GK's eccentricity, is it good or bad ?

i've always wandered what it really does.

i've always wandered what it really does.

Both good and bad methinks. Hard to explain. But it helps if he has a high "decisions" stat to go with it

depends, whether you think Barthez was a good goalkeeper or not?

Personally, if a keeper has a high stat of eccentricity I steer clear and look elsewhere?!

Take Boruc as an example hes as eccentric as hell and look at the saves he pulls off

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Celtic 08:

Take Boruc as an example hes as eccentric as hell and look at the saves he pulls off </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I will take back my comment above, as I have signed Boric a few times as he is a very good keeper and you can get him fairly cheap.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by The_Future's_Maroon:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Celtic 08:

Take Boruc as an example hes as eccentric as hell and look at the saves he pulls off </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I will take back my comment above, as I have signed Boric a few times as he is a very good keeper and you can get him fairly cheap. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

At least someone agrees

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">depends, whether you think Barthez was a good goalkeeper or not? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think legendary Derby County commentator Graham Richards put it best when he referred to Barthez as a clown, a stupid clown. Never a truer words been said imo lol

More eccentric goalkeepers will come out of the area more and try to dribble around. This can be bad if they get beaten to a ball they come out for.

Generally, I wouldn't recommend anyone with an eccentricity above 15 unless you feel like giving away a few goals a season.

This is taken out from the Hints & Tips by Marc Vaughan & Nick Habershon for FM07.

Eccentricity;

An eccentric keeper is a double-edged sword. He might be capable of moments of genius, but equally you may find him scampering out of his box with no hope of getting to the ball before the opposition striker. If you like a player with a bit of character, a low rating, in my opinion, is not necessarily a good thing.

So as you can see it's totally up to you to decide on how you look at signing 'keepers.

Look at David James. He's a quality keeper but then look at the times he comes out his area and missed the ball etc. Like Riza said, clearly a double-edged sword.

Well I would say it's not a bad thing to be eccentric. Just look at Gigi Buffon, he is eccentric and by far and away the best keeper at the start of the game, and has been the best in real life for a long while now.

As for everyone who is knocking Fabien Barthez, please dont.

For a long time he was considered the best goalkeeper in the world. He was once the worlds most expensive goalkeeper when he moved to Manchester United for £7.8million. He DID have 2-3 great seasons at Old Trafford with only fleeting errors. Unfortunately these errors usually came in games that were broadcast live on television, therfore highlighting them even more.

The only thing Barthez ever lacked was good concerntration. At a top club like Manchester United goalkeepers have little to do at times and need to remain alert all the times. This was Barthez's downfall. In terms of shot stopping, aerial abiility, one on ones, etc. he was second to none.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fattyg:

I think legendary Derby County commentator Graham Richards put it best when he referred to Barthez as a clown, a stupid clown. Never a truer words been said imo lol </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well your opinion, and Graham Richards, is wrong. Graham Richards is clearly the clown in this situation, as perhaps you are too.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Well your opinion, and Graham Richards, is wrong. Graham Richards is clearly the clown in this situation, as perhaps you are too. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

lol i never said he wasn't a good goalkeeper, however i maintain that he was a clown.

Ok, sorry, I guess I took it out of context. And I shouldn't have labelled you a clown, you know, unless you are one.

-------------------------

Me thinks an "eccentric" stat up to 15 you can live with. Above that and Id be getting worried!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tomtuck01:

Well I would say it's not a bad thing to be eccentric. Just look at Gigi Buffon, he is eccentric and by far and away the best keeper at the start of the game, and has been the best in real life for a long while now.

As for everyone who is knocking Fabien Barthez, please dont.

For a long time he was considered the best goalkeeper in the world. He was once the worlds most expensive goalkeeper when he moved to Manchester United for £7.8million. He DID have 2-3 great seasons at Old Trafford with only fleeting errors. Unfortunately these errors usually came in games that were broadcast live on television, therfore highlighting them even more.

The only thing Barthez ever lacked was good concerntration. At a top club like Manchester United goalkeepers have little to do at times and need to remain alert all the times. This was Barthez's downfall. In terms of shot stopping, aerial abiility, one on ones, etc. he was second to none.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fattyg:

I think legendary Derby County commentator Graham Richards put it best when he referred to Barthez as a clown, a stupid clown. Never a truer words been said imo lol </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well your opinion, and Graham Richards, is wrong. Graham Richards is clearly the clown in this situation, as perhaps you are too. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm sorry mate but if you're not a REALLY biased United fan with a few too many pairs of red coloured specticles on, then I'll eat my hat.

I'm a United fan and I can admit that Barthez was bobbins in a United shirt. Look at some of the goals he 'gave' to Henry, and to West Ham...standing up straight with his hands in the air?

An remember the Ronaldo show at Old Trafford for Real? At least 2 of them goals would have been saved by a half competant keeper.

Sure he wasn't a sunday league keeper, he could play, hence why he is a bit richer than most of us. But for a top level keeper, he was bobbins.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Ok, sorry, I guess I took it out of context. And I shouldn't have labelled you a clown, you know, unless you are one. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

haha no worries, no i'm definately not a clown, i've never seen them the same way since I accidentally saw IT when i was 9 lol

And yeh as tomtuck says anything above 15 and you'd probably be better sending them off to a mental hospital then putting them in goal. (maybe i've slightly exagerated there )

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LSF07:

I'm a United fan and I can admit that Barthez was bobbins in a United shirt. Look at some of the goals he 'gave' to Henry, and to West Ham...standing up straight with his hands in the air?

An remember the Ronaldo show at Old Trafford for Real? At least 2 of them goals would have been saved by a half competant keeper. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

And what did I just say;

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">these errors usually came in games that were broadcast live on television, therfore highlighting them even more. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

All of the errors you have mentioned were broadcast live on TV and therefore stcik in peoples minds more easily. Plus it is human nature to remeber the bad from the good.

^Not only that, but any professional at the top level of football deserves respect in my opinion, no matter their level of skill compared to other professionals.

Barthez was a great a keeper during his career and all the nay sayers need to understand that no 'keeper is perfect. There's more shots that he has saved, than he has let in. And that's what matters.

12-14 is what I aim for in a keeper.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Riza:

^Not only that, but any professional at the top level of football deserves respect in my opinion, no matter their level of skill compared to other professionals.

Barthez was a great a keeper during his career and all the nay sayers need to understand that no 'keeper is perfect. There's more shots that he has saved, than he has let in. And that's what matters. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have to disagree with you there.

Sure, every single goalkeeper that ever lived, I would bet my life on, has saved more than they let it, otherwise they would conceed thousands of goals. So that is a moot point.

It's about important saves. Most goalkeepers make the routine saves, but Barthez rarely ever made outstanding saves that you don't expect keepers to make, but the very best do make.

He also let in some efforts which he really should have saved easily, and on top of that, he also would completely mess up badly, thus gifting the opposition a goal way too many times for a supposed top keeper.

As I said, he wasn't totally rubbish, as no professional is. But for his standard and compared to his peers, he was quite an awful goalkeeper who never installed confidence in his defence.

But enough of distracting from the original post lol.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LSF07:

It's about important saves. Most goalkeepers make the routine saves, but Barthez rarely ever made outstanding saves that you don't expect keepers to make, but the very best do make. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Im sorry, but that is the biggest load of rubbish I have read in a long while.

Fabien Barthez made outstanding, point/game winning saves throughut his career. Go back to World Cup 98 in France, or Euro 2000 in Holland and Belgium. Look at some of his performances for Monaco. While at the club he won 2 league titles. Infact throughout his career he won 13 trophies at club and International level, aswell as the Yashin Award at the 1998 World Cup.

Poor keepers are not first choice at clubs that win so many trophies, or in national teams that win tournaments. And they certainly do not win individual awards as prestigious as the Yashin Award.

Yes, at times Barthez made the basics look difficult, but he had the ability to win you games. A rare commondity in a goalkeeper.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LSF07;

He also let in some efforts which he really should have saved easily, and on top of that, he also would completely mess up badly, thus gifting the opposition a goal way too many times for a supposed top keeper. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Excuse me, but all keepers at times let in goals that they should stop.

Just look at Petr Cech, considered by many to be the best goalskeeper around in the past 3-4 years. But in the past season and a half he has made rather a few costly errors, even "messing up badly" at times, and gifting the opposition goals. Now are you trying tell me that Petr Cech isn't an outstanding goalkeeper just because glaring mistakes have been in his game? I think not.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LSF07;

But for his standard and compared to his peers, he was quite an awful goalkeeper who never installed confidence in his defence. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

As for this last point, this is what I really have a problem with. Compared to his peers he WAS NOT awful. And he clearly installed condifence in his defence. France's victories in the 98 World Cup and 2000 European Championships was based on good defending. If they were so concerned with how Barthez would perform then neither of these tophies would have been possible.

--------------------------

This is the only point I agree with you about;

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">enough of distracting from the original post </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

the trick with 'keepers is that they do much of their most important work when we're not even looking at them. By the time the shot's reached them they've either read it and positioned themselves well, or they're making desperate lurches to try to keep it out.

It's why Paul Robinson is so overrated. He keeps getting beaten from 30 yards. People say "oh, what a goal", but a 'keeper like James would have been in a better position earlier and the same shot would've resulted in a difficult but makeable save.

Barthez always looked like a fool, but again, his instincts were probably generally very sound meaning that when he wasn't looking like an idiot he could generally do his job well.

We have an interesting situation at Fulham with Antti Niemi and Kasey Keller. Both are probably about equal as keepers, but in extremely different ways. Niemi can get to almost anything, while Keller never seems to have to dive because he's already anticipated things and got into a position to save it without fuss.

So for goalkeepers I'd say that things like positioning will always be key. Evaluating them with our eyes is really really hard.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fattyg:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">depends, whether you think Barthez was a good goalkeeper or not? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think legendary Derby County commentator Graham Richards put it best when he referred to Barthez as a clown, a stupid clown. Never a truer words been said imo lol </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

A forum member who chose the name fattyg and a Derby County commentator calling a world cup and european championship winning goalkeeper a clow. Hmm

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">

So for goalkeepers I'd say that things like positioning will always be key. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry guys i'm digressing a little here, anybody has any idea why Canizares has a positioning of only 2? Is his positioning really that bad? However, he's still a top class goalkeeper for the previous FM/CM versions.

I personally look for as low an eccentricity stat as possible.

High eccentricity allows keepers to have phenomenal games in which they cannot be beaten but it also lead to the possibility of them inexplicably conceding a goal and playing on 5 for the remainder of the game.

Clearly there are arguments to be made both for and against signing an eccentric keeper, but as I see it if your keeper has to pull off a string of world class saves to keep you in a game then you clearly aren't defending properly - a solid defence can compensate for a keeper who is not eccentric. However they are powerless to prevent a crazy, eccentric act such as the ball bouncing over his head when he comes charging out for no reason!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Celtic 08:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by The_Future's_Maroon:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Celtic 08:

Take Boruc as an example hes as eccentric as hell and look at the saves he pulls off </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I will take back my comment above, as I have signed Boric a few times as he is a very good keeper and you can get him fairly cheap. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

At least someone agrees </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I do agree with you slightly, but being eccentric does lead boruc to make some silly mistakes and therefore over a lengthy period of time, he will let a lot more goals in than say a young talented keepa' with a low eccentric rating

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Nomis07:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fattyg:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">depends, whether you think Barthez was a good goalkeeper or not? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think legendary Derby County commentator Graham Richards put it best when he referred to Barthez as a clown, a stupid clown. Never a truer words been said imo lol </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

A forum member who chose the name fattyg and a Derby County commentator calling a world cup and european championship winning goalkeeper a clow. Hmm </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

lol whats wrong with fattyg!! And this was a few years ago when derby actually tried to attempt to fight relegation from the prem rather than the inmentionable attempt of this season.

I seem to remember we should have beat man united 3-2 but somehow the last goal was disallowed because Barthez got a lucky fowl decision (i'm not biased or bitter btw )

Anyway I admit he was a good goalkeeper, just prone to a few clownish antics which did cost united occasionally.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fattyg:

Anyway I admit he was a good goalkeeper, just prone to a few clownish antics which did cost united occasionally. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

To years in succession against Deportivo if I remember rightly, I think they would have won the CL on those occasions as well.

I always try to steer clear of eccentric keepers - but my tactics have usually been a bit boring anyway. This time I needed someone as 1st choice for Man City until Hart or Schmeichel get good, so got Canizares who has eccentricity of 18 I believe. Well, hes been amazing! Almost single handedly won us games at Arsenal and Reading, and ive got him tutoring Schmeichel cos hes got great Ariel Ability and Schmeichels is 7

So eccentricity can be a good thing, but I wouldnt keep a gk with it for too long.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Nomis07:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fattyg:

Anyway I admit he was a good goalkeeper, just prone to a few clownish antics which did cost united occasionally. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

To years in succession against Deportivo if I remember rightly, I think they would have won the CL on those occasions as well. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I dont think you can make predictions like that.

I am sweyed towards goalkeepers with high eccentricity, it adds a bit more spice to my teams game.

Guys, get a goalkeeper with Eccentricity 20 and put him on maximum Creative Freedom.

What are the effects like??

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Colorado:

What are the effects like?? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I dunno, that's why I've asked others to try it.

It used to really bother me, so I always looked for a keeper with low eccentricity. I was convinced that it was the best thing, not to have a keeper who might do odd things in goal.

However, I currently have an excellent regen in my current save who I note has a stat of 17 for eccentricity. He is truly awesome, with consistent clean sheets in the serie a, not an easy league to do so. Eccentric or otherwise, I guess that blows my ideas out of the window.

Does anybody remember that Colombian keeper Higuita ?

As far as eccentricity goes he made Barthez look as boring as watching cricket and was a fairly decent keeper too.

So I think ecccentricity is a good thing