Tactics with/without ball feature

One of the small small gripes ive been having about fm in recent years is player positions. What i mean by this the colour a player gets to show how effective they are in a certain position. I know due to the evolution of european and world football recently the traditional position of CM has been expanded to DM and AM.

What im getting at is I remember the tactic line ups being broken down to with and without the ball. I think this is a feature that should be brought back because it is more prominent than ever in modern game!

For example man utd last year they mostly played 4-3-3 with the ball but when they lost the ball the left sided and right sided attacking wide players tucked in to create a 5 man midfield and I just think this should be implemented again....

Anybody else agree this would add depth to the tactics further and give you more control over how your team plays???

It was taken away because it restricted the match engine and independent player movement, just as the arrows did... resulting in the "super tactics"

So I hope it isn't brought back.

wasnt aware of that so i guess you make a fair point but surely there must be some way around this, not really talking about the arrows but literally having 2 screens for your with ball and without

wasnt aware of that so i guess you make a fair point but surely there must be some way around this, not really talking about the arrows but literally having 2 screens for your with ball and without

The positions on the tactic screen are "Without Ball"

The team & player instructions you give come into effect when your team has the ball but this isn't represented graphically other than the 3d/2d match engine.

again another fair point....but i still think this feature could be implemented better as one of my other points of how effective a player is in a certain position is represented by a shade of colour which is irritating...for example in my arsenal save i have miguel veloso who is a DM but I play him in CM because of the way my tactics are set up and because he isnt a "natural" CM my assistant doesnt put him in my team report and puts in ramsey instead.

What im trying to get at is I think the players position is too restricted to where he is placed on the tactics screen and i think that it jus needs a bit more depth such as the with/out ball option.

The new player role feature is a step in the right direction but with a bit more depth you could really dictate how your team plays and equip each individual player and their position with more instruction of how you want it to be played.....

I have to admit I agree on the player positioning point especially when you think that alot of players that have DMC position have actually played a fair bit of their career as what FMers know as CMd cause really what does actually matter where you are positioned on the FM screen your job and positioning on the pitch are probably going to be roughly the same. The same goes with AMC and CMa Gerrard for example has played alot of his career playing in a 4-4-2 formation until benitez anyway but he played very offensively. The same goes for players like Kranjcar and Cahill and several others who all have listings as an AMC in FM but have many times played in a 4-4-2 formation but with attacking responsibilities. So I agree with the original poster that player positions need to be more flexible these sort of players should be able to play in a CM role equally effectively as AMC as long as they are attacking ask them to be a holding midfield player on the other hand and fair enough they aren't going to do as well but then their stats should take care of that. Maybe a mentality setting rather than positionality. With the new defend, support, attack system give the player a rating at that instead so a player who has spent most if not all his career as an attacking midfielder give him 20/20 for attacking and a player who does alot of supporting give them 20 for that maybe with 10 for attack or something if they have done that well. This is just a clumsy example what I am trying to say is that where a player is played in a flexible role like midfield should be less important than the role they actually fullfill. Hell for me this could be just as easily and more simply taken care of with stats. If a player has great defensive stats but lousy attacking ones he is going to make a poor AMC and would do badly there if played there but if he is a midfielder he should be able to do a decent job positionally he won't have a great game though because what your asking him to do is beyond his capabilities isn't that really how it should be?

i would ignore your assistant manager, i always do - you know your team better than he does!

I always do but i was just using it as an example to back up my point! lol

The positions on the tactic screen are "Without Ball"

The team & player instructions you give come into effect when your team has the ball but this isn't represented graphically other than the 3d/2d match engine.

So i play Ronaldo and Messi as ML and MR but with max attacking mentality and runs from deep then they will play as Inside Forwards with the ball and as a classical midfielders in 4-5-1 without the ball?

Good to see others are thinking in the same way

i was a big fan of the feature that let you be very precise with instructions for the with and without ball. it added a great amount of detail to the tactical side whilst leaving it quite easy to build a good successful tactic. i certainly enjoying playing with this type of setting to get it prefected and i miss it today. i would love to see it returning. or perhaps even as an option that could be activated and deactivaed through the users choice?

i never understood the with/without ball feature if im honest with you. LIke... i understand the principal, but not how to get it to work.

So i play Ronaldo and Messi as ML and MR but with max attacking mentality and runs from deep then they will play as Inside Forwards with the ball and as a classical midfielders in 4-5-1 without the ball?

The simple answer is yes.

in which version of the game with this feature available ?

in which version of the game with this feature available ?

I think it was in early 2000's with championship manager before SI splilt with eidos, dont know if im 100% accurate though....

The simple answer is yes.

There isnt an option to play wide players across the middle as "inside forward".....

There isnt an option to play wide players across the middle as "inside forward".....

Yes there is. As long as they are in an AMC or AM R / L position, the inside forward option is definitely available

youve obviously missed my previous posts about player positions and effectiveness

I think it was in early 2000's with championship manager before SI splilt with eidos, dont know if im 100% accurate though....

Yes, this is correct; late 90's, early 00's, throughout the CM3 series.

I still play CM01/02 regularly and I enjoy nothing more than endless tinkering with the wib/wob screens, but i do feel the current system is more realistic. No manager in the world would ever give his players instructions where to stand every single moment of the match.

in which version of the game with this feature available ?

CM01/02 was the last version that had it.