Is it just me or is impossible to find 7-star coaches?

Honestly. I am lucky if I can get 6 stars with even the best in th world.

I've used the coaching formula but if a coach has good stats in let's say, attacking, he very rarely has good motivating, disciple and determination stats.

Am I doing something wrong?

I am only at 2010 so does this have somehting to do with it?

I think coaches got toned down with the 9.3 patch, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

I think coaches got toned down with the 9.3 patch, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

I never played the game pre-9.0.3 but if they have been toned down I cannot find any that are 7 star.

I have some staff with excellent attributs in attacking, defending, tactics etc, but they are let down in the DDM areas.

It's a bit unrealistic because if you are deemed to be world class, you should be looking at 6+ stars in one area. The vast majority of World Class are 5 stars in one area and less that 5 elsewhere.

Yes, it was changed and listed in the changes for the patch. Now the rating isn't purely about how good he is in attacking/defending/tactics, but also about how good his discipline is, his motivation etc. It's much more fair now.

Yes, it was changed and listed in the changes for the patch. Now the rating isn't purely about how good he is in attacking/defending/tactics, but also about how good his discipline is, his motivation etc. It's much more fair now.

That seems like a big chance just for a patch. It makes more sense but I'm surprised.

So then the question is...are there any7-star coaches.

Beacuse using a filter for DDM - all at least 14. And then a specialist area above 14 - there are no coaches!

Only ones that fit the bill are managers - and they won't join for obvious reasons.

it made sense to change it but the new system makes no sense, there are very, very few 7 star coaches now but my problem with it is that there seems to be little logic to which coaches were chosen to be 7 star.

Slightly off topic, but what's always baffled me is how you'll get a player, say a striker, who retires and becomes a GK coach, or a GK who becomes a shooting coach (based on their attributes).

There's already some examples of existing coaches, not just regens or retiree's, who's attributes are focused on completely different coaching areas than would be expected. A classic example would be John Ebbrel. Now for those of you too young to remember, he was a very short-arsed Everton player. His name sticks in my mind because I recall watching an Everton v Derby match on TV. Derby brought on a then unheard of Kevin Francis, who was 6'7" tall. At corners, John Ebbrel had the unenviable task of marking him, even though he was a whole foot shorter!

So then, John Ebbrel. Midfielder, short-arse and ex-Everton player. What type of coach would you expect him to be? Well, in my game, he's classed as a Goalkeepr coach! Perhaps a little more research required there. If it's hard to research former players who are now quite obscure, at least relate their coaching stats in some way to the positions they played in.

As for the 7* ratings, it should be difficult to find them. There should be more 6* coaches available though. I don't think there's enough to marry with what you would expect to find working with clubs in the top divisions. Also, if 5* is considered to be "World Class" then I'm from Neptune!

it made sense to change it but the new system makes no sense, there are very, very few 7 star coaches now but my problem with it is that there seems to be little logic to which coaches were chosen to be 7 star.

Exactly. For instance...

Many coacheshave 20 for a training area yet have very low discipline, motivation and determination.

If a coach has 20 in a specific training area and is described as world class, what are the chances of him having really poor motivating skills and for what it's worht, discipline and determination. That makes no sense

Slightly off topic, but what's always baffled me is how you'll get a player, say a striker, who retires and becomes a GK coach, or a GK who becomes a shooting coach (based on their attributes).

There's already some examples of existing coaches, not just regens or retiree's, who's attributes are focused on completely different coaching areas than would be expected. A classic example would be John Ebbrel. Now for those of you too young to remember, he was a very short-arsed Everton player. His name sticks in my mind because I recall watching an Everton v Derby match on TV. Derby brought on a then unheard of Kevin Francis, who was 6'7" tall. At corners, John Ebbrel had the unenviable task of marking him, even though he was a whole foot shorter!

So then, John Ebbrel. Midfielder, short-arse and ex-Everton player. What type of coach would you expect him to be? Well, in my game, he's classed as a Goalkeepr coach! Perhaps a little more research required there. If it's hard to research former players who are now quite obscure, at least relate their coaching stats in some way to the positions they played in.

As for the 7* ratings, it should be difficult to find them. There should be more 6* coaches available though. I don't think there's enough to marry with what you would expect to find working with clubs in the top divisions. Also, if 5* is considered to be "World Class" then I'm from Neptune!

Must agree with this. In my save, Edgar Davids is a physio! Now I must confess that I do not know if he holds the relevant qualifications IRL, so I stand to be corrected, but I will go out on a limb and say he probably doesn;t have them.

I've never understood why retired layers become physios - surely this is not really a football job as such and new pysios in the game could simpky be regens.

On a similar topic - Oleg Luzshni (spelling) is 6 stars at coaching set pieces! Any Arsenal fans willing to verify big Oleg could Bend it like Beckham?

I think coaches got toned down with the 9.3 patch, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

You're wrong.

The way stars are evaluated changed, not the coaches or the impact they have on players and training. Only the formula to get the number of stars changed. Coaches themselves and their results were untouched.

scoot4nat - Although it's perhaps unlikely for a more recent "top" former player such as Davids to end up heading into a career as a physio, it has happened in the past. I actually remember being at a Northwich Victoria match IRL once and their physio was non other than Norman Whiteside. At the time he was taking his qualifications to be a fully registered physio. Have not heard much of him since, though I'll always have fond memories of his goal in the '85 FA Cup final. Big "Norm" isn't featured in FM, so must not have continued coaching or physio at a sufficient level to be included.

Another former player to train as a physio was Paul Lake, who is featured in the game as a physio at Bolton. If anyone had experience of injuries, it's Paul Lake. He was a very promising player for City in his day, who's career was cut short by a string of injuries.

Totally agree with former players like Oleg Luzhnyi being high technically as a coach though. It's the only data side of the game that lets FM down to be fair, considering that in the modern game, great importance is also placed on building a skilled backroom staff, as much so in some respects as building a good squad of players.

scoot4nat - Although it's perhaps unlikely for a more recent "top" former player such as Davids to end up heading into a career as a physio, it has happened in the past. I actually remember being at a Northwich Victoria match IRL once and their physio was non other than Norman Whiteside. At the time he was taking his qualifications to be a fully registered physio. Have not heard much of him since, though I'll always have fond memories of his goal in the '85 FA Cup final. Big "Norm" isn't featured in FM, so must not have continued coaching or physio at a sufficient level to be included.

Another former player to train as a physio was Paul Lake, who is featured in the game as a physio at Bolton. If anyone had experience of injuries, it's Paul Lake. He was a very promising player for City in his day, who's career was cut short by a string of injuries.

Totally agree with former players like Oleg Luzhnyi being high technically as a coach though. It's the only data side of the game that lets FM down to be fair, considering that in the modern game, great importance is also placed on building a skilled backroom staff, as much so in some respects as building a good squad of players.

Fair point regarding Lak and Whiteside. I suppose for Lake, suffering many injuries probably gave him motivation to become a physio. I'm sure this will be the case for other players hwo may have to retire through injury.

I suppose as well that a lot of physios have some connection to the game before actually getting a job for a club.

It will be interesting to see Beckham's coaching attributes to see if he is a set piece specialist. If not then it appears it may be entirely random in what areas players become effective coaches,

Ah, but you have to remember that being able to do something and knowing how to teach someone to do something are two very very different things. Oleg Luzhny may be well-schooled in the intricacies of taking a freekick, just because he can't do it himself doesn't mean he doesn't know how to.

If the world was like that then surely the players would just coach each other?

You're wrong.

The way stars are evaluated changed, not the coaches or the impact they have on players and training. Only the formula to get the number of stars changed. Coaches themselves and their results were untouched.

How was it evaluated previously?

There are no 7 star coaches in my game. There are even a few categories where there isn't a single 6 star coach in the game world.

While I generally agree that the new system is a step forward, the requirements for 6 or 7 stars need to be lower or there has to be at least a few coaches around with attributes that add up to 7 stars. Also, we need a simpler way to identify top coaches. Solving equations to find suitable staff isn't really something we should be expected to do in a football management game.

Ah, but you have to remember that being able to do something and knowing how to teach someone to do something are two very very different things. Oleg Luzhny may be well-schooled in the intricacies of taking a freekick, just because he can't do it himself doesn't mean he doesn't know how to.

If the world was like that then surely the players would just coach each other?

Again a fair point but I have to say that in most cases, if you are a coach (or let's say teacher) you must have some sort of ability to do the task yourself. My maths teacher taught me maths because he was a capable mathametician. Pendantic, yes, but true.

I think a better way of putting it is that not all free kick specialists will be able to teach how to take a free kick, but a good teacher of taking free kicks will have good free-kicking skils.

There are no 7 star coaches in my game. There's even a few categories where there isn't a single 6 star coach in the game world.

While I generally agree that the new system is a step forward, the requirements for 6 or 7 stars need to be lower or there has to be at least a few coaches around with attributes that add up to 7 stars. Also, we need a simpler way to identify top coaches. Solving equations to find suitable staff isn't really something we should be expected to do in a football management game.

Right on. If you don't know the formula there's no way of knowing how good a coach will be before you've signed him, which is ridiculous imho.

Again a fair point but I have to say that in most cases, if you are a coach (or let's say teacher) you must have some sort of ability to do the task yourself. My maths teacher taught me maths because he was a capable mathametician. Pendantic, yes, but true.

I think a better way of putting it is that not all free kick specialists will be able to teach how to take a free kick, but a good teacher of taking free kicks will have good free-kicking skils.

I disagree, the Maths example isn't appropriate for football, or indeed any complex physical sport. You can know everything about how you're supposed to control or strike a football without being able to do it yourself, if you simply don't have the coordination or speed of reaction to do it. You can sure as hell tell someone who does have these how to do it though.

Is it still as previous whereby coach stars have no impact as long as the workload is light?

I disagree, the Maths example isn't appropriate for football, or indeed any complex physical sport. You can know everything about how you're supposed to control or strike a football without being able to do it yourself, if you simply don't have the coordination or speed of reaction to do it. You can sure as hell tell someone who does have these how to do it though.

I must disagree again haha!

If someone has the coordination, technical ability and speed of reactions to take a free kick, they probably would'nt need someone to tell them how to do it.

If someone doesn't have the ability then they would then need to be told how to do it. Granted, I may not be able to do it but coudl tell someone else how to. The maths analogy is not a great one because it is not a mechanical movement but then perhaps the free kick idea is not great either.

Most players who take great free kicks were not taught by someone. It's practice - like all mechanical ability i.e. riding a bike. Parents can tell their kids how to do it till they;re blue in the face but the fact is the human body needs to learn it physically. Muscles have mechancial memory so we never forget how to do these things.

The point I'm essentially trying to make is that generally, an attacking player will be better at attacking coaching.

Hansen springs to mind here. (an overrated defender in my opinion) How often can we here him talking baout defenders and defending? He knows what he's talking about and he views the game from a defenders point of view. Other guys you might see on Match Of The Day like Martin Kewon and in the past Tony Adams, all like to pick out defensive errors.

Shearer on the other quite often talked about attakcers and good creative players.

I suppose it is an assumption, but I would expect to see retired players have spcific abilities in coaching their own specialist areas. There of course has to be exceptions when it come to managers who would have to know the all round game.

It's just absurd that strikers become GK coaches. Thje best GK coches are former goalkeepers. Paddy Bonner, Bib Wilson et al.

Think you will find that Alec Chamberlain is a 7 star goalkeeper coach, at least once I signed him my goalkeeping training all round was 7 stars.

So it's not just me that's spotted coaches who seem to have coaching abilities that have nothing whatsoever in common with their playing history then.

The John Ebbrel example as a GK coach is my particular favorite, but if anyone can prove to me that he has in fact become a GK coach IRL, then I will eat my own shorts!

In fact, this is how good a GK coach I think he would be...