Last Minute Goals - 4-2-4

I'm sick to death of the number of times I concede last minute goals because the opposing team go 4 up front...never seems to work when I do it.

And it's always a sure fire way for them to score, they go 4-2-4 and you KNOW that they're going to do it. How many times do you see teams do that in the premier league week in week out? Happens all the time in the game, and no matter what I do (ultra defensive, long ball, counter attack...) they always score.

I hate it, and it does my head in!

Roaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar

Right, got that off my chest!

I like it when they go 424.

Back defence, barrows on midfielders, counter attack and timewasting

Probably only concede in 10% of games, score another myself in about 40%

I have the same problem

I concede in last minute about 40 prcent of the time no matter what tactics I use.

Yeh I hate this when it happens. Worse was when I was playing Man Utd in the cup with my championship Sheff Wed side. I'd taken the lead but they'd equalised just after half time. Then around 60 mins they change formation to a 4-2-4. I had to spend 30 minutes suffering attack after attack. I lost 4-1

I was about to post something like this. lol. Yeah, happens to me alot. I've lost out on 6 points. Argh!

Delete the 4-2-4 from preset tactics.

When they go 4-2-4 make sure you have an extra (5th) man in defence. Either play with 5 defenders, or barrow one of your midfielders. Always make sure you have enough midfielders left to close down their two midfielders. Lower your d-line, tick counter attack, and make sure to play a direct passing style. If you make sure you have 3 or 4 players in the front, you will get chances on the counter attack. Lower CF for your players, because this will make them hold the ball for too long in midfield.

That will be a Tactical matter - there's a forum for this kinda thing, don'tcha know?

Whenever I'm winning and the AI goes 424 I have a little smile to myself, hit pause, go to tactics, load up my "shut-up-shop" 4-5-1 arrangement, sit back, and win the game. It's a piece of the proverbial to defend against.

Either take some time to think about it and experiment to deal with the attack, or do a search using the function at the top left of the forum. And do the same in the tactics forum. There's plenty of advice if you're struggling.

What is this 4-2-4? I've never heard mention of it on the forums before

I've tried negating the tactical advantage by mimicing them. except the 2 centre mids are told to track back as a defensive precaution. doesn't work everytime but at least it logically evens the odds.

Originally posted by Nomis07:

What is this 4-2-4? I've never heard mention of it on the forums before

me niether maybe they mean mike bassets 4-4- effing 2, the ultimate tactic.

anyway all you have to do is *read backpackants post*

4 defenders, two center midfielders and four strikers.

This was never a problem for me, but then in 3 of my most recent games, the AI broke my tactic and have scored in the last few minutes.

1. I'm holding out at Anfield 0-0 and Torres gets it, runs around 2 guys, shoots, and the shot is deflected and in. I'm mad, but I was lucky to even get to that point tied so I figured it was a fluke.

2. I'm playing West Brom at home and I really should win this. My team has a bad day but I'm winning 2-1, then AI goes 424 and Samaras hits one of those annoying shots from an angle which would be impossible to score from irl. BTW, Samaras has more goals than games as of March. Is he broken for anyone else?

3. Away at Man U. 1-1 draw which I think was pretty fair in terms of stats, though they had squandered lots of opportunities. They go to 424, I switch tactics and know that I will concede anyway. Febian Brandy gets the ball at midfield, runs by one guy and then covers the length of half the pitch in like 1 second, rounds my keeper, and scores. Really annoying.

I had been using a tactic for the past 2-3 seasons which has worked REALLY well, but now it appears to have been broken. The real problem is that strikers (finishing and dribbling ability) is too good, so even a poor dribbler can get around a 20-rated tackler, and even a poor finisher (like Samaras whose finishing is like 14) can make those impossible tight angle shots. It sometimes feels as if stats do not matter.

just done a little research (hour til clocking off what do the expect me to do, work?)

anyway, its the goals in the last ten minutes from this season.

1 Man Utd 20

2 Chelsea 7

3 Arsenal 20

4 Liverpool 15

5 Everton 11

6 Aston Villa 15

7 Blackburn 8

8 Portsmouth 14

9 Man City 5

10 West Ham 8

11 Tottenham 16

12 Newcastle 8

13 Middlesbrough 9

14 Wigan 6

15 Sunderland 11

16 Bolton 7

17 Fulham 7

18 Reading 13

19 Birmingham 9

20 Derby 3

total goals 1002

total goals 80 minutes + 220

average goals per team 50

average goals per team in 80 minutes plus 11

now if my maths is right thats about 20 percent of all goals scored in the last ten minutes(ten percent of a match), when every goes gung ho. double the ammount of goals you see in any other 10 minute period of a match. if anyone else would be kind enough to provide fm data, then we can see if they match up, just going of what i can remember in my game id say its about right. (obviously some season you may see a ot less and some a lot more.)

i noticed a few things, man u(saf has been moainnig about arsenals late goasl when they have had the same ammoun, although man u did have about 10 goals in the 78/79th, chelsea havent really got that many. tottenham have been pretty lucky, they have scraped quite a few games and are only mid table.

Originally posted by Kan:

I'm sick to death of the number of times I concede last minute goals because the opposing team go 4 up front...never seems to work when I do it.

And it's always a sure fire way for them to score, they go 4-2-4 and you KNOW that they're going to do it. How many times do you see teams do that in the premier league week in week out? Happens all the time in the game, and no matter what I do (ultra defensive, long ball, counter attack...) they always score.

I hate it, and it does my head in!

Roaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar

Right, got that off my chest!

You just have to quite simply alter your own tactic, to counter it.

Until FM06, I never used more than 1 tactic. I'd use it season in, season out without fail, no matter if I was doing good, or bad.

Now however, my tactics set looks as follows :

(Most tactics are based on a standard 4-4-2 with farrows for the wingers)

Standard Tactic 1 (Home version, a little more attacking)

Standard Tactic 2 (Away version, a little more defensive)

Close Game (A defensive tactic that a. counters the 4-2-4 and b. gets used in the last 15 minutes of games where I'm only 1 goal up and not dominating)

Ice Cold (For Icy pitches, practically a "long ball" tactic)

WetWetWet (says it all, another "long ball" style tactic, but a few differences than Ice Cold)

The Special One (My own version of 4-2-4, except its actually 2-5-3, and used sparingly when a goal is desperate. Not always effective )

and lastly

Park the Bus (A solidly defensive tactic (5-1-3-1)against bigger teams that I expect to get my rectum handed to me from. Only used in Cup games)

I don't often use some tactics, for 2 reasons, firstly, if I don't have the players capable of filling certain roles in each tactic, I'll just not use the tactic (I/E - no decent DM in the defensive tactic), and secondly, because some are only there for rare occasions, but its nice to be able to watch the balance of a game change, due to your managerial greatness

Originally posted by turn it upto 11:

just done a little research (hour til clocking off what do the expect me to do, work?)

anyway, its the goals in the last ten minutes from this season.

1 Man Utd 20

2 Chelsea 7

3 Arsenal 20

4 Liverpool 15

5 Everton 11

6 Aston Villa 15

7 Blackburn 8

8 Portsmouth 14

9 Man City 5

10 West Ham 8

11 Tottenham 16

12 Newcastle 8

13 Middlesbrough 9

14 Wigan 6

15 Sunderland 11

16 Bolton 7

17 Fulham 7

18 Reading 13

19 Birmingham 9

20 Derby 3

total goals 1002

total goals 80 minutes + 220

average goals per team 50

average goals per team in 80 minutes plus 11

now if my maths is right thats about 20 percent of all goals scored in the last ten minutes(ten percent of a match), when every goes gung ho. double the ammount of goals you see in any other 10 minute period of a match. if anyone else would be kind enough to provide fm data, then we can see if they match up, just going of what i can remember in my game id say its about right. (obviously some season you may see a ot less and some a lot more.)

i noticed a few things, man u(saf has been moainnig about arsenals late goasl when they have had the same ammoun, although man u did have about 10 goals in the 78/79th, chelsea havent really got that many. tottenham have been pretty lucky, they have scraped quite a few games and are only mid table.

I think the Real Life results weren't too different from what you have there. Its common for late goals to be scored often, as players tire, spaces open and teams push for results.

they are this seasons resuts.

bbc have them all on one page so i just scrolled down and made a tally chart.

its simple to counter the 4-2-4 and i have NEVER had any problems - just keeping the sodding ball! its not hard, pass it and remain defensive, dont hoof it to your forwards, just pass the ball round and they cannot do a thing about it!

u should use the individual player instructions on the 4 forward players, close down always,hard tackle and show onto weaker foot the wide forwards and hard tackle and show onto weaker foot for the central forwards. works a treat 4 me

i just go 4-4(DMs & WBs)-1-1, time wasting, no forward runs apart from the striker, zonal marking, passing down the flanks, direct or long passing & counter attack. i also leave substitutions until the 80th minute if possible, allowing me to bring on proper defensive players.

i hardly concede late goals anymore.

I often think that, when people start complaining about facing 4-2-4, they seem to feel as if they're really facing 4-4-4.

If you actually think about it, it's not too difficult to deal with and exploit. The key is the '2'. Basically, the oppostion have pushed their wingers further forward, and yeah, there's a good chance you'll come under attack. However, if you can get the ball out wide to your own wingers, you'll have a good chance of creating your own attack. Consider also that, because 4-2-4 is generally the desperate last throws in trying to salvage a result, their full-backs will be pressing on too. So, don't go too defensive so as to invite a bombardment, but make sure you select counter-attacking and get the ball to your wide players. They will often have a lot of space to exploit.

That's my advice, anyway.

I just remove the farrows from my full backs and give them, no RwB and FR. I score more goals than the AI when it goes 4-2-4.

Originally posted by turn it upto 11:

just done a little research (hour til clocking off what do the expect me to do, work?)

anyway, its the goals in the last ten minutes from this season.

1 Man Utd 20

2 Chelsea 7

3 Arsenal 20

4 Liverpool 15

5 Everton 11

6 Aston Villa 15

7 Blackburn 8

8 Portsmouth 14

9 Man City 5

10 West Ham 8

11 Tottenham 16

12 Newcastle 8

13 Middlesbrough 9

14 Wigan 6

15 Sunderland 11

16 Bolton 7

17 Fulham 7

18 Reading 13

19 Birmingham 9

20 Derby 3

total goals 1002

total goals 80 minutes + 220

average goals per team 50

average goals per team in 80 minutes plus 11

now if my maths is right thats about 20 percent of all goals scored in the last ten minutes(ten percent of a match), when every goes gung ho. double the ammount of goals you see in any other 10 minute period of a match. if anyone else would be kind enough to provide fm data, then we can see if they match up, just going of what i can remember in my game id say its about right. (obviously some season you may see a ot less and some a lot more.)

i noticed a few things, man u(saf has been moainnig about arsenals late goasl when they have had the same ammoun, although man u did have about 10 goals in the 78/79th, chelsea havent really got that many. tottenham have been pretty lucky, they have scraped quite a few games and are only mid table.

i checked my save last night and i conceded 11 goals in the last 10 minutes of games. i conceded about 60 all season, so that lies just below the average for last (real) season. so it is time for all the people who make threads every single day to stop it, if it is going ok for me then it proves its your tactics. facts dont lie friends.

Everyone here keeps saying what to do to prevent it in terms of the tactics to create. It doesn't really matter because you have to wait until the ball goes out of play for the tactics to apply. Many times the ball doesn't go out of play until after they score. And after they score the game sometimes switches back to the original formation. What do you do in that case? There's nothing you can do about it. It's total ********.

Originally posted by Frazza Pee:

Delete the 4-2-4 from preset tactics.

I don't see a 4-2-4 in my preset tactics folder. Where do I find it?

4-2-4 is possibly the easiest tactic to counter. And no, I hardly ever concede before the tactic takes effect. Pausing the game to change the tactic often helps, but it's no biggie.

Defending a narrow lead, I just sit back and relax when this tactic pops up.

I won't go into details as the IS a search facility. Use it if you want to genuinely counter this tactic. If you just want to sound off simply open yet ANOTHER thread on the subject.

Originally posted by dihcar:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Frazza Pee:

Delete the 4-2-4 from preset tactics.

I don't see a 4-2-4 in my preset tactics folder. Where do I find it? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

In the data folder, but it's not in 'preset tactics'. It's in the file 'tactics'

Originally posted by Chrisy177:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by dihcar:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Frazza Pee:

Delete the 4-2-4 from preset tactics.

I don't see a 4-2-4 in my preset tactics folder. Where do I find it? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

In the data folder, but it's not in 'preset tactics'. It's in the file 'tactics' </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Okay went there and deleted it but it's still showing up in the game....what now?

I wish people would stop creating new threads to moan about this "problem".

There are 100's of threads about this around already. If people would just use the search function, (it does actually work), then you would find the vast array of threads with this "complaint" in it, and 100's responses informing you how to counter the 4-2-4 system.

Originally posted by tomtuck01:

I wish people would stop creating new threads to moan about this "problem".

There are 100's of threads about this around already. If people would just use the search function, (it does actually work), then you would find the vast array of threads with this "complaint" in it, and 100's responses informing you how to counter the 4-2-4 system.

You must be frickin' blind. My responses weren't "moaning" about it being a tactic that can't be countered. The problem is that the frickin' game does not apply the tactics to counter it until after the opposition scores. Now if you should go through and try all those suggestions what's the point if the game only applies it after the worst case scenario has already come through. If you're not even gonna take the time to read the posts carefully why bother to reply?

Originally posted by dihcar:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tomtuck01:

I wish people would stop creating new threads to moan about this "problem".

There are 100's of threads about this around already. If people would just use the search function, (it does actually work), then you would find the vast array of threads with this "complaint" in it, and 100's responses informing you how to counter the 4-2-4 system.

You must be frickin' blind. My responses weren't "moaning" about it being a tactic that can't be countered. The problem is that the frickin' game does not apply the tactics to counter it until after the opposition scores. Now if you should go through and try all those suggestions what's the point if the game only applies it after the worst case scenario has already come through. If you're not even gonna take the time to read the posts carefully why bother to reply? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thats just bad luck I'm afraid. It can happen in real life as well. It's not a problem, just bad luck.

Originally posted by tomtuck01:

I wish people would stop creating new threads to moan about this "problem".

There are 100's of threads about this around already. If people would just use the search function, (it does actually work), then you would find the vast array of threads with this "complaint" in it, and 100's responses informing you how to counter the 4-2-4 system.

Are you a wannabe moderator? STFU man and keep to topic you fool

Originally posted by TGD:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tomtuck01:

I wish people would stop creating new threads to moan about this "problem".

There are 100's of threads about this around already. If people would just use the search function, (it does actually work), then you would find the vast array of threads with this "complaint" in it, and 100's responses informing you how to counter the 4-2-4 system.

Are you a wannabe moderator? STFU man and keep to topic you fool </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

451.

Ok, there's obviously the aspect of how to defend against the formation, and try and keep your lead, but then there's also the aspect of why so many teams revert to that formation in premier league games week in week out.

I could understand cup games, or championship contender/relegation battler games, but 3 weeks into the season, the away teams go 4-2-4 and I've even seen 4-1-5 when they're one nil down at the 80th minute...come on man, that just doesn't happen!

Just played a match. 4-0 up after 73 mins. Lost 5-4.

Unbelievable. No tactical switches would have helped. It was one of those games where you can tell instantly what will happen. Defensive errors that wouldn't happen in the local park.

Well if anyone watched the MLS match where Beckham cored from 70 yards the goalkeeper ran up and they were going all out attack in a league match.

I personally believe that all teams should go all out attack close to the end of the game. The pros of a draw far outweigh the cons of losing by another goal. The game is simply transferring a tactical representation of that philosophy into a playable tactic.

With that said, I've never had huge trouble with 4-2-4. The teams do it quite often and they have worked a few times but they definitely don't work every time, its far from a killer tactic otherwise people would never win.

Mate, you're right!! I hate the last 5 minutes when the IA doesn't know how to beat me and it uses a 4-2-4.

When it happens My defenders begin to play badly (they played well all the match) and finally the rival team scores.

I've even tried going 10-0-0. Never works. I always have to at least concede a goal! Funny how it rarely works when I go 4-2-4, though.