Six Issues to be resolved to make the game great again

After spending a bit of time on this forum since the release of the game I think it's a fair assessment that there is some unhappiness with this version - probably as the 'Polish' title didn't deliver 100% and people's expectations have not been met.

In some part I think this is down to the success that was FM09 which, in my and many others opinion, was the best FM (when fully patched) in a while - especially long term games.

With this success - coupled with the 'polish' PR terminology - it's easy to see why some people feel unhappy.

However I'm convined that by 10.3 (hopefully 10.2!) the game will be even better than 9.3 and I wanted to try and round up the most important gameplay fixes that we think need to be addressed - whether in 10.2 or 10.3.

1. Too many striker goals

Being worked on for 10.2.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=167497

2. More tackling/Better defensive work

Being worked on for 10.2.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=157896&highlight=defenders+tackling

3. Shortlist Bug

Fixed for 10.2 Not getting news about players being signed/approached by other clubs.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=171614&highlight=shortlist

4. Long shot goals reduced.

Being worked on for 10.2

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?p=4266868#post4266868

5. Regens

In particular the grouping of various attributes - DM marking for example.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=172218

6. Too many penalties converted.

Lots of threads about really long penalty shootouts, penalties being scored too much in matches.

These are the 6 MAIN gameplay issues for me that once fixed - will make this game great again.

Just to put things into perspective that we're hopefully not that far off.

EDIT - There is an SI response to each issue in each thread posted above.

I just don't understand how all these could be missed in testing.

I just don't understand how all these could be missed in testing.

It's not always a case of them being 'missed' sometimes there's just too much to be worked on and too little time. Minor changes have big consequences.

From some of the responses I've had from SI Developers over the past few years I know there is a nervousness to touch code at times as some bits are ancient and the knock ons are not always fully known.

I just don't understand how all these could be missed in testing.

How many seasons do the testers play. If it is only a season then none of these issues would be glaringly obvious.

Also do testers work in groups or are they independant. If the latter then they may think it just happens in their test game.

It would maybe be nice to know how the testing is done.

I'm not 100% convinced 'testing' is the issue.

I think some of these issues, if not all, are reported - but you have to remember the testers don't fix them. There is only a finite pool SI can call upon to actually fix the issues.

I just don't understand how all these could be missed in testing.

Perhaps Football manager is a very difficult game to program???

Must admit, I havn't noticed a few of these

1. Too many striker goals

Maybe I'm not very good, but my Rooney/Berbatov isn't really scoring a ridiculous amount of goal (I did win the league - season 1)

2. More tackling/Better defensive work

Again, not really had this. Rio and Vidic + VDS has been quite solid.

Used to concede quite a few, then made tactical change and now quite solid.

3. Shortlist Bug

Haven't noticed, but I guess that's what this bug is!

4. Long shot goals reduced.

Again, I'm not scoring too many from long shots, nor conceeding that many either.

5. Regens

Yep!!!

6. Too many penalties converted.

I've missed 2 or 3 over a season (havn't had any penalty shootout)? That sounds about right.

The penalties bug is more apparent in shootouts.

The rest SI have commented on that they are tweaking.

Looking good then, only Regens to go!

Come on SI!

20 days until Xmas = less than 20 days until patch 2!

In some part I think this is down to the success that was FM09 which, in my and many others opinion, was the best FM (when fully patched) in a while - especially long term games.

FM09 was a total disaster compared to FM10 to be honest though!

There are far less major problems in FM10 right now than there was at this stage last year.

Not denying that any of the things you have listed are problems but thought I would just add my opinion.

1. Too many striker goals

When I was playing with 4-4-2, a large portion of my goals did seem to come from the strikers but I must say, since switching to 4-2-3-1, that my striker doesn't actually score that many and my attacking midfield players are the ones chipping in with the goals. So this hasn't been much of a problem for me.

2. More tackling/Better defensive work

I do wonder if this is something that is more noticeable when you use 3D. Perhaps something to do with the animations?

It does seem largely cosmetic though from what I've seen. My current team have been defending really well and keeping clean sheets. Things look good to me on the 2D representation. Could just be my team and tactics though.

3. Shortlist Bug

Didn't notice it to be honest. Minor issue as far as I am concerned and I am glad to hear it is being fixed.

4. Long shot goals reduced.

Again, an issue that hasn't really had any kind of effect in my game. I haven't seen too many.

5. Regens

In particular the grouping of various attributes - DM marking for example.

Some of the regens in my 2039 save didn't look too bad.

To be honest, I think this is an area that is constantly being worked on anyway. Fingers crossed that it will be improved again for the patch.

6. Too many penalties converted.

Haven't noticed it.

Just to put things into perspective that we're hopefully not that far off.

I think it does put things into perspective. The 'issues' in the game really aren't that bad and a number of them will be improved in the patch. There are a lot of complaints, as there are every year, but this is actually a big improvement compared to FM09 and a step in the right direction.

All in my opinion, of course.

C.

One bug I would like to add is offsides.

Not sure if it's a ME or 3D issue, but often the decisions look wrong (and are wrong).

This includes calling offside when it isn't / not calling offside when it is / calling offside despite player not interfering with play.

One bug I would like to add is offsides.

Not sure if it's a ME or 3D issue, but often the decisions look wrong (and are wrong).

This includes calling offside when it isn't / not calling offside when it is / calling offside despite player not interfering with play.

There is a fellow at Clarence Park on a Saturday who stands near me and keeps complaining very loudly about this kind of bug. Often the decisions look wrong (and are wrong) and doesn't this fellow let the lino know about it! Good Lord!

There is a fellow at Clarence Park on a Saturday who stands near me and keeps complaining very loudly about this kind of bug. Often the decisions look wrong (and are wrong) and doesn't this fellow let the lino know about it! Good Lord!

Exactly. The fact this is being complained about makes it very realistic imo.

Be careful boys, keep encouraging them and you'll start seeing the ball crossing the goal line not being counted, and handballs being missed (especially in any game Henry plays in)

I must admit, I now understand why SAF gets so angry at the referees!

(And yes, I have "earned" a touchline ban in FM2010)

The penalties bug is more apparent in shootouts.

The rest SI have commented on that they are tweaking.

Shootouts - definitely too many converted. In a save game I did with leagues down to level 10, I was playing as Welwyn Garden City (!) and in the 1st qualifying round of the FA cup I prevailed 13-12 despite most of my players having a penalty kick taking attribute of 1.

I just started a new game and now as manager of Celano in Serie C, I watched as the taker hit a penalty in normal play straight at the keeper who didn't dive and saved it with his hand in front of his face. A few minutes later - same taker hit the penalty in exactly the same place and saved in exactly the same way! (We still won 3-0....lol)

One bug I would like to add is offsides.

Not sure if it's a ME or 3D issue, but often the decisions look wrong (and are wrong).

This includes calling offside when it isn't / not calling offside when it is / calling offside despite player not interfering with play.

Absolutely! Might be just the 3d cosmetic thing but OMG. More then half the times it looked 2 meters behind the line. Think this is the most important.

Where are these announces for future fixes being made?

There is a fellow at Clarence Park on a Saturday who stands near me and keeps complaining very loudly about this kind of bug. Often the decisions look wrong (and are wrong) and doesn't this fellow let the lino know about it! Good Lord!

But I work Saturday's now, so I don't get a chance to go to games anymore!!

Sorry to go completely off topic, but I remember a game down Clarence Park, I think it was the opening game of the season, and we lost 3-0 to Dorchester, where half way through the game, despite leading, the Dorchester full-back pelted the ball at the lino for giving a throw in against him.

Needless to say, the ref sent him off. We still lost, though.

I also believe it was DJ Harvey's debut for us.

Absolutely! Might be just the 3d cosmetic thing but OMG. More then half the times it looked 2 meters behind the line. Think this is the most important.

Playing both 09 and 10 I think I've only looked at 20 offside call in careers spanning about 50 all told (different saves), and only about 2-3 times have I had a complaint after the replay. It's not like real life at all.

There is a lot more than 6 to make the game great, more like 6 to make the game playable.

I can't be the only person who's hoping they don't make too many changes. I'm having a whale of a time on my game at the moment, and too many tweaks might mess up my tactics!

Number 1 issue for a lot of us is the crash dumps. Doesn't matter how great the match engine performs if the game crashes on us routinely.

It's not always a case of them being 'missed' sometimes there's just too much to be worked on and too little time. Minor changes have big consequences.

From some of the responses I've had from SI Developers over the past few years I know there is a nervousness to touch code at times as some bits are ancient and the knock ons are not always fully known.

Thats all fine, they have to priortise to get what they feel is essential fixed. However, and I have said this before - testing is one of the last stages before they get to release. If they get to this stage and there is so much wrong that they have to priortise, and deliberately leave mistakes in the game to get it out on time, a) should they not push back the release date to get the game totally fixed, or b) work out a more efficient way of limiting problems as they go along?

The OP talks about the general unhappiness about FM10 but yet there are literally thousands of people out there with this game who don't come on the forums. I personally would not of noticed many of these bugs had it not been for reading about them on here. This isn't me saying they don't exist though just think it needs to be brought into prospective this unhappiness that is talked about.

Agree about some of the stuff from the OP.

Too many long shots, idiotic defending, just ballwatching, and too many freekicks.

And Carlos Tevez.....he's scored 130 goals in his last 130 games - and there way too many hattricks, 5-4, 4-3,4-4 games in the game. SORT IT OUT!

Sort it out si

After the amazing analysis work done by Shrekiejai regarding the regen issue in another thread I really do hope SI get to working on it.

What I dont understand is - do the testers even do any analytical work? It was glaringly obvious when you look at Shrekiejai's work. How could these paid employees fail to see it?

I'm sure this point has probably been made in some previous thread, but I'll say it anyway. Why do we have to wait until patch 10.2 for the game to improve and then 10.3 for the game to be close to perfection? Surely SI would have learned their mistakes from the previous two FMs (FM08 and FM09). They should have just improved the FM09 version instead of introducing all these new features. FM08 and FM09 were both close to unplayable and FM10 seems to be riddled with bugs too. It's like that comment that George Bush made: "You can't fool me twice" (lol). Well SI have fooled us 3 times.

Adriano007 - SI have been doing this since day one. Patches always get released to fix their product. It has gotten worse over the last few years though. I think thats why quite a few people were hoping CM10 was going to be a good product to compete with SI and FM. Having no competition in this game genre that is really of the same standard stops innovation and creativity. Also with pressure to release the game by the publishers we end up with a sub-par finished product.

Now what happened to SI saying this years release would be the best tested version yet...hmmm..actually maybe it is, but if thats true, were the testers a bunch of kids playing for a season or two? and if thats the best released version, damn I feel like George W Bush and his dumbness of getting fooled. haha

Note that when I said FM08 and FM09 were close to unplayable, I meant at the time of release. Just to clear any confusion.

How about the world cup subscriptions, world cup qualifiers subscriptions? Most people can't seem to get them to work. Can we have an option to subscribe to all competitions?

I honestly think SI will NEVER try to fix certain things like player regens. If they ever make a perfect game - which includes being able to play for 30 seasons or more and still have a good pool of players to choose from with the right attributes for position - then they would be worried people wouldn't buy the game the next year. It's all about the money. We are SI's cash cow and every year they will continue to milk us.

I honestly think SI will NEVER try to fix certain things like player regens. If they ever make a perfect game - which includes being able to play for 30 seasons or more and still have a good pool of players to choose from with the right attributes for position - then they would be worried people wouldn't buy the game the next year. It's all about the money. We are SI's cash cow and every year they will continue to milk us.

I think I'd still buy the new update. Half the fun is getting the update rosters and running a new game before you know what tactics and players are good.

Every now and again there is issues with passing / players leaving balls that are in play until it just stops and then lets an opposition player get there.

Passing sometimes my players just drill it at the back of a player and it just bounces off him...

Four out of six are match engines problems. The match engine is never going to be satisfactory considering the impossible task of simulating real football.

I think there are far more fundamental issues that haven't been addressed. Regens are still not right so that is one, but I'd just lump that in with the general neglect of long term play that is, in my opinion, the major problem with the game.

Anyone has problems with the AI transfer regime?

In my current save, ManUtd has 3 DL and 0 DR.

They initially had Fabio and Evra. After selling Fabio, they proceeded to buy 3 DLs - Dodo and Baines for a total of 40million pounds.

After one season, They loaned out Dodo and Baines and SOLD Evra, leaving them with 0 DLs.

They are also spending a ridiculous sum of money on very old players.

The transfer list market is also crazy. Everyone is overpriced, the "not needed" players want large wages.

An example is Nednum Onuha. Currently at Man City, he is earning 60k in wages. He has been listed for 3 years. I put a bid in and he wants 50k a week! After his contract ran out, he was happy to settle for 20k a week.

That is madness.

I can see one slight problem with this

At the moment the scorlines in FM seem fairly realistic to me, though perhaps not quite as many goals as irl EPL (never seen a result like Spurs Wigan)

If you improve defending, there will be fewer goals

If you make strikers score less, there will be fewer goals

If you make long shots worse, there will be fewer goals

A situation where 0-0 draws are very common would be a disaster, much worse than any compaint we have now.

Where will we get the remaining goals from? I haven't seen too many from corners or indirect freekicks this year, or any deflected shot goals. Should wingers drift in more and score from the back post?

Suggestions?

I can see one slight problem with this

At the moment the scorlines in FM seem fairly realistic to me, though perhaps not quite as many goals as irl EPL (never seen a result like Spurs Wigan)

If you improve defending, there will be fewer goals

If you make strikers score less, there will be fewer goals

If you make long shots worse, there will be fewer goals

A situation where 0-0 draws are very common would be a disaster, much worse than any compaint we have now.

Where will we get the remaining goals from? I haven't seen too many from corners or indirect freekicks this year, or any deflected shot goals. Should wingers drift in more and score from the back post?

Suggestions?

It's not improving 'defending' as a whole - it's stopping things happening in certain scenarios - whilst ensuring there are more goalscoring scenarios for other positions such as wingers.

All about balance and this is why it takes so much testing to get right. A constant evolution that gets closer and closer to real life football.

It's just a shame that the ME and other aspects of the game seem to get worse at times and undoes all the good work.

Must admit, I havn't noticed a few of these

1. Too many striker goals

Maybe I'm not very good, but my Rooney/Berbatov isn't really scoring a ridiculous amount of goal (I did win the league - season 1)

2. More tackling/Better defensive work

Again, not really had this. Rio and Vidic + VDS has been quite solid.

Used to concede quite a few, then made tactical change and now quite solid.

3. Shortlist Bug

Haven't noticed, but I guess that's what this bug is!

4. Long shot goals reduced.

Again, I'm not scoring too many from long shots, nor conceeding that many either.

5. Regens

Yep!!!

6. Too many penalties converted.

I've missed 2 or 3 over a season (havn't had any penalty shootout)? That sounds about right.

agreed with you

After spending a bit of time on this forum since the release of the game I think it's a fair assessment that there is some unhappiness with this version - probably as the 'Polish' title didn't deliver 100% and people's expectations have not been met.

In some part I think this is down to the success that was FM09 which, in my and many others opinion, was the best FM (when fully patched) in a while - especially long term games.

With this success - coupled with the 'polish' PR terminology - it's easy to see why some people feel unhappy.

However I'm convined that by 10.3 (hopefully 10.2!) the game will be even better than 9.3 and I wanted to try and round up the most important gameplay fixes that we think need to be addressed - whether in 10.2 or 10.3.

1. Too many striker goals

Being worked on for 10.2.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=167497

2. More tackling/Better defensive work

Being worked on for 10.2.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=157896&highlight=defenders+tackling

3. Shortlist Bug

Fixed for 10.2 Not getting news about players being signed/approached by other clubs.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=171614&highlight=shortlist

4. Long shot goals reduced.

Being worked on for 10.2

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?p=4266868#post4266868

5. Regens

In particular the grouping of various attributes - DM marking for example.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=172218

6. Too many penalties converted.

Lots of threads about really long penalty shootouts, penalties being scored too much in matches.

These are the 6 MAIN gameplay issues for me that once fixed - will make this game great again.

Just to put things into perspective that we're hopefully not that far off.

EDIT - There is an SI response to each issue in each thread posted above.

I agree with you but i could play with all these bugs except for the shortlist bug.I stopped playing cus of that bug.

After spending a bit of time on this forum since the release of the game I think it's a fair assessment that there is some unhappiness with this version - probably as the 'Polish' title didn't deliver 100% and people's expectations have not been met.

In some part I think this is down to the success that was FM09 which, in my and many others opinion, was the best FM (when fully patched) in a while - especially long term games.

With this success - coupled with the 'polish' PR terminology - it's easy to see why some people feel unhappy.

However I'm convined that by 10.3 (hopefully 10.2!) the game will be even better than 9.3 and I wanted to try and round up the most important gameplay fixes that we think need to be addressed - whether in 10.2 or 10.3.

1. Too many striker goals

Being worked on for 10.2.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=167497

2. More tackling/Better defensive work

Being worked on for 10.2.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=157896&highlight=defenders+tackling

3. Shortlist Bug

Fixed for 10.2 Not getting news about players being signed/approached by other clubs.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=171614&highlight=shortlist

4. Long shot goals reduced.

Being worked on for 10.2

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?p=4266868#post4266868

5. Regens

In particular the grouping of various attributes - DM marking for example.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=172218

6. Too many penalties converted.

Lots of threads about really long penalty shootouts, penalties being scored too much in matches.

These are the 6 MAIN gameplay issues for me that once fixed - will make this game great again.

Just to put things into perspective that we're hopefully not that far off.

EDIT - There is an SI response to each issue in each thread posted above.

I agree we need all those fixing

But i'd love for this bug to be fixed as it's been 'bugging' the hell out of me!

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php?t=163590

I just hate the fact that players in the leagues you don't manage in are now always rated higher!!! Unfortunately this hasn't been mentioned much so i'm not sure it's going to get fixed

The game is getting more disappointing year by year. SIGA are cheating everybody. Every year the gamers are dealing with a lot of problems. WE PAY for the game and what we get...a faulty game. also the game it doesnt getting any improvements at all. its like its getting updated every year. same boring rubbish game. For example. The opposition team are lethal. and this is not realistic. i mean that my team may miss 20 or more chances to score, but the opposition needs only one chance to score. rubbish game. its like throwing the money in the trash.

The only bugs i've noticed is penalties ALWAYS going in, long shots galore and defenders falling asleep ALL THE TIME. There seems to be air of dishonesty from people on these forums where they think because its not happening to them, fellow managers are making things up just to moan about the game, yet if it was happening to them they would be the first on here complaining that certain things haven't fixed.

I find the double standards on these forums fantastic to read sometimes.

I would honestly rather FM11 to be a proper finished release of FM10 disguised with updated transfers and a new colour scheme for the skin, rather than a bug riddled version with x amount of new features that add relatively little to the game play. Get the basics right & 100% finished, and regardless of what's new people will buy it and be happy they don't have to wait for the 3rd patch to be able to enjoy a career save of decent length.

The quality of regens destroys long term playability for me as the imbalance of vital attributes makes the game totally unrealistic.

I response to the "6 Issues"

1. Annoying - Not Vital

2. Don't use 3d and not noticeable in 2d (often) - Can't comment as not greatly affected.

3. Have not experienced (or haven't noticed) this yet so can't comment.

4. Needs toning down in my opinion.

5. Disastrous to any long term save (and the reason FM10 is shelved til fixed in patch, I hope patch 2)

6. Really very irritating in shoot outs. Last time any one remembers a 19-18?

7. No loan players in long term. (Big teams not have reserves and not loan U18 team players too) Its specially annoying for people who like lower leagues and use too much loan...

8. Idiot regen managers...(specially in future) Even good ex-footballers has tactical knowledge less than 10

Good points raised by the OP.

I'd add 7 as the transfer system still needs work.

Negotiation has been much improved but you still can't give away very decent players.

The worst bug I've encountered by far is some home-grown players losing their home-grown status after you sign them...game-breaking bug right here due to the new home-grown quotos in the Premiership. It's happened to me with Insua, Wilshere and Kakuta so far...all home-grown before I signed them, then totally lose their status after joining. They've said they're probably going to fix it for the next patch, but I can't play the game at the moment due to this bug.

I am getting very frustrated at the shortlist bug.

I am getting very frustrated at the shortlist bug.

I have to say, like a previous poster, it is this that stops me playing.

I lost a few players as other teams went in for them and I wasn't alerted and it COMPLETELY ruins the game. In a way I've never experienced and I've been playing since 1993.

SI could have at least put this vital fix in 10.1.1. The others do not make the game unplayable but losing out on players you should be subscribed to is a disaster.

Besides crashes, this list is absolutely spot on.