this is already in the game (to a lesser extent at least)

if your going to adjust the attributes it MUST be to an allround number like 100 or if you want to double the current one to 40 i think this could be a good thing for us more detailed gamers, but then when there tackling heading marking concentration positoning is all 100 and they still make BLATENT errors week in week out what do we blame then? match engine?

There are quite a lot of things that could imrpove the game.

Agents I would like to see them in the game, offering players, pestering you about them, even sending video clips. Arsene Wenger often talks about his phone constantly on the go with agents trying to sell him so called great players, but in FM theres a total lack of this. I play as Arsenal and the only players i get offered are from the Championship......and im sure Arsene Wenger gets offered better players than that.

Transfer Negotiations I want to sit down with the player, kind of interview him before I decide if I go through with the deal. It could be done using the same kind of code as talking to the press with mulitple options, only you get to select questions too. I'm sure both players and managers have questions for eachother before they agree to a deal. Example being that i struggle to sign a back up keeper thats willing to be just that, even though they ask for a contract based on being a back up player.......this could be handled better if you could have the option to tell the player that he would only be cover for X player before he signed.

Agents where in previous versions of the game - they were terrible and generic. Yes, you got sent video clips etc. but they meant nothing to nobody.

You already have an indication of the players personality on his profile screen - negotiations would once again be generic and become tiresome within minutes like the god-awful press conferences.

Soo many stats..would take too long to judge and complicate the game even further. Some hardcore FM users might enjoy it, but the average user might be scared off. What stats would you add? Turning ability, bone brittleness, mental toughness, focus, intelligence, shot placement? There's already enough hidden from us, why add more?

To me ... more stats = more bugs. Lol

I stopped reading after i saw "100 150 stats..."

thoughts? :o

It seems to me that many of the supposed innovations you're suggesting are, in fact, already simulated in the game as it is.

- FM already has something like 70 displayed and hidden player attributes (there were already nearly 50 a decade ago, so this is not new). There are very few additional attributes which could refine the engine further, so why do we need dozens more? Please list the 80 new attributes that you'd like to see added.

- Players' attributes already affect how effectively they train.

- Focusing on particular areas of training already impacts a player's ability to train in other areas - case in point, positional retraining.

- There is already a versatility attribute.

- Natural talent is already explicitly there through the CA/PA system (combined with factors like determination which determine their ability to meet their potential).

Am I missing something, or is the OP greatly underestimating the complexity of the game engine?

Trying to level out the match engine is hard enough with the current stats set up. Just imagine how hard it would be if you treble the amount of stats you have in the game!

100-150 attributes is a nonsense idea

Although I fully agree with the training needing changed. I started a thread about it a while back. REMOVE THE SLIDERS!

height isn't in the match engine which is one of my main problems - look at Tim Cahill.. he has jumping 17 or something - then look down the lower leagues, even at tall players - just because they have low CA they have lower jumping or strength than they should

Yes it is.

Jumping as an attribute is how high the player can get his head off the ground, height is taken into consideration as part of this.

Height is also included in the ME calculations when the player decides if he has to jump or not to reach a ball in the air.

The only stat I'd like to see added to the game is "Vision", as in, a player's ability to pick out a good pass.

But I wouldn't be surprised if another stat (or combination of stats) already accounts for this.

I would agree with above, though. 150 is waaaaaaaaaay too much.

100-150 attributes is a nonsense idea

Although I fully agree with the training needing changed. I started a thread about it a while back. REMOVE THE SLIDERS!

For the people demanding training be overhauled, I've yet to see a single decent, practical solution to how to do it. Especially if you want one that doesn't have sliders. I skimmed through your thread, and again there's a few decent ideas, but they're either just tweaks to the existing system, or big ideas with no practical suggestions for implementing them (system/formation training being the obvious case here).

100-150 attributes is a nonsense idea

Although I fully agree with the training needing changed. I started a thread about it a while back. REMOVE THE SLIDERS!

Agreed on this

So suggest a better way of doing training that doesn't have sliders then...

The only stat I'd like to see added to the game is "Vision", as in, a player's ability to pick out a good pass.

But I wouldn't be surprised if another stat (or combination of stats) already accounts for this.

This would probably be covered - in varying degrees of importance, mind you - by a combination of Passing, Creativity and Decisions, not to mention the PPMs Dwells on ball, Stops play, Tries long range passes, Plays short simple passes, Dictates tempo and even Likes to switch ball to other flank. That's not an exhaustive list, either; any number of attributes could subtly alter a player's ability to pass effectively and creatively. And I think that sort of interlocking complexity is ultimately better than leaving it all to a single attribute.

Agents where in previous versions of the game - they were terrible and generic. Yes, you got sent video clips etc. but they meant nothing to nobody.

You already have an indication of the players personality on his profile screen - negotiations would once again be generic and become tiresome within minutes like the god-awful press conferences.

I know this, but im sure SI could improve upon it and make it much better than it was previously.

So you are happy with sending a bid, getting a counter offer, sending a final offer and then simply selecting player role and offering the contract? and you go on about it could be tiresome and generic.....haha.

It is true that this suggestion would take FM to the next level. Just I don't think that's a level anyone bt very few hardcore nerds would like.

Impossible to research or use.

I know this, but im sure SI could improve upon it and make it much better than it was previously.

So you are happy with sending a bid, getting a counter offer, sending a final offer and then simply selecting player role and offering the contract? and you go on about it could be tiresome and generic.....haha.

I'm sure you'll change your tune if it were introduced. Every year we're promised better press conferences - yet they are by far and away the worst part of the game and should be binned completely. I'm fairly sure even SI will agree with that, given nobody at all likes press conferences.

The negotiation system, as it is, does the necessary job. If SI introduce agents again as a part of the negotiations, rather than the irritating occasional involvement... I shudder to think of how poor it'd be.

There's a reason it was dumped in the first place you know.

Id love to see a list of 100+ things that could be added. Off you go

i dont ever touch my training just leave it as it is..to compicated to me

Id love to see a list of 100+ things that could be added. Off you go

well take the "technique" stat for example, that could be broken down into about 10-20 stats right ther

well take the "technique" stat for example, that could be broken down into about 10-20 stats right ther

such as ?

I think training and press conferences should be improved.

well take the "technique" stat for example, that could be broken down into about 10-20 stats right ther

Please explain - list all of your proposed attributes. By the way, as I mentioned previously, you do realise that - apart from this arbitrary proposal for "100-150" new attributes - everything you mentioned is already in the game?

I'd like SI to get rid of attributes altogether and make it so that managers have to rely on scout/coach reports and actual performances, like in real life.

Hey, a man can dream, cant he?

I would love to see them too.

Shot Power

Shot Accuracy

Shot technique (inside/outside of boot & laces)

Short passing accuracy

Short passing power/speed

Long passing accuracy

Long passing power/speed

Crossing Accuracy

Crossing power/speed

crossing technique (straight, curling, drilled along floor, front post, back post)

Defensive heading

offensive heading

defensive discipline (keeping a good offside line)

heading accuracy

heading power

standing tackles

slide tackles

freekick accuracy

freekick power

freekick shooting technique (inside & outside of boot, laces, dying leaf, low and drilled, distance)

free kick crossing technique (inside & outside of boot, floated, drilled, distance)

man marking

zonal marking

Penalty accuracy

penatly power

Penalty run up (short, long, staggered)

Height (to actually have an affect)

weight (to have an effect in standing tackles)

throw in accuracy

throw in distance

throw in technique (flat/low, looped, fast)

Small game player (opposite to big game(can play well and be motivated for smaller teams))

away games (can play well away from home(i.e not robinho!))

tactical discipline

That's just off the top of my head. Not quite a hunger but it's a start

making each club and each league noticeably different from each other would be my number one choice for game development