Defensive Line- What the hell does it actually do, and how does it work?

I have no clue on this anymore- so Ill shamelessly plunder Cleon's loose definition of it:

Im sure the defensive line only works when you are not in possession of the ball and in your own half.

What's your take on it? I've recently been setting it to 6 as I seem to concede less that way but have no real idea why...

I think Cleon is spot on.

When I first started out on this version, I tried to carry on using my FM06 tactics, most of which had a high d/line as this seemed to work best on that version.

As soon as I started out on FM07, although my centre backs are no slouches the high d/line saw my team shipping far too many goals when the strikers got in behind them.

I haven't gone as low as 6, bit would not now have the d/line on push up anymore.

Also if Cleon is right, this would surely be the way the def line should work, as even if a real life team was playing a deep defensive line, I would still expect to see the centre backs up on the half way line when my team were attacking, and the def line setting only kicking in when the opposition attacked.

Originally posted by swash:

Also if Cleon is right, this would surely be the way the def line should work, as even if a real life team was playing a deep defensive line, I would still expect to see the centre backs up on the half way line when my team were attacking, and the def line setting only kicking in when the opposition attacked.

Yups, thats why people keep saying they notice no difference in a 1 defensive line or 20. But if u look at play when you loose the ball, then you notice the defensive line kicking in. Pause the game next time you loose possession and you will see

Im also a bit unsure of this myself especially since some people are suggesting that if yuor playing at home against a defensive side that you use a lower D Line and if your playing away from home against a very attacking team that you use a very high D Line. For my this is completely against what would happen IRL.

Suggestion.....

A good test would be that when you come up against a pacey strikers make sure to field a slow back 4 and have a very high D Line (17) with Closing Down (3) and watch what happens if they are getting in behind you alot.

If you see that they are getting in behind watch the position of your back line and remember that then decrease the D Line along with increasing the Closing Down and then take a look at your back line. If its still exactly the same then im buggered if I know what to suggest!

That's all very logical.

So do you guys always go for a pre-defined defensive line setting? If not, how do you determine where your team should defend? Defensive pace?

I tend to stick to the same defensive line, although being on the deep side it is probably most effective against the teams with the pacy strikers.

As I am currently playing in the Prem and there are a lot of quick strikers, it seems to work well.

If I play in the lower leagues and come up against more lumbering giants, I might well decide to push the line up, to keep them as far away from my goal as possible.

Originally posted by Asmodeus:

That's all very logical.

So do you guys always go for a pre-defined defensive line setting? If not, how do you determine where your team should defend? Defensive pace?

I never used to, but 6 is perfect for me I found. SO I always go with that now

Originally posted by swash:

I tend to stick to the same defensive line, although being on the deep side it is probably most effective against the teams with the pacy strikers.

As I am currently playing in the Prem and there are a lot of quick strikers, it seems to work well.

If I play in the lower leagues and come up against more lumbering giants, I might well decide to push the line up, to keep them as far away from my goal as possible.

Do you counter attack? I always do if I use a deep defensive line, even if I am far suprior than the team I am playing. It still allows me to play counter attacking cos of the deep line.

Jury is still out on counter attacking for me, have tried it on and off, and not really convinced either way yet.

I find if you set your defenders up to pass the right way, you can play a counter attacking style without specifying it anyway.

I don't think there is anything wrong in principle though with ticking counter attacking even against weaker sides, especially as you become more highly ranked, as it becomes more necessary to find ways of luring the opposition out of position and hitting them with a sucker punch.

Strangely on this version, high possession and pass completion stats seem to lead to disappointing results, but I digress.....

Anybody here that bothers reading the manual? I do, and it may be worth reading the stuff about tactical options on pages 30-35 (defensive line is covered on page 33)

I think its a good idea to take those comments in the manual in mind when coming up with certain theories.

Originally posted by Benoit2:

Anybody here that bothers reading the manual? I do, and it may be worth reading the stuff about tactical options on pages 30-35 (defensive line is covered on page 33)

I think its a good idea to take those comments in the manual in mind when coming up with certain theories.

Yeah, but we all know its not that simple. All it is is a basic description of what it does. It doesn't explain anything.

Originally posted by Cleon:

Yeah, but we all know its not that simple. All it is is a basic description of what it does. It doesn't explain anything.

Yes it does, its new in the FM07 manual. Thats why Im posting it.

Originally posted by Benoit2:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Cleon:

Yeah, but we all know its not that simple. All it is is a basic description of what it does. It doesn't explain anything.

Yes it does, its new in the FM07 manual. Thats why Im posting it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It doesn't I got it in front of me. It doesn't tell us anything what we don't know already. Its just a basic overview of what it does.

However people want to discuss it in detail, as the manual lacks a lot of important information.

If nothing else, it helps to have a good discussion on it. What settings seems to be successful, what effect it has on the overall tactic and flow of the game.

Does a deep defensive line mean that once you lose possesion your players will track back quicker?

And if so is it possible to play an early pressing game with a deep defensive line?

Or will this be really difficult because your team will get stretched.

I am of the opinion that the defensive line slider doesn't work properly. Not as noticeably as in previous versions anyway

For what my opinion is worth, I visualise the defensive line thus. I assume that 0 might be defending across your goal line, therefore 20 has you on the halfway line. I hope that is correct.

I am currently using a 4-1-3-2 formation with the two outside C.M.s out on the wings. I have my defensive line between 11 and 13 inclusive. Any further up and it will encroach upon the effectiveness of my D.M.C.. I do not allow my D.C.M. to, hopefully, go across the halfway line. With the defensive player instructions that I have for the back four, I should have a fairly solid defence.

With this picture of my defensive line setup, you can visualise that it should not allow a situation to develop that affected Liverpool under Gerard Houlier. That was, that Liverpool's defence retreated more and more as the game went on. This usually resulted in a late goal against and defeat!

If you do not use a D.M.C. you can push up your defensive line a little more. However, you should always bear in mind that no matter how sound your tactics may be, without the appropiate players in their best positions, most of your tactics will be doomed to failure.

I hope that this might be of some little use to some managers, who like myself are labouring without the assistance of some of the more, shall I say, "Diablo" type tactics of the past. I find it hard to win in this game but much prefer to work things out using my knowledge? of the game of "footy". Kind regards to all managers.

Here's what I don't understand:

It is said that having a defensive line of 14 or higher will push the defensive line into the defensive mid, negating his purpose of stopping attacks before they reach the line.

However, I would think the entire team would set up based on the defensive line, so if it is pushed up, the rest of the team should be pushed up as well maintaining the spacing, correct?

Furthermore, if this defensive line is independent of the positioning of the other players, aren't some positions, such as defensive midfield and wing back, obsolete in a high line? You might as well play 6 across the back (probably not possible, I know) with one CB on 20 closing down to act as a defensive midfielder.

What relationship would this have on a sweeper, too? Does he move independently of the line. Could the line move up and leave the sweeper in acres of space, or, conversely, could the sweeper end up in front of the line if it was set to play deep?

I'm sorry if this has been asked before but it just doesn't make sense to me.

After watching several matches with the D Line set to different notches I have to agree with Cleon that the positioning of the D Line only comes into effect when your side is without the ball. However this brings me to ask one question and it is something that I am having trouble working out....

Scenario

D Line 16

CD 4

Mentality

CB 4

FB 6

MC 8

Wing 10

Striker 12

Now when we are without the ball our D Line will be squeezing up but what im thinking is would that not mean that in effect our defence is so high up the pitch that it will disturb the mentality settings of the rest of the team possibly resulting in the defence playing far too close to the midfield?

Just something that I have been thinking about and trying to gain a much better understanding of the D Line and how important this slider actually is. I know that IRL it is highly important and is a big factor on how a team will play whether it be attacking or defending.

Any comments or ideas regarding this will be highly appreciated.

The defensive line is the point to which your team falls back to when they lose posession. Whilst staying in their structured formation (their position in this structure is based on their mentality setting) they will fall back as a unit until the defence reaches the chosen defensive line, and it is at this point that their closing down instructions will kick in and you will see your players start to go for the ball.

I agree with Jep and Cleon. DL kicks in only when you lose the ball, and it needs to be looked in conjunction with closing down. A low d line means the players will fall back deeper before they close down, a high dline means they will do so much higher on the pitch hence this increases the risk of being caught our of position.

Personally I practice mixed closing down instructions but I find that mucking about with Dlines during the course of a game help me increase or decrease pressure. I now use 2 tactics exclusively a 343 and a 424. Unbelievably the 343 is probably one of the most defensive formations I've ever made, hardly concedes a goal, when playing with a deep dline. If I want to increase pressure, I increase width, increase Dline and remove CA.

I believe that Dline works in conjunction with other sliders and needs to be treated as such. It works extremely well with mixed closing down instructions, but if you decide to have one standard closing down slider for the whole team, I dont' think it will be nearly as effective

Very interesting topic. I think jep and cleon are on to something. It makes sense if you think about real life tactics, where teams deploy a low D line when they want to reduce the space between the goal and the defenders. Obviously the point then is to reduce the potential danger of through balls to pacey strikers. A side effect is that you risk inviting unwanted pressure, which can be dangerous against a strong team. On the other hand it may be useful in a counter attacking scenario where you want to unleash the fury when the opposition is high on the pitch and most of their players are in your half of the pitch. It's like a 'terror from the deep' style of play.

I adjust my D line frequently, according to the opposition. I am less likely to start the game with a high D line if my scout tells me it is important to defend deep, especially away from home. On the other hand, if my team has really pacy defenders it could be useful to start higher up, especially against lesser teams.

I also believe width and closing down settings are important factors that should be set accordingly. It does not make sense to me to have a deep D line and play very wide. And when playing a high D line should be followed with more aggressive closing down settings, like in real life. At least I try to use these very simple guide lines when I play FM'07. I also makes it more fun thinking that some basic real life tactics are viable inside the game engine. I'm not always getting the results I want though, so I need to do some more testing on what actually happens when the D line is very deep and when it is very low.

i find it simple

if your playing against henry you have a deep defensive line otherwise he gets in behind to often and reaks havoc

or other fast strikers, darren bent, martins, saha etc

Just read few all the points and as Rafa stated i think Cleon and Jep are on the right road.

Maybe there is some correlation between defensive line and closing down. For example

DEEP defensive line + High Closing down

HIGH defensive line = Low Closing down

One thing please don't overcomplicate things.....

The manual states very clearly, if you want your boys to tick tock the ball up, you cannot employ a deep d line. Your d line has to be at least normal or high.

If you want your team to play a long passing game at speed, then you should use a deep d line. If you want to use a deep dline you almost have to use a DMC. Cos the backline needs someone to take the ball away from them and act as the link.

For me I like to keep things simple. KISS.

If I am using a DMC in my formation....then its a deep dline

If I am not using a DMC then its a normal to high d line depending on the amount of pressure I want.

To reiterate, I have a 343 with a DM its D line is 6, I also have a 424 its d line is 12. They both work brilliantly. I have only conceded 6 goals in 22 matches.

Seems very logical Rash

I am currently working on a 4-3-3 system, and the defensive element of it is working quite well. I play fairly deep (around 7 or 8 D/Line) and have my players on high closing down (around 15). The front 3 close down on around 18 so that when we lose possession these 3 start to close down sooner than the rest of the team, and you can see these 3 chasing the ball while the other 7 outfield players have more chance to drop back to the D/Line and regroup.

I would definitely advocate high closing down on your forwards and wide men when using a deeper d/line

From most of the posts that I have read about the defensive line, the following becomes apparent. The actual line of your defensive line would appear to vary with each posters interpretation of the defensive line.

It would be beneficial, therefore , to have a reference point for the start of a defensive line. For instance. Where does the defence line begin? Is 0 (zero) on the goaline, the six yard line, the penalty spot or the eighteen yard line, or even further up the field?

Where is 20? Is it on the halfway line. Only on getting a starting point can we begin to agree on where a deep defensive line is. It appears that there are differences over this. Does anyone know for definite what the parameters are for 0 and 20? For myself, I assume that 0 is your goal line and 20 is the half way line. In my last match my defensive line was at 11. that, to me, meant that my defence was just over half way from my goal line.

I would be very interested to learn what others understand the parameters to be. Kind regards to all.

Firstly the sliders are only numbered from 1-20

Secondly i feel Jep has got the defensive line spot on

I’m glad that someone comes up with another theory about the d-line than wwfan and Supersaint. Although I very much appreciate their work and their threads have helped me enormously, I could never follow where tey were going with the low d-line/high CD thing. Here’s my take on it for what it’s worth:

IRL, a defensive strategy would most likely be a narrow, counterattacking strategy that would let the opposition come onto their half, capture the ball and then strike with a quick, long ball to the striker. IMO, translated to FM that means low d-line and low CD (let the opposition come forward), narrow width, high tempo, direct passing and CA on. I’m not exactly sure about time wasting, as players seem to dally on the ball too long when TW is set high, and we don’t want a counter-attacking team to do that. Also, I wouldn’t enable hold up ball for any player, as this also takes the speed out of an attack.

An offensive strategy on the other hand would likely be pressing, high up the pitch to force an error by the opposition as soon as possible to take over control again, preferably on the opposition’s half. Possession should be the key here. In FM that would mean: wide, high d-line, high CD, slower tempo, short passing I guess, and of course no Counter attacking.

Some of this may be a little off topic, but the bottom line is that instead of mirroring the d-line and CD, it could be worth the try to link them instead. Makes more sense to me. I will begin testing in the coming week, as the mirrored d-line and CD just doesn’t seem to work for me.

Originally posted by lameris:

I’m glad that someone comes up with another theory about the d-line than wwfan and Supersaint. Although I very much appreciate their work and their threads have helped me enormously, I could never follow where tey were going with the low d-line/high CD thing. Here’s my take on it for what it’s worth:

IRL, a defensive strategy would most likely be a narrow, counterattacking strategy that would let the opposition come onto their half, capture the ball and then strike with a quick, long ball to the striker. IMO, translated to FM that means low d-line and low CD (let the opposition come forward), narrow width, high tempo, direct passing and CA on. I’m not exactly sure about time wasting, as players seem to dally on the ball too long when TW is set high, and we don’t want a counter-attacking team to do that. Also, I wouldn’t enable hold up ball for any player, as this also takes the speed out of an attack.

An offensive strategy on the other hand would likely be pressing, high up the pitch to force an error by the opposition as soon as possible to take over control again, preferably on the opposition’s half. Possession should be the key here. In FM that would mean: wide, high d-line, high CD, slower tempo, short passing I guess, and of course no Counter attacking.

Some of this may be a little off topic, but the bottom line is that instead of mirroring the d-line and CD, it could be worth the try to link them instead. Makes more sense to me. I will begin testing in the coming week, as the mirrored d-line and CD just doesn’t seem to work for me.

Im also very glad that there are discussions around this, because what works well within one tactical system might not work within another one.

What you say about pairing the D-L and CD didnt work for me, because the players were dragged all over the pitch, leaving huge gaps behind them. But Im sure it can be done, if it is done correct.

From what I could understand of the information in the manual, the D-L relates partially to team mentality(attacking=high line, defending=low line), and passing-style(direct=low line for long and deadly crosses).

I have tried playing high defensive line away(because someone wanted it to be tested), but it didnt work out. Why? Because when playing away I do play with more defensive mentality than at home. I also want my team to counter-attack with deep direct balls from the defence, but this can be hard to get right since the defensive line is high, and strikers are dropping back-who are they gonna play the direct pass to?

Playing at home with a higher line also makes sense, since you want the team to break down attacks higher and gain possession high up the pitch.

So in basic I do agree with the most people here that use low defensive line for counter-attacking football, or for away games - and ups it for home matches.

But at exactly what settings the line should be, varies from tactic to tactic and from opponent to opponent.

Originally posted by supersaint:

What you say about pairing the D-L and CD didnt work for me, because the players were dragged all over the pitch, leaving huge gaps behind them.

If you're talking high d-line and high CD, this makes sense to me. But is this is this also the case with low d-line and low CD? My assumption was that with low CD, the defenders should wait longer before attacking an opponent, thus staying in position instead of being dragged around the pitch.

When playing at home with a high(er) d-line, maybe I should try and link the midfielders' CD to the D-line, so they try and do the dirty work, leaving the defence in position? This would mean that CD is low for defenders at all times though, both home and away. (Don't know if that is a bad thing though.) Any of the tacticians have ideas about this?

Originally posted by lameris:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by supersaint:

What you say about pairing the D-L and CD didnt work for me, because the players were dragged all over the pitch, leaving huge gaps behind them.

But is this is this also the case with low d-line and low CD?

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No, the case here was that my players just didnt want to go into challenges, which left players alone between the DC and DMC to shoot from the egde of the penalty area.

So its probably just about finding the right balance - which for me happened to be around the "mirror-point".

Just now Im trying to build a new tactical system, based on what the manual says about the D-L and my own mirror-theory, to see how it works.

Originally posted by lameris:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by supersaint:

What you say about pairing the D-L and CD didnt work for me, because the players were dragged all over the pitch, leaving huge gaps behind them.

If you're talking high d-line and high CD, this makes sense to me. But is this is this also the case with low d-line and low CD? My assumption was that with low CD, the defenders should wait longer before attacking an opponent, thus staying in position instead of being dragged around the pitch.

When playing at home with a high(er) d-line, maybe I should try and link the midfielders' CD to the D-line, so they try and do the dirty work, leaving the defence in position? This would mean that CD is low for defenders at all times though, both home and away. (Don't know if that is a bad thing though.) Any of the tacticians have ideas about this? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You wouldn´t want a ronaldinho getting a free shot at goal in real life , that´s what you get if you play a deep defence with low cd,

he would score a hattrick every game

Originally posted by big daddy:

You wouldn´t want a ronaldinho getting a free shot at goal in real life , that´s what you get if you play a deep defence with low cd,

he would score a hattrick every game

And that's where the DMC comes in IMO.

Having a DMC with defensive mentality and high CD playing before a low d-line with low CD should help against the long shots-thing, right?

And with my team, I would probably have two man-markers on Ronaldinho anyway

Originally posted by lameris:

And that's where the DMC comes in IMO.

Having a DMC with defensive mentality and high CD playing before a low d-line with low CD should help against the long shots-thing, right?

In theory yes, but in practice not always - because the DMC often wants to close down players that aint dangerous, they can suddenly decide that they want to track down i.e. a winger and leave the space in front of the area open.

Which annoys the H... out of me

Originally posted by supersaint:

the DMC often wants to close down players that aint dangerous, they can suddenly decide that they want to track down i.e. a winger and leave the space in front of the area open.

A bit off-topic, but is this a match engine problem or does the DMC's decision-making have anything to do with this?

Originally posted by supersaint:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by lameris:

And that's where the DMC comes in IMO.

Having a DMC with defensive mentality and high CD playing before a low d-line with low CD should help against the long shots-thing, right?

In theory yes, but in practice not always - because the DMC often wants to close down players that aint dangerous, they can suddenly decide that they want to track down i.e. a winger and leave the space in front of the area open.

Which annoys the H... out of me </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I feel there are 2 types of defensive midfielders you can use. The first is the Makalele type, who doesn't really close down all over the place but does hold a position in front of his 2 centrebacks to stop throughballs and people running at the last line through the middle. For this type of player you need lower closing down and works better with a deeper defensive line as it stops the opposition players getting 30 yard shots at goal from central areas.

The other type is the Sissoko type defensive midfielder. He tries to win the ball higher up the pitch and covers just about all of the area in front of the defence rather than concentrating on the central area. This works better with a higher defensive line where you want to really press the ball and harrass the opposition.

@Iameris

I think it is down to a combination of the players stats and what jep said here, that there are two kind of DMC types that need different D-L settings and CD to work infront of the Centrebacks.

[b}@jep[/b]

It could very well be like that. I think that getting the D-L right to suit the spesific way you want to play, can be extremely frustrating. I like to defend deep but with high pressure midfield, including the DMC. And this of course could be one of the reasons that my DMC all the time gets dragged out of position, leaving space behind him. But if it is like you say, this means I have to raise my D-L, to suit the pressing midfield.

Originally posted by jep:

I feel there are 2 types of defensive midfielders you can use. The first is the Makalele type, who doesn't really close down all over the place but does hold a position in front of his 2 centrebacks to stop throughballs and people running at the last line through the middle. For this type of player you need lower closing down and works better with a deeper defensive line as it stops the opposition players getting 30 yard shots at goal from central areas.

What kind of instructions would be ideal for this Makélélé-style of midfield anchor... because so far I've found comfortable instructions only for the Sissoko-type of midfielder. For some reason it just seems that I can't find the correct instructions for the "shield player", I've tried to set CD rarely or first notch of mixed and little creative freedom but somehow I screw it up by instructing my team with "wrong" defensive line setup.

What comes to the whole team, I've been using RoT-style and having pretty much great success. Still, there are little tactical things that I seemingly can't get hold of, just like this "shielding anchor-man" issue. Any insight?

The other type is the Sissoko type defensive midfielder. He tries to win the ball higher up the pitch and covers just about all of the area in front of the defence rather than concentrating on the central area. This works better with a higher defensive line where you want to really press the ball and harrass the opposition.

FWIW, this is how I employ my hard-working anchor:

Mentality = 8, CF = 8, CD=16, tackling = hard, FWR=rarely, RWB=rarely, LS=mixed, TTB=mixed, CB=rarely, uses tight zonal marking, has Hold up ball checked.

The mentality of my centre-backs are 4-6 and the full-backs have mentality of 10, so the anchor-man should be in the middle of my central defence and wide defenders. This seems to work well but like I said, I'd also like to experiment with the Makélélé-type of shield player who is always in front of back four and is the first line of defence.

Originally posted by swash:

Also if Cleon is right, this would surely be the way the def line should work, as even if a real life team was playing a deep defensive line, I would still expect to see the centre backs up on the half way line when my team were attacking, and the def line setting only kicking in when the opposition attacked.

With a slow defense, defensive mentality and a deep defensive-line I would expect a DMC to be at the half-way line and the CBs further back, surely between the goal and opposition strikers, even when in possession. If I'm not employing an offside trap, why would they be further upfield to stage sprint duels they're bound to lose?

Since there's a good chance I've misinterpreted what I've seen on the 2D-pitch, I should probably test with a ultra-slow defense against a ultra-fast attack and see if the depth of the defensive line actually has an effect on how often my defenders stray too far upfield.

25 clean sheets in 32 matches...that's what I'm staring at in my game with Merthyr Tydfil, a newly promoted side playing in League 1.

My logic is simple..and I don't particular pay much attention to people who overcomplicate things. Unless what they say can be empirically proven, its still a point of view. Furthermore, testing a game out, say using a certain tactic won't prove anything. If you score a goal in the first minute..there is going to be morale boost. And if you concede one quickly you are going to get a morale plunge. What happens then happens as a result of the effects of morale, the overall determination of your team, and probably how you change things around.

Hence for me personally, its my own approach. And I believe its consistent enough for me to warrant some observations.

When I want to play a defensive game, you won't believe this but I turn to my 343 formation, its set to a deep d line and hardly concedes a goal. The closing down instructions are varied, with the front line closing down high. A balance needs to be structured because mentality can affect the tactic, though I do understand the effects on formation from mentality are not very effective now, and they will be tweaked in the upcoming patch.

Mentality tends to affect the distance your 3 parts of your formation take, if the mentality of your players are all the same, then there is really no issue, so when you set up your DL its very straightforward...if you have a DMC you need to use a deep dline. Anything more will result in the defense and midfield playing so close together that the players go for the same ball. Its that simple.

When you start using another formation, then assuming your mentality is same across the group and the distances between the groups is the same, what you need to do is to have the DLine higher.

To set the DLine just simply look at your formation, its as simple as that...it can't get any simpler than that. If you are using a 4132...you need a deep d line...if you are using a 442 you need a normal dline. How high up your DLine goes.. is a matter for you to decide.

Right now I really love the way my DM plays in my 343 formatio...or rather 3133...he is the quintessential Gerrard..he stops players from taking long shots, wins the ball and distrbutes it well.

In my 424... I tend to concede more goals...because I play with a much higher DLine..but it works so well that I can keep teams at bay with 1 shot on my goal...My possession for both tactics is more than 50%

Set your DLine based on your formation first before you decide anything else. Then work on your mentality, and then closing down instructions. I don't walk around with 4 formations, seriously there's no need to in this game...you just need 2. One defensive, one offensive. That's all.

Rashidi : How wide do you play in your offensive 4-2-4? and how wide do you play in your defensive 3-4-3?

Both of them are wide formations, I wouldn't call my 343 a defensive tactic per se, it just happens to be defensively sound...so if I'm faced with a really superior opponent I tend to drop it to narrow. And then adjust according to the match.

Width affects the potency of my 343, the higher the width the more potent it becomes.

Just taken over AZ and contemplating on the width of my 4-3-3 and 3-4-3.

rashidi:

can you post a picture of the formation setup? Im interested in knowing how you handle threats down the flanks. Not just formation wise, but also player instructions.

I'd also like to know how much you are scoring. Im my experience, playing with three central strikers makes for a goal galore, but you concede slightly more. Considering you are conceding very few goals, I assume you're not scoring 2.8 goals per match?

If you remember Scramjet...its got the same shape. But yes, i'm a bit disappointed with its goal scoring rate..we do create chances, but we score something like 1.8 per game.

My 424 scores on average 3.0, but it does concede goals, more than Scramjet II. But I believe the reason why my 343 is not pounding in the goals is simply because I don't have a good targetman upfront. Secondly, there is a bug in the matchengine, where strikers fail to orientate themselves with the far and near post before they take a shot. That explains some really bizarre attmepts.

Even though it has a low Dline its not giving me as many goals as I'd like, but I'm eagerly awaiting the patch, cos i think once the patch comes out...Scram II could be yielding a lot of goals. I have no intention of posting the tactic up. Not now at least.

In case you've forgotten, the tactic employs farrowed MR/ML. the 3 man defense has sarrowed DCs and a SW. In front of them sits the DMC.

If you want more information on the set up of the defensive end...please go to the Creating Effective Tactics thread... I have covered the set up for the 3 man defense in there...i don't wanna clutter up the defensive line discussion here discussing my tactics

i have read everything in this post and i am intrigued by it as the answer to my question would likely be the answer to all my questions as a base to creating any tactic i want!

Am i to understand that 1 is the goalline and 20 is the halfway line?

having studied what cleon has said about what exactly the D-line does i am inclined to agree and it has come as a bit of a revelation as ive stumbled around and not really bothered to much with meanings of all the slider affects as everyone seems to have a different answer, that all seem to work(for them)! therein lies the problem with everyones inability to create good tactics i heard a lot of people asking for explanations to what does what in the manual before 07 even came out, but they/we never got it and thats where all the ambiguity comes from!

but hey at least it makes for a good forum