Why are regens so poor 'off the ball'?

I have had 4 different games running for a few seasons or more now on FM10 and every single one has a shocking issue with some of the major stats on regen players.

Almost all regens, id say least 8 out of 10 are very poor off the ball, im talking 8 at the most....or if defenders very low on positioning etc. I know training can improve these, and that thats like these improve with experience, but ive got a game 13 seasons in and its still a major problem, no matter what training you give them. If i use a player search for players with above 12 off the ball i get a very low number of players in the list now all the real life players have pretty much retired.

Its pretty much a waste of time playing after X seasons because of how poor the regens can be.

The previous thread on this issue was locked, for what SI claimed to be full of trolling and people not telling the truth. So lets try and fill this one with enough facts that they cannot ignore.

Totally agree with the 'Off The Ball' attribute.

In 2015, there are 8373 Attacking Midfielders in my player search who are regens. Only 22 of those have a rating of 12 or higher for 'Off The Ball'. Most of the top wingers with good Pace, Acceleration, Crossing, Technique all have an Off The Ball of 9-11.

I have noticed this too.

did you download patch? I think it fixed this issue

Yep, started a new game using the latest patch, it seems that it fixed a few regen errors but players are still terrible ' off the ball ' for the most part.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=172218

SI need to take fix the regen issue because the game is just about pointless about 10 seasons of play.

Guys lets keep this constructive, because if SI brown nosing trolls like John Smith continue this thread will get locked too.

SI had this to say about my previous thread on the matter because some people got annoyed...

Most rational posters would agree that we've improved the newgen system in 10.2, and in fact we improve it for every single release – games and patch.

I'm sorry the system isn't perfect, but it never will be. It can be better yes, but not perfect. If that isn't good enough for you, then I'm sorry about that. I think some of you just need to move on instead of continual trolling with hyperbolic postings.

We can't provide instant fixes, and to suggest we should is wide of the mark.

Constructive feedback is welcomed, and is responded to. Specific issues are always dealt with. What we can't continue to do is waste time responding to heresay and half-truths. I'm sorry if someone's post has been lost in this thread, but for now it's best this thread was locked.

Now to say ' well if thats not good enough for you, then im sorry about that ' is not exactly what we want to hear when 5 pages of which was mostly constructive posting and people putting time and effort into posting only for you to sweep it under the rug by claiming its full of heresay. Why would anyone come on these forums and simply post on a thread about regens if they werent having issues with it? Its a major flaw to your game, you know this, but all you can say is ' well if thats not good enough for you '

Shocking.....I suggest someone higher up than the people that moderate the forums sends you over to some other games developer forums to see how they actually operate when players have issues with their games. If you know this is a problem, and people talk about it being so, then don't lock a thread with such a lame excuse. The game is playable, yes, but its far from competetive, on both my games I had to weaken my team otherwise id win the league in March or April every single season, play my back up players in the Champions League all the way to the Semi Finals ( at least ) because the quality of the game is THAT poor after X seasons. I don't think player comments saying its ' unplayable ' are that wide of the mark. When you play a game you want it it to challenge you, otherwise its quite empty, FM10 does this for the first four or five years then it declines to the point where its a poor season if you win anything less than the treble.

Now, this to me just sounds like they are are quite content with this poor coding on yet another FM game. I have played FM games for a good 15 years now, and yes some of them have been great, some very poor, but the regen issue has pretty much always been there, one way or another. I know its been patched, and the regens are actually better, well theres more of them, good ones at least, but they still lack major stats for the natural position. I have done a search after just 3 seasons and only 34 players under the age of 20 have above 10 for ' off the ball ' and some of those were already in the game, not even regens.

The thread was full of constructive posts, people even put up screenshots, saves, stats and all were showing this huge flaw that prevented the game from being competetive in the future. I have gotten to the point now where I feel like giving up on FM10, which is a shame, because regens aside, the game is fantastic. But at the end of the day regens are the game after X seasons, and to have to play with defenders that cant jump, wingers that arent good off the ball for example, kills what the game becomes. Lets keep this one constructive and not give them a reason to sweep this one under the table because they claim a few people are going over the top. I think the locking of the old thread says a lot about how they feel about this issue, they feel like they cannot fix this, which coming from what people regard as a top games developer just is not good enough. There must be a way to fix this issue, its in the code, you create it, if someone doesnt know how to, then hire someone that does. I know a regen system is pretty unique in games, but surely its as simple as making sure a AMR with a good PA is going to have base stats which allow him to become a top player, or should we just accept that the new Messi is going to be 5 off the ball?

You say you cant provide an instant fix, which nobody can really ask for, but it would be nice to be able to discuss this with the FM community rather than you dismiss a thread which people have invested a lot of time and effort in to.

I actually own/manage my own game store, and its not just some issue people are dreaming up, as ive had numerous people come in and talk about this very issue ( they see me playing and talk about the game ) and all we want is for the game to remain rewarding and competitive, which at the moment, it simply fails to do.

Guys lets keep this constructive, because if SI brown nosing trolls like John Smith continue this thread will get locked too.

What problem do you have with me pointing the OP to a thread that was and had already been discussed for so long? My intent is for them to read it and understand what was discussed, not start a thread #2. And how did I start the trolling in the original thread?

Jeez....

Edit: Just saw that you are the OP. Have a read on the original thread, understand the issues, and get on with it. No point with you starting a second thread when SI says they are aware of the issue and have closed the original thread.

There is a point, this is a discussion forum, and im sure people would like to continue doing so. They did say they are aware of this, but surely more info from the players can only help?

Posting a link and notihng else is hardly helpful, maybe a little text to explain ur intentions would help in the future, sorry if i took it the wrong way but posting a link is usually someone being smart on these forums. Any feedback, or help is welcome on this, and again, sorry i took it the wrong way.

If SI want to comment on this thread then please do so in a constructive manner, we dont want to hear ' well if thats not good enough for you, then im sorry '

We all love this game, and want it to be better, SI did do a good job in the last patch, and theres now more regens, which is nice, but theres still a huge issue/bug with regens having terrible stats for the natural postion.

I dont have any meaningful stats on regens, i did just sign a stiker with 19 off the ball, guess i must be lucky. I cant see how it has too much of a detrimental effect. If the stikers all have bad off the ball and the defenders bad postioning, then surely it just balances itself out?

I do agree though that Regens do seem to be an ongoing issue, particuarly a real lack of top quality regens, I have a 32 yr old sergio aguero up front for my spurs side and cant find anyone on his level and he is past his best. There also seems to be a lack of well rounded players.

I dont have any meaningful stats on regens, i did just sign a stiker with 19 off the ball, guess i must be lucky. I cant see how it has too much of a detrimental effect. If the stikers all have bad off the ball and the defenders bad postioning, then surely it just balances itself out?

Haha. Good point.

I'm in 2024 now and it's very hard finding players with decent off the ball/positioning.

It's normally between 1-9, with a few exeptions.

Having said that. I haven't come to a new season yet on the latest patch, and it could possibly be a bit different from there and on, but i don't know.

It will be very interesting to see if the "new" newgens have more normall off the ball/positioning after a while.

Yep, started a new game using the latest patch, it seems that it fixed a few regen errors but players are still terrible ' off the ball ' for the most part.

You have to wait for new regens to appear, the regens you already have won't spontaniously get higher off the ball. Is this the case?

Shocking.....I suggest someone higher up than the people that moderate the forums sends you over to some other games developer forums to see how they actually operate when players have issues with their games.

I suggest you have a look at the technical issues thread when people were actually having a problem with their game, and how good the response of the SI staff was. Then I suggest having a look at the FIFA 10 thread where the staff promised a whole raft of things in their new game that they didn't deliver, then totally denied that it was a problem.

Guys lets keep this constructive, because if SI brown nosing trolls like John Smith continue this thread will get locked too.

*Adds user to ignore list*

There is a point, this is a discussion forum, and im sure people would like to continue doing so. They did say they are aware of this, but surely more info from the players can only help?

SI had already indicated that they are aware of the regen issue and are improving on it. It will take time. Meanwhile, harping on the same old points would not help. If you have a project that you are confident of completing within some time, having your boss breathing down your neck every other day would hardly help, right?

Posting a link and notihng else is hardly helpful, maybe a little text to explain ur intentions would help in the future, sorry if i took it the wrong way but posting a link is usually someone being smart on these forums. Any feedback, or help is welcome on this, and again, sorry i took it the wrong way.

Yeah I posted the link but you started the original thread and you didn't indicate why you started a second one either, no? And coming in with name-calling did not help but only show a sense of immaturity.

If SI want to comment on this thread then please do so in a constructive manner, we dont want to hear ' well if thats not good enough for you, then im sorry '

Did anyone from SI say this? If they did, then I agree with you on this point.

We all love this game, and want it to be better, SI did do a good job in the last patch, and theres now more regens, which is nice, but theres still a huge issue/bug with regens having terrible stats for the natural postion.

Shocking.....I suggest someone higher up than the people that moderate the forums sends you over to some other games developer forums to see how they actually operate when players have issues with their games.

Not trying to defend SI, but show some sympathy. Maybe I suggest someone send you over to be part of the developers / beta-testing team to see how they actually operate when players have issues with their games?

Although not sure what was to be gained by opening another thread about this issue, this thread needs to stay within the forum rules. If you cant all debate the issue without getting personal and insulting, this one will be closed as well.

Bummer, hadn't realised this until i read this thread and i had a look at the regens i just signed and the best is an argentinian striker at age 16 with off the ball of 7. That should improve with training but comparing him to a couple of other young strikers who are real players he seems a bit behind, i have an 18 yo striker with 11 and a 21 yo striker with 15.

I give up on this for now, too many people simply trying to derail what i find to be a very important issue in FM10.

John I have already apologised for taking your post the wrong way, yet you still want to reply and make digs at me, suggesting that im immature. Get over it, accept my apology, or stop trolling my thread.

As for the people being smart about me saying they need to have a look at other developers forums, how about looking at the Blizzard forums, IW, Rockstar, Rocksteady, Bioware to name a few and see how they deal with players concerns.

The last thread was fantastic, and i find the way it was locked to be quite shocking considering the effort people had put into it, which is why i have tried to start a new one, but people like John Smith and Crouchaldhinho are doing their best to sabotage it.

I suggest you have a look at the technical issues thread when people were actually having a problem with their game, and how good the response of the SI staff was. Then I suggest having a look at the FIFA 10 thread where the staff promised a whole raft of things in their new game that they didn't deliver, then totally denied that it was a problem.

I suggest you think about this....

Other developers simply release games that work at release with if any, minimal bugs or issues.

The Tech support for SI is fantastic, not denying that. However, once you get past that, to the actual game its pretty much broken after X seasons of play, im sorry that you accept that in a game.

I’m in July 2013 and all the regens I’ve seen so far have 7-8 “Off the ball”, I just didn’t found any regen with a higher “Off the ball” than that!

I give up on this for now, too many people simply trying to derail what i find to be a very important issue in FM10.

John I have already apologised for taking your post the wrong way, yet you still want to reply and make digs at me, suggesting that im immature. Get over it, accept my apology, or stop trolling my thread.

As for the people being smart about me saying they need to have a look at other developers forums, how about looking at the Blizzard forums, IW, Rockstar, Rocksteady, Bioware to name a few and see how they deal with players concerns.

The last thread was fantastic, and i find the way it was locked to be quite shocking considering the effort people had put into it, which is why i have tried to start a new one, but people like John Smith and Crouchaldhinho are doing their best to sabotage it.

Your apology doesn't seem very sincere, does it? To be frank, I was disappointed that the last thread was locked. But I can put myself in SI's shoes in that they prefer uninterrupted progress, not answering to a new thread on the same old issue every other day. So that's it. I don't care if this thread gets locked because the arguments are too tired. Nor do I care if you yourself sabotaged the thread due to unneeded comments like all others being too smart and your personal opinion being godly. I had not messed with the previous thread and you can try to prove me wrong if you can. Weird people can jump to conclusions sometimes.

May I hope that you don't experience bad customers who react the same way as you do. Karma sometimes has a way of coming back.