Tactical changes are far too slow

Really frustrating when it costs you in 3 consecutive games, each time I've seen who the opposition are mainly building chances and opportunities with, so I decide to mix it up a bit and you know, tell my players to mark him up and whatnot. However, between this decision, and putting the right things in place, the 6 or 7 minutes between that player scores or sets up an assist. Of course, theres no guarantee my changes would have made any difference, but when it costs you because apparently the instructions you would have called your player over for nearly 10 minutes ago haven't set in yet it brings a whole new level of thick footballers to the fore.

It essentially feels like "yea yea, you want to make changes but you aren't interrupting this highlight scene, you will wait until its finished regardless of outcome... it doesn't matter that you want that player to drop back into defence to help out whilst you have a man off the pitch, he wont and when he can finally do it the player will be back on the pitch or replaced"

I have noticed this In one match it took almost 15 minutes to make a substitution, and sometime by the time the game has changed my tactic to defensive i have conceeded and then had to change it back again and it takes another 10-15 minutes to do.

This does need a serious look into in my opinion. I like most people have had similar issues. I especially hate when touchline instructions take 10-15mins to be actioned.

It's been fairly rare. In FM09 I only remember one situation when I tried to change my tactics to more defensive to protect my lead and conceded before tactic was actually changed by the game.

But it's just one game in 4-5 seasons, so it's not a big problem.

Also it's rather realistic. When you're a manager IRL and yelling sideline instructions to your players to change tactics.

What are the chances that they can't hear you properly?

What are the chances that they misunderstood your point?

What are the chances that players on your sie of the pitch will get your instructions instantly, but players on the other side won't hear you and it takes couple of minutes until players exchange information?

What are the chances that change in tactics will need couple of minutes to adapt and during these minutes your defence is more vulnerable?

So, of course in FM this delay is not intentional, but considering above points it seems to me quite realistic, that changing your whole tactics is not happening in a second.

yea i sort of agree it wont take a second but a touchline shout of retain possesion wouldnt take 25mins to get between 11 players as the other players will tell each other at least, and in that time the ball goes out of play numerous time's

another thing regarding this it wont take too long as you always see in games when a manager changes things around a player genrally comes to the touchline to get the instructions to spread to the rest of the team,

It wouldnt be so bad if the AI had the same problem .... but it doesn't

Ive paused, entered tactics, fiddled & confirmed, restarted play, whilst im waiting the AI

changes from 442 to 424 .. im still waiting

changes from 424 to 235 .. im still waiting

changes from 235 to 424 .. im still waiting

changes from 424 to 442 and equalises .. now my redundant changes are implemeted

AI scores the winning goal within 1 min of the restart

It's been fairly rare. In FM09 I only remember one situation when I tried to change my tactics to more defensive to protect my lead and conceded before tactic was actually changed by the game.

But it's just one game in 4-5 seasons, so it's not a big problem.

Also it's rather realistic. When you're a manager IRL and yelling sideline instructions to your players to change tactics.

What are the chances that they can't hear you properly?

What are the chances that they misunderstood your point?

What are the chances that players on your sie of the pitch will get your instructions instantly, but players on the other side won't hear you and it takes couple of minutes until players exchange information?

What are the chances that change in tactics will need couple of minutes to adapt and during these minutes your defence is more vulnerable?

So, of course in FM this delay is not intentional, but considering above points it seems to me quite realistic, that changing your whole tactics is not happening in a second.

I thought about this as well. Realistically a team cannot instantly change its tactics or make subs, but it also shouldn't take 10+ minutes for it to happen. Meanwhile the ball goes out of play but the official won't make you make any subs for that long?

The real issue, is that substitutions take an eternity too.

Stop the clock to make my 3 subs, and even though the clock often stops on a break in play incident e.g, keeper preparing for a goal kick, a throw in, free kick etc, the ME will NOT allow your subs until the next stop incident, which can be many minutes given the lack of throw ins in this game compared to CM4 for example

yea i get this far too often. it really does need looked at.

From what I have seen it changes as soon as the ball goes out of play however many minutes that may take.

I can understand that changes don't always get taken into account immediately, but very often you will see a manager call a player over and tell him to pass them on and within 30 seconds its implement. Especially when its something like assigning your DM to mark the creative midfielder they've just brought on, in a game against me Leon Osman has just scored 4 goals because he initially got moved to AMC after an injury to Cahill so I needed to get him marked up like I had Cahill.

1 - Osman scores before the changes are implemented - Everton change back to a 4-4-2 with no AMC, Osman goes out right.

2 - My DM is now still marking Osman way out of position, massive gap through the middle is being exploited I try to change it Osman scores again.

3 - Everton have a player sent off, they go with 2 DM's and 1 CM (Osman) in midfield, again I want to set a player to pick Osman up at all times, but before they are put into practice he charges through the middle and scores again.

4 - Osman goes wide right as Everton go defensive again, again DM is still tracking him out wide, ball is played through centre DM is lost somewhere and Osman slots in his 4th.

I don't mind having lost, its a game at the end of the season with a back up team which now has no bearing on the final positions. But, its annoying because "Diarra, mark Osman" shouldn't take 5 - 6 minutes to get to him, and by that time I wouldn't still be shouting it if Moyes has put him out wide.

It wouldnt be so bad if the AI had the same problem .... but it doesn't

Ive paused, entered tactics, fiddled & confirmed, restarted play, whilst im waiting the AI

changes from 442 to 424 .. im still waiting

changes from 424 to 235 .. im still waiting

changes from 235 to 424 .. im still waiting

changes from 424 to 442 and equalises .. now my redundant changes are implemeted

AI scores the winning goal within 1 min of the restart

And when those redundant changes are your final substitute entering the match....

I also know this frustration. I was up by 1 at arsenal so they brought on van persie. I went to the oi page to have him tightly marked etc. Well 2 mins after that, he scored as he wide open. 4 mins after that hit the post. 5 mins er so after that, my settings kicked in and van persie was utterly useless from that point on. Luckily I won the game 3-1.

I know that your players don't headsets so they won't instantly hear what you shout, but 10+ mins is absolutely unheard of.......at that point you would be just about ready to run on the pitch, mourinho-style, and give your players instructions.

Well its a bit over the top.

But havent you seen the managers scream like crazy to the referee in matches for REAL that "now we want to make the substitution!!".

But it could be tweaked down a bit agreed.

Tactical changes should be implemented immediately, to give you more control over what happens on the pitch. In this case realism is nothing more than a pain in the backside - it IS a game after all, even though many people seem to have forgotten that.

Once i had to wait about 8 mins for my subs to come on, really frustrating when you need a goal.

SI should revert to the old system- the game waits until it's ready to be changed, then pauses, and you can implement your changes instantly. None of the situation described in post #11. Also, if you forget to make part of your change, you can simply re-enter the screen. With the current system, you have to wait until there's another opputunity to make a change, which can be quite some time.

I've had similar things happen to me too, not all the time, but it is frustrating as hell when it happens, and yet the AI changes get made instantly.

This is one of my biggest problems with the game.

Its not a game killer though, as it doesnt always happen atleast.

What is odd is that there are often several pauses in the play, corners, throwins and such, and yet the sub or tactical change does not occur. Meanwhile, it seems to happen virtually instantly with the AI.

I believe the problem is to do with the fact of, what you are seeing on the screen is already in the past

Instructions should take direct effect at the next "calculation point"

Subs take effect at the next break of play

And then either lower how far ahead the match is calculated so these changes occur sooner... or set breakpoints, so if an instruction/sub is made anything after the breakpoint is dumped, and then recalculated with the new information

Also, allow us to change subs after we've decided to make them, but have yet to be brought on (especially useful if someone gets hurt just before bringing on sub #3)

Failing that, SCIAG's idea of how it used to be would work, didn't have to fix what wasn't broken after-all

I believe the problem is to do with the fact of, what you are seeing on the screen is already in the past

Instructions should take direct effect at the next "calculation point"

Subs take effect at the next break of play

And then either lower how far ahead the match is calculated so these changes occur sooner... or set breakpoints, so if an instruction/sub is made anything after the breakpoint is dumped, and then recalculated with the new information

It has to be calculated until the end of the half so highlights can be selected.

If it's already determined that a move is going to be a highlight, it will make the changes at the end of the highlight.

This does need a serious look into in my opinion. I like most people have had similar issues. I especially hate when touchline instructions take 10-15mins to be actioned.

I thought the whole point of touchline instructions was to give you fast and easy access to getting tactics across to your players? I've never used it so I can't comment on how long it takes to give instructions, but what you're basically saying is it's a pointless feature? 10-15 mins for the instructions to get across to your players eh, I'm no stephen hawking, bit I'm pretty sure sound is supposed to travel faster than that.

The touchline shouts allows you to implement changes to your tactics quicker and does not have any bearing on how quickly the ME allows those changes to take place on the pitch.

The ability to "cancel" changes is a must, to be honest, for this reason and others (i.e. players get injured between a tactical change and the actual change; you make a mistake in the change; etc.).